From mle+la at mega-nerd.com Thu Dec 1 03:00:54 2005 From: mle+la at mega-nerd.com (Erik de Castro Lopo) Date: Thu Dec 1 03:01:07 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] libsndfile - ogg, mp3 In-Reply-To: <438C4C81.9040403@woh.rr.com> References: <1133258601.438c2769a2bbb@www1.helsinki.fi> <20051129222104.04ad2dc3.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> <438C4C81.9040403@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> Dave Phillips wrote: > Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: > > >I've heard that Thompson has attempted to collect license fees from > >people distributing a software decoder. > > > > > I'd like verification on that story. My understanding is that > Frauenhofer has gone after only the encoders, not the decoders. This does it for me: http://www.mp3licensing.com/royalty/software.html Erik -- +-----------------------------------------------------------+ Erik de Castro Lopo +-----------------------------------------------------------+ "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction." -- Blaise Pascal, mathematician, 1670 From pete.leigh at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 04:55:56 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Thu Dec 1 04:56:19 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] libsndfile - ogg, mp3 In-Reply-To: <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> References: <1133258601.438c2769a2bbb@www1.helsinki.fi> <20051129222104.04ad2dc3.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> <438C4C81.9040403@woh.rr.com> <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> Message-ID: On 01/12/05, Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: > This does it for me: > http://www.mp3licensing.com/royalty/software.html Daunting indeed! But see also: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2005-February/msg00040.html Judging by that, it seems that GPL decoders (and even encoders) may be ok with the patent holders (though I suspect you'd want to confirm it with the source of the info). OTOH, short of an explicit and public exemption clause for non-commercial use, every encouragement for people to move over to ogg is probably worthwhile :) - Pete. From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Thu Dec 1 05:38:26 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Thu Dec 1 05:23:07 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] libsndfile - ogg, mp3 In-Reply-To: <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> References: <1133258601.438c2769a2bbb@www1.helsinki.fi> <20051129222104.04ad2dc3.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> <438C4C81.9040403@woh.rr.com> <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> Message-ID: <438ED2A2.5070508@woh.rr.com> Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: >Dave Phillips wrote: > > > >>Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: >> >> >> >>>I've heard that Thompson has attempted to collect license fees from >>>people distributing a software decoder. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>I'd like verification on that story. My understanding is that >>Frauenhofer has gone after only the encoders, not the decoders. >> >> > >This does it for me: > > http://www.mp3licensing.com/royalty/software.html > >Erik > > Thanks, Erik, that does it for me too, at least in the letter terms of the law. Whether Thomson or Frauenhofer actually pursue the decoders isn't really the point. It's that they *can* if they so desire, putting the decoder in a dependent and shaky position. Nevertheless, I get the impression that importing MP3s into editors, HDRs, and so on, is standard procedure for Windows users. Is that correct ? Best, dp From mle+la at mega-nerd.com Thu Dec 1 05:26:06 2005 From: mle+la at mega-nerd.com (Erik de Castro Lopo) Date: Thu Dec 1 05:26:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] libsndfile - ogg, mp3 In-Reply-To: References: <1133258601.438c2769a2bbb@www1.helsinki.fi> <20051129222104.04ad2dc3.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> <438C4C81.9040403@woh.rr.com> <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> Message-ID: <20051201212606.0237d42a.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> Pete Leigh wrote: > On 01/12/05, Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: > > This does it for me: > > > http://www.mp3licensing.com/royalty/software.html > > Daunting indeed! But see also: > > http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2005-February/msg00040.html > > Judging by that, it seems that GPL decoders (and even encoders) may > be ok with the patent holders (though I suspect you'd want to > confirm it with the source of the info). > > OTOH, short of an explicit and public exemption clause for non-commercial > use, every encouragement for people to move over to ogg is probably > worthwhile :) This is actually not all that helpful. There are a number of people linking libsndfile dynamically to commercial applications. Add code for MP3 then makes it hard for them. I'd also hate to get into a situation where these people have to pay someone else to use the library that I have put so much work into ;-). Erik -- +-----------------------------------------------------------+ Erik de Castro Lopo +-----------------------------------------------------------+ "Do I do everything in C++ and teach a course in advanced swearing?" -- David Beazley at IPC8, on choosing a language for teaching From i_38808 at eml.cc Thu Dec 1 12:16:53 2005 From: i_38808 at eml.cc (;*]) Date: Thu Dec 1 12:25:48 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] m_audio 192 In-Reply-To: <200511301709.jAUH7pst025065@roar.music.columbia.edu> References: <200511301709.jAUH7pst025065@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <1133457413.19611.248776840@webmail.messagingengine.com> hELLO. i've both m-audio 192 [not sure abt the exact model name, just doesnt matter realy] i found no drivers for that at all . well tehre is some kindda support from OSS , but i nearly burned the headphns with that , cause of no way to turn the volume lower. so okay. i'm gonna start bsc_audio_electronics course next year, but i've got this card now and tihs a very good idea to start my study writting drivers for this device . can any one help in some-how .. i havent got any clue yet , hot-to make drivers... what can be use-full? do you know a good beginners guide on this? thanx whatever. -- ;* ` _] i_38808@eml.cc -- http://www.fastmail.fm - Does exactly what it says on the tin From m_nels at gmx.net Thu Dec 1 12:50:12 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Thu Dec 1 13:00:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] m_audio 192 In-Reply-To: <1133457413.19611.248776840@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <200511301709.jAUH7pst025065@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1133457413.19611.248776840@webmail.messagingengine.com> Message-ID: <438F37D4.7010406@gmx.net> ;*] wrote: > do you know a good beginners guide on this? I don't really have an answer to your question - but here are some thoughts... 1. You might have some more luck asking the Linux Audio Developers mailing list. Try searching through the archives - someone may have asked this before. 2. Look through any ALSA driver documentation - and maybe also the source code for existing drivers. I don't know what software you would like to talk to your soundcard - but ALSA is definitely the currently desired driver. 3. I have no idea what your experience of programming is. Books are always good - try your local bookshops. Hope this helps Michael Nelson From dsbaikov at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 13:12:58 2005 From: dsbaikov at gmail.com (Dmitry Baikov) Date: Thu Dec 1 13:13:02 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] [admin] attention gmail users: please fix your message format! In-Reply-To: References: <438DDED3.5030402@folkwang-hochschule.de> Message-ID: <70a871c80512011012i5814a83sfa7e4dad36b528a1@mail.gmail.com> testing... ok? From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Thu Dec 1 13:32:36 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Thu Dec 1 13:34:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] m_audio 192 In-Reply-To: <438F37D4.7010406@gmx.net> References: <200511301709.jAUH7pst025065@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1133457413.19611.248776840@webmail.messagingengine.com> <438F37D4.7010406@gmx.net> Message-ID: <438F41C4.7020400@walescomputers.co.uk> Does the card show up in Jack? What track count does it give? Cheers Bob Ps Are you running Envy24control? Michael T D Nelson wrote: > ;*] wrote: > >> do you know a good beginners guide on this? > > > I don't really have an answer to your question - but here are some > thoughts... > > 1. You might have some more luck asking the Linux Audio Developers > mailing list. Try searching through the archives - someone may have > asked this before. > > 2. Look through any ALSA driver documentation - and maybe also the > source code for existing drivers. I don't know what software you would > like to talk to your soundcard - but ALSA is definitely the currently > desired driver. > > 3. I have no idea what your experience of programming is. Books are > always good - try your local bookshops. > > Hope this helps > Michael Nelson > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From robin at rektau.ukfsn.org Thu Dec 1 13:38:06 2005 From: robin at rektau.ukfsn.org (robin) Date: Thu Dec 1 13:38:02 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] m_audio 192 In-Reply-To: <1133457413.19611.248776840@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <200511301709.jAUH7pst025065@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1133457413.19611.248776840@webmail.messagingengine.com> Message-ID: <438F430E.8060009@rektau.ukfsn.org> ;*] wrote: > hELLO. > > i've both m-audio 192 [not sure abt the exact model name, just doesnt > matter realy] > > i found no drivers for that at all . > > well tehre is some kindda support from OSS , but i nearly burned the > headphns with that , cause of no way to turn the volume lower. > > so okay. i'm gonna start bsc_audio_electronics course next year, but > i've got this card now > and tihs a very good idea to start my study writting drivers for this > device . > > > can any one help in some-how .. i havent got any clue yet , hot-to make > drivers... what can be use-full? > do you know a good beginners guide on this? > > > thanx whatever. Saw this earlier today: http://alsa-project.org/~iwai/writing-an-alsa-driver/index.html robin From perlanegra.proyect at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 13:40:15 2005 From: perlanegra.proyect at gmail.com (perlanegra proyect) Date: Thu Dec 1 13:40:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] New Free Proyect starting In-Reply-To: <20051128212610.GA16229@phlunky.Belkin> References: <311b5a1a0511281126u19d368ben@mail.gmail.com> <20051128212610.GA16229@phlunky.Belkin> Message-ID: <311b5a1a0512011040p19c66684k@mail.gmail.com> "...While reading this and your site, I thought maybe the strangeness was simply a language thing..." XDDD coul be the language, sorry by my english, I haven't too much choices to practise it... thanks by the comment, I'm happy you like... thanks 2 the other visitors, too... you have made an international site of this (more than 20 different countries, even an UNKNOWN COUNTRY has visited this..) XDD u are very curious !!!.. :) see ya.. From hans at fugal.net Thu Dec 1 13:47:03 2005 From: hans at fugal.net (Hans Fugal) Date: Thu Dec 1 13:47:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] libsndfile - ogg, mp3 In-Reply-To: <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> References: <1133258601.438c2769a2bbb@www1.helsinki.fi> <20051129222104.04ad2dc3.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> <438C4C81.9040403@woh.rr.com> <20051201190054.6146e8c8.mle+la@mega-nerd.com> Message-ID: <20051201184703.GA9518@falcon.fugal.net> On Thu, 1 Dec 2005 at 19:00 +1100, Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: > Dave Phillips wrote: > > > Erik de Castro Lopo wrote: > > > > >I've heard that Thompson has attempted to collect license fees from > > >people distributing a software decoder. > > > > > > > > I'd like verification on that story. My understanding is that > > Frauenhofer has gone after only the encoders, not the decoders. > > This does it for me: > > http://www.mp3licensing.com/royalty/software.html I stand by Erik in not doing mp3. However all you who would like mp3 needn't stand idly by, the code is libre after all. Create an independent patch and host/advertise it separately. Then you/the user carry the burden and Erik and libsndfile proper remain free of patent problems. -- Hans Fugal ; http://hans.fugal.net There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself. -- Johann Sebastian Bach -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051201/1917a860/attachment.bin From torbenh at gmx.de Thu Dec 1 15:28:39 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Thu Dec 1 15:09:16 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] fst-1.7 -- build ardour with fst support. In-Reply-To: <438A3EFC.2080206@gmail.com> References: <438A3EFC.2080206@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051201202839.GA4399@mobilat> On Mon, Nov 28, 2005 at 12:19:24AM +0100, Carlos Pino wrote: > Hi there,I'm using fst.1.7 for launch the vst's with very > succes,thanks to everyone who did this posible,it works really greate. > At the readme file included in the tarball I read this: > / > 5) build ardour with fst support. > > copy the SC* files from the ardour directory into your ardour build path. > and the build ardour like: > > scons VST=1 VSTPATH=/path/to/compiled/fst-1.7/ > > > > I tried to compile ardour in that way,copied the > fst-1.7/ardour/SConstruct to the build directory,and run scons with > this options: you did not copy ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript to your gtk_ardour directory. libfst.pc is NOT needed. > > > /supertux@sid:~/proceso/ardour/ardour-0.99$ scons > BUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS=1 USE_SSE_EVERYWHERE=0 VST=1 > VSTPATH=/home/supertux/vst/fst-1.7/ PREFIX=/usr KSI=no DEBUG=yes/ > > > > Anybody did it with succes? me :) > > > Another question is, I see that there is another SC* file at > fst-1.7/ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript ,must it be copied too to the > gtk_ardour directory found at the building directory of ardour-0.99? yes... i would have written SConstruct and not SC*... sorry... i did not put very much love in the README file... > > > Thanks very much in advance. > > Saludos > Cheers > -- Carlos. > -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From torbenh at gmx.de Thu Dec 1 16:14:33 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Thu Dec 1 15:55:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] networking jack In-Reply-To: <200512010038.17618.conrad.berhoerster@gmx.de> References: <200511201323.19350.conrad.berhoerster@gmx.de> <20051122224703.GB4446@mobilat> <200512010038.17618.conrad.berhoerster@gmx.de> Message-ID: <20051201211433.GA4422@mobilat> On Thu, Dec 01, 2005 at 12:38:15AM +0100, conrad berh?rster wrote: > Hallo Torben, > > nice to hear/ read from you. (Ist das Haus winterfest oder frierst du B)) wir haben ja den ofen. und das bad und die kueche unten ist auch fertig. > > Can you explain more detailed the status of the project. Is it working or not. > Am i right , that the main idea is the tranfer audio data over the net. > transparent for the soundcard - all sound are played an the computer in the > network? that means, that i must decide, which soundcard i want to use in the > session. for sound it works very well. i am still working on transmitting the jack_transport information in a sample accurate manner. you have jack_ports which are connected to other ports on the other side of the networkcable. until the transport stuff is done you will have to use alsa midi over network to trigger the other computers. or if you have time you can wait for jack_midi and support in netjack. > i think, for the application i wish to use, i need a server and a client side, > were the server just syncs a time code and send it to the clients. > If I remember well, there was once a jack client with udp and/or osc (open > sound control) heard of that. this project is the evolution of jack.udp which did not handle the clock drift between the two machines. with netjack there is no clock drift. the current cvs has transport sync code which works ok for non-slowsync clients. (ie syncing 2 ardours gives a little delay between the 2) > > > > Am Dienstag 22 November 2005 23:47 schrieb torbenh@gmx.de: > > On Sun, Nov 20, 2005 at 01:23:19PM +0100, conrad berh?rster wrote: > > > Hello all, > > > > > > did anyone know, if there is a possibility to run jack in the network. I > > > don't mean as a streaming client, but as sync server. the scenario should > > > be, standing in a group with 2 or 3 computers making music together in a > > > sync, like MIDI sequencers can do. > > > > working on it... > > current state is in the cvs of > > of www.sf.net/projects/netjack > -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From torbenh at gmx.de Thu Dec 1 16:20:45 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Thu Dec 1 16:01:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Ebuild for fst In-Reply-To: <4388DF8D.3060008@laposte.net> References: <438181A0.9090004@pro.onet.pl> <5bdc1c8b0511251009u4e0e9f2ne2066fc4f3bdfdb@mail.gmail.com> <567aa5f60511251052n55e80ebcr65aecec7b696f97a@mail.gmail.com> <5bdc1c8b0511251605t7f3eca13v8bb94021cd294398@mail.gmail.com> <567aa5f60511261203m16d598a6ia5b8a11186312dfe@mail.gmail.com> <4388BA9A.9080905@laposte.net> <4388EB6E.30407@adelphia.net> <4388DF8D.3060008@laposte.net> Message-ID: <20051201212045.GB4422@mobilat> On Sat, Nov 26, 2005 at 11:19:57PM +0100, Guillaume Meurisse wrote: > Brian Sturk wrote: > > > > >Great stuff, I had just built the latest xfst but now will start using > >this. Will you be submitting this to portage? > > > >~telengard > > > With this ebuild fst needs xfst.exe.so to be copied in the same > directory as fst. This is quite ugly. I'll try to fix this before > submiting to portage. cool... go ahead... fst searches $PATH though.. so if you change line 15 to for i in $PATH:$FSTPATH it should be ok... > > guitoo > -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From pinojazz at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 17:14:07 2005 From: pinojazz at gmail.com (Carlos Pino) Date: Thu Dec 1 17:15:16 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] fst-1.7 -- build ardour with fst support. In-Reply-To: <20051201202839.GA4399@mobilat> References: <438A3EFC.2080206@gmail.com> <20051201202839.GA4399@mobilat> Message-ID: <438F75AF.4090004@gmail.com> torbenh@gmx.de wrote: >On Mon, Nov 28, 2005 at 12:19:24AM +0100, Carlos Pino wrote: > > >> Hi there,I'm using fst.1.7 for launch the vst's with very >>succes,thanks to everyone who did this posible,it works really greate. >> At the readme file included in the tarball I read this: >>/ >> 5) build ardour with fst support. >> >> copy the SC* files from the ardour directory into your ardour build path. >> and the build ardour like: >> >> scons VST=1 VSTPATH=/path/to/compiled/fst-1.7/ >> >> >> >> I tried to compile ardour in that way,copied the >>fst-1.7/ardour/SConstruct to the build directory,and run scons with >>this options: >> >> > >you did not copy ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript to your gtk_ardour >directory. >libfst.pc is NOT needed. > > > > >>/supertux@sid:~/proceso/ardour/ardour-0.99$ scons >>BUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS=1 USE_SSE_EVERYWHERE=0 VST=1 >>VSTPATH=/home/supertux/vst/fst-1.7/ PREFIX=/usr KSI=no DEBUG=yes/ >> >> >> >>Anybody did it with succes? >> >> > >me :) > > > >> Another question is, I see that there is another SC* file at >>fst-1.7/ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript ,must it be copied too to the >>gtk_ardour directory found at the building directory of ardour-0.99? >> >> > >yes... i would have written SConstruct and not SC*... >sorry... i did not put very much love in the README file... > > > > Hi Torbenh ,thank you very much for your answer. I copied fst-1.7/ardour/SConstruct to the build directory and ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript to ardour-0.99/gtk_ardour directory ,run scons as sayd before,but get another error message : /supertux@sid:~/proceso/ardour/ardour-0.99$ scons BUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS=1 USE_SSE_EVERYWHE RE=0 VST=1 VSTPATH=/home/supertux/vst/fst-1.7/ PREFIX=/usr/ KSI=no DEBUG=yes scons: Reading SConscript files ... Package libfst was not found in the pkg-config search path. Perhaps you should add the directory containing `libfst.pc' to the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable No package 'libfst' found Checking for C header file alsa/asoundlib.h... yes Checking for internationalization support ... Checking for C header file libintl.h... yes Checking for C header file /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreAudio.framework/Versions/A/Header s/CoreAudio.h... no Checking for C function posix_memalign()... yes Checking for C function getmntent()... yes Checking for jack_client_open()...ok Checking for jack_recompute_total_latencies()...ok Checking for C header file wordexp.h... yes Checking for C header file sys/vfs.h... yes Checking for executable gtk-config ...yes scons: done reading SConscript files. scons: Building targets ... Substituting vars from ardour.rc.in into ardour.rc .......................... .......................... libs/ardour/audioengine.cc:32:17: error: fst.h: No such file or directory libs/ardour/audioengine.cc: In function 'void _thread_init_callback(void*)': libs/ardour/audioengine.cc:87: error: 'fst_adopt_thread' was not declared in this scope scons: *** [libs/ardour/audioengine.o] Error 1 scons: building terminated because of errors. / The complet shell output is attached. Any idea? Thanks very much Saludos Cheers -- Carlos. -------------- next part -------------- supertux@sid:~/proceso/ardour/ardour-0.99$ scons BUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS=1 USE_SSE_EVERYWHE RE=0 VST=1 VSTPATH=/home/supertux/vst/fst-1.7/ PREFIX=/usr/ KSI=no DEBUG=yes scons: Reading SConscript files ... Package libfst was not found in the pkg-config search path. Perhaps you should add the directory containing `libfst.pc' to the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable No package 'libfst' found Checking for C header file alsa/asoundlib.h... yes Checking for internationalization support ... Checking for C header file libintl.h... yes Checking for C header file /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreAudio.framework/Versions/A/Header s/CoreAudio.h... no Checking for C function posix_memalign()... yes Checking for C function getmntent()... yes Checking for jack_client_open()...ok Checking for jack_recompute_total_latencies()...ok Checking for C header file wordexp.h... yes Checking for C header file sys/vfs.h... yes Checking for executable gtk-config ...yes scons: done reading SConscript files. scons: Building targets ... Substituting vars from ardour.rc.in into ardour.rc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/AAFilter.o libs/soundtouch/AAFilter.cpp g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/FIFOSampleBuffer.o libs/soundtouch/FIFOSampleBuffer.cpp g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/FIRFilter.o libs/soundtouch/FIRFilter.cpp g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/RateTransposer.o libs/soundtouch/RateTransposer.cpp g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/SoundTouch.o libs/soundtouch/SoundTouch.cpp g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/TDStretch.o libs/soundtouch/TDStretch.cpp libs/soundtouch/TDStretch.cpp:118: warning: 'int _getClosest2Power(double)' defined but not used g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/mmx_gcc.o libs/soundtouch/mmx_gcc.cpp g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_CONFIG_ H -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/soundtouch -Ilibs -c -o lib s/soundtouch/cpu_detect_x86_gcc.o libs/soundtouch/cpu_detect_x86_gcc.cpp ar r libs/soundtouch/libsoundtouch.a libs/soundtouch/AAFilter.o libs/soundtouch/FIFOSampleB uffer.o libs/soundtouch/FIRFilter.o libs/soundtouch/RateTransposer.o libs/soundtouch/SoundT ouch.o libs/soundtouch/TDStretch.o libs/soundtouch/mmx_gcc.o libs/soundtouch/cpu_detect_x86 _gcc.o ranlib libs/soundtouch/libsoundtouch.a ar: creating libs/soundtouch/libsoundtouch.a g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs -c -o libs/sigc++/sigc++/adaptor.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/adaptor.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs -c -o libs/sigc++/sigc++/basic_signal.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/basic_signal.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs -c -o libs/sigc++/sigc++/marshal.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/marshal.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs -c -o libs/sigc++/sigc++/object.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/object.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs -c -o libs/sigc++/sigc++/scope.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/scope.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs -c -o libs/sigc++/sigc++/slot.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/slot.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs -c -o libs/sigc++/sigc++/thread.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/thread.cc ar r libs/sigc++/libsigc++.a libs/sigc++/sigc++/adaptor.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/basic_signal.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/marshal.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/object.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/scope.o libs/s igc++/sigc++/slot.o libs/sigc++/sigc++/thread.o ranlib libs/sigc++/libsigc++.a ar: creating libs/sigc++/libsigc++.a g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/basename.o libs/pbd/basena me.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/dirname.o libs/pbd/dirname .cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/dmalloc.o libs/pbd/dmalloc .cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/ftw.o libs/pbd/ftw.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/mountpoint.o libs/pbd/moun tpoint.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/pathscanner.o libs/pbd/pat hscanner.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/pool.o libs/pbd/pool.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/pthread_utils.o libs/pbd/p thread_utils.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/receiver.o libs/pbd/receiv er.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/strsplit.o libs/pbd/strspl it.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/textreceiver.o libs/pbd/te xtreceiver.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/transmitter.o libs/pbd/tra nsmitter.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/undo.o libs/pbd/undo.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/unescape.o libs/pbd/unesca pe.cc version_builder(["libs/pbd/version.cc", "libs/pbd/pbd/version.h"], ["libs/pbd/SConscript"]) g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/version.o libs/pbd/version .cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DHAVE_GETMNTE NT -D_REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ - Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -c -o libs/pbd/xml++.o libs/pbd/xml++.cc ar r libs/pbd/libpbd.a libs/pbd/basename.o libs/pbd/dirname.o libs/pbd/dmalloc.o libs/pbd/f tw.o libs/pbd/mountpoint.o libs/pbd/pathscanner.o libs/pbd/pool.o libs/pbd/pthread_utils.o libs/pbd/receiver.o libs/pbd/strsplit.o libs/pbd/textreceiver.o libs/pbd/transmitter.o libs /pbd/undo.o libs/pbd/unescape.o libs/pbd/version.o libs/pbd/xml++.o ranlib libs/pbd/libpbd.a ar: creating libs/pbd/libpbd.a g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/fd_midiport.o libs/midi++/fd_midiport.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/fifomidi.o lib s/midi++/fifomidi.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/midi.o libs/mi di++/midi.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/midichannel.o libs/midi++/midichannel.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/midicontrollab le.o libs/midi++/midicontrollable.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/midifactory.o libs/midi++/midifactory.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/midimanager.o libs/midi++/midimanager.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/midiparser.o l ibs/midi++/midiparser.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/midiport.o lib s/midi++/midiport.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/mmc.o libs/mid i++/mmc.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/mtc.o libs/mid i++/mtc.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/port_request.o libs/midi++/port_request.cc version_builder(["libs/midi++/version.cc", "libs/midi++/midi++/version.h"], ["libs/midi++/S Conscript"]) g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/version.o libs /midi++/version.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -DWITH_ALSA -D _REENTRANT -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -Ilibs/midi++ -Ilibs -Ilibs/sigc++ -Il ibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -I/usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/pbd -c -o libs/midi++/alsa_sequencer _midiport.o libs/midi++/alsa_sequencer_midiport.cc ar r libs/midi++/libmidi++.a libs/midi++/fd_midiport.o libs/midi++/fifomidi.o libs/midi++/m idi.o libs/midi++/midichannel.o libs/midi++/midicontrollable.o libs/midi++/midifactory.o li bs/midi++/midimanager.o libs/midi++/midiparser.o libs/midi++/midiport.o libs/midi++/mmc.o l ibs/midi++/mtc.o libs/midi++/port_request.o libs/midi++/version.o libs/midi++/alsa_sequence r_midiport.o ranlib libs/midi++/libmidi++.a ar: creating libs/midi++/libmidi++.a g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -D_REENTRANT - D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -DPACKAGE=\"libardour\" -DDATA_DIR=\"/usr//share\" -DCONFIG_DIR=\"/usr//etc\" -DLOCALEDIR=\"/usr//share/locale\" -DHAVE_JACK_CLIENT_OPEN -DHA VE_JACK_RECOMPUTE_LATENCIES -DHAVE_WORDEXP -DHAVE_SYS_VFS_H -Ilibs/ardour -Ilibs -Ilibs -I/ usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/soun dtouch -Ilibs/midi++ -c -o libs/ardour/audio_library.o libs/ardour/audio_library.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -D_REENTRANT - D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -DPACKAGE=\"libardour\" -DDATA_DIR=\"/usr//share\" -DCONFIG_DIR=\"/usr//etc\" -DLOCALEDIR=\"/usr//share/locale\" -DHAVE_JACK_CLIENT_OPEN -DHA VE_JACK_RECOMPUTE_LATENCIES -DHAVE_WORDEXP -DHAVE_SYS_VFS_H -Ilibs/ardour -Ilibs -Ilibs -I/ usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/soun dtouch -Ilibs/midi++ -c -o libs/ardour/audio_playlist.o libs/ardour/audio_playlist.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -D_REENTRANT - D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -DPACKAGE=\"libardour\" -DDATA_DIR=\"/usr//share\" -DCONFIG_DIR=\"/usr//etc\" -DLOCALEDIR=\"/usr//share/locale\" -DHAVE_JACK_CLIENT_OPEN -DHA VE_JACK_RECOMPUTE_LATENCIES -DHAVE_WORDEXP -DHAVE_SYS_VFS_H -Ilibs/ardour -Ilibs -Ilibs -I/ usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/soun dtouch -Ilibs/midi++ -c -o libs/ardour/audio_track.o libs/ardour/audio_track.cc g++ -g -DARCH_X86 -DBUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS -Wall -DVST_SUPPORT -DENABLE_NLS -D_REENTRANT - D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_LARGEFILE64_SOURCE -DPACKAGE=\"libardour\" -DDATA_DIR=\"/usr//share\" -DCONFIG_DIR=\"/usr//etc\" -DLOCALEDIR=\"/usr//share/locale\" -DHAVE_JACK_CLIENT_OPEN -DHA VE_JACK_RECOMPUTE_LATENCIES -DHAVE_WORDEXP -DHAVE_SYS_VFS_H -Ilibs/ardour -Ilibs -Ilibs -I/ usr/include/libxml2 -Ilibs/sigc++ -Ilibs/sigc++/sigc++/config -Ilibs/pbd -Ilibs -Ilibs/soun dtouch -Ilibs/midi++ -c -o libs/ardour/audioengine.o libs/ardour/audioengine.cc libs/ardour/audioengine.cc:32:17: error: fst.h: No such file or directory libs/ardour/audioengine.cc: In function 'void _thread_init_callback(void*)': libs/ardour/audioengine.cc:87: error: 'fst_adopt_thread' was not declared in this scope scons: *** [libs/ardour/audioengine.o] Error 1 scons: building terminated because of errors. From pcoccoli at gmail.com Thu Dec 1 23:43:03 2005 From: pcoccoli at gmail.com (Paul Coccoli) Date: Thu Dec 1 23:43:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] puzzling ecasound error In-Reply-To: References: <8d27a0610511282009k71b859b3i5e7a5117f465cf88@mail.gmail.com> <8d27a0610511290741n83c5650j245057695a9b2d4b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8d27a0610512012043s4c1296f8o7523a706727e8568@mail.gmail.com> On 11/30/05, Kai Vehmanen wrote: > On Tue, 29 Nov 2005, Paul Coccoli wrote: > > I get that plate reverb error no matter what options I use. Is that > > something in my system configuration? > > Hmm, which plate reverb that is? That warning msg seems a bit strange -- > something wrong with the description the plate reverb reports to ecasound. > > Btw, you can get a listing of all LADSPA plugins ecasound finds with: > > sh> echo ladspa-register |ecasound -c > > That can be fed to a file, more/less, etc. Can you see the plate reverb in > the list? > I see three plate reverbs: 152. Versatile plate reverb -el:Plate,'bandwidth','tail','damping','blend' 153. Versatile plate reverb, ... 2x2 -el:Plate2x2,'bandwidth','tail','damping','blend' 222. Plate reverb -el:plate,'Reverb time','Damping','Dry/wet mix' From doj at cubic.org Fri Dec 2 12:27:34 2005 From: doj at cubic.org (Dirk Jagdmann) Date: Fri Dec 2 13:48:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Lighting In-Reply-To: <438DE7D1.7070603@xung.org> References: <438A3879.2040105@xung.org> <20051127230848.GA5915@replic.net> <2def88b80511280212s318fe1ack@mail.gmail.com> <438AF315.3010109@xung.org> <438AFAA9.4050000@cubic.org> <438B2A6A.3020308@xung.org> <438C9159.7060509@cubic.org> <438DE7D1.7070603@xung.org> Message-ID: <43908406.9040706@cubic.org> > That's an important point. But if I understand correctly, I need to know how to > "merge" or "route" DMX streams, either at software or hardware level. Needs some > investigation... When merging DMX data it only makes sense to choose the highest value from two (or more) channels for the output value. In lighting speak this is named HTP "highest takes place/precedence". Routing of your DMX stream would be up to your software, but for your setup would be easy. You would have one of the following setups: YourComputer ---> LightingConsole ---> DMX equipment In this case there's nothing for you todo, as the lighting console will merge the DMX data coming from you. If the console does not have this capability you would have to change this to: LightingConsole ---> YourComputer ---> DMX equipment So you'd need an DMX input interface, read it and merge it with your DMX data. > > * Name : Jacklight > * Purpose : act as a bridge between Jack audio streams and DMX lighting > * Basic features : > 1 - set the brightness of a lamp according to the level of a given audio > stream > 2 - a single stream can be connected to several DMX channels (= several > lamps), and several streams can be connected to a single DMX channel. > 3 - each DMX channel is assigned a level control, to customize the > audio-to-brightness conversion ratio Makes sense, and I think it should be doable by a weekend of hacking some code together. > * Advanced features : > 4 - GUI : a gtk based interface that allows to easily add/remove DMX > channels. Additionally, it could try and represents lamps on the screen, > with some (customizable) color squares GUI is always nice, but this often takes much time when implementing, because 1) a good GUI is not easy to design and implement 2) if you have a good GUI you often have much "expressive" capabilities which then take some code to use. > 5 - Midi : each channel level control could be assigned to a Midi > Continuous Controller. For Live operation, that would allow to use a > hardware controller, and turn a knob to decrease/increase every > channels' audio-to-brightness ratio, Depending on how sophisticated you want a midi<->dmx mapping this can be really easy by noticing that: midi value range 0-127, dmx value range 0-255. So you can make a 1to1 mapping by multipling/dividing all values by 2. Of course advanced features need more time to implement and it quickly becomes complex. I personally have not used JackBeat yet, so I can't comment on specific issues with that software. My comments are just my general experience with lighting software gained from 3 attempts by Michael and me to write a medium sized lighting software (which all more or less failed, because if you want to have something better than real basic [as my dmxconsole ncurses program] it quickly becomes a *real* program, which takes a lot of developers ressources.) In the dmx4linux archive Michael has coded an xmms plugin which assign each of the (fake) xmms spectrum bars to one DMX channel. If you want to have a quick check if your light setup works by some not random blinking it's a nice tool, however not usable for any serious lighting work. -- ---> Dirk Jagdmann ^ doj / cubic ----> http://cubic.org/~doj -----> http://llg.cubic.org From torbenh at gmx.de Fri Dec 2 13:55:54 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Fri Dec 2 13:48:51 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] fst-1.7 -- build ardour with fst support. In-Reply-To: <438F75AF.4090004@gmail.com> References: <438A3EFC.2080206@gmail.com> <20051201202839.GA4399@mobilat> <438F75AF.4090004@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051202185554.GA5320@mobilat> On Thu, Dec 01, 2005 at 11:14:07PM +0100, Carlos Pino wrote: > Hi Torbenh ,thank you very much for your answer. > I copied fst-1.7/ardour/SConstruct to the build directory > and ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript to ardour-0.99/gtk_ardour directory > ,run scons as sayd before,but get another error message : > copy the fst.h file from the fst dir to someplace where ardour can find it. (/usr/local/include for example) -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From chris at dukla.plus.com Fri Dec 2 13:58:37 2005 From: chris at dukla.plus.com (Chris Norris) Date: Fri Dec 2 13:58:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems with Roland PC-300 Message-ID: <4390995D.9030005@dukla.plus.com> Hi all - I would appreciate if someone is able to help get my Roland PC-300 midi keyboard controller to work. The short problem seems to me that although the keyboard is being recognised via USB OK, it is not being correctly/completely identified by ALSA. When I plug it in I get in my system log: Nov 28 17:17:57 dukla kernel: usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using uhci_hcd and address 3 Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: midi: probe of 3-2:1.0 failed with error -5 Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: midi: probe of 3-2:1.1 failed with error -5 Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbmidi: found [ Roland PC-300 ] (0x0582:0x0008), attached: Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbmidi: /dev/midi00: in (ep:81 cid: 0 bufsiz:64) out (ep:01 cid: 0 bufsiz:64) Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbcore: registered new driver midi Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbcore: registered new driver snd-usb-audio Even better, it shows up as a device: me@dukla:~> cat /proc/asound/cards 0 [V8237 ]: VIA8237 - VIA 8237 VIA 8237 with ALC658D at 0xe000, irq 177 1 [PC300 ]: USB-Audio - PC-300 Roland PC-300 at usb-0000:00:10.2-2, full speed And yet I cannot see it as an input ALSA device: me@dukla:~> aconnect -i -o client 0: 'System' [type=kernel] 0 'Timer ' 1 'Announce ' client 62: 'Midi Through' [type=kernel] 0 'Midi Through Port-0' client 128: 'FLUID Synth (10018)' [type=user] 0 'Synth input port (10018:0)' I am running SuSE 10.0 x86_64 (kernel 2.6.13-15) which has ALSA 1.0.9-23. My skills do not run to kernel compiles: the keyboard does work fine under Windows and even cat /dev/midi shows some garbage at each key press. Any/all help or suggestions would be very welcome! Thanks From pinojazz at gmail.com Fri Dec 2 18:19:57 2005 From: pinojazz at gmail.com (Carlos Pino) Date: Fri Dec 2 18:20:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] fst-1.7 -- build ardour with fst --- SOLVED ----- Message-ID: <4390D69D.3050107@gmail.com> > On Thu, Dec 01, 2005 at 11:14:07PM +0100, Carlos Pino wrote: > > Hi Torbenh ,thank you very much for your answer. > > I copied fst-1.7/ardour/SConstruct to the build directory > > and ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript to ardour-0.99/gtk_ardour directory > > ,run scons as sayd before,but get another error message : > > > > copy the fst.h file from the fst dir to someplace where ardour can > find it. > (/usr/local/include for example) > Hi again,Torbenh,and everyone at the list,thank you very much for your time and help. The solution came after copy from the fst-1.7/ardour build folder: - the SC* files : fst-1.7/ardour/SConstruct to the build directory of ardour-0.99 and fst-1.7/ardour/gtk_ardour/SConscript to the ardour-0.99/gtk_ardour build directory -the vst directory created during the compilation of fst-1.7 and the fst.h file to the build directory ardour-0.99/libs/ardour . After try your advice,It did'nt work giving diferents error messages. I tried again as the first time ,wihtout copying fst.h to /usr/local/include and the last error : /libs/ardour/audioengine.cc:32:17: error: fst.h: No such file or directory libs/ardour/audioengine.cc: In function 'void _thread_init_callback(void*)': libs/ardour/audioengine.cc:87: error: 'fst_adopt_thread' was not declared in this scope scons: *** [libs/ardour/audioengine.o] Error 1 scons: building terminated because of errors. /made me think that scons was looking for fst.h at libs/ardour/ folder inside the building place. After this ,a similar error looking for vst/AEffect.h file in the same place: / libs/ardour/fst.h:26:25: error: vst/AEffect.h: No such file or directory libs/ardour/fst.h:58: error: expected ';' before '(' token libs/ardour/fst.h:89: error: 'audioMasterCallback' has not been declared scons: *** [libs/ardour/audioengine.o] Error 1 scons: building terminated because of errors./ after copy that folder everything went fine. The next step I did was create /usr/local/lib/vst folder and put inside the vst.dll files,but launching Ardour as root is needed the first time,due to the write acces of that folder.After this I open some vstfx that work with very good performance (ambience reverb and nomad factory free sweeper) Thank you very much and best wishes from Spain. Saludos. Cheers. -- Carlos. From pedro.lopez.cabanillas at gmail.com Sat Dec 3 13:39:04 2005 From: pedro.lopez.cabanillas at gmail.com (Pedro Lopez-Cabanillas) Date: Sat Dec 3 13:39:11 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems with Roland PC-300 In-Reply-To: <200512031702.jB3H2J7n021161@roar.music.columbia.edu> References: <200512031702.jB3H2J7n021161@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <200512031939.05161.pedro.lopez.cabanillas@gmail.com> On Fri, 02 Dec 2005 18:58, Chris Norris wrote: > Hi all - I would appreciate if someone is able to help get my Roland > PC-300 midi keyboard controller to work. > > The short problem seems to me that although the keyboard is being > recognised via USB OK, it is not being correctly/completely identified > by ALSA. > > When I plug it in I get in my system log: > Nov 28 17:17:57 dukla kernel: usb 3-2: new full speed USB device using > uhci_hcd and address 3 > Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: midi: probe of 3-2:1.0 failed with error -5 > Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: midi: probe of 3-2:1.1 failed with error -5 > Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbmidi: found [ Roland PC-300 ] > (0x0582:0x0008), attached: > Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbmidi: /dev/midi00: in (ep:81 cid: 0 > bufsiz:64) out (ep:01 cid: 0 bufsiz:64) These messages mean that the old OSS-like "usb-midi" driver has been loaded, taking over the device, which is recognized and probably working with this driver. > Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbcore: registered new driver midi > Nov 28 17:17:58 dukla kernel: usbcore: registered new driver snd-usb-audio The alsa driver has been loaded too, but it doesn't find a free interface in the PC-300 to attach. > Even better, it shows up as a device: > me@dukla:~> cat /proc/asound/cards > 0 [V8237 ? ? ? ? ?]: VIA8237 - VIA 8237 > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?VIA 8237 with ALC658D at 0xe000, irq 177 > 1 [PC300 ? ? ? ? ?]: USB-Audio - PC-300 > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?Roland PC-300 at usb-0000:00:10.2-2, full speed > > And yet I cannot see it as an input ALSA device: > me@dukla:~> aconnect -i -o > client 0: 'System' [type=kernel] > 0 'Timer ' > 1 'Announce ' > client 62: 'Midi Through' [type=kernel] > 0 'Midi Through Port-0' > client 128: 'FLUID Synth (10018)' [type=user] > 0 'Synth input port (10018:0)' > > I am running SuSE 10.0 x86_64 (kernel 2.6.13-15) which has ALSA > 1.0.9-23. My skills do not run to kernel compiles: the keyboard does > work fine under Windows and even > cat /dev/midi > shows some garbage at each key press. > > Any/all help or suggestions would be very welcome! > Thanks You can either: * Remove the module usb-midi, if you don't need it anymore. Or * Add one line at end of your file "/etc/hotplug/blacklist". To do it, open a terminal window, login as root and enter: # echo "usb-midi" >> /etc/hotplug/blacklist Next time you boot the computer, the module "usb-midi" won't be loaded and your keyboard controller will be driven by ALSA. There is a diagnostic script to debug ALSA problems here: http://alsa.opensrc.org/aadebug Perhaps you would like to run it, before and after, and tell us it this helps. Regards, Pedro From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Sat Dec 3 14:12:57 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Sat Dec 3 14:13:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Behringer DDX3216 Midi to run Jack?ARdour Message-ID: <4391EE39.30800@walescomputers.co.uk> Hi All Well it's time for this Musician to bite the Midi Bullet! I have Endirol Midi to USB and it seems to work, as I managed to get something into Rosegarden ( I could see data but it made no sound, I dont think I had anything set for output, like a keyboard) The DDX has Midi out and controlls for play stop and all the rest so I assume it should be able to control Ardour/jack. Anyone tried this? If so please mail me any pitfalls/Advice. Cheers Bob Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From job17and9 at yahoo.com Sat Dec 3 15:02:18 2005 From: job17and9 at yahoo.com (Brian Dunn) Date: Sat Dec 3 15:02:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> The possibility of using and contributing to studio quality audio software is really what first sparked my interest in linux. So I installed Mandrake 10.1, because someone gave it to me and it sounded cool. Since then i've had a lot of fun with it, using their mm kernel and running jack with seq24 and trying to come up with something cool enough to use ardour for, and everything ran relatively reliably. BUT... The lan componets of the distro simply don't work, the USB plug and play is more like plug-and-if-i-feel-like-it-play, and the printer suport is also compleatly unreliable. So, just use mandrake for when i'm feeling musical and reboot to Micro$oft whenever i need to do anything else, right? well, that's getting old. So i took a friends advice and started playing with gentoo. After all, it's well documented. and it was fun writing all those config files and oh so neat to DIY, but then i tried to install Gnome, and after like a 7 hour compile that i can't yet figure out how to use i'm thinking, what have i gotten myself into... So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? good free documentation, reliable hardware support, binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config files that don't get re-written by some user friendly script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except for the whole doesn't work thing? If your system works the way you want it too most of the time, i want to hear your opinion. gratefull, Brian From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Sat Dec 3 16:09:36 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Sat Dec 3 16:09:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1133644176.3095.1.camel@eviltwin> On Sat, 2005-12-03 at 12:02 -0800, Brian Dunn wrote: > The possibility of using and contributing to studio > quality audio software is really what first sparked my > interest in linux. So I installed Mandrake 10.1, > because someone gave it to me and it sounded cool. > Since then i've had a lot of fun with it, using their > mm kernel and running jack with seq24 and trying to > come up with something cool enough to use ardour for, > and everything ran relatively reliably. BUT... The > lan componets of the distro simply don't work, the USB > plug and play is more like > plug-and-if-i-feel-like-it-play, and the printer > suport is also compleatly unreliable. So, just use > mandrake for when i'm feeling musical and reboot to > Micro$oft whenever i need to do anything else, right? > well, that's getting old. > So i took a friends advice and started playing with > gentoo. After all, it's well documented. and it was > fun writing all those config files and oh so neat to > DIY, but then i tried to install Gnome, and after like > a 7 hour compile that i can't yet figure out how to > use i'm thinking, what have i gotten myself into... > > So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? > good free documentation, reliable hardware support, > binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config > files that don't get re-written by some user friendly > script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except > for the whole doesn't work thing? > > If your system works the way you want it too most of > the time, i want to hear your opinion. > Planet CCRMA. http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/software/ -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From cesare at poeticstudios.com Sat Dec 3 16:20:36 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Sat Dec 3 16:20:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> Brian Dunn wrote: >The possibility of using and contributing to studio >quality audio software is really what first sparked my >interest in linux. So I installed Mandrake 10.1, >because someone gave it to me and it sounded cool. >Since then i've had a lot of fun with it, using their >mm kernel and running jack with seq24 and trying to >come up with something cool enough to use ardour for, >and everything ran relatively reliably. BUT... The >lan componets of the distro simply don't work, the USB >plug and play is more like >plug-and-if-i-feel-like-it-play, and the printer >suport is also compleatly unreliable. So, just use >mandrake for when i'm feeling musical and reboot to >Micro$oft whenever i need to do anything else, right? >well, that's getting old. >So i took a friends advice and started playing with >gentoo. After all, it's well documented. and it was >fun writing all those config files and oh so neat to >DIY, but then i tried to install Gnome, and after like >a 7 hour compile that i can't yet figure out how to >use i'm thinking, what have i gotten myself into... > >So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? >good free documentation, reliable hardware support, >binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config >files that don't get re-written by some user friendly >script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except >for the whole doesn't work thing? > >If your system works the way you want it too most of >the time, i want to hear your opinion. > >gratefull, >Brian > > > > Just try Slackware. Things will not work out of the box, but you'll learn the basics of gnu/Linux and you'll have a stable and clean system, without the need to compile everything from scratch (as with Gentoo). I run Slackware 10.2 with kernel 2.6.13 (compiled by myself with just the stuff I need) and the realtime-lsm module. My pc works the way I want most of the time, more than how it used to be with a closed source commercial operation system. I guess there are a lot of better distributions out there. My only advice is to avoid a distro that does everything for you. These are the most difficult to configure and tweak if something doesn't work plug-and-play, and less adherent to standards. And you'll learn nothing. c. From cesare at poeticstudios.com Sat Dec 3 16:32:55 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Sat Dec 3 16:33:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <43920F07.5040909@poeticstudios.com> Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Brian Dunn wrote: > >> The possibility of using and contributing to studio >> quality audio software is really what first sparked my >> interest in linux. So I installed Mandrake 10.1, >> because someone gave it to me and it sounded cool. Since then i've >> had a lot of fun with it, using their >> mm kernel and running jack with seq24 and trying to >> come up with something cool enough to use ardour for, >> and everything ran relatively reliably. BUT... The >> lan componets of the distro simply don't work, the USB >> plug and play is more like >> plug-and-if-i-feel-like-it-play, and the printer >> suport is also compleatly unreliable. So, just use >> mandrake for when i'm feeling musical and reboot to >> Micro$oft whenever i need to do anything else, right? >> well, that's getting old. >> So i took a friends advice and started playing with >> gentoo. After all, it's well documented. and it was >> fun writing all those config files and oh so neat to >> DIY, but then i tried to install Gnome, and after like >> a 7 hour compile that i can't yet figure out how to >> use i'm thinking, what have i gotten myself into... >> >> So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? >> good free documentation, reliable hardware support, >> binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config >> files that don't get re-written by some user friendly >> script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except >> for the whole doesn't work thing? >> >> If your system works the way you want it too most of >> the time, i want to hear your opinion. >> >> gratefull, >> Brian >> >> >> >> > Just try Slackware. Things will not work out of the box, but you'll > learn the basics of gnu/Linux and you'll have a stable and clean > system, without the need to compile everything from scratch (as with > Gentoo). > I run Slackware 10.2 with kernel 2.6.13 (compiled by myself with just > the stuff I need) and the realtime-lsm module. My pc works the way I > want most of the time, more than how it used to be with a closed > source commercial operation system. sorry, operating > > I guess there are a lot of better distributions out there. My only > advice is to avoid a distro that does everything for you. These are > the most difficult to configure and tweak if something doesn't work > plug-and-play, and less adherent to standards. And you'll learn nothing. > > c. > > From ce at christeck.de Sat Dec 3 16:34:51 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sat Dec 3 16:34:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> > Just try Slackware. Things will not work out of the box, but you'll > learn the basics of gnu/Linux and you'll have a stable and clean > system, without the need to compile everything from scratch (as with > Gentoo). ;-))) Needless to say that I'm very happy with my Gentoo audio box :) . Best regards ce From hanaghan at starband.net Sat Dec 3 17:05:08 2005 From: hanaghan at starband.net (Russell Hanaghan) Date: Sat Dec 3 16:55:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <43921694.2080202@starband.net> Christoph Eckert wrote: >>Just try Slackware. Things will not work out of the box, but you'll >>learn the basics of gnu/Linux and you'll have a stable and clean >>system, without the need to compile everything from scratch (as with >>Gentoo). >> >> > >;-))) > > >Needless to say that I'm very happy with my Gentoo audio box :) . > > >Best regards > > > ce > > > > I luv this topic! :) Suffice to say, If we threw a bag of M&M's on the floor, everyone would grab a different (their favorite) color! PclinuxOS with Thac's Audio RPM's! Soon to be another bootable LiveCD jamn packed with all the favorite Audio apps! Cheers, R~ From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Sat Dec 3 16:59:35 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Sat Dec 3 16:57:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <1133647175.7540.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Sat, 2005-12-03 at 22:20 +0100, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > I guess there are a lot of better distributions out there. My only > advice is to avoid a distro that does everything for you. These are the > most difficult to configure and tweak if something doesn't work > plug-and-play, and less adherent to standards. And you'll learn nothing. I really doubt that. The distributions that have automatic hardware detection and setup etc still use the same config files as more barebones distributions, and editing a config file on Mandrake is no harder than doing it on Slackware. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051203/996e0cd6/attachment-0001.bin From cesare at poeticstudios.com Sat Dec 3 17:21:32 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Sat Dec 3 17:21:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1133647175.7540.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> <1133647175.7540.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <43921A6C.80100@poeticstudios.com> Lars Luthman wrote: >On Sat, 2005-12-03 at 22:20 +0100, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > >>I guess there are a lot of better distributions out there. My only >>advice is to avoid a distro that does everything for you. These are the >>most difficult to configure and tweak if something doesn't work >>plug-and-play, and less adherent to standards. And you'll learn nothing. >> >> > >I really doubt that. The distributions that have automatic hardware >detection and setup etc still use the same config files as more >barebones distributions, and editing a config file on Mandrake is no >harder than doing it on Slackware. > > > That's right. But you're forced to learn how to do something if the distro doesn't do it for you. :-) c. From fbar at footils.org Sat Dec 3 17:23:45 2005 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat Dec 3 17:23:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051203222345.GE2073@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Brian Dunn hat gesagt: // Brian Dunn wrote: > So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? > good free documentation, reliable hardware support, > binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config > files that don't get re-written by some user friendly > script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except > for the whole doesn't work thing? AGNULA/Demudi. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ From yaqtil at gmail.com Sat Dec 3 17:32:33 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (ix) Date: Sat Dec 3 17:32:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1133647175.7540.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> <1133647175.7540.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512031432s76962c81m63d7778cc3560403@mail.gmail.com> > > advice is to avoid a distro that does everything for you. These are the > > most difficult to configure and tweak if something doesn't work > > plug-and-play, and less adherent to standards. And you'll learn nothing. > > I really doubt that. i tend to agree with mr "> >". i absolutely couldnt get a second screen going in SuSE since it wasnt autodetected/configured, yet in gentoo it was just a matter of 'emerge nvidia-kernel'. same with sound - all i had to do was echo ALSA_CARDS=mia >> /etc/make.conf && emerge alsa-driver && /etc/init.d/alsasound restart, but since the card wasnt autodetected and i couldnt even find a package containing alsa driver modules for debian, it required falling back to something even more primitive and timeconsuming (google for tarball location, grab tarball, configure, mess with make-kpkg, install crap, reboot, etc) > The distributions that have automatic hardware > detection and setup etc still use the same config files as more > barebones distributions, and editing a config file on Mandrake is no > harder than doing it on Slackware. if only it were that simple.. take things like the builtin GUI utilities being incredibly dumb and overwriting settings you changed behind the scenes. compared with the etc-update util in gentoo (or the similar thing in debian) these 'autoconfiguring' distrii often have no inkling that a user might want to override only certain things so my vote should be apparent.. From jouzts at gmail.com Sat Dec 3 18:24:35 2005 From: jouzts at gmail.com (John Ouzts) Date: Sat Dec 3 18:24:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Java Ambisonic b-format player Message-ID: <59c9195a0512031524w7dbe0566y82641be53e9e7feb@mail.gmail.com> Particularly for the Gentooists out there..... I downloaded and installed Roger Klaveness' Java ambisonics _player_ (not a plugin!) on Gentoo Linux for AMD64 according to Roger's very complete instructions: http://klaveness.info/roger/ambplay/ (Since the recommended Sun JDK 1.5 is not yet available for regular installation on Gentoo, I used the alternate axxo overlay, which installs dev-java/sun-jdk-1.5.0.05-r1along side the blackdown-jdk-1.4 default.) This alpha project already offers more than just the basics of an excellent, open source, cross-platform ambisonic player. It is known to work on Windows XP as well as Gentoo Linux. It plays 4 channel (b-format) flacs, as well as a wide variety of higher order Ambisonic and binaural material in several file formats. Memory and CPU usage is very reasonable while uncompressing and playing 4 channel flacs. This is real SURROUND sound, not 5.1 movie sound effects. The player decodes to as many as 12 speakers including some on the vertical axis. The success of this player has created a problem for me, however. I normally feed the S/PDIF output of my RME Digi96 PAD into my Panasonic SA-XR70 digital receiver. Now I need to feed at least four channels, not just a stereo pair, to the receiver, which has HDMI inputs for multi-channel for DVD-Audio players. (Ever heard of a sound card with an HDMI output?) My current theory is that I need to use the ADAT 8 channel output of the Digi96 to feed some sort of external converter that will make a 4 channel MPEG2, DTS or AC3 feed into a single S/PDIF or Toslink cable for me, since I don't want to go to analog only to be converted to digital again to feed the Panasonic's digital power amps. Does anyone in Linuxland know an elegant way to solve this problem? John From jesse at essej.net Sat Dec 3 18:57:40 2005 From: jesse at essej.net (Jesse Chappell) Date: Sat Dec 3 18:57:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Java Ambisonic b-format player In-Reply-To: <59c9195a0512031524w7dbe0566y82641be53e9e7feb@mail.gmail.com> References: <59c9195a0512031524w7dbe0566y82641be53e9e7feb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/3/05, John Ouzts wrote: > The success of this player has created a problem for me, however. I > normally feed the S/PDIF output of my RME Digi96 PAD into my Panasonic > SA-XR70 digital receiver. Now I need to feed at least four channels, > not just a stereo pair, to the receiver, which has HDMI inputs for > multi-channel for DVD-Audio players. (Ever heard of a sound card with > an HDMI output?) My current theory is that I need to use the ADAT 8 > channel output of the Digi96 to feed some sort of external converter > that will make a 4 channel MPEG2, DTS or AC3 feed into a single S/PDIF > or Toslink cable for me, since I don't want to go to analog only to be > converted to digital again to feed the Panasonic's digital power amps. Well, you can also convert the multichannel (4 in your case) output in software to AC3 using ac3jack ( http://essej.net/ac3jack/ ). That is if the java app can be made to use JACK. The Java sound stuff appears to use ALSA, so you might have to use the alsa-jack plugin in some fashion to do this. Let the ALSA masters comment more on that one. ac3jack uses the ffmpeg lib to do the AC3 encoding, and the quality is OK, not stellar. If you are interested in this route, I have some implementation updates that make it easier to use and more efficient (for streaming directly to a spdif output in realtime). Let me know, and I'll expedite that project. As a PS, I found the following comment in the docs for javasound that carelessly lump JACK into the category with all the other sound servers. [ Excerpted from http://www.jsresources.org/faq_misc.html#no_daemons ] "In Florian's and my opinion, mixing daemons like artsd, esd, JACK, rplay, NAS, yiff, ... are hacks that work around a shortcoming of the device drivers. We feel that mixing should be done either by the soundcard hardware or in software by the device driver." They clearly don't understand the full implications of what JACK is :) jlc From ce at christeck.de Sat Dec 3 19:03:27 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sat Dec 3 19:03:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <43921694.2080202@starband.net> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> <43921694.2080202@starband.net> Message-ID: <200512040103.27317.ce@christeck.de> > I luv this topic! :) Suffice to say, If we threw a bag of M&M's on > the floor, everyone would grab a different (their favorite) color! Hehe. Usually I tend to be quiet in these "Mine is longer than yours" or even "What is the best Distro for xyz purpose" discussions. Setting USE flags and the compile times are surely disadvantages of Gentoo, but what I really like is the easy update mechanism and (mainly) the fact that the repository really is huge and offers all packages in recent versions. This is a major advantage over the commercial and binary only distributions like SuSE or Mandriva. Debian could be an alternative to avoid the compile times, but Debian tends to be very slow in adopting new technologies. Anyway, the optimal distribution doesn't exist. But Gentoo survived longer than any other distro before on my machine :) . Best regards ce From ce at christeck.de Sat Dec 3 19:06:28 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sat Dec 3 19:05:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <43921A6C.80100@poeticstudios.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1133647175.7540.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <43921A6C.80100@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <200512040106.28287.ce@christeck.de> > That's right. But you're forced to learn how to do something if the > distro doesn't do it for you. :-) Seconded. I remember the times as I used Mandrake 10. Setting up DSL via DrakConf was a pain. So I edited the config file manually and I was done. The evil thing with all these GUI config frontends is that you are not told which config files these edit. It's as worse as on other operating systems. Best regards ce From chris at dukla.plus.com Sat Dec 3 19:22:46 2005 From: chris at dukla.plus.com (Chris Norris) Date: Sat Dec 3 19:22:52 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems with Roland PC-300 In-Reply-To: <200512031939.05161.pedro.lopez.cabanillas@gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2J7n021161@roar.music.columbia.edu> <200512031939.05161.pedro.lopez.cabanillas@gmail.com> Message-ID: <439236D6.4010802@dukla.plus.com> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- ALSA Audio Debug v0.1.0 - Sat Dec 3 22:35:15 GMT 2005 http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php?page=aadebug http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.txt Kernel ---------------------------------------------------- Linux dukla 2.6.13-15-default #1 Tue Sep 13 14:56:15 UTC 2005 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux Loaded Modules -------------------------------------------- snd_seq_midi 11840 0 snd_seq_midi_event 9088 1 snd_seq_midi snd_seq_dummy 4612 0 snd_usb_audio 93696 0 snd_usb_lib 19840 1 snd_usb_audio snd_hwdep 12448 1 snd_usb_audio snd_pcm_oss 70432 0 snd_mixer_oss 22144 1 snd_pcm_oss snd_seq 68824 3 snd_seq_midi,snd_seq_midi_event,snd_seq_dummy snd_via82xx 33696 1 snd_ac97_codec 117060 1 snd_via82xx snd_ac97_bus 3328 1 snd_ac97_codec snd_pcm 117260 4 snd_usb_audio,snd_pcm_oss,snd_via82xx,snd_ac97_codec snd_timer 29320 2 snd_seq,snd_pcm snd_page_alloc 13200 2 snd_via82xx,snd_pcm snd_mpu401_uart 9344 1 snd_via82xx snd_rawmidi 31904 3 snd_seq_midi,snd_usb_lib,snd_mpu401_uart snd_seq_device 11024 4 snd_seq_midi,snd_seq_dummy,snd_seq,snd_rawmidi snd 77600 18 snd_seq_midi,snd_seq_midi_event,snd_seq_dummy,snd_usb_audio,snd_usb_lib,snd_hwdep,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_seq,snd_via82xx,snd_ac97_codec,snd_pcm,snd_timer,snd_mpu401_uart,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq_device Proc Config ----------------------------------------------- CONFIG_SOUND=m CONFIG_SND=m CONFIG_SND_TIMER=m CONFIG_SND_PCM=m CONFIG_SND_HWDEP=m CONFIG_SND_RAWMIDI=m CONFIG_SND_SEQUENCER=m CONFIG_SND_SEQ_DUMMY=m CONFIG_SND_OSSEMUL=y CONFIG_SND_MIXER_OSS=m CONFIG_SND_PCM_OSS=m CONFIG_SND_SEQUENCER_OSS=y CONFIG_SND_RTCTIMER=m CONFIG_SND_VERBOSE_PRINTK=y CONFIG_SND_DEBUG=y CONFIG_SND_DEBUG_MEMORY=y # CONFIG_SND_DEBUG_DETECT is not set CONFIG_SND_MPU401_UART=m CONFIG_SND_OPL3_LIB=m CONFIG_SND_VX_LIB=m CONFIG_SND_DUMMY=m CONFIG_SND_VIRMIDI=m CONFIG_SND_MTPAV=m CONFIG_SND_SERIAL_U16550=m CONFIG_SND_MPU401=m CONFIG_SND_AC97_CODEC=m CONFIG_SND_AC97_BUS=m CONFIG_SND_ALI5451=m CONFIG_SND_ATIIXP=m CONFIG_SND_ATIIXP_MODEM=m CONFIG_SND_AU8810=m CONFIG_SND_AU8820=m CONFIG_SND_AU8830=m CONFIG_SND_AZT3328=m CONFIG_SND_BT87X=m # CONFIG_SND_BT87X_OVERCLOCK is not set CONFIG_SND_CS46XX=m CONFIG_SND_CS46XX_NEW_DSP=y CONFIG_SND_CS4281=m CONFIG_SND_EMU10K1=m CONFIG_SND_EMU10K1X=m CONFIG_SND_CA0106=m CONFIG_SND_KORG1212=m CONFIG_SND_MIXART=m CONFIG_SND_NM256=m CONFIG_SND_RME32=m CONFIG_SND_RME96=m CONFIG_SND_RME9652=m CONFIG_SND_HDSP=m CONFIG_SND_HDSPM=m CONFIG_SND_TRIDENT=m CONFIG_SND_YMFPCI=m CONFIG_SND_ALS4000=m CONFIG_SND_CMIPCI=m CONFIG_SND_ENS1370=m CONFIG_SND_ENS1371=m CONFIG_SND_ES1938=m CONFIG_SND_ES1968=m CONFIG_SND_MAESTRO3=m CONFIG_SND_FM801=m CONFIG_SND_FM801_TEA575X=m CONFIG_SND_ICE1712=m CONFIG_SND_ICE1724=m CONFIG_SND_INTEL8X0=m CONFIG_SND_INTEL8X0M=m CONFIG_SND_SONICVIBES=m CONFIG_SND_VIA82XX=m CONFIG_SND_VIA82XX_MODEM=m CONFIG_SND_VX222=m CONFIG_SND_HDA_INTEL=m CONFIG_SND_USB_AUDIO=m CONFIG_SND_USB_USX2Y=m CONFIG_SOUND_PRIME=m CONFIG_SOUND_BT878=m CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI=m CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI_FM=y CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI_MIDI=y CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI_JOYSTICK=y CONFIG_SOUND_EMU10K1=m # CONFIG_SOUND_FUSION is not set CONFIG_SOUND_CS4281=m CONFIG_SOUND_ES1370=m CONFIG_SOUND_ES1371=m CONFIG_SOUND_ESSSOLO1=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAESTRO=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAESTRO3=m CONFIG_SOUND_ICH=m CONFIG_SOUND_SONICVIBES=m CONFIG_SOUND_TRIDENT=m # CONFIG_SOUND_MSNDCLAS is not set # CONFIG_SOUND_MSNDPIN is not set CONFIG_SOUND_VIA82CXXX=m CONFIG_SOUND_OSS=m CONFIG_SOUND_TRACEINIT=y CONFIG_SOUND_DMAP=y CONFIG_SOUND_AD1816=m CONFIG_SOUND_AD1889=m CONFIG_SOUND_SGALAXY=m CONFIG_SOUND_ADLIB=m CONFIG_SOUND_ACI_MIXER=m CONFIG_SOUND_CS4232=m CONFIG_SOUND_SSCAPE=m CONFIG_SOUND_GUS=m # CONFIG_SOUND_GUS16 is not set CONFIG_SOUND_GUSMAX=y CONFIG_SOUND_VMIDI=m CONFIG_SOUND_TRIX=m CONFIG_SOUND_MSS=m CONFIG_SOUND_MPU401=m CONFIG_SOUND_NM256=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAD16=m CONFIG_SOUND_PAS=m CONFIG_SOUND_PSS=m CONFIG_SOUND_SB=m CONFIG_SOUND_AWE32_SYNTH=m CONFIG_SOUND_WAVEFRONT=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAUI=m CONFIG_SOUND_YM3812=m CONFIG_SOUND_OPL3SA1=m CONFIG_SOUND_OPL3SA2=m CONFIG_SOUND_YMFPCI=m CONFIG_SOUND_YMFPCI_LEGACY=y CONFIG_SOUND_UART6850=m CONFIG_SOUND_AEDSP16=m CONFIG_SOUND_TVMIXER=m CONFIG_SOUND_KAHLUA=m CONFIG_SOUND_ALI5455=m CONFIG_SOUND_FORTE=m CONFIG_SOUND_RME96XX=m CONFIG_SOUND_AD1980=m Modprobe Conf --------------------------------------------- # remove this if sound is configured Proc Asound ----------------------------------------------- Advanced Linux Sound Architecture Driver Version 1.0.9b (Thu Jul 28 12:20:13 2005 UTC). 0 [V8237 ]: VIA8237 - VIA 8237 VIA 8237 with ALC658D at 0xe000, irq 177 1 [PC300 ]: USB-Audio - PC-300 Roland PC-300 at usb-0000:00:10.2-2, full speed 17: [0- 1]: digital audio playback 25: [0- 1]: digital audio capture 16: [0- 0]: digital audio playback 24: [0- 0]: digital audio capture 0: [0- 0]: ctl 1: : sequencer 33: : timer 40: [1- 0]: raw midi 32: [1- 0]: ctl 00-00: VIA 8237 : VIA 8237 : playback 4 : capture 1 00-01: VIA 8237 : VIA 8237 : playback 1 : capture 1 Client info cur clients : 3 peak clients : 5 max clients : 192 Client 0 : "System" [Kernel] Port 0 : "Timer" (Rwe-) Port 1 : "Announce" (R-e-) Client 62 : "Midi Through" [Kernel] Port 0 : "Midi Through Port-0" (RWe-) Client 72 : "PC-300" [Kernel] Port 0 : "PC-300 MIDI 1" (RWeX) Dev Snd --------------------------------------------------- controlC0 midiC1D0 pcmC0D0p pcmC0D1p timer controlC1 pcmC0D0c pcmC0D1c seq CPU ------------------------------------------------------- model name : AMD Sempron(tm) Processor 3000+ cpu MHz : 2289.878 RAM ------------------------------------------------------- MemTotal: 508760 kB SwapTotal: 1036184 kB Hardware -------------------------------------------------- 00:00.0 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.1 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.2 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.3 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.4 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.7 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:11.5 Multimedia audio controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8233/A/8235/8237 AC97 Audio Controller (rev 60) 00:18.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] HyperTransport Technology Configuration 00:18.1 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Address Map 00:18.2 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] DRAM Controller 00:18.3 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Miscellaneous Control -------------- next part -------------- ALSA Audio Debug v0.1.0 - Sat Dec 3 20:08:16 GMT 2005 http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php?page=aadebug http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.txt Kernel ---------------------------------------------------- Linux dukla 2.6.13-15-default #1 Tue Sep 13 14:56:15 UTC 2005 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux Loaded Modules -------------------------------------------- snd_usb_audio 93696 0 snd_usb_lib 19840 1 snd_usb_audio snd_hwdep 12448 1 snd_usb_audio snd_seq_dummy 4612 0 snd_pcm_oss 70432 0 snd_mixer_oss 22144 1 snd_pcm_oss snd_seq 68824 1 snd_seq_dummy snd_via82xx 33696 1 snd_ac97_codec 117060 1 snd_via82xx snd_ac97_bus 3328 1 snd_ac97_codec snd_pcm 117260 4 snd_usb_audio,snd_pcm_oss,snd_via82xx,snd_ac97_codec snd_timer 29320 2 snd_seq,snd_pcm snd_page_alloc 13200 2 snd_via82xx,snd_pcm snd_mpu401_uart 9344 1 snd_via82xx snd_rawmidi 31904 2 snd_usb_lib,snd_mpu401_uart snd_seq_device 11024 3 snd_seq_dummy,snd_seq,snd_rawmidi snd 77600 16 snd_usb_audio,snd_usb_lib,snd_hwdep,snd_seq_dummy,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_seq,snd_via82xx,snd_ac97_codec,snd_pcm,snd_timer,snd_mpu401_uart,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq_device Proc Config ----------------------------------------------- CONFIG_SOUND=m CONFIG_SND=m CONFIG_SND_TIMER=m CONFIG_SND_PCM=m CONFIG_SND_HWDEP=m CONFIG_SND_RAWMIDI=m CONFIG_SND_SEQUENCER=m CONFIG_SND_SEQ_DUMMY=m CONFIG_SND_OSSEMUL=y CONFIG_SND_MIXER_OSS=m CONFIG_SND_PCM_OSS=m CONFIG_SND_SEQUENCER_OSS=y CONFIG_SND_RTCTIMER=m CONFIG_SND_VERBOSE_PRINTK=y CONFIG_SND_DEBUG=y CONFIG_SND_DEBUG_MEMORY=y # CONFIG_SND_DEBUG_DETECT is not set CONFIG_SND_MPU401_UART=m CONFIG_SND_OPL3_LIB=m CONFIG_SND_VX_LIB=m CONFIG_SND_DUMMY=m CONFIG_SND_VIRMIDI=m CONFIG_SND_MTPAV=m CONFIG_SND_SERIAL_U16550=m CONFIG_SND_MPU401=m CONFIG_SND_AC97_CODEC=m CONFIG_SND_AC97_BUS=m CONFIG_SND_ALI5451=m CONFIG_SND_ATIIXP=m CONFIG_SND_ATIIXP_MODEM=m CONFIG_SND_AU8810=m CONFIG_SND_AU8820=m CONFIG_SND_AU8830=m CONFIG_SND_AZT3328=m CONFIG_SND_BT87X=m # CONFIG_SND_BT87X_OVERCLOCK is not set CONFIG_SND_CS46XX=m CONFIG_SND_CS46XX_NEW_DSP=y CONFIG_SND_CS4281=m CONFIG_SND_EMU10K1=m CONFIG_SND_EMU10K1X=m CONFIG_SND_CA0106=m CONFIG_SND_KORG1212=m CONFIG_SND_MIXART=m CONFIG_SND_NM256=m CONFIG_SND_RME32=m CONFIG_SND_RME96=m CONFIG_SND_RME9652=m CONFIG_SND_HDSP=m CONFIG_SND_HDSPM=m CONFIG_SND_TRIDENT=m CONFIG_SND_YMFPCI=m CONFIG_SND_ALS4000=m CONFIG_SND_CMIPCI=m CONFIG_SND_ENS1370=m CONFIG_SND_ENS1371=m CONFIG_SND_ES1938=m CONFIG_SND_ES1968=m CONFIG_SND_MAESTRO3=m CONFIG_SND_FM801=m CONFIG_SND_FM801_TEA575X=m CONFIG_SND_ICE1712=m CONFIG_SND_ICE1724=m CONFIG_SND_INTEL8X0=m CONFIG_SND_INTEL8X0M=m CONFIG_SND_SONICVIBES=m CONFIG_SND_VIA82XX=m CONFIG_SND_VIA82XX_MODEM=m CONFIG_SND_VX222=m CONFIG_SND_HDA_INTEL=m CONFIG_SND_USB_AUDIO=m CONFIG_SND_USB_USX2Y=m CONFIG_SOUND_PRIME=m CONFIG_SOUND_BT878=m CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI=m CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI_FM=y CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI_MIDI=y CONFIG_SOUND_CMPCI_JOYSTICK=y CONFIG_SOUND_EMU10K1=m # CONFIG_SOUND_FUSION is not set CONFIG_SOUND_CS4281=m CONFIG_SOUND_ES1370=m CONFIG_SOUND_ES1371=m CONFIG_SOUND_ESSSOLO1=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAESTRO=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAESTRO3=m CONFIG_SOUND_ICH=m CONFIG_SOUND_SONICVIBES=m CONFIG_SOUND_TRIDENT=m # CONFIG_SOUND_MSNDCLAS is not set # CONFIG_SOUND_MSNDPIN is not set CONFIG_SOUND_VIA82CXXX=m CONFIG_SOUND_OSS=m CONFIG_SOUND_TRACEINIT=y CONFIG_SOUND_DMAP=y CONFIG_SOUND_AD1816=m CONFIG_SOUND_AD1889=m CONFIG_SOUND_SGALAXY=m CONFIG_SOUND_ADLIB=m CONFIG_SOUND_ACI_MIXER=m CONFIG_SOUND_CS4232=m CONFIG_SOUND_SSCAPE=m CONFIG_SOUND_GUS=m # CONFIG_SOUND_GUS16 is not set CONFIG_SOUND_GUSMAX=y CONFIG_SOUND_VMIDI=m CONFIG_SOUND_TRIX=m CONFIG_SOUND_MSS=m CONFIG_SOUND_MPU401=m CONFIG_SOUND_NM256=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAD16=m CONFIG_SOUND_PAS=m CONFIG_SOUND_PSS=m CONFIG_SOUND_SB=m CONFIG_SOUND_AWE32_SYNTH=m CONFIG_SOUND_WAVEFRONT=m CONFIG_SOUND_MAUI=m CONFIG_SOUND_YM3812=m CONFIG_SOUND_OPL3SA1=m CONFIG_SOUND_OPL3SA2=m CONFIG_SOUND_YMFPCI=m CONFIG_SOUND_YMFPCI_LEGACY=y CONFIG_SOUND_UART6850=m CONFIG_SOUND_AEDSP16=m CONFIG_SOUND_TVMIXER=m CONFIG_SOUND_KAHLUA=m CONFIG_SOUND_ALI5455=m CONFIG_SOUND_FORTE=m CONFIG_SOUND_RME96XX=m CONFIG_SOUND_AD1980=m Modprobe Conf --------------------------------------------- # remove this if sound is configured Proc Asound ----------------------------------------------- Advanced Linux Sound Architecture Driver Version 1.0.9b (Thu Jul 28 12:20:13 2005 UTC). 0 [V8237 ]: VIA8237 - VIA 8237 VIA 8237 with ALC658D at 0xe000, irq 177 1 [PC300 ]: USB-Audio - PC-300 Roland PC-300 at usb-0000:00:10.2-2, full speed 17: [0- 1]: digital audio playback 25: [0- 1]: digital audio capture 16: [0- 0]: digital audio playback 24: [0- 0]: digital audio capture 0: [0- 0]: ctl 1: : sequencer 33: : timer 32: [1- 0]: ctl 00-00: VIA 8237 : VIA 8237 : playback 4 : capture 1 00-01: VIA 8237 : VIA 8237 : playback 1 : capture 1 Client info cur clients : 2 peak clients : 6 max clients : 192 Client 0 : "System" [Kernel] Port 0 : "Timer" (Rwe-) Port 1 : "Announce" (R-e-) Client 62 : "Midi Through" [Kernel] Port 0 : "Midi Through Port-0" (RWe-) Dev Snd --------------------------------------------------- controlC0 controlC1 pcmC0D0c pcmC0D0p pcmC0D1c pcmC0D1p seq timer CPU ------------------------------------------------------- model name : AMD Sempron(tm) Processor 3000+ cpu MHz : 2289.866 RAM ------------------------------------------------------- MemTotal: 508760 kB SwapTotal: 1036184 kB Hardware -------------------------------------------------- 00:00.0 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.1 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.2 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.3 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.4 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:00.7 Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. K8T800Pro Host Bridge 00:11.5 Multimedia audio controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8233/A/8235/8237 AC97 Audio Controller (rev 60) 00:18.