From liav.koren at gmail.com Sun Apr 6 14:15:57 2008 From: liav.koren at gmail.com (Liav Koren) Date: Sun Apr 6 14:16:10 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] dbot, this thursday. Message-ID: I'm thrilled to be having Sally McKay and Andrew Hunter coming in this thursday to present. Dbot, as always, will begin at 7. More or less. On taking over dorkbot, Sally McKay was near the top of my list of people I wanted to have present. For me, the charm of dorkbot is the precision with which it manages to be deliberately vague. This is beautifully captured in the phrase "people doing strange things with electricity," and my major agenda with the series has been to try to maintain and then expand that strategic vagueness into new interdisciplinary areas. Sally McKay's work is exemplary of that ability to target the vague. One of her recent major project was The Trouble with Oscillation, an exploration of fundamental physics and the oscillations that they imply for our own world-views. As she writes, "One disorienting aspect of [a] Big Physics Vacation is the tendency for topics to oscillate between A and C without passing through B: from neutrinos to the big bang without even a nod to the normal daily lives of human beings on the planet earth." Moving from the the Sudbury Neutrino Observatory, (where radon detectors stare into a sphere of heavy water waiting for a single photon, the trace of a neutino colliding with a neutron), to meditations on the changing relationship of Big Physics to the military-industrial complex. While most current theoretical physics is outside the realm of anything that seems to be currently weaponizable, the spectre of the Bomb remains. Subsequent work by McKay has involved elements of neurobiology and the philosophy of mind, as well as cur rating and participating in a range of shows across Ontario. =-=-=-= Andrew Hunter's interdisciplinary practice is ideally suited for presentation alongside Sally's work. Andrew is the curator and organizer behind Render, based at the university of Waterloo, where he's been collaborating with both the departments of English and Architecture, as well as an impressive range of diverse artists and designers. Some of Andrew's projects include an exploration into the potential for deployable and flexible architecture that resulted in a cubic, scorched, monolithic structure that can be wheeled into spaces and unfolded into an artist's studio/fabrication centre; large scale performance and installation work by David Poolman and Roman Tkaczyk, and collaborations with a range of artists and collectives based within and outside Ontario and Canada, such as Cathy Busby (Halifax), proboscis (London) Dane Watkins (UK), and several others. Andrew will be talking about Render and his own work. I'm really looking forward to both these presenters, and expect it will be a great night. From david.mikula at gmail.com Sat Apr 12 16:48:45 2008 From: david.mikula at gmail.com (David Mikula) Date: Sat Apr 12 16:49:11 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] Re: April dbot In-Reply-To: References: <6bae84660804120903o2ce78814t9bf79b6725817ed2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6bae84660804121348q44720459pb2f35de7bc5c6a4c@mail.gmail.com> Liav, it's not "your show". It should be a show for everyone to enjoy, not just something just you are interested in seeing. I guess this explains why there are so few repeat visitors to dbot Toronto; it's a collection of the artists and their friends, never to be seen at a meeting again. You're not drawing true dorks to the meetings. Your inability to be inspired by what's being done in other cities is limiting the success of your meetings. Dorkbot San Francisco's organizer, Karen Marcelo, has been featured in New Scientist for her work (http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19125601.700.html) and the meetings have been featured by Boing Boing and Make Magazine ( http://dorkbot.org/press/make_article.jpg). I am just asking you to consider what Dorkbot is really about and if your selections for presentations are serving the motto "people doing strange things with electricity". Thanks, David. On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 1:58 PM, Liav Koren wrote: > My last post to the dbot mailing list was actually a fairly extensive > contextualization of why Sally and Andrew's work fits within my vision > of dorkbot. Further, there were bios and descriptions of Sally and > Andrew's art practice sent to the list quite some time ago. > > It's my show. I program people I want to see. And I have little to no > interest in criticism along the lines of "your dorkbot's not like > other dorkbots." > > On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 12:03 PM, David Mikula > wrote: > > I was disappointed by the presentations at the last Dorkbot. What did > > either of these presentations have to do with "people doing strange > > things with electricity"? While Sally and Andrew's presentations were > > interesting, I don't feel they belonged at Dorkbot. Take a look at > > what Dorkbot in other cities is about. The last meeting in San > > Francisco, for example featured: > > > > - hybrid teleoperated/autonomous robotic "observatories" that allow > > groups of scientists, via the internet, to remotely observe, record, > > and index detailed animal activity > > > > - enabling mobile