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] HyperTransport Technology Configuration 00:18.1 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Address Map 00:18.2 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] DRAM Controller 00:18.3 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Miscellaneous Control From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Sat Dec 3 19:37:11 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Sat Dec 3 19:37:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203222345.GE2073@fliwatut.scifi> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20051203222345.GE2073@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <43923A37.4070406@walescomputers.co.uk> Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Brian Dunn hat gesagt: // Brian Dunn wrote: > > >>So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? >>good free documentation, reliable hardware support, >>binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config >>files that don't get re-written by some user friendly >>script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except >>for the whole doesn't work thing? > AGNULA/Demudi. Yep and 64studio for us who think we need speed!! Cheers Bob > Ciao -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From fbar at footils.org Sat Dec 3 19:58:44 2005 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat Dec 3 19:58:51 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512040103.27317.ce@christeck.de> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> <43921694.2080202@starband.net> <200512040103.27317.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <20051204005844.GG2073@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Christoph Eckert hat gesagt: // Christoph Eckert wrote: > Debian could be an alternative to avoid the compile times, but Debian > tends to be very slow in adopting new technologies. Make that: "... slow in adopting new technologies *into Debian stable*". You can get very current packages if you run Debian testing, Debian unstable or Demudi rsp. Ubuntu. And the package count in Debian traditionally is *HUGE*. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ From markknecht at gmail.com Sat Dec 3 20:28:22 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sat Dec 3 20:28:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> On 12/3/05, Brian Dunn wrote: > So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? > good free documentation, reliable hardware support, > binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config > files that don't get re-written by some user friendly > script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except > for the whole doesn't work thing? > > If your system works the way you want it too most of > the time, i want to hear your opinion. > > gratefull, > Brian > I have two opinions: 1) If I want *exactly* what Fernando provides on the Planet site, no more and no less, then PlanetCCRMA is the best I know of. It's well supported in the audio area by a great guy. It has a good mailing list with helpful people. (Of which I hope I'm one once in awhile anyway.) Overall very positive, but it has two downsides: a) If you need ANYTHING that's not part of the Planet apt system then be prepared for RPM hell. At least that's my experience. Email, DVD stuff, etc. b) Pick your Fedora version and be prepared to upgrade, upgrade, upgrade. Every release of FC# is an opportunity to rebuild your system from scratch. I know some folks report that they just do an upgrade and it works for them but I'm sure that not a single one ever worked for me. 2) The best overall distro, in my experience, for package availablity and stability is Gentoo. I have pretty much every app I can think of using. When I want to use something that's not in portage I have never had to find a library that wasn't already supported. Best of all I have a 3 year old Gentoo system that is completely equal to my newest Gentoo system. The portage/emerge system means never having to say 'upgrade'. There are other good options - DeMudi being themost notible. I've never run it but we hear good things. There are other minor distros like 64studio and PCOS (I think that's what it's called) that are worth looking at. With all the press about Ubuntu I'd imaginge it's worth a look, but I don't know who uses it for audio. Probably this is a rehash of the other responses. Hope it added something. cheers, Mark From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sat Dec 3 20:58:14 2005 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Sat Dec 3 20:58:19 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133661494.16477.83.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Sat, 2005-12-03 at 17:28 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/3/05, Brian Dunn wrote: > > > So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? > > good free documentation, reliable hardware support, > > binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config > > files that don't get re-written by some user friendly > > script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except > > for the whole doesn't work thing? > > > > If your system works the way you want it too most of > > the time, i want to hear your opinion. > > > > gratefull, > > Brian > > > > I have two opinions: > > 1) If I want *exactly* what Fernando provides on the Planet site, no > more and no less, then PlanetCCRMA is the best I know of. It's well > supported in the audio area by a great guy. It has a good mailing list > with helpful people. (Of which I hope I'm one once in awhile anyway.) > Overall very positive, but it has two downsides: > > a) If you need ANYTHING that's not part of the Planet apt system then > be prepared for RPM hell. At least that's my experience. Email, DVD > stuff, etc. Hmmmm, I'd dare say this is a bit extreme :-) I'm not saying this is easy, of course. I'm not saying that it is better or greater than other distros, either. I'm not saying that I can be objective :-) ;-) :-p The ammount of work depends on what "anything" is. Anything that is in Fedora Core should be easy (includes email I guess). Anything in other apt/yum repositories is usually fine. If you want to build your own packages from source you will need to install the required development packages and maybe that is what you mean by "RPM hell[*]", but I imagine that should be the case in other distros as well - unless they don't make a separation between base and developer packages, perhaps that's the case with gentoo. You may run into stumbling blocks if whatever you are trying to build depends on newer versions of core packages than the ones provided by the base distro, that can of course be a problem. YMMV... -- Fernando [*] usually "RPM Hell" was meant to describe the situation in which you want to install an isolated package (an RPM in the case of rpm based distros), and it requires another package you don't have, and after finding it it requires another, and so on and so forth. This particular situation is old history, these days you can use dependency resolvers such as apt, yum or smart to resolve dependencies automatically for you. From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Sat Dec 3 22:49:55 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Sat Dec 3 22:49:57 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133668195.8742.5.camel@eviltwin> On Sat, 2005-12-03 at 17:28 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/3/05, Brian Dunn wrote: > > > So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? > > good free documentation, reliable hardware support, > > binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config > > files that don't get re-written by some user friendly > > script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except > > for the whole doesn't work thing? > > > > If your system works the way you want it too most of > > the time, i want to hear your opinion. > > > > gratefull, > > Brian > > > > I have two opinions: > > 1) If I want *exactly* what Fernando provides on the Planet site, no > more and no less, then PlanetCCRMA is the best I know of. It's well > supported in the audio area by a great guy. It has a good mailing list > with helpful people. (Of which I hope I'm one once in awhile anyway.) > Overall very positive, but it has two downsides: > Yep, you're one of them ;-) > a) If you need ANYTHING that's not part of the Planet apt system then > be prepared for RPM hell. At least that's my experience. Email, DVD > stuff, etc. > I don't have any trouble with things that aren't covered in CCRMA. I just download the source and build it. No RPMs = no RPM hell. I normally build JACK, Ardour, and JAMin from source anyway. > b) Pick your Fedora version and be prepared to upgrade, upgrade, > upgrade. Every release of FC# is an opportunity to rebuild your system > from scratch. I know some folks report that they just do an upgrade > and it works for them but I'm sure that not a single one ever worked > for me. This is true in part. I NEVER upgrade. I also have never had one work correctly and every time I tried it left a lot of loose ends laying around. On the other hand, I stayed on FC1 for a couple of years before I switched up to FC4 (three days ago) because it was stable. I wouldn't recommend FC4 from the Planet just yet though as it is still a work in progress. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From smassy at sdf.lonestar.org Sat Dec 3 23:31:29 2005 From: smassy at sdf.lonestar.org (S. Massy) Date: Sat Dec 3 23:31:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <43920C24.3010102@poeticstudios.com> <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <20051204043129.GA1428@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG> On Sat, Dec 03, 2005 at 10:34:51PM +0100, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > > Just try Slackware. Things will not work out of the box, but you'll > > learn the basics of gnu/Linux and you'll have a stable and clean > > system, without the need to compile everything from scratch (as with > > Gentoo). > > ;-))) > > > Needless to say that I'm very happy with my Gentoo audio box :) . I would definitely second that. I recently bought this used computer (with relatively modest specs) and installed Gentoo Linux on it (my first time, since I'm usually a Debian-man) and have so far enjoyed surprisingly good performance, as far as low-latency audio goes. Besides, if you don't mind getting your hands dirty, it can be really fun and instructive. Cheers, S.M. > > > Best regards > > > ce > > -- smassy@sdf.lonestar.org From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Sun Dec 4 00:22:52 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Sun Dec 4 00:23:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051204043129.GA1428@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG> Message-ID: <20051204052252.91007.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> Debian has been my desktop for almost seven years. After trying Mandrake, RedHat, Slackware and some of their derivatives, I always reverted back to Debian. I agree that Debian Stable is a slow mover, but think of Debian Stable and Debian Testing remotely akin to RedHat *S and Fedora. Debian Stable moves slowly and it seems things take forever to get there from Testing. The same could be said for Fedora Core and RedHat's *S commercial offerings. If you want pre-built package rotation to move fast, don't use RedHat *S and use Fedora. If you want your package rotation to move faster, use Debian Testing instead of Debian Stable. Debian is also my choice because I have Linux installs on both Mac and PC; it is easier to maintain both systems when using the same distro. I was a lurker on Fernando's list, and got a great deal of very helpful information there. However, I took that info and applied it to my Debian Testing system. No matter what your distro, It will deviate from the pristine snapshot provided by pre-built binary packages. You will probalby need to compile something, edit a file somewhere, upgrade a library . . . I would suggest just pick something and stick with it through the tough times because you will have to do something out of your package management at some point down the road. That statement is more true than you think, especially with sound and music apps on Linux. -=Sean Edwards=- __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From timg at expressmart.com Sun Dec 4 02:59:29 2005 From: timg at expressmart.com (timg@expressmart.com) Date: Sun Dec 4 03:11:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051204052252.91007.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051204043129.GA1428@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG> <20051204052252.91007.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1869.24.97.120.120.1133683169.squirrel@24.97.112.38> Fedora rocks... Slak for me though...... it seems pure..... > Debian has been my desktop for almost seven years. > After trying Mandrake, RedHat, Slackware and some of > their derivatives, I always reverted back to Debian. > I agree that Debian Stable is a slow mover, but think > of Debian Stable and Debian Testing remotely akin to > RedHat *S and Fedora. Debian Stable moves slowly and > it seems things take forever to get there from > Testing. The same could be said for Fedora Core and > RedHat's *S commercial offerings. If you want > pre-built package rotation to move fast, don't use > RedHat *S and use Fedora. If you want your package > rotation to move faster, use Debian Testing instead of > Debian Stable. Debian is also my choice because I > have Linux installs on both Mac and PC; it is easier > to maintain both systems when using the same distro. > > I was a lurker on Fernando's list, and got a great > deal of very helpful information there. However, I > took that info and applied it to my Debian Testing > system. No matter what your distro, It will deviate > from the pristine snapshot provided by pre-built > binary packages. You will probalby need to compile > something, edit a file somewhere, upgrade a library . > . . > > I would suggest just pick something and stick with it > through the tough times because you will have to do > something out of your package management at some point > down the road. That statement is more true than you > think, especially with sound and music apps on Linux. > > -=Sean Edwards=- > > > > > > __________________________________ > Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs > -- There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened. -- Douglas Adams, The Restaurant at the End of the Universe From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 4 05:55:59 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 4 05:55:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051204005844.GG2073@fliwatut.scifi> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200512040103.27317.ce@christeck.de> <20051204005844.GG2073@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <200512041155.59734.ce@christeck.de> > Make that: "... slow in adopting new technologies *into Debian > stable*". ?You can get very current packages if you run Debian > testing That's true. I even remember that someone told me he's updating his "Testing" machine every night by a cron job :) . Best regards ce From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 4 05:59:33 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 4 05:58:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512041159.33102.ce@christeck.de> > With all the press about Ubuntu I'd imaginge it's > worth a look, but I don't know who uses it for audio. I heard rumors that it's a bit hard to convert it into an audio machine, but I also heard about people who have been very successful using it for audio. Best regards ce From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 4 06:11:51 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 4 06:11:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051204043129.GA1428@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <200512032234.51916.ce@christeck.de> <20051204043129.GA1428@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG> Message-ID: <200512041211.51553.ce@christeck.de> > Besides, if you don't mind getting your hands dirty, it can be really > fun and instructive. It's surely not for the Linux n00b, but I think that it is *much* easier to edit a config file instead of struggling with certain GUI setup tools. I remember that I once tried to configure a DSL connection in Mandrake 10, and I did fail. Finally, learn edit the config files and you're done. That's why I like Gentoo for not trying to invent yet another setup tool :) . Best regards ce From dubphil at free.fr Sun Dec 4 09:14:02 2005 From: dubphil at free.fr (Dubphil) Date: Sun Dec 4 07:15:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051204141402.GB10014@migratis.net> On Sat, Dec 03, 2005 at 12:02:18PM -0800, Brian Dunn wrote: > > If your system works the way you want it too most of > the time, i want to hear your opinion. > My only advice, if you intend to make music *seriously* with Linux : take one or two month to choose your system and compare with those two criterias. - The first criteria imho is the compatibility between your hardware and your operating system. All of the prebuilt kernel of all the distros where not enough tuned for my USB soundcard (unstability, xruns...etc). So I was obliged to compil my own kernel. From this point of view, choose the distro that provides the easiest way to manage the kernel building. For me the N?1 is of course Gentoo. - Matters of availability, in the package repository of the distro, latest versions or whatever concerning an audio software package will become very useless when, one day or another, you will have to compil the main softwares set of your audio system. From this point of view, choose the distro that provides the most reliable compilation environment. For me the N?1 is of course Gentoo. This was the result of an heavy testing of DeMuDI, AudioSlack, PlanetCCRMA. To attest my objectivity, My operating system of choice, at my work, is Debian for other reasons than audio consideration... :) Best regards Philippe From atte.jensen at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 07:18:53 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Sun Dec 4 07:18:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] joystick => midi Message-ID: <4392DEAD.9000506@gmail.com> Hi I have a usb joystick (Logitech Extreme 3D pro) that I'd like to be able to use for controlling stuff in my synth (om). Is it possible to have it show up as an alsa device? If so how? I don't know too much about joysticks in the first place, but it seems to be connected to /dev/input/js0, at least "cat /dev/input/js0" outputs garbage when moving the joystick... Thanks in advance... -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From mista.tapas at gmx.net Sun Dec 4 07:49:00 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Sun Dec 4 07:49:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] joystick => midi In-Reply-To: <4392DEAD.9000506@gmail.com> References: <4392DEAD.9000506@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051204134900.15b556c1@mango.fruits.de> On Sun, 04 Dec 2005 13:18:53 +0100 Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Hi > > I have a usb joystick (Logitech Extreme 3D pro) that I'd like to be able > to use for controlling stuff in my synth (om). Is it possible to have it > show up as an alsa device? If so how? I don't know too much about > joysticks in the first place, but it seems to be connected to > /dev/input/js0, at least "cat /dev/input/js0" outputs garbage when > moving the joystick... > > Thanks in advance... aseqjoy have fun, flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 4 07:52:40 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 4 07:52:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] joystick => midi In-Reply-To: <4392DEAD.9000506@gmail.com> References: <4392DEAD.9000506@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512041352.40900.ce@christeck.de> > I have a usb joystick (Logitech Extreme 3D pro) that I'd like to be > able to use for controlling stuff in my synth (om). Is it possible to > have it show up as an alsa device? If so how? I don't know too much > about joysticks in the first place, but it seems to be connected to > /dev/input/js0, at least "cat /dev/input/js0" outputs garbage when > moving the joystick... Maybe you can use it in conjunction with raton/x. Requirement: It behaves like a mouse. Best regards ce From sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk Sun Dec 4 08:19:35 2005 From: sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk (guy) Date: Sun Dec 4 08:19:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4392ECE7.2040304@tiscali.co.uk> Brian Dunn wrote: >The possibility of using and contributing to studio >quality audio software is really what first sparked my >interest in linux. So I installed Mandrake 10.1, >because someone gave it to me and it sounded cool. >Since then i've had a lot of fun with it, using their >mm kernel and running jack with seq24 and trying to >come up with something cool enough to use ardour for, >and everything ran relatively reliably. ( ....snip) >So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? >good free documentation, reliable hardware support, >binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config >files that don't get re-written by some user friendly >script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except >for the whole doesn't work thing? > >If your system works the way you want it too most of >the time, i want to hear your opinion. > >gratefull, >Brian > > >Hi > >I think the choice boils down to two things. You either need to have a distro where all the music software you want is packaged for you (like demudi or PCLinuxOS, or a distro where source packages compile well from source. I choose Slackware because of the latter: because of its 'vanilla' approach most things compile well from source, which for a non-programmer like me who cannot 'fix' things is essential, including re-compiling the kernel. I am very happy with the result. > > Regards Guy -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.362 / Virus Database: 267.13.11/191 - Release Date: 02/12/2005 ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Model Search 2005 - Find the next catwalk superstars - http://uk.news.yahoo.com/hot/model-search/ From fbar at footils.org Sun Dec 4 08:38:14 2005 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun Dec 4 08:38:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] joystick => midi In-Reply-To: <20051204134900.15b556c1@mango.fruits.de> References: <4392DEAD.9000506@gmail.com> <20051204134900.15b556c1@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <20051204133814.GL2073@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Florian Schmidt hat gesagt: // Florian Schmidt wrote: > On Sun, 04 Dec 2005 13:18:53 +0100 > Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > > I have a usb joystick (Logitech Extreme 3D pro) that I'd like to be able > > to use for controlling stuff in my synth (om). Is it possible to have it > > show up as an alsa device? If so how? I don't know too much about > > joysticks in the first place, but it seems to be connected to > > /dev/input/js0, at least "cat /dev/input/js0" outputs garbage when > > moving the joystick... > > aseqjoy It seems that aseqjoy doesn't support the buttons and also doesn't allow to scale the joystick data in various ways. If you need something more, I can very much recommend to use Pd in conjunction with either the [joystick] external or the more general [hid] external, which can map any USB hid device (mouse, joystick, keyboard, sensors, dj consoles etc.) to whatever you want (Midi, OSC, numbers etc. [hid] comes with many utility objects dealing with things like converting between polar and cartesian coordinates, which is handy if for example you want to use the distance from the center as amplitude and the angle as frequency. Try that with aseqjoy! In short: [hid] is power- and wonderful. Read more at http://at.or.at/hans/pd/hid.html and http://at.or.at/hans/research/nime/ Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Sun Dec 4 09:12:59 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Sun Dec 4 08:57:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4392F96B.3090406@woh.rr.com> Brian Dunn wrote: >If your system works the way you want it too most of >the time, i want to hear your opinion. > > Hi Brian: I have two machines I use for music (and everything else too). My laptop is a PII 366 HP Omnibook 4150, not a very powerful machine at all. It isn't suitable for serious audio work, so I mainly use it for writing and for some MIDI work. That machine is running Planet CCRMA Red Hat 9. Yes, it's an old system, but it performs flawlessly with apps such as seq24, QSynth, and Sequencer Plus (under DOSemu). My desktop box has two systems on its drives. Again, Planet CCRMA's RH9 runs on one, AGNULA/Demudi runs on the other. The RH9 systems use a 2.4 kernel and are tuned according to Fernando's excellent instructions. However, I don't use many of the Planet C packages, I prefer to build the apps locally. And here's where the major problem with the system kicks in: If I want to build a newer package like, for example, Om, the default system components won't do the job. Alas, upgrading the major components like GTK, gtkmm, the KDE libs and the associated Qt build, all this turns rapidly into a nightmare. Thus, while Planet C's RH9 can claim excellent performance it's just not very easy to update to accommodate the newer stuff. On my laptop that's not much of an issue, but it's a problem for the desktop machine if I want to test and report on the newer apps. Performance on the laptop under Planet C's FC3 was not so good, and I've been reluctant to try again with a more recent version of FC. My AGNULA/Demudi system is based around a 2.6 kernel. It also works quite nicely, and it has the advantage of being more up-to-date in its components. However, even that system is not as current as I'd like, and I still run into problems compiling programs that need the absolute latest versions of their dependencies. I'm fairly experienced with Linux, and I often consider building a system "from scratch", i.e., start with a distro that offers the very latest GTK2, Qt4, most recent KDE and GNOME libs, and so forth, then start building the apps I want to run. I used Slackware when I first started with Linux, maybe I'll return to it someday. Btw, you might like to know that my desktop machine is only an 800 MHz box, but Ardour, JAMin, ecasound, Rosegarden, Hydrogen, etc. all work beautifully on it, regardless of the underlying system. Linux rules, Linux audio developers rock. :) So there's my two ducats. Best, dp From ninjadroid at gazuga.net Sun Dec 4 12:18:58 2005 From: ninjadroid at gazuga.net (Pete Bessman) Date: Sun Dec 4 12:19:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1133716738.9906.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> Lindows. -- Pete Bessman http://gazuga.net "So this baby seal walks into a club." From markknecht at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 14:06:10 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sun Dec 4 14:06:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1133661494.16477.83.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> <1133661494.16477.83.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512041106v546f81f7q4b9cc9b0740719e9@mail.gmail.com> On 12/3/05, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > On Sat, 2005-12-03 at 17:28 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On 12/3/05, Brian Dunn wrote: > > > > > So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? > > > good free documentation, reliable hardware support, > > > binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config > > > files that don't get re-written by some user friendly > > > script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except > > > for the whole doesn't work thing? > > > > > > If your system works the way you want it too most of > > > the time, i want to hear your opinion. > > > > > > gratefull, > > > Brian > > > > > > > I have two opinions: > > > > 1) If I want *exactly* what Fernando provides on the Planet site, no > > more and no less, then PlanetCCRMA is the best I know of. It's well > > supported in the audio area by a great guy. It has a good mailing list > > with helpful people. (Of which I hope I'm one once in awhile anyway.) > > Overall very positive, but it has two downsides: > > > > a) If you need ANYTHING that's not part of the Planet apt system then > > be prepared for RPM hell. At least that's my experience. Email, DVD > > stuff, etc. > > Hmmmm, I'd dare say this is a bit extreme :-) Yeah, most probably you are correct, but it's my unfortunatel view of the world of prepackaged distros. They work really well when I use exactly what they provide. As soon as I go outside of that boundry they get dodgy in my experience. > > I'm not saying this is easy, of course. > I'm not saying that it is better or greater than other distros, either. > I'm not saying that I can be objective :-) ;-) :-p As objective as anyone about distro religion and you have 100x more rights to speak you mind based on the work you've done. > > The ammount of work depends on what "anything" is. Anything that is in > Fedora Core should be easy (includes email I guess). Yes, there are many good solutions for email clients. I should not have included this. > Anything in other > apt/yum repositories is usually fine. This is where I ran into many problems and eventually got put off. > If you want to build your own > packages from source you will need to install the required development > packages and maybe that is what you mean by "RPM hell[*]", but I imagine > that should be the case in other distros as well - unless they don't > make a separation between base and developer packages, perhaps that's > the case with gentoo. You may run into stumbling blocks if whatever you > are trying to build depends on newer versions of core packages than the > ones provided by the base distro, that can of course be a problem. That is the problem I ran into many times. I got started with some app on Gentoo and built, for instance, Aqualung. The Aqualung guys used whatever library they wanted to use, and I had no problem finding it on Gentoo. Aqualung worked. Then I wanted to build it on FC and found that the library didn't exist. You would look into installing some RPM, but maybe it didn't come from the same depository I was getting everything else. I start changing apt setup files to get stuff, then forget I've made changes, then download stuff the next day that maybe I shouldn't have downloaded and after a few weeks somethign gets flakey. Clearly this sort of experience is driven by my lack of structure and background in properly administering a Linux machine. I'm sure that FC works well for folks who know what they are doing. (I'm not part of that group.) That said, I still have one FC2/Planet machine here. It's working quite well and probably will for years to come if I don't change things. > > YMMV... > -- Fernando > > [*] usually "RPM Hell" was meant to describe the situation in which you > want to install an isolated package (an RPM in the case of rpm based > distros), and it requires another package you don't have, and after > finding it it requires another, and so on and so forth. This particular > situation is old history, these days you can use dependency resolvers > such as apt, yum or smart to resolve dependencies automatically for > you. > yep. From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Sun Dec 4 14:48:46 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Sun Dec 4 14:48:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <4392F96B.3090406@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20051204194846.58099.qmail@web52610.mail.yahoo.com> Have you tried ecasound? I guarantee your machine is powerful enough to use ecasound for audio work --- Dave Phillips wrote: > Brian Dunn wrote: > > >If your system works the way you want it too most > of > >the time, i want to hear your opinion. > > > > > Hi Brian: > > I have two machines I use for music (and > everything else too). My > laptop is a PII 366 HP Omnibook 4150, not a very > powerful machine at > all. It isn't suitable for serious audio work, __________________________________ Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Sun Dec 4 15:32:30 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Sun Dec 4 15:30:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Java Ambisonic b-format player In-Reply-To: References: <59c9195a0512031524w7dbe0566y82641be53e9e7feb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133728350.4219.11.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sat, 2005-12-03 at 18:57 -0500, Jesse Chappell wrote: > [ Excerpted from http://www.jsresources.org/faq_misc.html#no_daemons ] > "In Florian's and my opinion, mixing daemons like artsd, esd, > JACK, rplay, NAS, yiff, ... are hacks > that work around a shortcoming of the device drivers. We feel > that mixing should be done > either by the soundcard hardware or in software by the device driver." > > They clearly don't understand the full implications of what JACK is :) I sent them a polite email. --p From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Sun Dec 4 15:49:12 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Sun Dec 4 15:33:15 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051204194846.58099.qmail@web52610.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051204194846.58099.qmail@web52610.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43935648.4090209@woh.rr.com> Sean Edwards wrote: >Have you tried ecasound? I guarantee your machine is >powerful enough to use ecasound for audio work > >--- Dave Phillips wrote: > > >> >> I have two machines I use for music (and >>everything else too). My >>laptop is a PII 366 HP Omnibook 4150, not a very >>powerful machine at >>all. It isn't suitable for serious audio work, >> >> Hi Sean: Yes, I've used ecasound on this machine. The problem isn't really the software. The audio chipset is a consumer-grade CS4232 that really isn't up to the task. I also have PDAudioCF card that works great, but it's digital-in only. Btw, the CS4232 works fine with JACK in simplex mode, but I get xruns aplenty when the device is in full duplex mode. Not so usable for multitracking. Really, it's underpowered hardware if I want to do what I mean by serious audio work. It's okay with non-realtime stuff though. I agree that ecasound is excellent Linux audio software. Best, dp From sstubbs at shout.net Sun Dec 4 12:08:45 2005 From: sstubbs at shout.net (The Other) Date: Sun Dec 4 18:09:16 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? Message-ID: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> Hello All who dual-boot Windows XP and Linux, I had to break down and order an OEM disk of Windows XP Professional w/SP2 to be able to run the upgrades to my legacy Windows audio software. I've always gone with Fat16 as the Windows file system so I could read the Windows partition in Linux and exchange files between the two OSes. I know the Windows NT file system was not read/writeable by Linux. So what file system should I install Windows XP with to be able to read and write to it with Linux? Also, is Windows XP going to grab an entire disk for install? Or will it play nice and install only in usable partitions that I set up for it? Thank you, Stephen. From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Sun Dec 4 18:27:56 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Sun Dec 4 18:27:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> Message-ID: <1133738876.12074.1.camel@eviltwin> On Sun, 2005-12-04 at 17:08 +0000, The Other wrote: > Hello All who dual-boot Windows XP and Linux, > > I had to break down and order an OEM disk of Windows XP Professional > w/SP2 to be able to run the upgrades to my legacy Windows audio > software. > > I've always gone with Fat16 as the Windows file system so I could read > the Windows partition in Linux and exchange files between the two > OSes. > > I know the Windows NT file system was not read/writeable by Linux. > > So what file system should I install Windows XP with to be able to > read and write to it with Linux? > If you just want to read it you can use NTFS. If you want to read and write it you'll need to use fat32. > Also, is Windows XP going to grab an entire disk for install? Or will > it play nice and install only in usable partitions that I set up for > it? > Windoze? Play nice? Ha, ha, ha. You really need to have Windoze installed first and then install Linux. Linux will play nice. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From fbar at footils.org Sun Dec 4 18:44:14 2005 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun Dec 4 18:44:19 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> Message-ID: <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, The Other hat gesagt: // The Other wrote: > So what file system should I install Windows XP with to be able to > read and write to it with Linux? FAT32. > Also, is Windows XP going to grab an entire disk for install? Or will > it play nice and install only in usable partitions that I set up for > it? If you take care while formatting, paritioning, then it is possible to let XP install only in one partition. However you will need to install Grub/Lilo again afterwards, as Win installs it's own boot sector (IIRC). Generally it's best to first install Windows, then Linux, but it works the other way around as well. Keep a Linux-boot-CD handy, in case something goes wrong. (You did a backup, did you?) Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ From cave.dnb at tiscali.fr Sun Dec 4 18:59:08 2005 From: cave.dnb at tiscali.fr (Nigel Henry) Date: Sun Dec 4 18:59:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200512050059.08518.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> On Saturday 03 December 2005 21:02, Brian Dunn wrote: > The possibility of using and contributing to studio > quality audio software is really what first sparked my > interest in linux. So I installed Mandrake 10.1, > because someone gave it to me and it sounded cool. > Since then i've had a lot of fun with it, using their > mm kernel and running jack with seq24 and trying to > come up with something cool enough to use ardour for, > and everything ran relatively reliably. BUT... The > lan componets of the distro simply don't work, the USB > plug and play is more like > plug-and-if-i-feel-like-it-play, and the printer > suport is also compleatly unreliable. So, just use > mandrake for when i'm feeling musical and reboot to > Micro$oft whenever i need to do anything else, right? > well, that's getting old. > So i took a friends advice and started playing with > gentoo. After all, it's well documented. and it was > fun writing all those config files and oh so neat to > DIY, but then i tried to install Gnome, and after like > a 7 hour compile that i can't yet figure out how to > use i'm thinking, what have i gotten myself into... > > So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? > good free documentation, reliable hardware support, > binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config > files that don't get re-written by some user friendly > script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except > for the whole doesn't work thing? > > If your system works the way you want it too most of > the time, i want to hear your opinion. > > gratefull, > Brian Hi Brian. Having seen everyone join in on this post, I thought I may as well join in the fun. I started off working with computers in July 2003. Soon after I tried my first Linux install, MDK 9.2 which proceeded to fry my LG cdrom drive. Fixed that with a new drive, but no sounds. Then went with FC1 (MDK 9.2 was still there, as I don't like trashing anything) which installed just fine. A short time later I found by accident planetccrma. Apart from a few problems getting ALSA to work, this went ok, and the music apps available from planetccrma are just fine. I now have, FC1, FC2, FC3 (which has a problem with KDE's kicker crashing each time I logout, but ALSA works out of the box with this). I also have Slackware 10.0. Couldn't get ALSA going on this until I got mm kernel from Audioslack. After that it was no problem. Debian too, I'd had problems with, but with help from folks on the lists the ALSA problems were resolved, and there are plenty of music apps available. I would not suggest a Debian Etch install at the moment. I have 2 Debian Sarge installs with music apps and no problems with upgrades, but the Debian Sarge/Etch install (all a bit experimental) is trying to remove a lot of my music apps when doing an aptitude dist-upgrade. I've already lost Cheesetracker, Wavemixer, and Seq24, from a previous aptitude dist-upgrade, and didn't want to lose any more music apps. I'm just waiting at the moment for the apps on the remove list to be upograded, and turn up on the upgrade list. Gotta be patient with the cutting edge stuff. Now we really go into the Twilight zone. GENTOO. Man. Perhaps it's just me, but it took me months to get Gentoo up and running, with help from a couple of folks posting to this thread. I admit it wasn;t months continually. I got a bit frustrated, and left it partially installed on the drive, going back to it from time to time, as it wasn't going to beat me. Now it's working just fine, music apps and all. To conclude Brian. I'd probably suggest a Fedora install. Perhaps FC2 or FC3. Even though FC2 is now only getting security updates from Fedora Legacy, it still works well. If you have the harddrive space, I'd also have a go at either Debian Sarge or Gentoo. Debian Sarge is probably the easier. This means you can work on making some music, while messing about with the more difficult distro when you feel like it. Personally, I've painted myself into the corner. I now have so many different distro's that need upgrading that I've hardly any time to try and make any music. I'd suggest one distro, easy to install, that you can work with for your music, another, perhaps more difficult distro to experiment with, which might work out better for you in the long run. Just an on the side to Mark, or Christoph if your following this thread. I'm redlining for the second time on Gentoo's / partition. Got rid of some of the bytes by removing some kernel sources from /usr/src from the first 100%+ redline. The latest one caused by some heavy updates had me remove the remaining 2 uninstalled kernel sources to my home partition to give me a bit of space. / is 7.3GB and 98% full. Please. Any suggestions apart from reinstalling. Off list, as this ain't audio stuff. Nigel. Meanwhile, back at the ranch to Brian's problems. Start with an easy to install distro. FC2, or FC3, with planetccrma support. if you have enough harddrive space, install another distro, Debian Sarge or Gentoo. You can play around with these without being stopped from working with making music on your reliable working distro. Looking forward to seeing some of your music on the list. Nigel From hardbop200 at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 19:49:34 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Sun Dec 4 19:49:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512041159.33102.ce@christeck.de> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> <200512041159.33102.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: On 12/4/05, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > > With all the press about Ubuntu I'd imaginge it's > > worth a look, but I don't know who uses it for audio. > > I heard rumors that it's a bit hard to convert it into an audio machine, > but I also heard about people who have been very successful using it > for audio. I'm actually in the middle of attempting to do this with Ubuntu 5.10, "breezy badger." So far I've had no problems with finding applications, but getting a kernel that is suitable for low-latency operation was a bit of a hassle (I should note here that I have compiled my own kernel only once, so I have to have baby-steps instructions). I found this: http://doc.gwos.org/index.php/2.6.14_Vanilla I've followed these instructions, and turned on the preemptable kernel function in the kernel config, and so far so good. My hardware is crap, though - I haven't actually tried this on a decent computer yet, but I'm sure it would work better. As far as Ubuntu in general is concerned, I love it. I've used Slackware for a year or two in an attempt to learn as much as I could about linux, but end the end, I got tired of trying to make everything work. There is something wonderfully easy about the apt repositories. I fully recommend it. Josh From rlrevell at joe-job.com Sun Dec 4 19:28:25 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Sun Dec 4 19:57:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 00:44 +0100, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > The Other hat gesagt: // The Other wrote: > > > So what file system should I install Windows XP with to be able to > > read and write to it with Linux? > > FAT32. Um, NTFS read/write works too. Lee From yaqtil at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 20:25:58 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (ix) Date: Sun Dec 4 20:26:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> > Um, NTFS read/write works too. if you dot your i's and cross your x's and its a blue moon. it might. i have yet to get captive-ntfs actally working right on x86 (if thats what youre talking about) on either debian or gentooo... unfortunately theres no rw reiser for windows or proper r/w ntfs for linux..oh well, deleting windows is easy enough there are some commercial ext[23] r/w drivers for win32, from paragon and maybe one other.. i hear they both will support ZFS tho From illth at gmx.de Sun Dec 4 20:28:02 2005 From: illth at gmx.de (Thomas Ilnseher) Date: Sun Dec 4 20:28:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <439397A2.5000902@gmx.de> Lee Revell schrieb: >On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 00:44 +0100, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > >>Hallo, >>The Other hat gesagt: // The Other wrote: >> >> >> >>>So what file system should I install Windows XP with to be able to >>>read and write to it with Linux? >>> >>> >>FAT32. >> >> > >Um, NTFS read/write works too. > > > NTFS read works reliable. NTFS write support: 1) with the inkernel driver you can only overwrite existing files without changing their size. 2) with some FUSE driver avail somewhere, you might be able to create files, change file sizes, and so on. but it might not work (they say that won't b0rk anything, it will just fail). if you are interested, RTFM. what i would suggest: a) do not use windowz3 ;) ok, as you seem to need it, here is my suggestion: partition your disk: use ntfs for your primary windowze partition, and add a small (~1GByte) partition with fat32 to exchange data. ths way you can read the windows data from within linux, copy files acroos easily using that partition. you also may use ext3 for your linux partition. ext3's performance may be subpar to reiserfs or xfs, but there are some windows tools that can read and write data from an ext2 partition. cause ext3 is an extension of ext2, you can use these toolz to read your data. i'd still suggest you to have this data-exchange fat32 partition, as it's easier to just read data from that partition in windowze, instead of first having to use some tool to copy it over from linux, but: this tool might be of interest considering the following: you are in teh M$ OS, and you just notice that you forgot to copy something from linux, so you have to reboot to linux, copy over, reboot to windowze. this really sucks, so the possibility to read the linux partition within windows comes handy. and if you care about FS performance, i'd suggest to have /home on a seperate ext3 partition, as /home usually holds all the "data", and use what you like for the / partition. also, ther is maybe some tool that can read reiser partitions under windows, but i don't remember, use g00gle ;) tom >Lee > > > > From stephen.a.lindsay at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 20:38:09 2005 From: stephen.a.lindsay at gmail.com (Steve Lindsay) Date: Sun Dec 4 20:38:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512041159.33102.ce@christeck.de> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> <200512041159.33102.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> On 12/4/05, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > > With all the press about Ubuntu I'd imaginge it's > > worth a look, but I don't know who uses it for audio. > > I heard rumors that it's a bit hard to convert it into an audio machine, > but I also heard about people who have been very successful using it > for audio. > Can you elaborate on what makes it hard? Is it just that the kernel is not optimised for this sort of stuff or are there other things that make ubuntu not suitable for linux audio? I'm just starting to look at getting into linux audio and am a bit of an ubuntu tragic so am interested in what makes it unsuitable. Cheers.....Steve From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Sun Dec 4 20:43:54 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Sun Dec 4 20:44:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1133747035.13648.0.camel@eviltwin> On Sun, 2005-12-04 at 19:28 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 00:44 +0100, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > Hallo, > > The Other hat gesagt: // The Other wrote: > > > > > So what file system should I install Windows XP with to be able to > > > read and write to it with Linux? > > > > FAT32. > > Um, NTFS read/write works too. > I've seen many a caveat on writing NTFS. It "usually" works but it isn't guaranteed and can smoke your system. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Sun Dec 4 20:47:22 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Sun Dec 4 20:47:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 01:25 +0000, ix wrote: > > Um, NTFS read/write works too. > > if you dot your i's and cross your x's and its a blue moon. it might. > i have yet to get captive-ntfs actally working right on x86 (if thats > what youre talking about) on either debian or gentooo... unfortunately > theres no rw reiser for windows or proper r/w ntfs for linux..oh well, > deleting windows is easy enough > > there are some commercial ext[23] r/w drivers for win32, from paragon > and maybe one other.. > There is an excellent freeware ext2 driver for Windoze. I use it at work. http://www.fs-driver.org/ -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From stephen.a.lindsay at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 21:00:12 2005 From: stephen.a.lindsay at gmail.com (Steve Lindsay) Date: Sun Dec 4 21:00:31 2005 Subject: 64bit linux audio was Re: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation Message-ID: <90078130512041800n770a38adr246ed7fd56e9bde8@mail.gmail.com> On 12/4/05, studio-64 wrote: > Yep and 64studio for us who think we need speed!! I'm thinking of putting together a new computer, and am thinking that going down the 64bit road might be a good idea. I would like to play around with audio on this machine however so i wondering if there are any "gotcha's" to doing this sort of stuff on a 64 bit machine, for example any of the major apps (jack, ardour, etc.) not running well on these platforms? (I think in principle there's no reason why they wouldn't, however I have run linux on an ibook for the last few years and have occasionally had endian issues in the past with some applications, just wondering if there are equivalents for this sort of problem in porting 32->64bit. I know nothing about the state of linux on 64bit so this is possibly a stupid question, if so apologies :) Also wondering what people's experience with 64studio is? Cheers.....Steve From hardbop200 at gmail.com Sun Dec 4 21:16:43 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Sun Dec 4 21:16:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> <200512041159.33102.ce@christeck.de> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I think that it is very suitable, *if* you know how to create your own kernel that allows for jack, et al to run with preemptable capabilities. I am not very knowledgeable with compiling kernels, so I had to wait until someone else provided a how-to for getting my own kernel. Quite the contrary, I see big things on the horizon for Ubuntu. This might be heresy, but I would like for Agnula to merge its efforts in with Ubuntu, thus making both distributions more complete. Josh On 12/4/05, Steve Lindsay wrote: > On 12/4/05, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > > > > With all the press about Ubuntu I'd imaginge it's > > > worth a look, but I don't know who uses it for audio. > > > > I heard rumors that it's a bit hard to convert it into an audio machine, > > but I also heard about people who have been very successful using it > > for audio. > > > > Can you elaborate on what makes it hard? Is it just that the kernel is > not optimised for this sort of stuff or are there other things that > make ubuntu not suitable for linux audio? > > I'm just starting to look at getting into linux audio and am a bit of > an ubuntu tragic so am interested in what makes it unsuitable. > > Cheers.....Steve > > -- Josh From andre.pereira at ig.com.br Mon Dec 5 04:38:19 2005 From: andre.pereira at ig.com.br (=?iso-8859-13?q?Andr=E9_Alves_Pereira?=) Date: Mon Dec 5 04:38:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133747035.13648.0.camel@eviltwin> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> <1133747035.13648.0.camel@eviltwin> Message-ID: <200512050738.19956.andre.pereira@ig.com.br> You can read/write in NTFS perfectly with this: http://www.jankratochvil.net/project/captive/ The main problem here is the performance... It isn't suitable for audio work. Andr? Magoo Em Domingo 04 Dezembro 2005 23:43, Jan Depner escreveu: > > I've seen many a caveat on writing NTFS. It "usually" works but it > isn't guaranteed and can smoke your system. From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Mon Dec 5 05:33:00 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Mon Dec 5 05:33:14 2005 Subject: 64bit linux audio was Re: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <90078130512041800n770a38adr246ed7fd56e9bde8@mail.gmail.com> References: <90078130512041800n770a38adr246ed7fd56e9bde8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4394175C.8010601@walescomputers.co.uk> Hi Re 64studio For sound Apps its rock solid, and still in alpha I believe. It's a usable system and we have recorded many songs that have done well in various charts on the net. So as a DAW I dont thnik you can fault it! Make sure you have Linux supported sound cards, which is the same for any Linux DAW. I use the RME on my Multitrack machine and this is a superb card. I would reccomend a duel boot system with a 32bit OS for the other stuff you'll need to do like OPen office, Flash ( websites get very tiring with a constant naggin from Firefox to install/update flash!) Plus you'll need to backup and burn DVD's. Like I said as a DAW you'll find it fast and stable, and the more people testing the better. Good luck Bob Steve Lindsay wrote: > On 12/4/05, studio-64 wrote: > >> Yep and 64studio for us who think we need speed!! > > > I'm thinking of putting together a new computer, and am thinking that > going down the 64bit road might be a good idea. I would like to play > around with audio on this machine however so i wondering if there are > any "gotcha's" to doing this sort of stuff on a 64 bit machine, for > example any of the major apps (jack, ardour, etc.) not running well on > these platforms? > (I think in principle there's no reason why they wouldn't, however I > have run linux on an ibook for the last few years and have > occasionally had endian issues in the past with some applications, > just wondering if there are equivalents for this sort of problem in > porting 32->64bit. I know nothing about the state of linux on 64bit so > this is possibly a stupid question, if so apologies :) > > Also wondering what people's experience with 64studio is? > > Cheers.....Steve > > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From bwanab+lau at juraview.com Mon Dec 5 06:11:27 2005 From: bwanab+lau at juraview.com (Bill Allen) Date: Mon Dec 5 06:11:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051203222345.GE2073@fliwatut.scifi> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <20051203222345.GE2073@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <4394205F.4050408@juraview.com> Frank Barknecht wrote: >Hallo, >Brian Dunn hat gesagt: // Brian Dunn wrote: > > > >>So does anybody out there have the best of all worlds? >>good free documentation, reliable hardware support, >>binary packaging, a fast audio kernel, and config >>files that don't get re-written by some user friendly >>script somewhere that would be oh so convinient except >>for the whole doesn't work thing? >> >> > >AGNULA/Demudi. > >Ciao > > I second this suggestion wholeheartedly. I've heard very good things about Planet CCRMA, but have no experience with it. AGNULA/Demudi gives the best of all world (IMHO). Debian packages, easy installation, works out of the box for music and it's free as in beer and freedom. Regards, Bill From sstubbs at shout.net Mon Dec 5 02:54:23 2005 From: sstubbs at shout.net (The Other) Date: Mon Dec 5 08:54:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> Message-ID: <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> On Monday 05 December 2005 01:47 am, Jan Depner wrote: > There is an excellent freeware ext2 driver for Windoze. I use > it at work. http://www.fs-driver.org/ Thanks to everyone who responded. It's greatly appreciated. The Captive project states that you should umount the NTFS partition before you reboot. Since I like to have Linux mount all partitions with fstab, I can see times when I would forget to umount the NTFS partion when rebooting into Windows XP and bork Windows XP. Being able to read ext2 partitions from Windows XP appears to offer the best of performance (use NTFS for Windows XP) and sharing of files on the ext2 partition. There have been times when I forgot to move a file from Linux to the FAT16 parition, booted into WindowsNT, then had to reboot back into Linux to move the file over. A little annoying. Thanks again, Stephen. From julien at c-lab.de Mon Dec 5 09:30:51 2005 From: julien at c-lab.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Mon Dec 5 09:31:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] simple ZynAddSubFX question In-Reply-To: <200511251332.27208.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> References: <200511132252.10088.ce@christeck.de> <200511180556.24285.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <200511251332.27208.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> Message-ID: Hi! Thanks for all the hints, it helped a great deal. Now we were able to pull it off. But I think the mentioning of the spelling problem could be helpful, perhaps this way we can add the banks directory, because I think it is spelled wrongly. Kindest regards Julien -------- Music was my first love and it will be my last (John Miles) ======== FIND MY WEB-PROJECT AT: ======== http://ltsb.sourceforge.net - the Linux TextBased Studio guide From rlrevell at joe-job.com Mon Dec 5 10:14:48 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Mon Dec 5 10:14:22 2005 Subject: 64bit linux audio was Re: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <4394175C.8010601@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <90078130512041800n770a38adr246ed7fd56e9bde8@mail.gmail.com> <4394175C.8010601@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <1133795689.21641.2.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 10:33 +0000, studio-64 wrote: > I would reccomend a duel boot system with a 32bit OS for the other > stuff you'll need to do like OPen office, Flash ( websites get very > tiring with a constant naggin from Firefox to install/update flash!) > Plus you'll need to backup and burn DVD's. Why can't you run OpenOffice or burn DVDs on a 32 bit system? Lee From pw_lists at slinkp.com Mon Dec 5 10:35:17 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Mon Dec 5 10:35:29 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> Message-ID: <20051205153517.GC8652@slinkp.com> On Mon, Dec 05, 2005 at 07:54:23AM +0000, The Other wrote: > On Monday 05 December 2005 01:47 am, Jan Depner wrote: > > There is an excellent freeware ext2 driver for Windoze. I use > > it at work. http://www.fs-driver.org/ > > Thanks to everyone who responded. It's greatly appreciated. > > The Captive project states that you should umount the NTFS partition > before you reboot. Since I like to have Linux mount all partitions > with fstab, I can see times when I would forget to umount the NTFS > partion when rebooting into Windows XP and bork Windows XP. So put this in /etc/init.d/local: /bin/umount /my/ntfs/mount/path But I have not used NTFS read-write under linux, so I'm not going to pretend to know how well it works or doesn't... -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From m_nels at gmx.net Mon Dec 5 10:44:35 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Mon Dec 5 10:44:35 2005 Subject: 64bit linux audio was Re: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1133795689.21641.2.camel@mindpipe> References: <90078130512041800n770a38adr246ed7fd56e9bde8@mail.gmail.com> <4394175C.8010601@walescomputers.co.uk> <1133795689.21641.2.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43946063.6020307@gmx.net> Lee Revell wrote: > On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 10:33 +0000, studio-64 wrote: > >>I would reccomend a duel boot system with a 32bit OS for the other >>stuff you'll need to do like OPen office, Flash ( websites get very >>tiring with a constant naggin from Firefox to install/update flash!) >>Plus you'll need to backup and burn DVD's. > > Why can't you run OpenOffice or burn DVDs on a 32 bit system? This puzzled me for a minute. I think you either misunderstand the previous post, or made a typo? I think he is saying that he has difficulty doing these things with 64 bit software - and consequently is recommending a dual-boot set-up with a 32 bit O/S installed specifically for these tasks. It sounds to me as though he *can* do these things in 32 bit, but has difficulty in 64 bit. Michael From pw_lists at slinkp.com Mon Dec 5 11:01:48 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Mon Dec 5 11:01:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <20051205153517.GC8652@slinkp.com> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051205153517.GC8652@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <20051205160148.GD8652@slinkp.com> On Mon, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:35:17AM -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > So put this in /etc/init.d/local: > > /bin/umount /my/ntfs/mount/path Oops, more explicitly for those who haven't messed with init.d scripts... more specifically, you would put the above line EITHER in the "stop" function within /etc/inid.d/local, or (PREFERRED) put it wherever your distribution's existing init.d/local looks for stuff to run. In my case, I run gentoo, and init.d/local looks for scripts at /etc/conf.d/local.start (for startup) and /etc/conf.d/local.stop (for shutdown). So I'd put the above line in /etc/conf.d/local.stop. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From rlrevell at joe-job.com Mon Dec 5 11:15:44 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Mon Dec 5 11:15:26 2005 Subject: 64bit linux audio was Re: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <43946063.6020307@gmx.net> References: <90078130512041800n770a38adr246ed7fd56e9bde8@mail.gmail.com> <4394175C.8010601@walescomputers.co.uk> <1133795689.21641.2.camel@mindpipe> <43946063.6020307@gmx.net> Message-ID: <1133799345.21641.10.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 15:44 +0000, Michael T D Nelson wrote: > Lee Revell wrote: > > On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 10:33 +0000, studio-64 wrote: > > > >>I would reccomend a duel boot system with a 32bit OS for the other > >>stuff you'll need to do like OPen office, Flash ( websites get very > >>tiring with a constant naggin from Firefox to install/update flash!) > >>Plus you'll need to backup and burn DVD's. > > > > Why can't you run OpenOffice or burn DVDs on a 32 bit system? > > This puzzled me for a minute. I think you either misunderstand the > previous post, or made a typo? > > I think he is saying that he has difficulty doing these things with 64 > bit software - and consequently is recommending a dual-boot set-up with > a 32 bit O/S installed specifically for these tasks. > > It sounds to me as though he *can* do these things in 32 bit, but has > difficulty in 64 bit. Sorry, that was a typo. What I meant was, you mean dvdrecord and OpenOffice have not even been ported to 64 bit Linux yet?!? If so it implies shockingly bad code. Most 32 bit C applications should "Just Work" on a 64 bit system. Lee From rlrevell at joe-job.com Mon Dec 5 11:30:19 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Mon Dec 5 11:29:48 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <20051205160148.GD8652@slinkp.com> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051205153517.GC8652@slinkp.com> <20051205160148.GD8652@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <1133800220.21641.20.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 11:01 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > On Mon, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:35:17AM -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > > So put this in /etc/init.d/local: > > > > /bin/umount /my/ntfs/mount/path > > Oops, more explicitly for those who haven't messed with init.d > scripts... > > more specifically, you would put the above line EITHER > in the "stop" function within /etc/inid.d/local, or (PREFERRED) > put it wherever your distribution's existing init.d/local looks > for stuff to run. In my case, I run gentoo, and init.d/local > looks for scripts at /etc/conf.d/local.start (for startup) > and /etc/conf.d/local.stop (for shutdown). > So I'd put the above line in /etc/conf.d/local.stop. > I was infuriated to find that the latest version of Ubuntu does not AUTOMATICALLY mount a USB drive as soon as it's plugged it. It does appear on the Gnome desktop, with a nice descriptive icon, but as soon as the user clicks it they get PERMISSION DENIED. Christ, it's 2005, do they still expect us to fuck with config files? Lee From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 5 11:42:31 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Mon Dec 5 11:42:37 2005 Subject: 64bit linux audio was Re: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1133799345.21641.10.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051205164231.95146.qmail@web52601.mail.yahoo.com> Sounds like library problems to me. -=cybersean3000=- __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From hardbop200 at gmail.com Mon Dec 5 11:55:07 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Mon Dec 5 11:55:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133800220.21641.20.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051205153517.GC8652@slinkp.com> <20051205160148.GD8652@slinkp.com> <1133800220.21641.20.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: > I was infuriated to find that the latest version of Ubuntu does not > AUTOMATICALLY mount a USB drive as soon as it's plugged it. It does > appear on the Gnome desktop, with a nice descriptive icon, but as soon > as the user clicks it they get PERMISSION DENIED. > > Christ, it's 2005, do they still expect us to fuck with config files? Lee, Sorry to hear that, but my USB key works just fine in Ubuntu 5.10. It is formatted as FAT (32, maybe?). -- Josh From okonsar at gmail.com Mon Dec 5 12:15:23 2005 From: okonsar at gmail.com (Mehmet Okonsar) Date: Mon Dec 5 12:15:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Yamaha's mLAN-LinuxSampler-Giga Files Message-ID: <284808262.20051205191523@okonsar.com> Hi! How mLAN (Firewire) is supported? What about the o1X users? Is LinuxSampler importing Giga files without problem now? I'm planning the "big-move".. any general advice? Thanks ------------- Best regards, Mehmet Okon?ar, pianist-composer www.okonsar.com mehmet@okonsar.com From rlrevell at joe-job.com Mon Dec 5 12:19:43 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Mon Dec 5 12:19:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051205153517.GC8652@slinkp.com> <20051205160148.GD8652@slinkp.com> <1133800220.21641.20.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1133803184.21641.51.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 10:55 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: > > I was infuriated to find that the latest version of Ubuntu does not > > AUTOMATICALLY mount a USB drive as soon as it's plugged it. It does > > appear on the Gnome desktop, with a nice descriptive icon, but as soon > > as the user clicks it they get PERMISSION DENIED. > > > > Christ, it's 2005, do they still expect us to fuck with config files? > > Lee, > > Sorry to hear that, but my USB key works just fine in Ubuntu 5.10. It > is formatted as FAT (32, maybe?). This was an NTFS filesystem. Despite the presence of NTFS read-write support in the kernel it seems to mount it such that only root can access the filesystem. Lee From renick at gmail.com Mon Dec 5 12:38:11 2005 From: renick at gmail.com (Renick Bell) Date: Mon Dec 5 12:38:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [OT] Ubuntu and automatic mount of USB drive (was Re: 64bit linux audio) Message-ID: > I was infuriated to find that the latest version of Ubuntu does not > AUTOMATICALLY mount a USB drive as soon as it's plugged it. It does > appear on the Gnome desktop, with a nice descriptive icon, but as soon > as the user clicks it they get PERMISSION DENIED. > > Christ, it's 2005, do they still expect us to fuck with config files? I've got to say that I had no problems in this regard. Plug it in and it showed up. Throw some files on it and grab others off it. Unmount it, plug in a different one, and it shows up, too. I've done this in Ubuntu Breezy with five different USB drives. This was on a standard fresh install of Breezy to an ordinary desktop machine. Now, if the owner of the directory on the USB drive was different than the user doing the moving on the Breezy system, that's a different story... I've had to change owners of folders or permissions at times, but it's supposed to be like that, isn't it? -- Renick Bell http://www.the3rd2nd.com From ce at christeck.de Mon Dec 5 12:58:13 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Mon Dec 5 12:57:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <200512041159.33102.ce@christeck.de> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512051858.14302.ce@christeck.de> > Can you elaborate on what makes it hard? Is it just that the kernel > is not optimised for this sort of stuff or are there other things > that make ubuntu not suitable for linux audio? no, I haven't tried it for myself. But what I've heard on another mailin list, you should at least build a new kernel. Best regards ce From markknecht at gmail.com Mon Dec 5 14:22:42 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Mon Dec 5 14:22:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133800220.21641.20.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <21e8fdff0512041725ta8ea638vb6f463553c862c97@mail.gmail.com> <1133747242.13648.3.camel@eviltwin> <200512050754.23549.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051205153517.GC8652@slinkp.com> <20051205160148.GD8652@slinkp.com> <1133800220.21641.20.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512051122v728ddfb4kbd346b0d78695662@mail.gmail.com> On 12/5/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Mon, 2005-12-05 at 11:01 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > > On Mon, Dec 05, 2005 at 10:35:17AM -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > > > So put this in /etc/init.d/local: > > > > > > /bin/umount /my/ntfs/mount/path > > > > Oops, more explicitly for those who haven't messed with init.d > > scripts... > > > > more specifically, you would put the above line EITHER > > in the "stop" function within /etc/inid.d/local, or (PREFERRED) > > put it wherever your distribution's existing init.d/local looks > > for stuff to run. In my case, I run gentoo, and init.d/local > > looks for scripts at /etc/conf.d/local.start (for startup) > > and /etc/conf.d/local.stop (for shutdown). > > So I'd put the above line in /etc/conf.d/local.stop. > > > > I was infuriated to find that the latest version of Ubuntu does not > AUTOMATICALLY mount a USB drive as soon as it's plugged it. It does > appear on the Gnome desktop, with a nice descriptive icon, but as soon > as the user clicks it they get PERMISSION DENIED. > > Christ, it's 2005, do they still expect us to fuck with config files? > > Lee Seemingly, yes. I don't use Ubuntu and don't understand the icon without the ability to use the drive. That's quite lame. Question: I have multiple 1394 drives. Without messing with config files where do you expect these to get mounted? - Mark From chris at dukla.plus.com Mon Dec 5 14:28:18 2005 From: chris at dukla.plus.com (Chris Norris) Date: Mon Dec 5 14:28:23 2005 Subject: 64bit linux audio was Re: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1133799345.21641.10.camel@mindpipe> References: <90078130512041800n770a38adr246ed7fd56e9bde8@mail.gmail.com> <4394175C.8010601@walescomputers.co.uk> <1133795689.21641.2.camel@mindpipe> <43946063.6020307@gmx.net> <1133799345.21641.10.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <439494D2.4080702@dukla.plus.com> Lee Revell wrote: > What I meant was, you mean dvdrecord and OpenOffice have not even been > ported to 64 bit Linux yet?!? > I am running a 64 bit version of K3B, and 32 bit Openoffice fine on SuSE x86_64. (There may be a 64 bit version of Openoffice - it is just being not very good at Linux I take what SuSE provides.) From scjody at modernduck.com Mon Dec 5 18:55:59 2005 From: scjody at modernduck.com (Jody McIntyre) Date: Mon Dec 5 18:59:38 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Yamaha's mLAN-LinuxSampler-Giga Files In-Reply-To: <284808262.20051205191523@okonsar.com> References: <284808262.20051205191523@okonsar.com> Message-ID: <20051205235559.GK19441@conscoop.ottawa.on.ca> On Mon, Dec 05, 2005 at 07:15:23PM +0200, Mehmet Okonsar wrote: > Hi! > How mLAN (Firewire) is supported? What about the o1X > users? mLAN support requires two things: 1. An iec61883-6 driver, which is currently being developed by the FreeBob project. 2. Connection management. This is harder, since there is very little documentation available on current mLAN devices. Things should be easier for future devices that implement the Open Generic Transporter standard, but older devices don't do things in a standard way. I'm working on connection management for the PreSonus FIRESTATION (and it's taking longer than I expected.) I'm not sure how close the 01X's firmware is to that and I don't have one to play with. Give this a try: http://modernduck.com/mlan_init/ and let me know what happens, but even if it does initialize the 01X it's far from a complete solution. Cheers, Jody > Is LinuxSampler importing Giga files without problem now? > I'm planning the "big-move".. any general advice? > Thanks > > ------------- > Best regards, > Mehmet Okon?ar, pianist-composer > www.okonsar.com > mehmet@okonsar.com > > -- From jody.noury at linucie.net Tue Dec 6 05:34:10 2005 From: jody.noury at linucie.net (Jody) Date: Tue Dec 6 05:33:07 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which Windows XP File System is Readable by Linux? In-Reply-To: <1133747035.13648.0.camel@eviltwin> References: <200512041708.45346.sstubbs@shout.net> <20051204234414.GQ2073@fliwatut.scifi> <1133742506.776.1.camel@mindpipe> <1133747035.13648.0.camel@eviltwin> Message-ID: <43956922.1000501@linucie.net> Hi, Jan Depner a ?crit : > [...] > >>> >>> >>> >>>>So what file system should I install Windows XP with to be able to >>>>read and write to it with Linux? >>>> >>>> >>>FAT32. >>> >>> >>Um, NTFS read/write works too. >> >> >> > > I've seen many a caveat on writing NTFS. It "usually" works but it >isn't guaranteed and can smoke your system. > > > > kernel driver is able to read *and* write on ntfs filesystem but not able to *write* to filesystem journal. And this blaireau of Windows just look at its own boot files in this journal ... Sometimes It could not see data on partition although these are fully readable by linux. Microsoft's filesystems suck, but you can easily read write on fat (vfat type on linux). -- Jody From bwanab+lau at juraview.com Tue Dec 6 06:05:57 2005 From: bwanab+lau at juraview.com (Bill Allen) Date: Tue Dec 6 06:06:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound Message-ID: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. What combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best sound from vocals particularly in Ardour? I know that this is one of those subjective questions for which the best answer is try it out yourself and find what sounds best, but there are so many plugins (an embarassment of riches), each of which has many settings, that a brute force search of all the combinations would take forever - not to mention that after a while, my poor ears become exhausted with the effort and refuse to hear differences anymore. So what I'm really looking for is good starting points to work from. One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to get width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. For comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've found that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for other setups. Regards, Bill From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Tue Dec 6 06:50:46 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Tue Dec 6 06:51:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <43957B16.9060403@walescomputers.co.uk> Hi I can imagine how many replies your gonna get to this!! I try get the vocals down as loud and clean as I can and only use a touch of tap reverb (one in two out panned L+R about 25%) I find that this allows the vocal timbre to come out while adding some nice space around them. Cheers Bob Bill Allen wrote: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. What > combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best sound > from vocals particularly in Ardour? I know that this is one of those > subjective questions for which the best answer is try it out yourself > and find what sounds best, but there are so many plugins (an > embarassment of riches), each of which has many settings, that a brute > force search of all the combinations would take forever - not to mention > that after a while, my poor ears become exhausted with the effort and > refuse to hear differences anymore. So what I'm really looking for is > good starting points to work from. > > One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to get > width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. For > comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've found > that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for other setups. > > Regards, > Bill > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Tue Dec 6 08:35:39 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Tue Dec 6 08:19:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <439593AB.80409@woh.rr.com> Bill Allen wrote: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. Hi Bill: You also have to remember that you don't hear yourself the way others hear you. I'm not especially fond of my voice, but I know how to hit the right notes and other people seem to like it. The *sound* of a voice can be effective enough as a carrier of personality. Bob Dylan is often used as an example of a not-so-beautiful voice that's perfectly suited to his material. And it's worth mentioning that Dylan does know how to sing (check out Girl From The North Country). > What combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best > sound from vocals particularly in Ardour? As you say, there are many to choose from. I like Tim Goetze's Versatile Plate Reverb, it's easy to control and has some sweet spots that complement my voice nicely. I also often use the SC4 compressor (pre-fade) and the TAP Scaling Limiter (post-fade) on the master track. As general advice: Pick an effect, preferably one with only a few controls, and learn what each control does to the sound. In the case of reverbs, think about the ambience you want to create and make your initial settings accordingly. Yes, you'll have to experiment, but IMO that's the best way to learn about these things. > I know that this is one of those subjective questions for which the > best answer is try it out yourself and find what sounds best, but > there are so many plugins (an embarassment of riches), each of which > has many settings, that a brute force search of all the combinations > would take forever - not to mention that after a while, my poor ears > become exhausted with the effort and refuse to hear differences > anymore. So what I'm really looking for is good starting points to > work from. It's easy to be overwhelmed: LADSPA, DSSI, VST/VSTi, all provide that embarassment of riches. But I figure that the pros don't have the time to learn everything about everything, so I don't expect it from myself. I think you should plan carefully: think about what sort of sound you want to project, think about its characteristics, then start working towards it with a minimum number of effects. A little 'verb and some judicious compression go a long way towards making a good basic sound, I find that for my purposes I use little else. Maybe someday I'll find a use for chorus and delays, but they'll probably get used on instruments, not on my voice. A few random tips: Stand when you sing. Use a pop filter (I should follow my own advice). Breathe deeply, you can always erase the noise. Don't raise your chin when you try to reach notes on the high end of your range, it tightens the vocal mechanism and works against your attempt. Relax, you won't sing (or play) well with excess tension. Consider your input chain, i.e., decent microphones, preamp if necessary, good hot signal, etc. Don't record with effects in, you'll fool yourself and it will be harder to fix (I like that Ardour forces that behaviour). Key your music to complement your available range. WRT planning: Do you want to recreate the sound of a small group playing in a bar ? Or a big band performing in a concert hall ? A rock band playing an auditorium ? A jazz quartet in your living room ? Each of these scenarios has some salient characteristics that you should try to describe and understand in relation to your selected effects. Try analyzing the vocal sound on some of your favorite recordings in the same manner. Yes, you have to study up on some terminology, but you don't have to become a DSP engineer. That's what we have Steve Harris here for anyway. ;-) And don't worry about understanding everything right away. It's enough to know what a compressor does, the rest you'll learn by fiddling with settings and *listening* to the results. For instance, I use the SC4 compressor but I'm still sort of blank about exactly what the knee radius does. Always more to learn. :) > One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to > get width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. > For comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've > found that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for > other setups. GVerb is more complex than I'd advise for a start, but it is a fine effect and definitely worth learning. Have you tried Freeverb or any of the other 'verbs from the LADSPA collection ? The TAP reverb is also superfine (with presets!), but again I'd suggest something even simpler. If you really have problems with intonation and pitch acuity you can always try fixing it in the mix with a pitch shifter plugin and Ardour's automation control, but that's getting elaborate. You can also try that infamous vocal "fixer" from Antares, but I don't know if it will run under any of the current support systems for VST under Linux. It costs $$ though, and frankly at that point I'd suggest singing lessons. You can also use Ardour's excellent editing tools to correct small (and not so small?) errors in timing. A bit tedious, but worth the effort. I listen a lot to the music made by other members of this list. I love the sound of Pete Bessman's F4, I'd like to know how he got it. I'm also fond of The Girls, their material is great and their singing is perfect for it. I like the overall sound they achieve, though it's quite different from my aims. And I'd commit heinous and unconscionable acts just to be able to play and sound like Steve Doonan. Lots to be learned from the folks using the same software (more or less). So many different genres are represented at http://lam.fugal.net, it's a terrific resource: if you like a particular piece, you can just write to the composer and ask how s/he did it. Well, there's my contribution to the thread. HTH. :) Best, dp From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Tue Dec 6 08:46:00 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Tue Dec 6 08:45:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <1133876761.16078.3.camel@eviltwin> On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 06:05 -0500, Bill Allen wrote: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. What > combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best sound > from vocals particularly in Ardour? I know that this is one of those > subjective questions for which the best answer is try it out yourself > and find what sounds best, but there are so many plugins (an > embarassment of riches), each of which has many settings, that a brute > force search of all the combinations would take forever - not to mention > that after a while, my poor ears become exhausted with the effort and > refuse to hear differences anymore. So what I'm really looking for is > good starting points to work from. > > One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to get > width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. For > comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've found > that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for other setups. > I usually use SC4 compression, GVerb, and Tape Delay Simulation. I've also used Versatile Plate Reverb (a tip of the cap to Dave Phillips for pointing that one out to me) instead of GVerb. Tom's TAP Stereo Echo set for Haas effect (see his web pages for documentation) can also be interesting but it can wash out the vocal. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Tue Dec 6 08:55:20 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Tue Dec 6 08:51:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> Bill Allen wrote: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. What > combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best sound > from vocals particularly in Ardour? I know that this is one of those > subjective questions for which the best answer is try it out yourself > and find what sounds best, but there are so many plugins (an > embarassment of riches), each of which has many settings, that a brute > force search of all the combinations would take forever - not to mention > that after a while, my poor ears become exhausted with the effort and > refuse to hear differences anymore. So what I'm really looking for is > good starting points to work from. > > One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to get > width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. For > comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've found > that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for other setups. I'm of the opinion that you should work on getting the vocals to sound good dry -- before adding any effects. What are you using to record the vocals? I recommend a good condensor mike and a pre-amp, and use balanced XLR for the entire signal path, at least until where the signal is going into your audio interface, where you probably just have RCA or 1/8" inputs. -- Brett From hans at fugal.net Tue Dec 6 09:12:23 2005 From: hans at fugal.net (Hans Fugal) Date: Tue Dec 6 09:12:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems with MIDIsport 2x2 In-Reply-To: <200511281129.10088.pgclarke@beeb.net> References: <200511281129.10088.pgclarke@beeb.net> Message-ID: <43959C47.4010806@fugal.net> Peter Clarke wrote: > Dear all, > Having just updated my Gentoo kernel from 2.6.11 to 2.6.13 > (trying to get my Novation Speedio to work - that's still > WIP), I can't get my MIDIsport 2x2 to work any more. Under > 2.6.11, it worked easily - I just had to fetch > midisport_firmware-0.5.tar.bz2 from Sourceforge, and follow > the instructions in the readme file there, which showed me > how to set up the firmware loader. But I can't get this to > work any longer. I can manually upload the firmware to the > MIDIsport using this command: > > fxload -D /proc/bus/usb/XXX/YYY -I MidiSport2x2.ihx > > The MIDIsport then flashes its lights and changes its ID and > bus address ("renumerates", in the wonderful jargon), but > doesn't pick up its driver - here's the relevant section > from /proc/bus/usb/devices: > > T: Bus=03 Lev=01 Prnt=01 Port=01 Cnt=02 Dev#= 14 Spd=12 > MxCh= 0 > D: Ver= 1.00 Cls=00(>ifc ) Sub=00 Prot=00 MxPS=64 #Cfgs= 1 > P: Vendor=0763 ProdID=1002 Rev= 1.21 > C:* #Ifs= 1 Cfg#= 1 Atr=a0 MxPwr= 0mA > I: If#= 0 Alt= 0 #EPs= 5 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=00 Prot=00 > Driver=(none) > E: Ad=81(I) Atr=03(Int.) MxPS= 32 Ivl=1ms > E: Ad=82(I) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 32 Ivl=0ms > E: Ad=02(O) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 32 Ivl=0ms > E: Ad=84(I) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 32 Ivl=0ms > E: Ad=04(O) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 32 Ivl=0ms > > I have put an entry in /etc/hotplug/usb.usermap, pointing to > the script (midisport_fw) that's supposed to load the > firmware, but no messages appear in the log, suggesting > that the script is not getting run. > > What's going wrong? Why is this not working now, when it > was childsplay before? Did you by chance also upgrade udev? udev has recently decided to take over the job of hotplug, but the upgrade is not seamless. See here: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1353514&group_id=87777&atid=584353 My own rule looks like this: ACTION=="add",SYSFS{modalias}=="usb:v0763p1014d0001dcFFdscFFdpFFic*isc*ip*",RUN+="/usr/local/sbin/midisport_fw" For more on what's going on, google for "udev hotplug firmware". From m_nels at gmx.net Tue Dec 6 10:30:48 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Tue Dec 6 10:30:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <4395AEA8.4090405@gmx.net> Hi! [DISCLAIMER] I've only done a (relatively) limited amount of recording. On the other hand, I have studied many recordings, and have read a lot about the subject... I'm slowly learning what works in practice. [/DISCLAIMER] In general, these are the steps which I would try to follow: 1. Try to make the raw acoustic sound as good as possible, thinking about the acoustics of the room, and the creation of the sound itself. 2. Pay a lot of attention to microphone choice, placement, and technique. 3. Try to make sure no other sounds on the recording interfere with the frequencies of the vocal. Apply parametric EQ where necessary, to cut appropriate frequencies. I did have a nice reference table of typical frequency ranges for a list of instruments, but I have mislaid it. The same information is probably freely available online. Play with the EQ until happy. 4. Maybe apply a little reverb, remembering that it often helps to apply the same reverb to all the sounds, as it lends a certain coherence to the mix. It is natural for all of the instruments to be performed in the same room in real life, I think. 5. That's about it I think. Lots of people would also use some compression. This might help smooth out uneven dynamics, and possibly make the recording more polished. Personally, I just try to get the original performance to be good. In my opinion, a decent musician should be able to control the dynamics of his playing. Dynamics are an integral part of music. Just keep playing with plugins, and I expect you'll find what you want! I find it interesting to bypass all my plugins at some point - and listen to the raw sound again. I often find that I prefer it. Maybe that's just because I'm not experienced enough to use them yet! Regards Michael From arnold.krille at gmail.com Tue Dec 6 10:34:53 2005 From: arnold.krille at gmail.com (Arnold Krille) Date: Tue Dec 6 10:34:57 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <439593AB.80409@woh.rr.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <439593AB.80409@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <2def88b80512060734w3f490725m@mail.gmail.com> 2005/12/6, Dave Phillips : > Bill Allen wrote: > > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. > Hi Bill: > A few random tips: Stand when you sing. Use a pop filter (I should > follow my own advice). Breathe deeply, you can always erase the noise. Depending on the music you make, the breathing can even be part of the singing (thats a place to use a compressor *hint*). Imagine John Lennons "Imagine" with a voice that drank to much alcohol sung/spoken into the mic and every breathe a thunder underlining the verses. Works with the "small bar"-type of jazz too... > Don't raise your chin when you try to reach notes on the high end of > your range, it tightens the vocal mechanism and works against your > attempt. Relax, you won't sing (or play) well with excess tension. > Consider your input chain, i.e., decent microphones, preamp if > necessary, good hot signal, etc. Don't record with effects in, you'll > fool yourself and it will be harder to fix (I like that Ardour forces > that behaviour). Key your music to complement your available range. Amen. Arnold PS: dp rulez (together with ron parker) -- visit http://dillenburg.dyndns.org/~arnold/ --- Wenn man mit Raubkopien Bands wie Brosis oder Britney Spears wirklich verhindern k?nnte, w?rde ich mir noch heute einen Stapel Brenner und einen Sack Rohlinge kaufen. From markknecht at gmail.com Tue Dec 6 10:50:35 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Tue Dec 6 10:50:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512060750g3e1193dq7d2ec5ddfc28e1d@mail.gmail.com> On 12/6/05, Bill Allen wrote: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. What > combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best sound > from vocals particularly in Ardour? I know that this is one of those > subjective questions for which the best answer is try it out yourself > and find what sounds best, but there are so many plugins (an > embarassment of riches), each of which has many settings, that a brute > force search of all the combinations would take forever - not to mention > that after a while, my poor ears become exhausted with the effort and > refuse to hear differences anymore. So what I'm really looking for is > good starting points to work from. > > One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to get > width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. For > comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've found > that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for other setups. > > Regards, > Bill > Hi Bill, You've gotten some great answers already. I'll give mine which probably approaches things quite a bit differently than the other answers so far. 1) The #1 factor to a good vocal track is a good take. Everything we do should be oriented toward that end. 2) Like Dave discussed about himself, many/most vocalists do not like their voices in the dry, pristine studio environment. If you don't like the way you are sounding then they don't perform well and we break rule #1. 3) There is absolutely no need to use the same signal chain when recording as when mixing. Many vocalists like far too much reverb on their voice, but they give a better performance when using it. 4) Consider the following: a) A good quality large diaphram condenser mic + pop screen. Make sure it's mounted on a good stand with isolation. b) As good preamp as you can afford c) An external compressor such as the wonderful FMR Audio RNC1773 on a fairly light setting. (For $170 everyone should have one or more of these around. You'd be surprised how many times you'll use it if it's available.) At this point you go into your A/D for recording, but you also tee the direct audio into an external reverb (if you have one) and take the output of that reverb into your vocal monitoring signal chain. The purpose of all of this is zero latency. Vocalists seem to be very latentcy sensitive so reducing that is, in general, pretty important for a good performance, and since you're not recording this reverb so any setting that allows you to sing better works well. Sometimes way too much external reverb is better as it takes the edge off the vocals and lets the singer do their job better. If you use this direct audio path when recording then remember NOT to monitor the recorded path or you'll be hearing two copies. If all this sounds like overkill then don't get me going about external submix bus mixers! ;-) Hope this helps, Mark From lestercolza at yahoo.fr Tue Dec 6 11:46:38 2005 From: lestercolza at yahoo.fr (olivier) Date: Tue Dec 6 11:46:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] RE: How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512061325.jB6DOE7o008942@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <20051206164638.63204.qmail@web26910.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> using an equalizer, could be very helpful too ... for me equaliser + reverb is a very good starting for voices, if you sing hard, the compressor is good, it's easier to use a compressor than playing with the distance and orientation of the micro, even if someones say that's better to don't use any compressor for recording, see yourself ;-) ... ___________________________________________________________________________ Appel audio GRATUIT partout dans le monde avec le nouveau Yahoo! Messenger T?l?chargez cette version sur http://fr.messenger.yahoo.com From job17and9 at yahoo.com Tue Dec 6 11:57:12 2005 From: job17and9 at yahoo.com (Brian Dunn) Date: Tue Dec 6 11:57:15 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: best distro for making music In-Reply-To: <200512050000.jB500S7n032045@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <20051206165712.67703.qmail@web81812.mail.mud.yahoo.com> >GENTOO. Man. Perhaps it's just me, but it took me months to get Gentoo up and >running, with help from a couple of folks posting to this thread. I admit it >wasn;t months continually. I got a bit frustrated, and left it partially >installed on the drive, going back to it from time to time, as it wasn't >going to beat me. Now it's working just fine, music apps and all. Nigel Henery: Yah, that's where i'm at. It's nigh on finals week and i'm procrastinating in my studies to make time to wrestle with gentoo video drivers ( i845G, no high rez and no /dev/agpgart, currently seeking help as Higgaion in the gentoo forums, if anyone has overcome these insues before and would like to help :-) ). So i was really just wondering if gentoo has ever successfully been used as a low-latency audio system, to determine weather i should toss in the gloves, as i'm feeling rather defeated. But i can't think of anything worth doing with XP on the 50 Gigs i stole from it's drive for gentoo, so I suppose i'll let it simmer and just try not to think about it 'til the semester is over. thanks to everyone who replied. I'm thinking seriously about replacing that Mandrivia with either ubunto or planet ccrma so i can still use my computer for some fun in the gentoo-interum of consernation... because mandrivia 2006 totaly wacked out my urpmi (the dependency resolver for rpms in mdk) and now it fusses about md5 keys, and can't resolve it's own dependencies, and i told it to just to do it anyways.. OOPS. just to be fair, I've got mdk 10.1 on this here laptop now, and it's been rather stable and useful. So an other lesson i learned from trial and error and y'alls replies "if it ain't broke..." Gratefull, Brian From pw_lists at slinkp.com Tue Dec 6 12:48:28 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Tue Dec 6 12:48:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> On Tue, Dec 06, 2005 at 08:55:20AM -0500, Brett McCoy wrote: > I'm of the opinion that you should work on getting the vocals to sound > good dry -- before adding any effects. What are you using to record the > vocals? I recommend a good condensor mike and a pre-amp, +1000. The best investment is a good mic. It doesn't have to be all that expensive if you do your research. I bought an MXL V67G on ebay for under $100 with shock mount and I've been pretty happy with the results. Google for that and "Harvey Gerst" and you'll know why I got it. Gerst's online writings are priceless for people doing recording on the cheap. Sure, I'd rather have a Neumann, but who has the money for that? Another important point about mics is that some mics are better suited to different voices or even different songs. Try what you have, there's no such thing as the one true mic. My preamps aren't anything special - I have a Mackie 1202 VLZ - it's fine for now, but a little harsh in the treble. I'll probably upgrade that before getting any more expensive mics. I often compress on the way in, using an FMR RNC. (But not always; sometimes I leave it until later and use SC4 mono). Vocals are pretty tolerant of large amounts of compression, and I find that having good solid levels in my headphones helps me get better pitch. So does having some reverb in the phones. I do in-computer reverb with hardware monitoring by setting up a bus for the reverb and setting its input to the hardware input, so it doesn't go to "tape". Then I listen to the results without reverb and sometimes decide it doesn't need any! But anything that helps an unconfident singer (i.e. me) get a better performance is worthwhile. I've tried all the reverbs... freeverb, gverb, TAP reverb, versatile plate... I don't have a favorite yet, they're all useful for vocals. A tip for using Freeverb: It may seem a bit plain and sometimes harsh for vocals by itself, but you can get very good sounds out of it with some tricks: First, set the "damping" really high, that makes it smoother. Now try adding some predelay - a simple delay plugin in front of the reverb, at 100% wet; try around 50 ms delay to start with - that makes the "room" a little bigger and more interesting. Lower the delay time to make it more subtle; bump it up to 100 ms to make it a more obvious effect. Finally, try post-filtering; follow the delay/reverb combo with a low pass filter (the simple one-pole filter from CMT will do fine); set the cutoff around 5000 Hz to start with and adjust to taste. Smooooth. Here's an example using the above freeverb recipe (please don't anybody make permanent links to this one as it's a rough mix of stuff that we're probably going to re-record due to some performance flubs and some too-hot levels you can hear a bit): http://slinkp.com/~paul/dont_get_sad_mix_20051206.mp3 I played guitar and sang backups (badly), my wife sang lead (beautifully). And no, we didn't write that, it's a cover of an Ida song. I wish I wrote that. Other technical notes: Lots of compression (SC1) on each vocal track. Maybe 6:1 ratio, attack around 30 ms, release around 120 ms. No EQ on Abby's voice. I forget if that was the MXL V67G or the MXL V57 (which I sometimes like better on female voices, it has less of an upper-mid presence peak). Some 10-band EQ on my voice due to poor mic choice during tracking (Sennheiser 421 which is a GREAT all-purpose mic but for this song I found it too present and sibilant in the upper mids for backing vocals). Which brings up another idea ... if you want a brighter reverb sound than I was going for in that track, like super-in-your- face radio pop, one problem is that voices can get really sibilant. TAP De-Esser can be really handy here. Put it on the vocals after compression, before EQ and before reverb. Then you can make really obnoxiously bright vocals without the ssssssibilancccccce tearing your head off. I don't have any recorded examples of this to share - yet :-) > and use > balanced XLR for the entire signal path, at least until where the signal > is going into your audio interface, where you probably just have RCA or > 1/8" inputs. That's nice if the rest of your gear is already pretty good, but personally I don't worry about balancing line levels at this point. In my view it's a lot less important than having a good mic, good soundcard, and good preamp. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From rtp405 at yahoo.com Tue Dec 6 13:46:14 2005 From: rtp405 at yahoo.com (R Parker) Date: Tue Dec 6 13:46:17 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi Paul, After a very quick listen I think your wife has a very nice voice. Is she ready to leaving you? Because I am available. Ron --- Paul Winkler wrote: > On Tue, Dec 06, 2005 at 08:55:20AM -0500, Brett > McCoy wrote: > > I'm of the opinion that you should work on getting > the vocals to sound > > good dry -- before adding any effects. What are > you using to record the > > vocals? I recommend a good condensor mike and a > pre-amp, > > +1000. The best investment is a good mic. > It doesn't have to be all that expensive if you do > your research. > I bought an MXL V67G on ebay for under $100 with > shock mount > and I've been pretty happy with the results. Google > for that > and "Harvey Gerst" and you'll know why I got it. > Gerst's online > writings are priceless for people doing recording on > the cheap. > Sure, I'd rather have a Neumann, but who has the > money for that? > Another important point about mics is that some mics > are better > suited to different voices or even different songs. > Try what > you have, there's no such thing as the one true mic. > > My preamps aren't anything special - I have a Mackie > 1202 VLZ - it's > fine for now, but a little harsh in the treble. I'll > probably upgrade > that before getting any more expensive mics. > > I often compress on the way in, using an FMR RNC. > (But not always; > sometimes I leave it until later and use SC4 mono). > Vocals are pretty > tolerant of large amounts of compression, and I find > that having good > solid levels in my headphones helps me get better > pitch. So does having > some reverb in the phones. I do in-computer reverb > with hardware > monitoring by setting up a bus for the reverb and > setting its input to > the hardware input, so it doesn't go to "tape". > Then I listen to the > results without reverb and sometimes decide it > doesn't need any! But > anything that helps an unconfident singer (i.e. me) > get a better > performance is worthwhile. > > I've tried all the reverbs... freeverb, gverb, TAP > reverb, > versatile plate... I don't have a favorite yet, > they're all useful for > vocals. > > A tip for using Freeverb: It may seem a bit plain > and sometimes harsh > for vocals by itself, but you can get very good > sounds out of it with > some tricks: > > First, set the "damping" really high, that makes it > smoother. > > Now try adding some predelay - a simple delay plugin > in front of the reverb, > at 100% wet; try around 50 ms delay to start with - > that makes the > "room" a little bigger and more interesting. Lower > the delay time to make it more subtle; bump it up to > 100 ms to make it a more obvious effect. > > Finally, try post-filtering; follow the delay/reverb > combo with a low > pass filter (the simple one-pole filter from CMT > will do fine); set the > cutoff around 5000 Hz to start with and adjust to > taste. Smooooth. > > Here's an example using the above freeverb recipe > (please don't anybody > make permanent links to this one as it's a rough mix > of stuff that we're > probably going to re-record due to some performance > flubs and some > too-hot levels you can hear a bit): > > http://slinkp.com/~paul/dont_get_sad_mix_20051206.mp3 > > > I played guitar and sang backups (badly), my wife > sang lead > (beautifully). > > And no, we didn't write that, it's a cover of an Ida > song. > I wish I wrote that. > > > Other technical notes: > Lots of compression (SC1) on each vocal track. > Maybe 6:1 ratio, attack around 30 ms, release around > 120 ms. No EQ on > Abby's voice. I forget if that was the MXL V67G or > the MXL V57 (which I > sometimes like better on female voices, it has less > of an upper-mid > presence peak). > > Some 10-band EQ on my voice due to poor mic choice > during tracking > (Sennheiser 421 which is a GREAT all-purpose mic but > for this song I > found it too present and sibilant in the upper mids > for backing vocals). > > Which brings up another idea ... if you want a > brighter > reverb sound than I was going for in that track, > like super-in-your- > face radio pop, one problem is that voices can get > really sibilant. > TAP De-Esser can be really handy here. Put it on the > vocals > after compression, before EQ and before reverb. > Then you can > make really obnoxiously bright vocals without the > ssssssibilancccccce > tearing your head off. I don't have any recorded > examples of > this to share - yet :-) > > > and use > > balanced XLR for the entire signal path, at least > until where the signal > > is going into your audio interface, where you > probably just have RCA or > > 1/8" inputs. > > That's nice if the rest of your gear is already > pretty good, but > personally I don't worry about balancing line levels > at this point. > In my view it's a lot less important than having a > good mic, good > soundcard, and good preamp. > > -- > > Paul Winkler > http://www.slinkp.com > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From brad at sonaural.com Tue Dec 6 14:06:58 2005 From: brad at sonaural.com (Brad Fuller) Date: Tue Dec 6 14:07:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins Message-ID: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> y'all see this at createdigitalmusic.com? http://createdigitalmusic.com/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=1037 Could be handy brad -- See Us At GDC 2006 Sonaural Audio Studio (408) 799-6123 West San Jose (408) 799-6124 Cambrian Hear us online: www.Sonaural.com See me on O'Reilly From pw_lists at slinkp.com Tue Dec 6 14:27:47 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Tue Dec 6 14:27:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051206192747.GF9030@slinkp.com> On Tue, Dec 06, 2005 at 10:46:14AM -0800, R Parker wrote: > Hi Paul, > > After a very quick listen I think your wife has a very > nice voice. Is she ready to leaving you? Because I am > available. I'm sure you are :-P -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Tue Dec 6 14:34:44 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Tue Dec 6 14:35:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4395E7D4.5020700@walescomputers.co.uk> Hi Ron thats a nice sound on the vocals there. Talking of that heres a link for you all. http://www.projectoverseer.biz/music/play.php?band_id=92&song_id=573&mode=song_hifi The song will just play Instead of me telling you what was used, have a guess!! I'll tell you its an Takomine with electrics built in. into a DDX 3216 and into Ardour on 64studio So: 1 How was it recorded? 2 What mike/type was used on the vocals I think this was we have to losten to the track in a different light without knowing what kit was used. Just curious to see what you all think. Cheers Bob R Parker wrote: > Hi Paul, > > After a very quick listen I think your wife has a very > nice voice. Is she ready to leaving you? Because I am > available. > > Ron > > --- Paul Winkler wrote: > > >>On Tue, Dec 06, 2005 at 08:55:20AM -0500, Brett >>McCoy wrote: >> >>>I'm of the opinion that you should work on getting >> >>the vocals to sound >> >>>good dry -- before adding any effects. What are >> >>you using to record the >> >>>vocals? I recommend a good condensor mike and a >> >>pre-amp, >> >>+1000. The best investment is a good mic. >>It doesn't have to be all that expensive if you do >>your research. >>I bought an MXL V67G on ebay for under $100 with >>shock mount >>and I've been pretty happy with the results. Google >>for that >>and "Harvey Gerst" and you'll know why I got it. >>Gerst's online >>writings are priceless for people doing recording on >>the cheap. >>Sure, I'd rather have a Neumann, but who has the >>money for that? >>Another important point about mics is that some mics >>are better >>suited to different voices or even different songs. >>Try what >>you have, there's no such thing as the one true mic. >> >>My preamps aren't anything special - I have a Mackie >>1202 VLZ - it's >>fine for now, but a little harsh in the treble. I'll >>probably upgrade >>that before getting any more expensive mics. >> >>I often compress on the way in, using an FMR RNC. >>(But not always; >>sometimes I leave it until later and use SC4 mono). >>Vocals are pretty >>tolerant of large amounts of compression, and I find >>that having good >>solid levels in my headphones helps me get better >>pitch. So does having >>some reverb in the phones. I do in-computer reverb >>with hardware >>monitoring by setting up a bus for the reverb and >>setting its input to >>the hardware input, so it doesn't go to "tape". >>Then I listen to the >>results without reverb and sometimes decide it >>doesn't need any! But >>anything that helps an unconfident singer (i.e. me) >>get a better >>performance is worthwhile. >> >>I've tried all the reverbs... freeverb, gverb, TAP >>reverb, >>versatile plate... I don't have a favorite yet, >>they're all useful for >>vocals. >> >>A tip for using Freeverb: It may seem a bit plain >>and sometimes harsh >>for vocals by itself, but you can get very good >>sounds out of it with >>some tricks: >> >>First, set the "damping" really high, that makes it >>smoother. >> >>Now try adding some predelay - a simple delay plugin >>in front of the reverb, >>at 100% wet; try around 50 ms delay to start with - >>that makes the >>"room" a little bigger and more interesting. Lower >>the delay time to make it more subtle; bump it up to >>100 ms to make it a more obvious effect. >> >>Finally, try post-filtering; follow the delay/reverb >>combo with a low >>pass filter (the simple one-pole filter from CMT >>will do fine); set the >>cutoff around 5000 Hz to start with and adjust to >>taste. Smooooth. >> >>Here's an example using the above freeverb recipe >>(please don't anybody >>make permanent links to this one as it's a rough mix >>of stuff that we're >>probably going to re-record due to some performance >>flubs and some >>too-hot levels you can hear a bit): >> >> > > http://slinkp.com/~paul/dont_get_sad_mix_20051206.mp3 > >> >>I played guitar and sang backups (badly), my wife >>sang lead >>(beautifully). >> >>And no, we didn't write that, it's a cover of an Ida >>song. >>I wish I wrote that. >> >> >>Other technical notes: >>Lots of compression (SC1) on each vocal track. >>Maybe 6:1 ratio, attack around 30 ms, release around >>120 ms. No EQ on >>Abby's voice. I forget if that was the MXL V67G or >>the MXL V57 (which I >>sometimes like better on female voices, it has less >>of an upper-mid >>presence peak). >> >>Some 10-band EQ on my voice due to poor mic choice >>during tracking >>(Sennheiser 421 which is a GREAT all-purpose mic but >>for this song I >>found it too present and sibilant in the upper mids >>for backing vocals). >> >>Which brings up another idea ... if you want a >>brighter >>reverb sound than I was going for in that track, >>like super-in-your- >>face radio pop, one problem is that voices can get >>really sibilant. >>TAP De-Esser can be really handy here. Put it on the >>vocals >>after compression, before EQ and before reverb. >>Then you can >>make really obnoxiously bright vocals without the >>ssssssibilancccccce >>tearing your head off. I don't have any recorded >>examples of >>this to share - yet :-) >> >> >>>and use >>>balanced XLR for the entire signal path, at least >> >>until where the signal >> >>>is going into your audio interface, where you >> >>probably just have RCA or >> >>>1/8" inputs. >> >>That's nice if the rest of your gear is already >>pretty good, but >>personally I don't worry about balancing line levels >>at this point. >>In my view it's a lot less important than having a >>good mic, good >>soundcard, and good preamp. >> >>-- >> >>Paul Winkler >>http://www.slinkp.com >> > > > > > > __________________________________________ > Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. > Just $16.99/mo. or less. > dsl.yahoo.com > > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From rlrevell at joe-job.com Tue Dec 6 14:47:29 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Tue Dec 6 14:54:27 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 06:05 -0500, Bill Allen wrote: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? Actually this reminds me of something that's been bugging me. What's that really digital sounding vocal effect that you hear on a lot of R&B stuff these days? It's all over that tune "I'm Sprung" that was on the radio all summer, and in the Simpsons episode where they have a boy band, on Ralph Wiggum's voice when he sings "love formation". Lee From conorotuama at eircom.net Tue Dec 6 15:05:34 2005 From: conorotuama at eircom.net (Conor O'Tuama) Date: Tue Dec 6 15:09:17 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <4395EF0E.8070302@eircom.net> Lee Revell wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 06:05 -0500, Bill Allen wrote: > >>I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your >>vocals to sound good? > > > Actually this reminds me of something that's been bugging me. What's > that really digital sounding vocal effect that you hear on a lot of R&B > stuff these days? It's all over that tune "I'm Sprung" that was on the > radio all summer, and in the Simpsons episode where they have a boy > band, on Ralph Wiggum's voice when he sings "love formation". > > Lee > > > The Vocoder, perhaps ? From cesare at poeticstudios.com Tue Dec 6 15:25:32 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Tue Dec 6 15:25:39 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> Lee Revell wrote: >On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 06:05 -0500, Bill Allen wrote: > > >>I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your >>vocals to sound good? >> >> > >Actually this reminds me of something that's been bugging me. What's >that really digital sounding vocal effect that you hear on a lot of R&B >stuff these days? It's all over that tune "I'm Sprung" that was on the >radio all summer, and in the Simpsons episode where they have a boy >band, on Ralph Wiggum's voice when he sings "love formation". > >Lee > > > > > Pitch correction with drastic settings (like the Atares AutoTune). Sometimes it's also used to fake the sound of a vocoder. c. www.cesaremarilungo.com From ce at christeck.de Tue Dec 6 15:56:53 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Tue Dec 6 15:56:17 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <200512062156.53411.ce@christeck.de> > Pitch correction with drastic settings (like the Atares AutoTune). > Sometimes it's also used to fake the sound of a vocoder. AFAIR it's not that new. It was heard in the charts just some months as a plugin for Cubase appeared some years ago (though I do not remember its name). It was a very interesting thing to see how long (or short) it lasts until new technology gets adopted by the users. Best regards ce From rlrevell at joe-job.com Tue Dec 6 16:13:58 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Tue Dec 6 16:13:12 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <200512062156.53411.ce@christeck.de> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <200512062156.53411.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <1133903639.29084.41.camel@mindpipe> On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 21:56 +0100, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > Pitch correction with drastic settings (like the Atares AutoTune). > > Sometimes it's also used to fake the sound of a vocoder. > > AFAIR it's not that new. It was heard in the charts just some months as > a plugin for Cubase appeared some years ago (though I do not remember > its name). > > It was a very interesting thing to see how long (or short) it lasts > until new technology gets adopted by the users. > Yeah I know it's been around since the 90's, it was obviously some Pro Tools thing, I just didn't know what it was called. Lee From pete.leigh at gmail.com Tue Dec 6 16:41:14 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Tue Dec 6 16:41:26 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: On 06/12/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Pitch correction with drastic settings (like the Atares AutoTune). > Sometimes it's also used to fake the sound of a vocoder. Funnily enough, curiosity sparked by the original question, I was reading Tweak's guide to recording vocals[1] and I read this: Q) How do i get vocal effects like on Cher's "Believe"? I heard it was done with a Vocoder. A) Nope. It was done with a pitch/intonation processor, like Antares AutoTune. You get that effect by "abusing" the settings. You tell autotune you are singing only Ab and and Eb notes and you sing F and C notes. Auto tune will bend your vocal notes to the closest selected pitch giving that "yodel-like" sound Is that the same thing? Unfortunately (or fortunately, according to taste :) I haven't heard Cher's "Believe". 