phones with sensors to share citizen science data > > > > - survival research labs' massive robotic horror shows > > > > - modifying / hacking old electronics > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/dorkbottoronto-blabber/attachments/20080412/ead5c0e3/attachment.html From liav.koren at gmail.com Sat Apr 12 17:56:50 2008 From: liav.koren at gmail.com (Liav Koren) Date: Sat Apr 12 17:57:03 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] Re: April dbot In-Reply-To: <6bae84660804121348q44720459pb2f35de7bc5c6a4c@mail.gmail.com> References: <6bae84660804120903o2ce78814t9bf79b6725817ed2@mail.gmail.com> <6bae84660804121348q44720459pb2f35de7bc5c6a4c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: As I said, I've posted a message to blabber last week that essentially outlines my vision for dbot. If you are unsatisfied with it, you're more than welcome to begin attending dbot SF meetings. L On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 4:48 PM, David Mikula wrote: > Liav, it's not "your show". It should be a show for everyone to enjoy, not > just something just you are interested in seeing. I guess this explains why > there are so few repeat visitors to dbot Toronto; it's a collection of the > artists and their friends, never to be seen at a meeting again. You're not > drawing true dorks to the meetings. Your inability to be inspired by what's > being done in other cities is limiting the success of your meetings. Dorkbot > San Francisco's organizer, Karen Marcelo, has been featured in New Scientist > for her work (http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19125601.700.html) and > the meetings have been featured by Boing Boing and Make Magazine > (http://dorkbot.org/press/make_article.jpg). I am just asking you to > consider what Dorkbot is really about and if your selections for > presentations are serving the motto "people doing strange things with > electricity". > > Thanks, > > David. > > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 1:58 PM, Liav Koren wrote: > > My last post to the dbot mailing list was actually a fairly extensive > > contextualization of why Sally and Andrew's work fits within my vision > > of dorkbot. Further, there were bios and descriptions of Sally and > > Andrew's art practice sent to the list quite some time ago. > > > > It's my show. I program people I want to see. And I have little to no > > interest in criticism along the lines of "your dorkbot's not like > > other dorkbots." > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 12:03 PM, David Mikula > wrote: > > > I was disappointed by the presentations at the last Dorkbot. What did > > > either of these presentations have to do with "people doing strange > > > things with electricity"? While Sally and Andrew's presentations were > > > interesting, I don't feel they belonged at Dorkbot. Take a look at > > > what Dorkbot in other cities is about. The last meeting in San > > > Francisco, for example featured: > > > > > > - hybrid teleoperated/autonomous robotic "observatories" that allow > > > groups of scientists, via the internet, to remotely observe, record, > > > and index detailed animal activity > > > > > > - enabling mobile phones with sensors to share citizen science data > > > > > > - survival research labs' massive robotic horror shows > > > > > > - modifying / hacking old electronics > > > > From gabe at pwd.ca Sat Apr 12 18:48:56 2008 From: gabe at pwd.ca (Gabe Sawhney) Date: Sat Apr 12 18:49:07 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] Re: April dbot In-Reply-To: References: <6bae84660804120903o2ce78814t9bf79b6725817ed2@mail.gmail.com> <6bae84660804121348q44720459pb2f35de7bc5c6a4c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <95b1c3780804121548i18b4f48cn9533f58933e598c5@mail.gmail.com> Interesting stuff. On the one hand, I believe that it's important that the programmer/curator have the freedom to pursue their vision -- whether or not others "get it" at first. On the other hand, if dorkbot is to be a "community" by any definition (which, I think, might've been the intention of its initial creators), the leader(s) must be responsive and accountable to the people who might make up that community. David: I agree that the dorkbot SF lineups look wickedly good, but here's the trick: people in Toronto aren't doing that kind of work. If you know otherwise, please (please!) get them in touch with Liav, or find a way to help them present their work because there are many people in Toronto who would be interested in hearing more about it. Liav: Please (please!) run with your vision, but recognize the difference between the potential impact of a well-managed community, and one person's "show". Gabe On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 5:56 PM, Liav Koren wrote: > As I said, I've posted a message to blabber last week that essentially > outlines my vision for dbot. If you are unsatisfied with it, you're > more than welcome to begin attending dbot SF meetings. > > L > > > On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 4:48 PM, David Mikula > wrote: > > Liav, it's not "your show". It should be a show for everyone to enjoy, > not > > just something just you are interested in seeing. I guess this explains > why > > there are so few repeat visitors to dbot Toronto; it's a collection of > the > > artists and their friends, never to be seen at a meeting again. You're > not > > drawing true dorks to the meetings. Your inability to be inspired by > what's > > being done in other cities is limiting the success of your meetings. > Dorkbot > > San Francisco's organizer, Karen Marcelo, has been featured in New > Scientist > > for her work (http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19125601.700.html) > and > > the meetings have been featured by Boing Boing and Make Magazine > > (http://dorkbot.org/press/make_article.jpg). I am just asking you to > > consider what Dorkbot is really about and if your selections for > > presentations are serving the motto "people doing strange things with > > electricity". > > > > Thanks, > > > > David. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 1:58 PM, Liav Koren > wrote: > > > My last post to the dbot mailing list was actually a fairly extensive > > > contextualization of why Sally and Andrew's work fits within my vision > > > of dorkbot. Further, there were bios and descriptions of Sally and > > > Andrew's art practice sent to the list quite some time ago. > > > > > > It's my show. I program people I want to see. And I have little to no > > > interest in criticism along the lines of "your dorkbot's not like > > > other dorkbots." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 12, 2008 at 12:03 PM, David Mikula > > > wrote: > > > > I was disappointed by the presentations at the last Dorkbot. What > did > > > > either of these presentations have to do with "people doing strange > > > > things with electricity"? While Sally and Andrew's presentations > were > > > > interesting, I don't feel they belonged at Dorkbot. Take a look at > > > > what Dorkbot in other cities is about. The last meeting in San > > > > Francisco, for example featured: > > > > > > > > - hybrid teleoperated/autonomous robotic "observatories" that allow > > > > groups of scientists, via the internet, to remotely observe, > record, > > > > and index detailed animal activity > > > > > > > > - enabling mobile phones with sensors to share citizen science data > > > > > > > > - survival research labs' massive robotic horror shows > > > > > > > > - modifying / hacking old electronics > > > > > > > > ........................................................................ > .........dorkbot: people doing strange things with electricity.......... > ......................... http://dorkbot.org ........................... > ........................................................................ > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/dorkbottoronto-blabber/attachments/20080412/8f2daa22/attachment-0001.html From jacob at appelbaum.net Sat Apr 12 21:01:48 2008 From: jacob at appelbaum.net (Jacob Appelbaum) Date: Sat Apr 12 21:01:59 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] Re: April dbot In-Reply-To: References: <6bae84660804120903o2ce78814t9bf79b6725817ed2@mail.gmail.com> <6bae84660804121348q44720459pb2f35de7bc5c6a4c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <48015B7C.9070105@appelbaum.net> Liav Koren wrote: > As I said, I've posted a message to blabber last week that essentially > outlines my vision for dbot. If you are unsatisfied with it, you're > more than welcome to begin attending dbot SF meetings. David, I'm a frequent contributer to San Francisco Dorkbot and for a time, I also lived in Toronto. I have great respect for Karen and I have a great deal of respect for *anyone* that's putting effort into bootstrapping such a weird group of well... Weirdos! I was pretty sad that there wasn't an active Dorkbot community when I lived in tdot. I did all of my electronics dorking alone and I was surprised. It seemed like Toronto was full of the "right" people and it's in one of the finest countries on the planet. I wasn't really sure what was lacking. I think you may have hit the nail right on the head. I'm quite lucky and can attend SF Dorkbot. You and others may not be so lucky. It's unrealistic to suggest people from Toronto fly to San Francisco for Dorkbot. For this reason, I really support you taking the time to build something else. Something that you feel fits the spirit you wish for in your local Dorkbot. There's nothing from stopping you from starting a second dorkbot in Toronto. Make your vision of dorkbot a reality and you'll see people come back. You're very much on a good track with your comments. Even if it's just once every six months. Find the right people, make it public, send other dorkbotters email - you'll find that people share your view about the content and the ownership ideals. It's one of the things that's made Karen so successful with how she promotes Dorkbot. She's not Douglas Repetto but she surely carries his spirit in her own way! Good luck, Jacob Appelbaum From liav.koren at gmail.com Sun Apr 13 15:13:19 2008 From: liav.koren at gmail.com (Liav Koren) Date: Sun Apr 13 15:13:27 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] dbot Message-ID: In the future I really will refrain from writing emails while annoyed... This really seems like a non-issue to me. It's not radical, or even a stretch, to consider work that's based on fundamental neuroscience, or methods of storytelling under the influence of tourism/mass culture, as completely appropriate to dorkbot. There've also been lots of presenters showing work in a much more clearly electronic milieu, and there'll be more