1) http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_record_vocals.htm and http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_process_vocal_tracks.htm No Linux content, but an interesting read.. - Pete. From cesare at poeticstudios.com Tue Dec 6 17:07:47 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Tue Dec 6 17:07:52 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> Pete Leigh wrote: >On 06/12/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > >>Pitch correction with drastic settings (like the Atares AutoTune). >>Sometimes it's also used to fake the sound of a vocoder. >> >> > >Funnily enough, curiosity sparked by the original question, >I was reading Tweak's guide to recording vocals[1] and >I read this: > > Q) How do i get vocal effects like on Cher's "Believe"? > I heard it was done with a Vocoder. > > A) Nope. It was done with a pitch/intonation processor, > like Antares AutoTune. You get that effect by "abusing" > the settings. You tell autotune you are singing only Ab > and and Eb notes and you sing F and C notes. Auto tune > will bend your vocal notes to the closest selected pitch > giving that "yodel-like" sound > >Is that the same thing? Unfortunately (or fortunately, >according to taste :) I haven't heard Cher's "Believe". > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). You want to hear how it sounds? Just watch MTV. c. www.cesaremarilungo.com >1) http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_record_vocals.htm >and http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_process_vocal_tracks.htm >No Linux content, but an interesting read.. > >- Pete. > > > > > From patrick-rotsaert at pandora.be Tue Dec 6 17:21:18 2005 From: patrick-rotsaert at pandora.be (Patrick Rotsaert) Date: Tue Dec 6 17:23:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] ADAT/FST file system Message-ID: <43960EDE.4020404@pandora.be> Hi, Does anybody know if it is possible to mount and read an Alesis ADAT/FST disk in Linux. AFAIK, this is a propriety file system. I read some messages on the net that Alesis did not release the specs of their file system, but those messages dated from 2001. Maybe there have been changes since then... From b0ef at esben-stien.name Tue Dec 6 23:18:34 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Tue Dec 6 21:24:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins In-Reply-To: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> (Brad Fuller's message of "Tue, 06 Dec 2005 11:06:58 -0800") References: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> Message-ID: <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Brad Fuller writes: > Could be handy Be adviced that these are not free software plugins in the sense of freedom. They are merely proprietary gratis software. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Wed Dec 7 01:34:44 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Wed Dec 7 01:34:37 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 14:47 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 06:05 -0500, Bill Allen wrote: > > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > > vocals to sound good? > > Actually this reminds me of something that's been bugging me. What's > that really digital sounding vocal effect that you hear on a lot of R&B > stuff these days? It's all over that tune "I'm Sprung" that was on the > radio all summer, and in the Simpsons episode where they have a boy > band, on Ralph Wiggum's voice when he sings "love formation". > Cher started that garbage about 4 or 5 years ago - it's pitch correction taken to extremes. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From loki.davison at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 02:40:31 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Wed Dec 7 02:40:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <4395E7D4.5020700@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4395E7D4.5020700@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: > >>A tip for using Freeverb: It may seem a bit plain > >>and sometimes harsh > >>for vocals by itself, but you can get very good > >>sounds out of it with > >>some tricks: > >> > >>First, set the "damping" really high, that makes it > >>smoother. > >> > >>Now try adding some predelay - a simple delay plugin > >>in front of the reverb, > >>at 100% wet; try around 50 ms delay to start with - > >>that makes the > >>"room" a little bigger and more interesting. Lower > >>the delay time to make it more subtle; bump it up to > >>100 ms to make it a more obvious effect. > >> > >>Finally, try post-filtering; follow the delay/reverb > >>combo with a low > >>pass filter (the simple one-pole filter from CMT > >>will do fine); set the > >>cutoff around 5000 Hz to start with and adjust to > >>taste. Smooooth. > >> I'm shocked no one has mentioned jack_convolve, or dssi_convolve yet. A truly wonderful reverb that works well on everything with the right choice of impulse. Though i haven't tried it that much on vocals. It's by far the best sounding reverb i've ever heard and is all round wonderful ;-). It's actually not that heavy on cpu either. Loki From fritz at fritzmetal.de Wed Dec 7 05:19:07 2005 From: fritz at fritzmetal.de (FRitz) Date: Wed Dec 7 05:19:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins In-Reply-To: <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> References: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: <4396B71B.2020303@fritzmetal.de> Esben Stien wrote: > Brad Fuller writes: > > >> Could be handy >> > > Be adviced that these are not free software plugins in the sense of > freedom. They are merely proprietary gratis software. > > What's the difference in real life? From bwanab+lau at juraview.com Wed Dec 7 05:54:00 2005 From: bwanab+lau at juraview.com (Bill Allen) Date: Wed Dec 7 05:54:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <4396BF48.9030608@juraview.com> Bill Allen wrote: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? To all who replied, thank you very much. You've all given me a ton of good ideas. A couple of comments: One of the common themes was microphone selection. Whenever you've got that much consensus on an issue, you've probably got a keeper. I've been using an old Shure SM-58, which is a great live mic, but I suspect I could get better results with a better mic even in my bedroom^h^h^h^h^h^hstudio. I'm not as concerned about the quality of my voice as much as how to get the best out of it that I can and more specifically to get the effect that I'm trying to achieve in a specific song. On the specific song in question that I'm working on right now (which I'd mentioned in a previous message) at http://juraview.com/Bills_Music.html, I've sung the lead to this song in bands in the past even though in every case, the band I was in had much better singers. It's the backup voices where I wish I had the good singers. They are what made the live performances work. Alas, I'll have the Ardour project on hand and when a good singer crosses my hearth, I'll hijack him or her to the studio and get a track out so quickly they won't have time to ask for a shot of Jack Daniel's. Paul - your wife has a lovely voice - detected a hint of Sandy Denny influence there. Best regards and thanks again for all the responses, Bill From franciscojfraga at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 06:10:24 2005 From: franciscojfraga at gmail.com (Francisco Fraga) Date: Wed Dec 7 06:10:29 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how enabling non-audio (AC3, DTS, MP3) S/PDIF out at ALSA? Message-ID: <74e871d60512070310r64c30b65gb52cb341ff467761@mail.gmail.com> Hi everybody, I would like to know how I could enable the use of non-audio (AC3, DTS, MP3) S/PDIF out at the ALSA context, in a set-top-box with the ALC650 AC'97 chipset, without having to re-compile the Linux kernel. In the linux-2.6.13 kernel, in line 1733 of the the source code "sound/pci/ac97/ac97_patch.c", there is a function: "patch_alc650(ac97_t * ac97)". In this funcion, several ALC650 registers are read and written. I know that, for enabling non-audio (AC3, DTS, MP3) S/PDIF out in an AC'97 chipset, I have to put a "1" at the 2nd LSB bit of the MX3A register, and also choose the correct Category Code for the non-audio S/PDIF format (AC3, DTS or MP3). So I have to basic problems to solve: 1. Find out how to create an AC'97 instance (ac97_t * ac97), in order to use the function "void snd_ac97_write_cache(ac97_t *ac97, unsigned short reg, unsigned short value)" for writing in the MX3A register; 2. Find out the correct Category Code for each non-audio S/PDIF format (AC3, DTS or MP3). If someone could help me, I would be very grateful. Best, Francisco From mista.tapas at gmx.net Wed Dec 7 06:17:55 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Wed Dec 7 06:18:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins In-Reply-To: <4396B71B.2020303@fritzmetal.de> References: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <4396B71B.2020303@fritzmetal.de> Message-ID: <20051207121755.2d8ba36b@mango.fruits.de> On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 11:19:07 +0100 FRitz wrote: > Esben Stien wrote: > > Brad Fuller writes: > > > > > >> Could be handy > >> > > > > Be adviced that these are not free software plugins in the sense of > > freedom. They are merely proprietary gratis software. > > > > > > What's the difference in real life? Think about it a bit. You want to change it -> you can't with gratis proprietary software, but you can with free software. A discontinued proprietary software cannot be developed further by the community, etc. pp. You might answer that as a mere user this doesn't concern you. But you are wrong. Of course, even as a mere user you have advantages with free software. You can always look for someone to do the stuff that you want (fixing the software, updating it, etc..). Even maybe paying someone to add that missing feature you need. If you want to, you can even keep the modified software all to yourself (as long as you don't distribute it no one has the right to see the changes you made). Free software has many advantages. But besides that gratis proprietary software can be fun, too ;) [i play around with some VSTi's, too] Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From jh at brainiac.com Wed Dec 7 06:24:27 2005 From: jh at brainiac.com (Joe Hartley) Date: Wed Dec 7 06:24:30 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 Cesare Marilungo wrote: > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit before it was a plug-in. Where would Ashlee and Britney be without it? -- ====================================================================== Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh@brainiac.com Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Wed Dec 7 07:50:24 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Wed Dec 7 07:50:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins In-Reply-To: <20051207121755.2d8ba36b@mango.fruits.de> References: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <4396B71B.2020303@fritzmetal.de> <20051207121755.2d8ba36b@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <4396DA90.9030906@walescomputers.co.uk> Florian Schmidt wrote: > On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 11:19:07 +0100 > FRitz wrote: > > >>Esben Stien wrote: >> >>>Brad Fuller writes: >>> >>> >>> >>>>Could be handy >>>> >>> >>>Be adviced that these are not free software plugins in the sense of >>>freedom. They are merely proprietary gratis software. >>> >>> >> >>What's the difference in real life? > > > Think about it a bit. You want to change it -> you can't with gratis > proprietary software, but you can with free software. A discontinued > proprietary software cannot be developed further by the community, etc. > pp. You might answer that as a mere user this doesn't concern you. But > you are wrong. Of course, even as a mere user you have advantages with > free software. You can always look for someone to do the stuff that you > want (fixing the software, updating it, etc..). Even maybe paying > someone to add that missing feature you need. If you want to, you can > even keep the modified software all to yourself (as long as you don't > distribute it no one has the right to see the changes you made). > > Free software has many advantages. > > But besides that gratis proprietary software can be fun, too ;) [i play > around with some VSTi's, too] > Re the Gratis proprietary software, I think a lot of these companies are a bit worried by the Linux thing and are trying to see how making their product free can help them with sales. I like to think Nvidea have seen better sales due to their drivers for Linux. They may even realise that they can open the drivers up and still retain a market share. Here's hoping Bob > Flo > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From SoenkeHahn at web.de Wed Dec 7 13:40:51 2005 From: SoenkeHahn at web.de (Soenke Hahn) Date: Wed Dec 7 13:41:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins In-Reply-To: <20051207121755.2d8ba36b@mango.fruits.de> References: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <4396B71B.2020303@fritzmetal.de> <20051207121755.2d8ba36b@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <43972CB3.5040705@web.de> Florian Schmidt schrieb: >On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 11:19:07 +0100 >FRitz wrote: > > > >>Esben Stien wrote: >> >> >>>Brad Fuller writes: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>Could be handy >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>Be adviced that these are not free software plugins in the sense of >>>freedom. They are merely proprietary gratis software. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>What's the difference in real life? >> >> > >You want to change it -> you can't with gratis >proprietary software, but you can with free software. > > In addition to that: with real free software you can be quite sure, the program doesn't do things, you don't want it to. ...no, I'm wrong, there are lots of things going on in my system, that I don't want to happen. But at least they were initially intended to help me to do the things i wanna do. Hmm, maybe my english is a bit crappy... Just consider spyware in a gratis downloadable game. You want to play the game, the company wants information about you. Two interests, both served by the same software. (Put like this, it sounds really great :)) S?nke From fritz at fritzmetal.de Wed Dec 7 13:58:57 2005 From: fritz at fritzmetal.de (FRitz) Date: Wed Dec 7 13:58:34 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins In-Reply-To: <43972CB3.5040705@web.de> References: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <4396B71B.2020303@fritzmetal.de> <20051207121755.2d8ba36b@mango.fruits.de> <43972CB3.5040705@web.de> Message-ID: <439730F1.40606@fritzmetal.de> Soenke Hahn wrote: > Florian Schmidt schrieb: > >> On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 11:19:07 +0100 >> FRitz wrote: >> >> >> >>> Esben Stien wrote: >>> >>>> Brad Fuller writes: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Could be handy >>>>> >>>> Be adviced that these are not free software plugins in the sense of >>>> freedom. They are merely proprietary gratis software. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> What's the difference in real life? >>> >> >> You want to change it -> you can't with gratis >> proprietary software, but you can with free software. >> > In addition to that: with real free software you can be quite sure, > the program doesn't do things, you don't want it to. > ...no, I'm wrong, there are lots of things going on in my system, that > I don't want to happen. But at least they were initially intended to > help me to do the things i wanna do. Hmm, maybe my english is a bit > crappy... > Just consider spyware in a gratis downloadable game. You want to play > the game, the company wants information about you. Two interests, both > served by the same software. (Put like this, it sounds really great :)) > > S?nke > > > > I never had spyware in any VSTplugin I ever downloaded. May it stay like this! ;-) Best wishes, FRitz From martin at dc.cis.okstate.edu Wed Dec 7 14:18:38 2005 From: martin at dc.cis.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Wed Dec 7 14:18:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base Message-ID: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> How does one read the MCM number and any other non-audio data from a music CD? I want to build a MP3 server for our house and definitely do not want to manually enter data from the art work in the CD box. It is my understanding that one can retrieve the MCM catalog number and match it against a data base to turn that in to an album name and song titles. Is this correct? I also want to do this without any X applications. The computer is good enough for command-line shells, etc, but is only a 400-meg Pentium with 65 megs of RAM. I am home-brewing this server which will probably end up being a collection of shell scripts and C applications written by me but I realized that I wasn't sure how to let the CD's own data speak for themselves. While ripping tracks using cdparanoia, I frequently see a short track numbered 0 which is not a song but appears to have some sort of binary data. CD's I burn or some commercial CD's do not have this special track. What is it? Thanks for any answers or suggestions. This is one of those times when Google searches turn up a boatload of all the wrong information, probably because I didn't use the right search terms, but nonetheless, I haven't found what I was looking for yet. Martin McCormick WB5AGZ Stillwater, OK OSU Information Technology Department Network Operations Group .-- -... ..... .- --. --.. From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 14:45:16 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 14:44:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] search: free vst plugins In-Reply-To: <439730F1.40606@fritzmetal.de> References: <4395E152.8000608@sonaural.com> <87y82x1qw5.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <4396B71B.2020303@fritzmetal.de> <20051207121755.2d8ba36b@mango.fruits.de> <43972CB3.5040705@web.de> <439730F1.40606@fritzmetal.de> Message-ID: <1133984717.17901.42.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 19:58 +0100, FRitz wrote: > I never had spyware in any VSTplugin I ever downloaded. May it stay > like > this! ;-) > And most people never imagined they could get spyware by popping in an innocent looking audio CD. Lee From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 14:46:32 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 14:45:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> References: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <1133984793.17901.44.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 13:18 -0600, Martin McCormick wrote: > How does one read the MCM number and any other non-audio data > from a music CD? I want to build a MP3 server for our house and > definitely do not want to manually enter data from the art work in the > CD box. > > It is my understanding that one can retrieve the MCM catalog > number and match it against a data base to turn that in to an album > name and song titles. Is this correct? Yes it's called CDDB and any decent music player should have built in support. XMMS does talk to the CDDB right? If not we are a lot further behind than I thought... Lee From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 14:47:51 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 14:46:55 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> Message-ID: <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 00:34 -0600, Jan Depner wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 14:47 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 06:05 -0500, Bill Allen wrote: > > > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > > > vocals to sound good? > > > > Actually this reminds me of something that's been bugging me. What's > > that really digital sounding vocal effect that you hear on a lot of R&B > > stuff these days? It's all over that tune "I'm Sprung" that was on the > > radio all summer, and in the Simpsons episode where they have a boy > > band, on Ralph Wiggum's voice when he sings "love formation". > > > > Cher started that garbage about 4 or 5 years ago - it's pitch > correction taken to extremes. > Cher could not have been the first to popularize this. I am pretty sure that boy band Simpsons episode predates "Believe". (BTW I can't stand the effect either) Lee From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 14:49:54 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 14:49:06 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> Message-ID: <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: > On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 > Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > before it was a plug-in. Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? Lee From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 15:05:22 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:05:50 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> Lee Revell wrote: >> Cher started that garbage about 4 or 5 years ago - it's pitch >>correction taken to extremes. >> > > > Cher could not have been the first to popularize this. I am pretty sure > that boy band Simpsons episode predates "Believe". > > (BTW I can't stand the effect either) I'm not sure I've heard this effect... what other songs have used it? -- Brett From mista.tapas at gmx.net Wed Dec 7 15:21:40 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:21:47 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051207212140.74170a80@mango.fruits.de> On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 14:49:54 -0500 Lee Revell wrote: > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > > before it was a plug-in. > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? Well, the one _you_ write :) <- smiley Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Wed Dec 7 15:24:58 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:22:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <1133984793.17901.44.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> <1133984793.17901.44.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1133987098.9954.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:46 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 13:18 -0600, Martin McCormick wrote: > > How does one read the MCM number and any other non-audio data > > from a music CD? I want to build a MP3 server for our house and > > definitely do not want to manually enter data from the art work in the > > CD box. > > > > It is my understanding that one can retrieve the MCM catalog > > number and match it against a data base to turn that in to an album > > name and song titles. Is this correct? > > Yes it's called CDDB and any decent music player should have built in > support. > > XMMS does talk to the CDDB right? If not we are a lot further behind > than I thought... but here is the greatest thing of all: freedb.org (and probably cddb too) do *not* use the MCM number because there are duplicates. instead, it does the absolutely *brilliant* thing of creating an ID for the CD based on the length and number of tracks, which is almost guaranteed to be unique. From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 15:31:50 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:30:50 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <20051207212140.74170a80@mango.fruits.de> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <20051207212140.74170a80@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <1133987510.17901.58.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 21:21 +0100, Florian Schmidt wrote: > On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 14:49:54 -0500 > Lee Revell wrote: > > > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > > > before it was a plug-in. > > > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? > > Well, the one _you_ write :) <- smiley > Dammit, you mean I can't produce boy bands with Linux? What good is it then? Lee From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Wed Dec 7 15:34:32 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:32:19 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:49 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: > > On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 > > Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > > > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). > > > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > > before it was a plug-in. > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051207/625a4ef2/attachment-0001.bin From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 15:37:23 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:36:25 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <1133987843.17901.63.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 15:05 -0500, Brett McCoy wrote: > Lee Revell wrote: > >> Cher started that garbage about 4 or 5 years ago - it's pitch > >>correction taken to extremes. > >> > > > > > > Cher could not have been the first to popularize this. I am pretty sure > > that boy band Simpsons episode predates "Believe". > > > > (BTW I can't stand the effect either) > > I'm not sure I've heard this effect... what other songs have used it? The most obnoxious, in your face example I have heard recently is this R&B tune, "I'm Sprung". Check gnutella or turn on MTV for 5 minutes. Lee From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 15:39:49 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:40:14 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> Brett McCoy wrote: >>> Cher started that garbage about 4 or 5 years ago - it's pitch >>> correction taken to extremes. >>> >> >> >> Cher could not have been the first to popularize this. I am pretty sure >> that boy band Simpsons episode predates "Believe". >> >> (BTW I can't stand the effect either) > > > I'm not sure I've heard this effect... what other songs have used it? I found a video of "I'm Sprung" via Google... that is an awful sound. Do people actually like that? It seems very gratuitous, like the overly obvious CG effects used in movies... -- Brett From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 15:51:35 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:51:40 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:49 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: > > > On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 > > > Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > > > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > > > > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). > > > > > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > > > before it was a plug-in. > > > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. > Unless it can be driven bt a MIDI controlled reference frequency source it's unlikely you'll inflict the same pain on the world. ;-) - Mark From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 15:54:17 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:53:19 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <1133988858.17901.69.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 21:34 +0100, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:49 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: > > > On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 > > > Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > > > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > > > > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). > > > > > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > > > before it was a plug-in. > > > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. > Isn't auto tune a lot harder than simple linear pitch shifting? Lee From okonsar at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 15:54:29 2005 From: okonsar at gmail.com (Mehmet Okonsar) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:54:29 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler Message-ID: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> What can you say about the usability of the LinuxSampler in its current state.. Giga import? Disk streaming? Writing audio to file? GUI? ------------- Best regards, Mehmet Okon?ar, pianist-composer www.okonsar.com mehmet@okonsar.com From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 15:55:38 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:54:37 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> Message-ID: <1133988938.17901.71.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: > On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 > Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > before it was a plug-in. > > Where would Ashlee and Britney be without it? > BTW this thread reminds me of a joke: Q: What did the Pro Tools engineer say to the artist? A: Sounds like shit, come on in! Lee From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 15:54:27 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 15:54:49 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133987843.17901.63.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <1133987843.17901.63.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43974C03.2030304@chapelperilous.net> Lee Revell wrote: >>I'm not sure I've heard this effect... what other songs have used it? > > > The most obnoxious, in your face example I have heard recently is this > R&B tune, "I'm Sprung". Check gnutella or turn on MTV for 5 minutes. I found it... very annoying effect. I think that's the same thing used on that one Audioslave song near the end... it's like someone is using a whammy bar on the voice -- Brett From aaron at nquit.com Wed Dec 7 16:14:05 2005 From: aaron at nquit.com (Aaron Trumm) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:14:14 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133990045.5200.0.camel@cmn8.stanford.edu> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 12:51 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:49 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: > > > > On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 > > > > Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > > > > > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > > > > > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). > > > > > > > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > > > > before it was a plug-in. > > > > > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? > > > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 but is this a pitch corrector like the AutoTune or just a pitch shifter? From mista.tapas at gmx.net Wed Dec 7 16:17:28 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:17:45 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133987510.17901.58.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <20051207212140.74170a80@mango.fruits.de> <1133987510.17901.58.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051207221728.544db349@mango.fruits.de> On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 15:31:50 -0500 Lee Revell wrote: > > > > > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? > > > > Well, the one _you_ write :) <- smiley > > > > Dammit, you mean I can't produce boy bands with Linux? What good is it > then? Well, a little more seriously: i suppose you could hack together something usable with i.e. SuperCollider. Albeit not as comfy as Antares AT probably. Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Wed Dec 7 16:21:21 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:19:07 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 12:51 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > > > I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. > > > Unless it can be driven bt a MIDI controlled reference frequency > source it's unlikely you'll inflict the same pain on the world. ;-) That's easy - just connect it up in Om and play the reference melody on your keyboard. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051207/63e34d2e/attachment.bin From sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk Wed Dec 7 16:19:54 2005 From: sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk (guy) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:19:49 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> Lars Luthman wrote: >On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:49 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > >>On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: >> >> >>>On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 >>>Cesare Marilungo wrote: >>> >>>>That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think >>>>one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). >>>> >>>> >>>Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit >>>before it was a plug-in. >>> >>> >>Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? >> >> >Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: >http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > >I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. > > Hi The Steve Harris plug in transposes everything by a fixed amount. Antares autotune 'tunes' out of tune sounds - it has been used as an effect but is also the number 1 criminal in propping up bands where people look trendy but can't actually sing in tune. When you get used to its distinct sound you can recognise it on a lot of chart records. I used a friends copy on a guitar line once & it made it sound really 'sweet' - it was actually a very nice sound, you can add a certain amount of vibrato too. I'd love it on Linux - it can be like sprinkling fairy dust on a take - but it does raise aesthetic/ethical issues about music as a result of ones ability versus music as a result of ones vision. BTW: I have loved this series of vocal tips - thanks folks! Guy -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.12/194 - Release Date: 07/12/2005 ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Exclusive Xmas Game, help Santa with his celebrity party - http://santas-christmas-party.yahoo.net/ From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 16:21:54 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:20:55 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <1133990515.17901.84.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 15:39 -0500, Brett McCoy wrote: > I found a video of "I'm Sprung" via Google... that is an awful sound. > Do people actually like that? It seems very gratuitous, like the > overly obvious CG effects used in movies... > I don't get it either. How can it be considered progress when almost 30 years later "state of the art" CGI still looks worse than Star Wars did? I guess because it's cheaper. Sad, really. Lee From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 16:21:37 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:22:04 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133988938.17901.71.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133988938.17901.71.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43975261.5010108@chapelperilous.net> Lee Revell wrote: > BTW this thread reminds me of a joke: > > Q: What did the Pro Tools engineer say to the artist? > > A: Sounds like shit, come on in! BWAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH! -- Brett From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 16:35:38 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:35:40 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133990045.5200.0.camel@cmn8.stanford.edu> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990045.5200.0.camel@cmn8.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071335x26b3d7fg15c000cdbd9d42ec@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Aaron Trumm wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 12:51 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:49 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: > > > > > On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 > > > > > Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I think > > > > > > one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for ProTools and as a VST). > > > > > > > > > > Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit > > > > > before it was a plug-in. > > > > > > > > Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? > > > > > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > > > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > but is this a pitch corrector like the AutoTune or just a pitch shifter? > Just a shifter. (No small feat, but not exactly the same as Auto Tune. - Mark From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 16:38:03 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:38:21 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133990045.5200.0.camel@cmn8.stanford.edu> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990045.5200.0.camel@cmn8.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <4397563B.5020805@chapelperilous.net> Aaron Trumm wrote: >>>Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: >>>http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > > but is this a pitch corrector like the AutoTune or just a pitch shifter? We don't need to steenkin' pitch correction... -- Brett From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 16:38:24 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:38:27 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071338y1e342228vefbbb5aeeec1ce2c@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 12:51 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > > > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > > > > > I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. > > > > > Unless it can be driven bt a MIDI controlled reference frequency > > source it's unlikely you'll inflict the same pain on the world. ;-) > > That's easy - just connect it up in Om and play the reference melody on > your keyboard. I don't see that this specific LADSPA plugin has any side channel input to allow a synth to drive it. Not to say it cannot be done, but if it's that easy pump out a little demo and let's hear what it sounds like. Sounds like fun to me. - Mark From ross at jose.lug.udel.edu Wed Dec 7 16:42:13 2005 From: ross at jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:42:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> On Tue, Dec 06, 2005 at 12:48:28PM -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > +1000. The best investment is a good mic. > It doesn't have to be all that expensive if you do your research. > I bought an MXL V67G on ebay for under $100 with shock mount > and I've been pretty happy with the results. I disagree - especially for vocals. If you're close-micing instruments, then the mic is the most important poart. Otherwise? Your room. Most people starting out with amatuer recording buy their first condensor mic and are disappointed at how poor the recording sounds. Usually, this is because you're not used to the mic picking up things like a computer fan running, people walking upstairs, etc. Sometimes it's because the room you are using is just not acoustically pleasing. You're not going to notice that so much with a dynamic mic. Unless you're a drummer, you'll have to keep at the condensors for a bit while you learn to love them. If you're a drummer (like me), slap em up as your overheads, you'll have no problem covering up any noise! And you'll definitely dig the new sizzle ::-) -- Ross Vandegrift ross@lug.udel.edu "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." --St. Augustine, De Genesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37 From ross at jose.lug.udel.edu Wed Dec 7 16:48:39 2005 From: ross at jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:48:42 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <20051207214839.GB17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> On Wed, Dec 07, 2005 at 03:39:49PM -0500, Brett McCoy wrote: > I found a video of "I'm Sprung" via Google... that is an awful sound. Do > people actually like that? It seems very gratuitous, like the overly > obvious CG effects used in movies... Well, it depends. I think AutoTune sounds kind of obnoxious when used as anything more than a touch-up. I respect the idea of abusing it for a new effect. Somehow, it doesn't come out pleasing though... ::-). It's probably just that the music I associate it with isn't the best. I suspect it'd be a great effect paired with some things that I like - think electronica/industrial hard rock mixes. I wouldn't be too surprised to learn that some of the effects The Faint come up with cam from AT. Anyhow, just playing it straight - don't hate the effect, hate the bad choice of the sound dude. -- Ross Vandegrift ross@lug.udel.edu "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." --St. Augustine, De Genesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37 From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 16:51:31 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:51:48 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133990515.17901.84.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> <1133990515.17901.84.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43975963.8060004@chapelperilous.net> Lee Revell wrote: > I don't get it either. How can it be considered progress when almost 30 > years later "state of the art" CGI still looks worse than Star Wars did? > I guess because it's cheaper. Sad, really. Yes, I think as far as movie SFX goes, "The Empire Strikes Back" (original version) was the pinnacle. Not to mention the audio engineering of albums like "Dark Side of the Moon" :-) Even now I find myself still using tube amps (even mike pre's) for everything. Love to get a tube compressor also. -- Brett From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 16:52:24 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:51:53 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <1133992345.17901.100.