in the future. If David or anyone else wants to set up their own version of dorkbot that would be awesome. The more forums for the presentation of work in the city, the better. Cheers, L. From liav.koren at gmail.com Tue Apr 22 08:43:22 2008 From: liav.koren at gmail.com (Liav Koren) Date: Tue Apr 22 08:43:39 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] reprap Message-ID: Sorry for the late notice, but Michael Bartosik and I will be talking about reprap tonight at Interaccess' Open Studio night. If you're interested in rapid prototyping (3d printing), open-source initiatives, and/or making stuff, it'll be worth checking out. L. From liav.koren at gmail.com Tue Apr 22 12:26:51 2008 From: liav.koren at gmail.com (Liav Koren) Date: Tue Apr 22 12:27:06 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] Re: [dorkbottoronto-announce] reprap In-Reply-To: <60937dab0804220557v621d7b87nfa5a211f045addfc@mail.gmail.com> References: <60937dab0804220557v621d7b87nfa5a211f045addfc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: 7pm. On 4/22/08, Ramy Gorgis wrote: > time? From danaplato at gmail.com Tue Apr 22 17:16:09 2008 From: danaplato at gmail.com (Dana Samuel) Date: Tue Apr 22 17:16:19 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] April dbot In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I agree, folks, this is not worthy of anything close to a flame.... if you want a great flame war, come to InterAccess and see the recent work by Eddo Stern, "Best... Flame War... Ever!" Please, let's remember how FANTASTIC it is to have Dorkbot happening in Toronto! As Director and Curator at InterAccess, Liav liaises with us regularly to discuss his lineup, and take ideas -- whether it's from us or the community at large. He's always around and accessible at the Dorkbot events to chat with the audiences, and I'd add that I see many repeat audience members whenever I'm at a dbot. David, your feedback is appreciated -- but let's remember Liav is a volunteer, and doing this out of love for "strange things with electricity." Personally, I'm glad that the view on the topic is a broad one, and we've seen presenters working with all kinds of science and technology related materials, and the last presentation on interdisciplinarity only proved how far dorkbot can go. If you want something more technically-oriented, there are other outlets here and in town for that -- in addition to Dorkbot. There's the InterAccess open studio. There's the Subtle Technologies Art-Science Salon. there's the Art and Robotics thang at Tortilla Flats. There's lots going on in the city. I believe part of Dorkbot -- in addition to Liav's very smart and very well-considered mandate -- is real practical stuff, like, who's available and when, who will speak for no money, who's passing through town.... I think the fact that SFDorkbot gets press and TBot doesn't shouldn't be a measure of success. I think that there are many other ways to gauge the level of engagement on the part of our audiences. I would also encourage those with differing ideas to *come* to a dorkbot and raise these questions. David, were you at last week's Dorkbot, you would have had the opportunity to raise questions about the interdisciplinary work and it's relationship to electricity, etc. We are fans of the Bot, and hope that a very diverse Bot continues and thrives here in Toronto. best to all for strange electronic goodness, Dana -- Dana Plato danaplato@gmail.com * * * * * dead child star since 1999 * * * * * -- Dana Plato danaplato@gmail.com * * * * * dead child star since 1999 * * * * * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/dorkbottoronto-blabber/attachments/20080422/71d5d477/attachment.html From danaplato at gmail.com Tue Apr 22 23:07:13 2008 From: danaplato at gmail.com (Dana Samuel) Date: Tue Apr 22 23:07:56 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] April dbot In-Reply-To: <6bae84660804221622yd37a73nae49affb5e2afcf2@mail.gmail.com> References: <6bae84660804221622yd37a73nae49affb5e2afcf2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi David, Well, I'd argue that Amos's pigeon cam (digital camera strapped to a bird?) is no less high-tech than Sally's thoughts on animal mimesis and Rob's projections.... in fact, perhaps the reverse: humans mirroring animals? I wasn't suggesting that you criticize the choice of artists at the event -- but how could questions of the nature of animal behaviour, collecting and curating in natural sciences, museology and history play into an electronic practice? Personally, I love the work of Mark Dion, and I see lots of connections between a practice like his -- which I believe is totally Dorkbotty -- and Sally's work, and Andrew's work.... and Amos's, and so on. Have you seen the doc Fast Cheap and Out of Control by Erroll Morris? One of my faves, as it links a topiary garden designer, with a lion tamer, with the man who discovered the naked mole rat, an important evolutionary link, and finally with the MIT guy who researches insect brain behaviour for robotics. I sort of saw the last Dorkbot in this light -- how can we think about the differences between ourselves, our machines, and the world around us? For me, just because there wasn't anything that specifically "plugged in" didn't make a difference to me.... I enjoyed engaging with the broader ideas of the implications of an electronic world. Mind you, I do feel that it's important to have a variety of presenters. Amos was awesome; Phillip Rae was great; I missed Dan Zen but I know he's a character (I believe he presented during the infamous "Darkbot" talk!); I loved the blimp guy (forget his name). But I feel that someone like Andrew Hunter is an excellent counterpoint to thinking about framing work like, for example, Amos Latteier's. It's about how we tell ourselves stories and frame narratives for whatever we do -- an overarching theme of any technology new or old. Amos sends pigeons to take pictures of the sky and tell a story. Andrew Hunter sends his kid to make a video and tell a story. For me, it's all good art. David, can you suggest anyone new who has not yet done a TBot? I'm sure Liav would love to have more names. Best wishes for future bots, with new and old technologies, Dana Samuel Director/Curator InterAccess -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/dorkbottoronto-blabber/attachments/20080422/776a7a67/attachment-0001.html From danaplato at gmail.com Tue Apr 22 23:10:44 2008 From: danaplato at gmail.com (Dana Samuel) Date: Tue Apr 22 23:10:56 2008 Subject: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] April dbot In-Reply-To: <6bae84660804221622yd37a73nae49affb5e2afcf2@mail.gmail.com> References: <6bae84660804221622yd37a73nae49affb5e2afcf2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Seems that David's email was intended for the list but didn't quite make it? I think the dorkbot folks changed their mail server or something, cos the columbia address doesn't work anymore, but the dorkbot.org one does. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: David Mikula Date: Tue, Apr 22, 2008 at 7:22 PM Subject: Re: [dorkbottoronto-blabber] April dbot To: danaplato@gmail.com, A discussion list for dorkbot-toronto < dorkbottoronto-blabber@music.columbia.edu> Dana, I *was *at the last Dorkbot meeting. However, I don't think it would have been appropriate to raise questions about the programming choices in front of the artists who had presented. My intention was to not to start a flame-war, I simply wanted to provide feedback on what I saw at the event and what I believe Dorkbot is about. I've seen some great presentations at Dorkbot Toronto: Dan Zen, David McCallum, Amos Latteier and Philip Rae were some of my favorites. All people doing strange things with electricity. Hopefully you and Liav will be able to bring back people like this. Thanks, David. On Tue, Apr 22, 2008 at 5:16 PM, Dana Samuel wrote: > > I agree, folks, this is not worthy of anything close to a flame.... if you > want a great flame war, come to InterAccess and see the recent work by Eddo > Stern, "Best... Flame War... Ever!" > > Please, let's remember how FANTASTIC it is to have Dorkbot happening in > Toronto! > > As Director and Curator at InterAccess, Liav liaises with us regularly to > discuss his lineup, and take ideas -- whether it's from us or the community > at large. He's always around and accessible at the Dorkbot events to chat > with the audiences, and I'd add that I see many repeat audience members > whenever I'm at a dbot. > > David, your feedback is appreciated -- but let's remember Liav is a > volunteer, and doing this out of love for "strange things with electricity." > Personally, I'm glad that the view on the topic is a broad one, and we've > seen presenters working with all kinds of science and technology related > materials, and the last presentation on interdisciplinarity only proved how > far dorkbot can go. > > If you want something more technically-oriented, there are other outlets > here and in town for that -- in addition to Dorkbot. There's the InterAccess > open studio. There's the Subtle Technologies Art-Science Salon. there's the > Art and Robotics thang at Tortilla Flats. There's lots going on in the city. > > I believe part of Dorkbot -- in addition to Liav's very smart and very > well-considered mandate -- is real practical stuff, like, who's available > and when, who will speak for no money, who's passing through town.... > > I think the fact that SFDorkbot gets press and TBot doesn't shouldn't be a > measure of success. I think that there are many other ways to gauge the > level of engagement on the part of our audiences. > > I would also encourage those with differing ideas to *come* to a dorkbot > and raise these questions. David, were you at last week's Dorkbot, you would > have had the opportunity to raise questions about the interdisciplinary work > and it's relationship to electricity, etc. > > We are fans of the Bot, and hope that a very diverse Bot continues and > thrives here in Toronto. > > best to all for strange electronic goodness, > Dana > > > > -- > Dana Plato > danaplato@gmail.com > > * * * * * dead child star since 1999 * * * * * > > > > -- > Dana Plato > danaplato@gmail.com > > * * * * * dead child star since 1999 * * * * * > ........................................................................ > .........dorkbot: people doing strange things with electricity.......... > ......................... http://dorkbot.org ........................... > ........................................................................ > -- Dana Plato danaplato@gmail.com * * * * * dead child star since 1999 * * * * * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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