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 21:19 +0000, guy wrote: > it does raise aesthetic/ethical issues about > music as a result of ones ability versus music as a result of ones > vision. Aesthetic, yes, but I don't think it raises any more ethical issues than quantization or synthesizers. It's just another way of changing a sound, that people with a good ear will be able to pick up on. Lee From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Wed Dec 7 16:55:25 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:53:12 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <1133992525.957.6.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 22:21 +0100, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 12:51 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > > > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > > > > > I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. > > > > > Unless it can be driven bt a MIDI controlled reference frequency > > source it's unlikely you'll inflict the same pain on the world. ;-) > > That's easy - just connect it up in Om and play the reference melody on > your keyboard. Ah, right, auto tuning. You would need some sort of pitch detection as well. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051207/dfcdbbbc/attachment.bin From ross at jose.lug.udel.edu Wed Dec 7 16:57:02 2005 From: ross at jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) Date: Wed Dec 7 16:57:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> References: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <20051207215702.GC17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> On Wed, Dec 07, 2005 at 01:18:38PM -0600, Martin McCormick wrote: > I also want to do this without any X applications. The > computer is good enough for command-line shells, etc, but is only a > 400-meg Pentium with 65 megs of RAM. Oh man! What happened?! I remember drooling over a machine that fast, thinking about all the X apps I could run... ::-) -- Ross Vandegrift ross@lug.udel.edu "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." --St. Augustine, De Genesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37 From cesare at poeticstudios.com Wed Dec 7 17:02:15 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:02:22 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <43975BE7.1040108@poeticstudios.com> guy wrote: > > > Lars Luthman wrote: > >> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:49 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: >> >> >>> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 06:24 -0500, Joe Hartley wrote: >>> >>> >>>> On Tue, 06 Dec 2005 23:07:47 +0100 >>>> Cesare Marilungo wrote: >>>> >>>>> That's exactly what I was talking about. There are lots of it. I >>>>> think one of the first was the Antares (it exists both for >>>>> ProTools and as a VST). >>>>> >>>> >>>> Just an FYI, the Antares AutoTune existed as a standalone rack unit >>>> before it was a plug-in. >>>> >>> >>> Obligatory Linux content: what's the LADSPA equivalent? >>> >> >> Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: >> http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 >> >> I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. >> >> > Hi > The Steve Harris plug in transposes everything by a fixed amount. > Antares autotune 'tunes' out of tune sounds - it has been used as an > effect but is also the number 1 criminal in propping up bands where > people look trendy but can't actually sing in tune. When you get used > to its distinct Yes, AutoTune is definitely evil! > sound you can recognise it on a lot of chart records. I used a > friends copy on a guitar line once & it made it sound really 'sweet' > - it was actually a very nice sound, you can add a certain amount of > vibrato too. I'd love it on Linux - it can be like sprinkling fairy > dust on a take - but it does raise aesthetic/ethical issues about > music as a result of ones ability versus music as a result of ones > vision. > BTW: I have loved this series of vocal tips - thanks folks! > > Guy > > > Basically the 'cher' effect we're talking about is the result of setting the response speed of the pitch correction to a very small amount. Even the best singer reaches the correct pitch by listening to himself, it's a continuous feedback. When using such an effect the voice goes from a pitch to another so fast it sounds fake. c. From core at jacklab.net Wed Dec 7 17:02:22 2005 From: core at jacklab.net (JackLab Core Team) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:02:34 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> Message-ID: <20051207230222.748fc89d@jacklab.metanet> On Wed, 7 Dec 2005 22:54:29 +0200 Mehmet Okonsar wrote: > What can you say about the usability of the LinuxSampler in its > current state.. > Giga import? > Disk streaming? > Writing audio to file? > GUI? HI Mehmet I use linuxsampler and the gui Qsampler. I have an older library of huge gigasamples *.gig and its working nice for me. LS supports diskstreaming as well. QSampler is an easy and intuitive GUI for LS I work in a lowlatency jack enviroment with rt kernel. courios, but linuxsampler dosn't work under a buffer of 256 samples on my system, thats 11ms audio latency. Thats ok... Writing to disk is possible in realtime via any jack recording unit like ardour or simple apps like qarecord. The killerfeature is the possibility to connect 2 or more computers with LS for a SamplerCluster. Regards, Michael > > ------------- > Best regards, > Mehmet Okon?ar, pianist-composer > www.okonsar.com > mehmet@okonsar.com > > From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 17:04:40 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:04:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Mehmet Okonsar wrote:> What can you say about the usability of the LinuxSampler in its current> state..> Giga import?> Disk streaming?> Writing audio to file?> GUI?>> -------------> Best regards,> Mehmet Okon?ar, pianist-composer> www.okonsar.com> mehmet@okonsar.com LinuxSampler is a good program but has recently considered strayingfrom the Open Source model. Please read the License Agreement includedin the CVS version for more info. For these reasons I've ceased usingit. My comments are probably a bit dated these days as I've not triedor even paid attention to the program in a few months. Giga Import - pretty good and getting better. Disk streaming - Good, up to a point, but not nearly as good asGigaStudio 3.0. Far fewer voices than GSt3 even when using betterhardware. Voice stealing not so mature so many clicks and pops. Somehard crashes when you really hit the wall with a lot of MIDI events. Writing audio - No support. GUI - OK for very simple setups of a few instruments. I've run as manyas 24 instruments on 16 MIDI channels (doing essentially stacking asper GST3) and it works but it can get pretty slow. Memory management - You didn't ask, but it's not nearly as good asGST3. Expect to use far more memory. Also LS's memory managementdoesn't play fair and makes it very difficult to run other apps whenrunning a lot of instruments in LS. LS is best used on a stand alonemachine. This is similar to GSt3 in real world terms since it'sWindows only and doesn't get along real well with Pro Tools on thesame box. Hope this helps,Mark From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 17:05:32 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:05:35 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133992345.17901.100.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> <1133992345.17901.100.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071405g7479380eqffd0287f031f3603@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 21:19 +0000, guy wrote: > > it does raise aesthetic/ethical issues about > > music as a result of ones ability versus music as a result of ones > > vision. > > Aesthetic, yes, but I don't think it raises any more ethical issues than > quantization or synthesizers. It's just another way of changing a > sound, that people with a good ear will be able to pick up on. > > Lee > > Interesting how a thread about getting good vocals can degenerate so quickly into one about getting bad vocals! ;-) - Mark From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 17:12:41 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:12:59 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <20051207214839.GB17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> <20051207214839.GB17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> Message-ID: <43975E59.4050309@chapelperilous.net> Ross Vandegrift wrote: >>I found a video of "I'm Sprung" via Google... that is an awful sound. Do >>people actually like that? It seems very gratuitous, like the overly >>obvious CG effects used in movies... > > > Well, it depends. I think AutoTune sounds kind of obnoxious when used > as anything more than a touch-up. I respect the idea of abusing it > for a new effect. Somehow, it doesn't come out pleasing though... > ::-). > > It's probably just that the music I associate it with isn't the best. > I suspect it'd be a great effect paired with some things that I like - > think electronica/industrial hard rock mixes. I wouldn't be too > surprised to learn that some of the effects The Faint come up with cam > from AT. > > Anyhow, just playing it straight - don't hate the effect, hate the bad > choice of the sound dude. That's what I was targeting... the gratuitous use of the effect. I like computer generated effects (audio or video) when they are well executed, not an attempt to make lousy music (or script) better. Seems like everything coming out these days is stunningly recorded (or photographed) crap. From ce at christeck.de Wed Dec 7 17:17:04 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:16:24 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> Message-ID: <200512072317.04639.ce@christeck.de> > GUI? qsampler. Best regards ce From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Wed Dec 7 17:28:32 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:26:22 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071338y1e342228vefbbb5aeeec1ce2c@mail.gmail.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071338y1e342228vefbbb5aeeec1ce2c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133994512.957.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 13:38 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 12:51 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > > > Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > > > > http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > > > > > > > I don't know if it will produce the same artifacts when abused. > > > > > > > Unless it can be driven bt a MIDI controlled reference frequency > > > source it's unlikely you'll inflict the same pain on the world. ;-) > > > > That's easy - just connect it up in Om and play the reference melody on > > your keyboard. > > I don't see that this specific LADSPA plugin has any side channel > input to allow a synth to drive it. Not to say it cannot be done, but > if it's that easy pump out a little demo and let's hear what it sounds > like. Sounds like fun to me. No side channel needed, the builtin Om note module transforms MIDI to a frequency signal that you can use to control the pitch shifter. But for auto tuning you need to know the pitch of the dry sound as well, so I guess it's not as easy as I thought. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051207/f7307d86/attachment.bin From rtp405 at yahoo.com Wed Dec 7 17:41:36 2005 From: rtp405 at yahoo.com (R Parker) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:41:39 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <4397563B.5020805@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <20051207224136.77127.qmail@web32413.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- Brett McCoy wrote: > Aaron Trumm wrote: > > >>>Steve Harris has a pitch shifter plugin: > >>>http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 > > > > > > but is this a pitch corrector like the AutoTune or > just a pitch shifter? > > We don't need to steenkin' pitch correction... Hey flat boy, leave that pitch alone ron > -- Brett > __________________________________________ Yahoo! DSL ? Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less. dsl.yahoo.com From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Wed Dec 7 18:01:14 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Wed Dec 7 17:58:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:04 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > LinuxSampler is a good program but has recently considered straying > from the Open Source model. Please read the License Agreement included in > the CVS version for more info. For these reasons I've ceased using it. My > comments are probably a bit dated these days as I've not tried or even > paid attention to the program in a few months. Their CVS server isn't responding, so I can't see the whole License Agreement. But I see this on the web page: LinuxSampler is licensed under the GNU GPL license with the exception that COMMERCIAL USE of the souce code, libraries and applications is NOT ALLOWED without prior written permission by the LinuxSampler authors. If you have questions on the subject please contact us. This is pretty nasty - if I interpret it correctly, it means that LinuxSampler is no longer free software (at least not as defined by the FSF, http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html ) and not even freeware, since a producer making commercial music would have to pay to use it. The LinuxSampler hackers are of course free to license their code any way they want, but I wish people who add this kind of exceptions to the GPL would call it something else instead of "GNU GPL with exception foo". That will just confuse people when the license is uncompatible with the GPL. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051208/c48ec8e7/attachment.bin From atte.jensen at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 17:32:44 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Wed Dec 7 18:17:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound Message-ID: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> Hi I can't figure out how to do this classic sound that's heard on this file http://www.atte.dk/download/sound.ogg. The one I'm talking about is the rising sound in the background. I guess it's modulated with a square lfo, but I can't figure out what's filter and what's pitch. If someone did this sound a zillion times an could explain the idea, I'd really appreciate it. BTW: My main weapon is om... -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From torbenh at gmx.de Wed Dec 7 18:49:45 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Wed Dec 7 18:29:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] [TESTERS WANTED] netjack jack-cluster Message-ID: <20051207234945.GA8490@mobilat> hi... just wanted to tell you all that the netjack effort is approaching full functionality. i need some evaluation on the transport sync code now. it should be possible to have two network synched ardours now. however it is possible, that there is a constant delay between the two. and i have seen some latency which accumulated between the two jackds once. so please give this thing a field test. the current version i would like you all to test is the cvs version which can be obtained at http://www.sourceforge.net/projects/netjack sorry that for building you still need a compiled jack-build directory. i hope the instructions are good enough. ok... i go to bed now... good night. -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk Wed Dec 7 18:37:40 2005 From: bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk (Bungee) Date: Wed Dec 7 18:37:48 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> Message-ID: Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Hi > > I can't figure out how to do this classic sound that's heard on this > file http://www.atte.dk/download/sound.ogg. The one I'm talking about is > the rising sound in the background. I guess it's modulated with a square > lfo, but I can't figure out what's filter and what's pitch. If someone > did this sound a zillion times an could explain the idea, I'd really > appreciate it. > > BTW: My main weapon is om... I think you need to give us a *much* longer sample to listen to! -- Bungee From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 18:41:24 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 18:41:27 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133994512.957.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071338y1e342228vefbbb5aeeec1ce2c@mail.gmail.com> <1133994512.957.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071541l4a4ea2e8h9373e16103616727@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > I don't see that this specific LADSPA plugin has any side channel > > input to allow a synth to drive it. Not to say it cannot be done, but > > if it's that easy pump out a little demo and let's hear what it sounds > > like. Sounds like fun to me. > > No side channel needed, the builtin Om note module transforms MIDI to a > frequency signal that you can use to control the pitch shifter. But for > auto tuning you need to know the pitch of the dry sound as well, so I > guess it's not as easy as I thought. > > -- > Lars Luthman I'm sure there's some semantics stuff going on here, but the side channel I was referring to would have to be on the pitch shifter and this plugin doesn't have one so there's no way to get it to shift by a variable amount. I used the Waves Morphoder quite a lot for a while. Basically you need pitch detection on the vocal, pitch generation which is generally done through a synth, and could be Om as you were suggesting, and then you drive the difference of the pitch detect and the pitch generation into the pitch shifter to modulate the vocal as desired. Unfortunately this LADSPA plugin lacks that third channel to tell it how much to shift. In general, it's pretty darn CPU intensive and not very real time friendly... ...but fun! ;-) - Mark From atte.jensen at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 18:43:07 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Wed Dec 7 18:43:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4397738B.6060805@gmail.com> Bungee wrote: > I think you need to give us a *much* longer sample to listen to! That's all there is. At least this is where the sound appears... -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From allan_wind at lifeintegrity.com Wed Dec 7 19:05:54 2005 From: allan_wind at lifeintegrity.com (Allan Wind) Date: Wed Dec 7 19:06:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> On 2005-12-08T00:01:14+0100, Lars Luthman wrote: > LinuxSampler is licensed under the GNU GPL license with the exception > that COMMERCIAL USE of the souce code, libraries and applications is > NOT ALLOWED without prior written permission by the LinuxSampler > authors. If you have questions on the subject please contact us. > > This is pretty nasty - if I interpret it correctly, it means that > LinuxSampler is no longer free software (at least not as defined by the > FSF, http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html ) and not even freeware, > since a producer making commercial music would have to pay to use it. Yep. Alternatives? /Allan From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 19:09:24 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 19:09:27 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:04 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > LinuxSampler is a good program but has recently considered straying > > from the Open Source model. Please read the License Agreement included in > > the CVS version for more info. For these reasons I've ceased using it. My > > comments are probably a bit dated these days as I've not tried or even > > paid attention to the program in a few months. > > Their CVS server isn't responding, so I can't see the whole License > Agreement. But I see this on the web page: > > LinuxSampler is licensed under the GNU GPL license with the exception > that COMMERCIAL USE of the souce code, libraries and applications is > NOT ALLOWED without prior written permission by the LinuxSampler > authors. If you have questions on the subject please contact us. > > This is pretty nasty - if I interpret it correctly, it means that > LinuxSampler is no longer free software (at least not as defined by the > FSF, http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html ) and not even freeware, > since a producer making commercial music would have to pay to use it. > > The LinuxSampler hackers are of course free to license their code any > way they want, but I wish people who add this kind of exceptions to the > GPL would call it something else instead of "GNU GPL with exception > foo". That will just confuse people when the license is uncompatible > with the GPL. Yep, this was the problem and you interpret it as many others do. The Debian folks didn't like this so much that they dropped LS from their releases. I think that the LS developers weren't taking the commercail thing quite as far as you are. They seemed more interested in keeping Synth manufacturers from using the code, which is disappointing sime a good software company could pick this up and run with it quite quickly. This would be great for us users, should they every do it. Note that this license modification was not in the latest official release the last time I looked. It was only in the CVS version so there is an opportunity to fork the database and put a development team together to keep it truly Open Source, should someone care enough to do so. Cheers, Mark From songshop at bizmedia.com.au Thu Dec 8 06:10:56 2005 From: songshop at bizmedia.com.au (Geoff Beasley) Date: Wed Dec 7 19:11:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: linux-audio-user Digest, Vol 27, Issue 21 In-Reply-To: <200512072320.jB7NJe7o019582@roar.music.columbia.edu> References: <200512072320.jB7NJe7o019582@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <200512081110.56877.songshop@bizmedia.com.au> on my system LS/QS works magnificently and @ 64 frame buffers as well if i choose... that's 2.9 ms @ 44.1 khz. no clicks at all using giga piano for example.... custom Gentoo 2.6.12/jackd 100 . it's totally fantastic. it stays up all day long and works a treat. best, g. From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Wed Dec 7 19:15:09 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Wed Dec 7 19:12:53 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071541l4a4ea2e8h9373e16103616727@mail.gmail.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071338y1e342228vefbbb5aeeec1ce2c@mail.gmail.com> <1133994512.957.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071541l4a4ea2e8h9373e16103616727@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134000909.957.26.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 15:41 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > > > I don't see that this specific LADSPA plugin has any side channel > > > input to allow a synth to drive it. Not to say it cannot be done, but > > > if it's that easy pump out a little demo and let's hear what it sounds > > > like. Sounds like fun to me. > > > > No side channel needed, the builtin Om note module transforms MIDI to a > > frequency signal that you can use to control the pitch shifter. But for > > auto tuning you need to know the pitch of the dry sound as well, so I > > guess it's not as easy as I thought. > > I'm sure there's some semantics stuff going on here, but the side > channel I was referring to would have to be on the pitch shifter and > this plugin doesn't have one so there's no way to get it to shift by a > variable amount. Now I'm confused. Are we still talking about the "AM pitchshifter" plugin (1433) ? It has a control input port called "Pitch shift" which determins the amount of shift, you can connect any control rate signal to that port. Or you could downsample an audio rate signal and connect that. For realtime modulation it would probably be better to have an audio rate input port for the shift amount though. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051208/05758a09/attachment.bin From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Wed Dec 7 20:34:43 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Wed Dec 7 20:32:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> > Yep, this was the problem and you interpret it as many others do. The > Debian folks didn't like this so much that they dropped LS from their > releases. I think that the LS developers weren't taking the commercail > thing quite as far as you are. They seemed more interested in keeping > Synth manufacturers from using the code, which is disappointing sime a > good software company could pick this up and run with it quite > quickly. This would be great for us users, should they every do it. there is more going on there than almost nobody on this list except for the LS authors and myself is aware of. it would be wise for everyone to not judge this admittedly very unpleasant change in the license without being aware of the reasons why it occured. unfortunately, it is not possible to explain any more. --p From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 20:41:29 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 20:41:32 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1134000909.957.26.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071338y1e342228vefbbb5aeeec1ce2c@mail.gmail.com> <1133994512.957.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071541l4a4ea2e8h9373e16103616727@mail.gmail.com> <1134000909.957.26.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071741l75526bf5x91e57e2ee48b33a5@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 15:41 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > > > > > I don't see that this specific LADSPA plugin has any side channel > > > > input to allow a synth to drive it. Not to say it cannot be done, but > > > > if it's that easy pump out a little demo and let's hear what it sounds > > > > like. Sounds like fun to me. > > > > > > No side channel needed, the builtin Om note module transforms MIDI to a > > > frequency signal that you can use to control the pitch shifter. But for > > > auto tuning you need to know the pitch of the dry sound as well, so I > > > guess it's not as easy as I thought. > > > > I'm sure there's some semantics stuff going on here, but the side > > channel I was referring to would have to be on the pitch shifter and > > this plugin doesn't have one so there's no way to get it to shift by a > > variable amount. > > Now I'm confused. Are we still talking about the "AM pitchshifter" > plugin (1433) ? It has a control input port called "Pitch shift" which > determins the amount of shift, you can connect any control rate signal > to that port. Or you could downsample an audio rate signal and connect > that. For realtime modulation it would probably be better to have an > audio rate input port for the shift amount though. > Yes, we have been, but I think I misread the 'Pitch Shift' section on this page: http://plugin.org.uk/ladspa-swh/docs/ladspa-swh.html#tth_sEc2.6 and mistook that it has a fixed pitch shift value. Upon rereading the page that seems incorrect on my part. None the less, we would still require a way to do pitch detection on the original vocal signal to know how far we are attemtping to shift, I believe. It's also unclear from this write up how little you can shift a signal. Does the pitch shift input support shifting down to a few cents? Cheers, Mark From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 20:45:02 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 7 20:45:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512071745m7b1d79fctfb6c40b83c883bc9@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Allan Wind wrote: > On 2005-12-08T00:01:14+0100, Lars Luthman wrote: > > LinuxSampler is licensed under the GNU GPL license with the exception > > that COMMERCIAL USE of the souce code, libraries and applications is > > NOT ALLOWED without prior written permission by the LinuxSampler > > authors. If you have questions on the subject please contact us. > > > > This is pretty nasty - if I interpret it correctly, it means that > > LinuxSampler is no longer free software (at least not as defined by the > > FSF, http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html ) and not even freeware, > > since a producer making commercial music would have to pay to use it. > > Yep. Alternatives? > > > /Allan > None that I know of under Linux with these sorts of features. I was involved with the project for over 3 years as an in-depth tester and user before the changed the direction. During that time period it was either LS or GSt for me. There are many other simple sample players, but none that I know of that read Gig files. LS is a good program. I sincerely hope the developers will remove this language one of these days. Until then I'm a Windows sampler user. Cheers, Mark From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Wed Dec 7 21:27:48 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Wed Dec 7 21:27:35 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1134008868.18519.1.camel@eviltwin> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:47 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 00:34 -0600, Jan Depner wrote: > > On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 14:47 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > > On Tue, 2005-12-06 at 06:05 -0500, Bill Allen wrote: > > > > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > > > > vocals to sound good? > > > > > > Actually this reminds me of something that's been bugging me. What's > > > that really digital sounding vocal effect that you hear on a lot of R&B > > > stuff these days? It's all over that tune "I'm Sprung" that was on the > > > radio all summer, and in the Simpsons episode where they have a boy > > > band, on Ralph Wiggum's voice when he sings "love formation". > > > > > > > Cher started that garbage about 4 or 5 years ago - it's pitch > > correction taken to extremes. > > > > Cher could not have been the first to popularize this. I am pretty sure > that boy band Simpsons episode predates "Believe". > I must have missed that one. > (BTW I can't stand the effect either) > I personally prefer the soothing sound of my dentist's drill. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Wed Dec 7 21:34:54 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Wed Dec 7 21:34:40 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43975963.8060004@chapelperilous.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> <1133990515.17901.84.camel@mindpipe> <43975963.8060004@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <1134009294.18519.5.camel@eviltwin> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 16:51 -0500, Brett McCoy wrote: > Lee Revell wrote: > > > I don't get it either. How can it be considered progress when almost 30 > > years later "state of the art" CGI still looks worse than Star Wars did? > > I guess because it's cheaper. Sad, really. > > Yes, I think as far as movie SFX goes, "The Empire Strikes Back" > (original version) was the pinnacle. > > Not to mention the audio engineering of albums like "Dark Side of the > Moon" :-) Even now I find myself still using tube amps (even mike pre's) > for everything. Love to get a tube compressor also. > Gotta have 'em! Tubes, tubes, tubes. I've got an HHB Fat Man stereo tube compressor and an Art Pro Channel with tube/optical compression. I even use the Pro Channel live 'cause it just sounds so good. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Wed Dec 7 21:40:34 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Wed Dec 7 21:40:40 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43975BE7.1040108@poeticstudios.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <4395F3BC.1020609@poeticstudios.com> <43960BB3.5000101@poeticstudios.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> <43975BE7.1040108@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <1134009634.18519.9.camel@eviltwin> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 23:02 +0100, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Basically the 'cher' effect we're talking about is the result of setting > the response speed of the pitch correction to a very small amount. Even > the best singer reaches the correct pitch by listening to himself, it's > a continuous feedback. When using such an effect the voice goes from a > pitch to another so fast it sounds fake. > So that's how they did that. I had always wondered why it sounded so synthesized. That makes sense. I'll have to listen more closely the next time I'm subjected to that Cher thing or Kid Rock's travesty of music (the name of which mercifully escapes me at the moment). -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Wed Dec 7 22:08:17 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Wed Dec 7 22:03:54 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <1134009294.18519.5.camel@eviltwin> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <43974895.4030504@chapelperilous.net> <1133990515.17901.84.camel@mindpipe> <43975963.8060004@chapelperilous.net> <1134009294.18519.5.camel@eviltwin> Message-ID: <4397A3A1.4070604@chapelperilous.net> Jan Depner wrote: >>Not to mention the audio engineering of albums like "Dark Side of the >>Moon" :-) Even now I find myself still using tube amps (even mike pre's) >> for everything. Love to get a tube compressor also. >> > > > Gotta have 'em! Tubes, tubes, tubes. I've got an HHB Fat Man > stereo tube compressor and an Art Pro Channel with tube/optical > compression. I even use the Pro Channel live 'cause it just sounds so > good. I just picked up an ART dual channel mike pre last week (on eBay for about $55) and did some test vocals with my singer the other day (using Ardour, of course). Very nice.... -- Brett From roberts.noah at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 22:13:30 2005 From: roberts.noah at gmail.com (Noah Roberts) Date: Wed Dec 7 22:13:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] profiling Message-ID: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> Could the RT patch be interfearing with my ability to run gprof? AFAICT I did everything right to use it, used the -pg on compile for instance, but my profiles have no time at all in them: Flat profile: Each sample counts as 0.01 seconds. no time accumulated % cumulative self self total time seconds seconds calls Ts/call Ts/call name 0.00 0.00 0.00 125000000 0.00 0.00 std::basic_string, std::allocator > std::operator+, std::allocator >(std::basic_string, std::allocator > const&, std::basic_string, std::allocator > const&) 0.00 0.00 0.00 500 0.00 0.00 test_append() 0.00 0.00 0.00 500 0.00 0.00 test_printf() 0.00 0.00 0.00 500 0.00 0.00 test_strcat() 0.00 0.00 0.00 500 0.00 0.00 test_add_str() 0.00 0.00 0.00 500 0.00 0.00 test_append_str() 0.00 0.00 0.00 1 0.00 0.00 global constructors keyed to _Z11test_printfv 0.00 0.00 0.00 1 0.00 0.00 __static_initialization_and_destruction_0(int, int) It makes no sense because I know for a fact that these functions are taking measurable time to execute. The only thing I can think of is that the Full on preempt is breaking my profiler. From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 7 22:40:02 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 7 22:40:33 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] profiling In-Reply-To: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> References: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134013203.1317.3.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 19:13 -0800, Noah Roberts wrote: > Could the RT patch be interfearing with my ability to run gprof? > AFAICT I did everything right to use it, used the -pg on compile for > instance, but my profiles have no time at all in them: Yes. The RT patch breaks kernel profiling. I posted a bug report to LKML a few weeks ago and didn't get an answer. Lee From roberts.noah at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 22:51:33 2005 From: roberts.noah at gmail.com (Noah Roberts) Date: Wed Dec 7 22:51:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] profiling In-Reply-To: <1134013203.1317.3.camel@mindpipe> References: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> <1134013203.1317.3.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <567aa5f60512071951k7d74d259sd4963caf644c3404@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 19:13 -0800, Noah Roberts wrote: > > Could the RT patch be interfearing with my ability to run gprof? > > AFAICT I did everything right to use it, used the -pg on compile for > > instance, but my profiles have no time at all in them: > > Yes. The RT patch breaks kernel profiling. I posted a bug report to > LKML a few weeks ago and didn't get an answer. Well I'm not doing kernel profiling that I know of. I'm just trying to run a profile on an application. I compile with -pg, run th program to get a gmon.out, and then run gprof on the executable. Kernel profiling is a different animal, is it not? From hardbop200 at gmail.com Wed Dec 7 23:51:42 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Wed Dec 7 23:51:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071745m7b1d79fctfb6c40b83c883bc9@mail.gmail.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> <5bdc1c8b0512071745m7b1d79fctfb6c40b83c883bc9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: > LS is a good program. I sincerely hope the developers will remove this > language one of these days. Until then I'm a Windows sampler user. > > Cheers, > Mark I've been eyeballing a Yamaha A5000 for this very reason. What is most irritating is that, while the gig library has seen a lot of activity, the Akai library has been neglected. I see no reason why those two features can't be worked on in parallel, but IANAP(rogrammer). It's a shame, considering that, from my vantage point at least, the Akai library is massive and would make LS a very popular program. Though it might be pointless to support either - seems like everything is in Kontakt or Halion format now, so maybe that should be the format to work on. Too many options - a moving target isn't easy to hit. -- Josh From martin at dc.cis.okstate.edu Thu Dec 8 00:05:05 2005 From: martin at dc.cis.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu Dec 8 00:05:11 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base Message-ID: <200512080505.jB8555hn030859@dc.cis.okstate.edu> My thanks to all. Cdda2wav appears to be the solution but, of course, there is one more problem. The man page and the help output clearly state: -J] [-L cddbp-mode] [-H] [-g] [-l buffers] [-D cd-device] If I put a -L anything anywhere in that command, it is instant failure: # cdda2wav -D0,0,0 -J -L cddb-mode cdda2wav: Bad Option: -L. use 'cdda2wav -help' to get more information. Hmm. That's what told me to do that.:-) Actually,I have tried -L and -L cddbpmode and several other creative things that one does in one of these syntax quandaries, all to no avail. Where are the examples when you really need them? If I don't put anything in the command with -L flags, cdda2wav appears to work just fine so the -L parameter is what is killing it. I once ran it without the -J flag and it created an .inf file containing headers for title, artist, etc but every line was blank after its header. The system is connected to a working network and all other network applications work. Thanks for any more ideas. Martin McCormick WB5AGZ Stillwater, OK OSU Information Technology Department Network Operations Group .-- -... ..... .- --. --.. From b0ef at esben-stien.name Thu Dec 8 03:32:50 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Thu Dec 8 01:38:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> (Ross Vandegrift's message of "Wed, 7 Dec 2005 16:42:13 -0500") References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> Message-ID: <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> ross@jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) writes: > close-micing instruments [..] condensor mic We should also be aware that static mics are sensitive to high SPLs' and might be broken by too high a volume, as I understand it. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From yaqtil at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 02:04:17 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Thu Dec 8 02:04:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> <5bdc1c8b0512071745m7b1d79fctfb6c40b83c883bc9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512072304h25461f78g1e0b5073f9d77c2a@mail.gmail.com> > Though it might be pointless to support either - seems like everything > is in Kontakt or Halion format now, so maybe that should be the format > to work on. Too many options - a moving target isn't easy to hit. agree (akai stuff is fairly obsolete, and gigasampler is major yawn: just a bunch of strings 'n' crap for the 'we no longer use real bands' hollywood set..CDXtract in WINE to wavs...) there was talk a while back about a common xml-metadata-based sample/bank/instrument format...itd be nice to be able to freely move files between chionic / specimen / sooperlooper / ardour / pd without redoing mapping, bpm, volume etc each time.... From peder at musikhuset.org Thu Dec 8 02:45:49 2005 From: peder at musikhuset.org (Peder Hedlund) Date: Thu Dec 8 02:45:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: On Thu, 8 Dec 2005, Lars Luthman wrote: > Their CVS server isn't responding, so I can't see the whole License > Agreement. But I see this on the web page: > > LinuxSampler is licensed under the GNU GPL license with the exception > that COMMERCIAL USE of the souce code, libraries and applications is > NOT ALLOWED without prior written permission by the LinuxSampler > authors. If you have questions on the subject please contact us. Hmm.... From what I understand of GPL you can't put additional restrictions to it. It's either GPL ot not. The only thing you can do as a copyright holder is to dual-licence it, like MySQL for instance, where you have one free GPL version with its licensing rules or the same code bought as a commercial license that you can use free of GPL restrictions. AFAIKT from what Lars reports, LinuxSampler is violating GPL. Regards, Peder From pete.leigh at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 03:12:22 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Thu Dec 8 03:12:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <200512080505.jB8555hn030859@dc.cis.okstate.edu> References: <200512080505.jB8555hn030859@dc.cis.okstate.edu> Message-ID: On 08/12/05, Martin McCormick wrote: > -J] [-L cddbp-mode] [-H] [-g] [-l buffers] [-D cd-device] > > If I put a -L anything anywhere in that command, it is instant > failure: > > # cdda2wav -D0,0,0 -J -L cddb-mode I think "cddb-mode" should be a 0 or a 1. From the readme of the current version: (-L) cddb=cddbpmode do cddbp title lookups. resolve multiple entries according to cddbpmode: 0=interactive, 1=first entry So run with something like cdda2wav -B -L 1 -dev or cdda2wav -B -L 0 -dev Worked for me in a quick test here. - Pete. From atte.jensen at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 03:23:12 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Thu Dec 8 03:23:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> Bungee wrote: > I think you need to give us a *much* longer sample to listen to! I've carved out a biger piece with a little context: http://www.atte.dk/download/sound2.ogg -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From pete.leigh at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 03:26:35 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Thu Dec 8 03:26:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: On 08/12/05, Peder Hedlund wrote: > Hmm.... > From what I understand of GPL you can't put additional restrictions > to it. It's either GPL ot not. If you own the copyright on something, you can license it how you like - the fact that older versions have been licensed under GPL is irrelevant. If the program is derived from GPL'd code whose copyright is owned by someone else, who's unwilling to allow re-licensing, then what you say is correct, but I think Linux Sampler was written from scratch. There's nothing to stop someone taking the last GPL'd version of Linux Sampler and forking a GPL version from there, of course, except that the mysterious "more going on" alluded to by Paul Davis might also start to happen to the forkers..? - Pete. From atte.jensen at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 03:27:27 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Thu Dec 8 03:27:33 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <200512080505.jB8555hn030859@dc.cis.okstate.edu> References: <200512080505.jB8555hn030859@dc.cis.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <4397EE6F.5020400@gmail.com> Martin McCormick wrote: > # cdda2wav -D0,0,0 -J -L cddb-mode Did you try either "cdda2wav -D0,0,0 -J --cddb"? -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From pete.leigh at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 03:33:58 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Thu Dec 8 03:34:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On 08/12/05, Paul Davis wrote: > there is more going on there than almost nobody on this list except for > the LS authors and myself is aware of. it would be wise for everyone to > not judge this admittedly very unpleasant change in the license without > being aware of the reasons why it occured. unfortunately, it is not > possible to explain any more. Still, without explaining any more, would it be an idea for the authors to indicate what their likely response would be under some easily imaginable scenarios, like: "I'm about to release a commercial album where linux sampler was used in production. May I?" - Pete. From james at dis-dot-dat.net Thu Dec 8 04:17:01 2005 From: james at dis-dot-dat.net (james@dis-dot-dat.net) Date: Thu Dec 8 04:16:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> On Thu, 08 Dec, 2005 at 09:23AM +0100, Atte Andr? Jensen spake thus: > Bungee wrote: > > >I think you need to give us a *much* longer sample to listen to! > > I've carved out a biger piece with a little context: > > http://www.atte.dk/download/sound2.ogg Do you mean the one that sounds like bells? If you do, then I'm guessing it's... bells. :) -- "I'd crawl over an acre of 'Visual This++' and 'Integrated Development That' to get to gcc, Emacs, and gdb. Thank you." (By Vance Petree, Virginia Power) From peder at musikhuset.org Thu Dec 8 04:36:58 2005 From: peder at musikhuset.org (Peder Hedlund) Date: Thu Dec 8 04:36:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: On Thu, 8 Dec 2005, Pete Leigh wrote: > On 08/12/05, Peder Hedlund wrote: > > Hmm.... > > From what I understand of GPL you can't put additional restrictions > > to it. It's either GPL ot not. > > If you own the copyright on something, you can license it how > you like - the fact that older versions have been licensed under > GPL is irrelevant. But can you really restrict usage of the software? I mean, if someone has accepted to use the software under GPL terms then, to him, it's GPL. Since GPL allows commercial use, that should be his right. I don't think GPL allows exceptions to the license in that something that's GPL suddenly changes licensing terms if it's being used commercially. Regards, Peder From atte.jensen at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 04:59:06 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Thu Dec 8 04:59:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> Message-ID: <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> james@dis-dot-dat.net wrote: > Do you mean the one that sounds like bells? If you do, then I'm > guessing it's... bells. I guess that's the one. But I don't think it bells (unless you mean synthesized bells), actually I'm quite sure esp since I know what instruments are used on this record (they are: analog synths, fender rhodes and toy-piano). I don't know Jean Michel Jarre too well but I seem to remember the same sound being used on the Oxygene (the swing one that was a big hit). Maybe that could ring a bell (pun intended)... -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From pete.leigh at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 05:02:31 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Thu Dec 8 05:02:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: On 08/12/05, Peder Hedlund wrote: > On Thu, 8 Dec 2005, Pete Leigh wrote: > > If you own the copyright on something, you can license it how > > you like - the fact that older versions have been licensed under > > GPL is irrelevant. > But can you really restrict usage of the software? Well, the way you can effectively license software - you'd have to ask a lawyer, but I think there are plenty of licensing schemes out there that say: "only for non-commercial use". Whether they would work in court, I've no real idea. > I mean, if someone has accepted to use the software under > GPL terms then, to him, it's GPL. Since GPL allows commercial > use, that should be his right. Under GPL terms, yes. If he's using a version of Linux Sampler which was released under the GPL you're quite right. But if he's accepted the LS license being talked about, it's not the GPL, it's the GPL plus an exception disallowing commercial use. A different beast. > I don't think GPL allows exceptions to the license in that something > that's GPL suddenly changes licensing terms if it's being used > commercially. The pure, original GPL doesn't allow this. But they are apparently not offering the software under the GPL, but under a GPL+commercial-exception license of their own. The developers themselves have no obligations under the GPL, because they themselves wrote the software and own the copyright. They did not license their use of it from some other party. Whether licenses that attempt to restrict the use of the thing licensed are robust enough to satisfy a court, that's a different question. - Pete. From pete.leigh at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 05:08:44 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Thu Dec 8 05:08:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 08/12/05, Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > james@dis-dot-dat.net wrote: > > Do you mean the one that sounds like bells? If you do, then I'm > > guessing it's... bells. > I guess that's the one. But I don't think it bells (unless you mean > synthesized bells), actually I'm quite sure esp since I know what > instruments are used on this record (they are: analog synths, fender > rhodes and toy-piano). Out of those, I'd go for the toy piano :) But it really sounds more like FM synthesised bells to me. Maybe they used an FM synthesis technique on analogue equipment somehow, or ring modulation? (but the sound seems too "digitally tamed" for that, to me.) - Pete. From m_nels at gmx.net Thu Dec 8 05:12:56 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Thu Dec 8 05:12:34 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> Message-ID: <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > james@dis-dot-dat.net wrote: > >> Do you mean the one that sounds like bells? If you do, then I'm >> guessing it's... bells. > > > I guess that's the one. But I don't think it bells (unless you mean > synthesized bells), actually I'm quite sure esp since I know what > instruments are used on this record (they are: analog synths, fender > rhodes and toy-piano). > > I don't know Jean Michel Jarre too well but I seem to remember the same > sound being used on the Oxygene (the swing one that was a big hit). > Maybe that could ring a bell (pun intended)... Just a guess... Try to Google for something like "bell synthesis -labs -speech". http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/demos/dafx02/ http://www.crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node67.html http://www.ec.vanderbilt.edu/computermusic/musc216site/Simple.bell.tutorial.html Alternatively, buy some books on synthesis methods - visit your local bookshop/library and take your time! I remember studying one at University which described methods of synthesising different percussive sounds, but I can't remember the details. Have a go! You might fins a sound which you like even more... Michael From S.W.Harris at ecs.soton.ac.uk Thu Dec 8 05:31:15 2005 From: S.W.Harris at ecs.soton.ac.uk (Steve Harris) Date: Thu Dec 8 05:31:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] profiling In-Reply-To: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> References: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051208103115.GA14239@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> On Wed, Dec 07, 2005 at 07:13:30 -0800, Noah Roberts wrote: > Could the RT patch be interfearing with my ability to run gprof? > AFAICT I did everything right to use it, used the -pg on compile for > instance, but my profiles have no time at all in them: IIRC gprof works by sampling program activity at some interval. My experience with realtime code is that it doesnt spend long enough doing anything in particular to get meaningful results. I think you will get better results by using cachegrind et al and running in freewheel mode so it doesn't get kicked off. Failing that you can write your own profiling code reasonably easily, just use gettimeofday before and after ciritcal sections, and sum the results from each run. The (ugly and scrappy, but largely automatic) code I use is here: http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/*checkout*/threestore/threestore-v3/src/timing.c?rev=1.5 http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/*checkout*/threestore/threestore-v3/src/timing.h?rev=1.4 Just uncomment the #define TIMING line to enable it, call TIME(NULL) to initialise or reset, and TIME("label") at each checkpoint. At the end of your run call TIME(TS_TIMING_REPORT) and it will print the total time spent in each section, and some stats. Don't rely on it for anything critically important though, the code is pretty unsafe, and can have a heisenberg effect if cache utility is important to your code and you call TIME too often. - Steve From peder at musikhuset.org Thu Dec 8 06:00:23 2005 From: peder at musikhuset.org (Peder Hedlund) Date: Thu Dec 8 05:59:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: On Thu, 8 Dec 2005, Pete Leigh wrote: > But if he's accepted the LS license being talked about, it's not the > GPL, it's the GPL plus an exception disallowing commercial use. > A different beast. What I was caught up with was ?6 of the GPL where it says "You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein." But apparently this only affects the right to "copy, distribute or modify" the software, not acctually running it. OTOH this raises the interesting question: what's to stop me from taking the GPL source, modifying it a bit and releasing it as LinuxSamplerXP with no extra restrictions? The source is GPL and according to ?6 I have GPL, and only GPL, rights to modify the source and create a derivative work. I then release it as "pure" GLP. I'm by no means a GPL expert. These thoughts are merely toughts. I'd love to hear from someone with proper GPL knowledge. Regards, Peder From loki.davison at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 06:18:31 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Thu Dec 8 06:18:33 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> Message-ID: On 12/8/05, Michael T D Nelson wrote: > Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > > james@dis-dot-dat.net wrote: > > > >> Do you mean the one that sounds like bells? If you do, then I'm > >> guessing it's... bells. > > > > > > I guess that's the one. But I don't think it bells (unless you mean > > synthesized bells), actually I'm quite sure esp since I know what > > instruments are used on this record (they are: analog synths, fender > > rhodes and toy-piano). > > > > I don't know Jean Michel Jarre too well but I seem to remember the same > > sound being used on the Oxygene (the swing one that was a big hit). > > Maybe that could ring a bell (pun intended)... > > Just a guess... Try to Google for something like "bell synthesis -labs > -speech". > > http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/demos/dafx02/ > http://www.crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node67.html > http://www.ec.vanderbilt.edu/computermusic/musc216site/Simple.bell.tutorial.html > > Alternatively, buy some books on synthesis methods - visit your local > bookshop/library and take your time! I remember studying one at > University which described methods of synthesising different percussive > sounds, but I can't remember the details. > > Have a go! You might fins a sound which you like even more... > > Michael > Seeing as you're wanting an om solution, try the smack fm drums patches, you can use them quite nicely for bells. I've got some physical synthesis stuff that sounds a lot like bells too if you want to have that. If it's actually the pad you mean then lots of osc's with a bit of detuning always makes for nice pads. Loki From mista.tapas at gmx.net Thu Dec 8 06:25:31 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Thu Dec 8 06:25:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 20:34:43 -0500 Paul Davis wrote: > there is more going on there than almost nobody on this list except for > the LS authors and myself is aware of. it would be wise for everyone to > not judge this admittedly very unpleasant change in the license without > being aware of the reasons why it occured. unfortunately, it is not > possible to explain any more. There's no way other to judge this than on the data we have. As i have said before i'm not really sure it's even legal to change the license to from GPL to something different, as there might have been many contributions by other people during the GPL time. As a project maintainer of a GPL project, it would be very wrong to accept patches while the project was GPL and then change the license without explicit agreement by _all_ other contributors. Actually not only wrong, but illegal. I have spoken out this concern earlier, but there has never been a conclusive answer. Actually i don't think there was ever _any_ answer. So from my point of view LS is dead until someone actually speaks up. This "Ah it's all ok, but we can't tell you why" doesn't sound convincing at all. Sorry. Have all contributors been asked whether they agree to the license change? Or did they sign off all copyrights to the LS authors? Browsing through the ML archives it doesn't look like either to me. Regards, Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Thu Dec 8 07:04:18 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Thu Dec 8 07:02:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <1134043458.9617.17.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 12:00 +0100, Peder Hedlund wrote: > > On Thu, 8 Dec 2005, Pete Leigh wrote: > > > But if he's accepted the LS license being talked about, it's not the > > GPL, it's the GPL plus an exception disallowing commercial use. > > A different beast. > > What I was caught up with was ?6 of the GPL where it says > "You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise > of the rights granted herein." > But apparently this only affects the right to "copy, distribute or > modify" the software, not acctually running it. These terms are for the licensee (you), not the copyright owner (the LS authors). The copyright owners are allowed to relicense their software any way they want. If you have a GPL'd copy of LS then it is GPL and no one can tell you that the terms for your copy have suddenly changed. But if you download the CVS version, which apparently has this "no commercial use" restriction, then you are not allowed to use that version commercially. > OTOH this raises the interesting question: what's to stop me from > taking the GPL source, modifying it a bit and releasing it as > LinuxSamplerXP with no extra restrictions? The source is GPL and > according to ?6 I have GPL, and only GPL, rights to modify the source > and create a derivative work. I then release it as "pure" GLP. You are not a copyright owner, so you can not release the software under another license. And since the actual license is GPL + the non-commercial "exception", that extract from ?6 could be taken to mean that you are not allowed to impose any restrictions other than the one in the GPL + the exception. _Or_ it could be taken to mean that you are not allowed to impose any further restrictions other than the ones in the pure GPL, in which case you are not allowed to redistribute LS at all since redistributing it under the pure GPL would give other people additional rights (using it commercially), which you can not give them since you are not the copyright owner. From ?7: "If you cannot distribute so as to satisfy simultaneously your obligations under this License and any other pertinent obligations, then as a consequence you may not distribute the Program at all." This is why I said it was confusing... -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051208/2d632e3f/attachment.bin From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Thu Dec 8 07:28:05 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Thu Dec 8 07:11:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <439826D5.2020606@woh.rr.com> Florian Schmidt wrote: >On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 20:34:43 -0500 >Paul Davis wrote: > > > > >>there is more going on there than almost nobody on this list except for >>the LS authors and myself is aware of. it would be wise for everyone to >>not judge this admittedly very unpleasant change in the license without >>being aware of the reasons why it occured. unfortunately, it is not >>possible to explain any more. >> >> > >[snip] >This "Ah it's all ok, but we can't tell you why" doesn't sound >convincing at all. Sorry. > > IANAL but I'll take a guess that there's a patent encumbrance issue. If I recall correctly the Giga folks own a patent on streaming audio to a sampler, and if the wording on that patent is sufficiently broad then there may indeed be a legal issue with LS's technology, regardless whether they actually broach the Giga patent. I welcome correction on the patent surmise, if I'm wrong about it. Btw, are there clones of GS in the Win/Mac world ? If not, I'm sure it would be easy to discover why. Well, you can always just use GS in Windows. That way you can be absolutely sure that you're dancing with the devil. ;) Best, dp From martin at dc.cis.okstate.edu Thu Dec 8 07:29:11 2005 From: martin at dc.cis.okstate.edu (Martin McCormick) Date: Thu Dec 8 07:29:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base Message-ID: <200512081229.jB8CTBhn026992@dc.cis.okstate.edu> Pete Leigh writes: > (-L) cddb=cddbpmode do cddbp title lookups. > resolve multiple entries according to cddbpmode: > 0=interactive, 1=first entry > >So run with something like > > cdda2wav -B -L 1 -dev That worked perfectly. Thank you! I knew I had to be doing something wrong because everything else just looked too right to be a bad installation plus the fact I had used normal debian procedures to install it. The results speak for themselves. 16.( 168957), 17.( 178867), 18.( 188580), lead-out( 199992) CDINDEX discid: CUkHzFbCjxnEHAQmLe0K_.I6Zho- CDDB discid: 0xe70a6a12 CDDBP titles: resolved CD-Text: not detected CD-Extra: not detected Album title: 'The Best Of The Girl Groups Volume 2' [from Various] Track 1: 'The Angels / My Boyfriend's Back' Track 2: 'The Chiffons / Sweet Talkin' Guy' Track 3: 'Little Eva / The Loco-Motion' Track 4: 'The Toys / A Lover's Concerto' Track 5: 'The Raindrops / The Kind Of Boy You Can't Forget' Track 6: 'Ellie Greenwich / You Don't Know' Track 7: 'The Cookies / Chains' Track 8: 'The Murmaids / Popsicles And Icicles' Track 9: 'The Honeys / The One You Can't Have' Track 10: 'The Exciters / Tell Him' Track 11: 'The Cookies / Don't Say Nothin' Bad (About My Baby)' Track 12: 'The Shirelles / I Met Him On A Sunday' Track 13: 'Robin Ward / Wonderful Summer' Track 14: 'Carole King / It Might As Well Rain Until September' Track 15: 'The Caravelles / You Don't Have To Be A Baby To Cry' Track 16: 'The Essex / Easier Said Than Done' Track 17: 'The Paris Sisters / I Love How You Love Me' Track 18: 'Joanie Sommers / Johnny Get Angry' scanning for MCN...Media catalog number: 0075677098926 scanning for ISRCs: 1 ...scanning for ISRCs: 2 ...scanning for ISRCs: 3 ...scanning for ISRCs: 4 ...scanning for ISRCs: 5 ...scanning for ISRCs: 6 ...scanning for ISRCs: 7 ...scanning for ISRCs: 8 ...scanning for ISRCs: 9 ...scanning for ISRCs: 10 ...scanning for ISRCs: 11 ...scanning for ISRCs: 12 ...scanning for ISRCs: 13 ...scanning for ISRCs: 14 ...scanning for ISRCs: 15 ...scanning for ISRCs: 16 ...scanning for ISRCs: 17 ...scanning for ISRCs: 18 ... and so forth. Pretty impressive! Martin McCormick WB5AGZ Stillwater, OK OSU Information Technology Department Network Operations Group .-- -... ..... .- --. --.. From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Thu Dec 8 07:35:08 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Thu Dec 8 07:32:51 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <439826D5.2020606@woh.rr.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> <439826D5.2020606@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <1134045308.9617.22.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 07:28 -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > Florian Schmidt wrote: > >On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 20:34:43 -0500 > >Paul Davis wrote: > >>there is more going on there than almost nobody on this list except for > >>the LS authors and myself is aware of. it would be wise for everyone to > >>not judge this admittedly very unpleasant change in the license without > >>being aware of the reasons why it occured. unfortunately, it is not > >>possible to explain any more. > > > >[snip] > >This "Ah it's all ok, but we can't tell you why" doesn't sound > >convincing at all. Sorry. > > > IANAL but I'll take a guess that there's a patent encumbrance issue. If > I recall correctly the Giga folks own a patent on streaming audio to a > sampler, and if the wording on that patent is sufficiently broad then > there may indeed be a legal issue with LS's technology, regardless > whether they actually broach the Giga patent. I welcome correction on > the patent surmise, if I'm wrong about it. A software patent? Then maybe EU citizens could be exempted from the non-commercial restriction (at least until Virgin and friends have bought enough MEPs). Not that it would make any practical difference to me, I'm not going to write any music that anyone would want to buy any time soon. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051208/f9a3a16e/attachment.bin From versuchsanstalt at gmx.de Thu Dec 8 08:46:51 2005 From: versuchsanstalt at gmx.de (Burkhard Woelfel) Date: Thu Dec 8 08:47:51 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <439593AB.80409@woh.rr.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <439593AB.80409@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <200512081447.01188.versuchsanstalt@gmx.de> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 06 December 2005 14:35, Dave Phillips wrote: > Bill Allen wrote: > > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. > > Hi Bill: > > You also have to remember that you don't hear yourself the way others > hear you. I'm not especially fond of my voice, but I know how to hit the > right notes and other people seem to like it. > > The *sound* of a voice can be effective enough as a carrier of > personality. Bob Dylan is often used as an example of a not-so-beautiful > voice that's perfectly suited to his material. And it's worth mentioning > that Dylan does know how to sing (check out Girl From The North Country). I'd let somebody else sing first, experiment and learn with his or her voice. After a bit of training the feeling of embarrassment wrt my own voice wouldn't be so much of a distraction. BTW, a few weeks ago a friend of mine told me that he really liked a particular song of mine. The voice, he told me, didn't sound like mine at all. Isn't that strange, I was really happy about that. Oh, the miracles of human perception. - - Burkhard > > > What combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best > > sound from vocals particularly in Ardour? > > As you say, there are many to choose from. I like Tim Goetze's Versatile > Plate Reverb, it's easy to control and has some sweet spots that > complement my voice nicely. I also often use the SC4 compressor > (pre-fade) and the TAP Scaling Limiter (post-fade) on the master track. > > As general advice: Pick an effect, preferably one with only a few > controls, and learn what each control does to the sound. In the case of > reverbs, think about the ambience you want to create and make your > initial settings accordingly. Yes, you'll have to experiment, but IMO > that's the best way to learn about these things. > > > I know that this is one of those subjective questions for which the > > best answer is try it out yourself and find what sounds best, but > > there are so many plugins (an embarassment of riches), each of which > > has many settings, that a brute force search of all the combinations > > would take forever - not to mention that after a while, my poor ears > > become exhausted with the effort and refuse to hear differences > > anymore. So what I'm really looking for is good starting points to > > work from. > > It's easy to be overwhelmed: LADSPA, DSSI, VST/VSTi, all provide that > embarassment of riches. But I figure that the pros don't have the time > to learn everything about everything, so I don't expect it from myself. > I think you should plan carefully: think about what sort of sound you > want to project, think about its characteristics, then start working > towards it with a minimum number of effects. A little 'verb and some > judicious compression go a long way towards making a good basic sound, I > find that for my purposes I use little else. Maybe someday I'll find a > use for chorus and delays, but they'll probably get used on instruments, > not on my voice. > > A few random tips: Stand when you sing. Use a pop filter (I should > follow my own advice). Breathe deeply, you can always erase the noise. > Don't raise your chin when you try to reach notes on the high end of > your range, it tightens the vocal mechanism and works against your > attempt. Relax, you won't sing (or play) well with excess tension. > Consider your input chain, i.e., decent microphones, preamp if > necessary, good hot signal, etc. Don't record with effects in, you'll > fool yourself and it will be harder to fix (I like that Ardour forces > that behaviour). Key your music to complement your available range. > > WRT planning: Do you want to recreate the sound of a small group playing > in a bar ? Or a big band performing in a concert hall ? A rock band > playing an auditorium ? A jazz quartet in your living room ? Each of > these scenarios has some salient characteristics that you should try to > describe and understand in relation to your selected effects. Try > analyzing the vocal sound on some of your favorite recordings in the > same manner. > > Yes, you have to study up on some terminology, but you don't have to > become a DSP engineer. That's what we have Steve Harris here for anyway. > ;-) And don't worry about understanding everything right away. It's > enough to know what a compressor does, the rest you'll learn by fiddling > with settings and *listening* to the results. For instance, I use the > SC4 compressor but I'm still sort of blank about exactly what the knee > radius does. Always more to learn. :) > > > One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to > > get width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. > > For comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've > > found that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for > > other setups. > > GVerb is more complex than I'd advise for a start, but it is a fine > effect and definitely worth learning. Have you tried Freeverb or any of > the other 'verbs from the LADSPA collection ? The TAP reverb is also > superfine (with presets!), but again I'd suggest something even simpler. > > If you really have problems with intonation and pitch acuity you can > always try fixing it in the mix with a pitch shifter plugin and Ardour's > automation control, but that's getting elaborate. You can also try that > infamous vocal "fixer" from Antares, but I don't know if it will run > under any of the current support systems for VST under Linux. It costs > $$ though, and frankly at that point I'd suggest singing lessons. > > You can also use Ardour's excellent editing tools to correct small (and > not so small?) errors in timing. A bit tedious, but worth the effort. > > I listen a lot to the music made by other members of this list. I love > the sound of Pete Bessman's F4, I'd like to know how he got it. I'm also > fond of The Girls, their material is great and their singing is perfect > for it. I like the overall sound they achieve, though it's quite > different from my aims. And I'd commit heinous and unconscionable acts > just to be able to play and sound like Steve Doonan. Lots to be learned > from the folks using the same software (more or less). So many different > genres are represented at http://lam.fugal.net, it's a terrific > resource: if you like a particular piece, you can just write to the > composer and ask how s/he did it. > > Well, there's my contribution to the thread. HTH. :) > > Best, > > dp - -- Libre Audio, Libre Video, Libre Software: www.AGNULA.org Get DeMuDi, the GNU/Linux distribution for multimedia creation Download and information: http://demudi.agnula.org/ Public key available here: key FP 0A65 5E83 F44F 47A5 3DFC 19C5 7779 E411 FD82 303B -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) iQEVAwUBQ5g5VGA1EUeMSxn+AQLOBggAiRaP7+pA+taWP0XXA7hywg+Y0h3HX2Ci sfZNnXo+Hv/HdDG0Ms3Z9IDHiUHwPsWxB2IJQz77Jtfsjk1MuJlmANdFGaGDXHfy J7m3clM15VFTGiZhR6CwPh82AaviodIg5+hZdBzs9Rb5Wuyjo3KnAnUYCrfhlu6s xK9fBTyjXMX5jls2gEK5OVD4ImAebiVdyxocSll3VpHmLs7zmAzja44jJYX6eon2 5IRUi1fRGCXiLUCDBFSRW2jPw4XzOkbz0n4eLZ7ha4xl6dhf1C7+zc7U6Rkv91j4 YmiAae7Q8HhSExJJxA7a9ygDTt6EMCw8znCnSl1gTK2kHc4Zars+nQ== =DfoE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From hardbop200 at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 09:33:52 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Thu Dec 8 09:33:55 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134045308.9617.22.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> <439826D5.2020606@woh.rr.com> <1134045308.9617.22.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: > A software patent? Then maybe EU citizens could be exempted from the > non-commercial restriction (at least until Virgin and friends have > bought enough MEPs). Not that it would make any practical difference to > me, I'm not going to write any music that anyone would want to buy any > time soon. Right, most people other than my wife will probably never hear anything I create, but at the same time, using software with any kind of restrictions on it really bothers me. This is exactly the reason I left the Windows world and went to Linux, so that I could have the peace of mind of using 100% free software. If I wanted to use software with sketchy licensing under the table, I'd load a cracked version of Windows on my box and start surfing the warez sites. This is an exaggeration I know, but still - if the software is GPL, then it should be GPL 100%. --- Josh From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Thu Dec 8 10:01:09 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Thu Dec 8 10:01:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Synching & triggering w/ Hydrogen Message-ID: <43984AB5.4090308@chapelperilous.net> (I potsed this to the Hydrogen forum but wanted to get opinions here also) I have an elaborate setup for scoring and recording symphonic and semi-symphonic rock music (along the lines of Therion, eRa, Enigma, etc). I am using Rosegarden for the main sequencing, Ardour for recording, a second machine (running Windows) for some virtual instruments controlled via MIDI... and Hydrogen. What I had been doing in the past is scoring the drum parts directly in Rosegarden, but this is awkward, and matching up the MIDI notes to Hydrogen instruments is also a pain. What I'd like to do is compose the entire drum part in Hydrogen (even if this means empty measures) and have the drum song triggered automatically and play back in synch with the other instruments. Will I be able to keep accurate synchronization with the Jack transport between Rosegarden and Hydrogen in this manner (and ultimately, with Ardour, since that is where I am recording)? I have had excellent results synching between Ardour and Rosegarden, especially with multiple parts and doing punch ins at different sections of the piece. -- Brett From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Thu Dec 8 10:37:17 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Thu Dec 8 10:37:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512081447.01188.versuchsanstalt@gmx.de> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <439593AB.80409@woh.rr.com> <200512081447.01188.versuchsanstalt@gmx.de> Message-ID: <4398532D.5040506@walescomputers.co.uk> Burkhard Woelfel wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On Tuesday 06 December 2005 14:35, Dave Phillips wrote: > >>Bill Allen wrote: >> >>>I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your >>>vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a >>>sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. >> >>Hi Bill: >> >>You also have to remember that you don't hear yourself the way others >>hear you. I'm not especially fond of my voice, but I know how to hit the >>right notes and other people seem to like it. >> >>The *sound* of a voice can be effective enough as a carrier of >>personality. Bob Dylan is often used as an example of a not-so-beautiful >>voice that's perfectly suited to his material. And it's worth mentioning >>that Dylan does know how to sing (check out Girl From The North Country). > > > I'd let somebody else sing first, experiment and learn with his or her voice. > After a bit of training the feeling of embarrassment wrt my own voice > wouldn't be so much of a distraction. > > BTW, a few weeks ago a friend of mine told me that he really liked a > particular song of mine. The voice, he told me, didn't sound like mine at > all. Isn't that strange, I was really happy about that. > > Oh, the miracles of human perception. > Strange, this is exactly what happened to me when I sang on my two tracks, thing is, it doesnt sound like me to me!! Bob > - - Burkhard > > >>>What combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best >>>sound from vocals particularly in Ardour? >> >>As you say, there are many to choose from. I like Tim Goetze's Versatile >>Plate Reverb, it's easy to control and has some sweet spots that >>complement my voice nicely. I also often use the SC4 compressor >>(pre-fade) and the TAP Scaling Limiter (post-fade) on the master track. >> >>As general advice: Pick an effect, preferably one with only a few >>controls, and learn what each control does to the sound. In the case of >>reverbs, think about the ambience you want to create and make your >>initial settings accordingly. Yes, you'll have to experiment, but IMO >>that's the best way to learn about these things. >> >> >>>I know that this is one of those subjective questions for which the >>>best answer is try it out yourself and find what sounds best, but >>>there are so many plugins (an embarassment of riches), each of which >>>has many settings, that a brute force search of all the combinations >>>would take forever - not to mention that after a while, my poor ears >>>become exhausted with the effort and refuse to hear differences >>>anymore. So what I'm really looking for is good starting points to >>>work from. >> >>It's easy to be overwhelmed: LADSPA, DSSI, VST/VSTi, all provide that >>embarassment of riches. But I figure that the pros don't have the time >>to learn everything about everything, so I don't expect it from myself. >>I think you should plan carefully: think about what sort of sound you >>want to project, think about its characteristics, then start working >>towards it with a minimum number of effects. A little 'verb and some >>judicious compression go a long way towards making a good basic sound, I >>find that for my purposes I use little else. Maybe someday I'll find a >>use for chorus and delays, but they'll probably get used on instruments, >>not on my voice. >> >>A few random tips: Stand when you sing. Use a pop filter (I should >>follow my own advice). Breathe deeply, you can always erase the noise. >>Don't raise your chin when you try to reach notes on the high end of >>your range, it tightens the vocal mechanism and works against your >>attempt. Relax, you won't sing (or play) well with excess tension. >>Consider your input chain, i.e., decent microphones, preamp if >>necessary, good hot signal, etc. Don't record with effects in, you'll >>fool yourself and it will be harder to fix (I like that Ardour forces >>that behaviour). Key your music to complement your available range. >> >>WRT planning: Do you want to recreate the sound of a small group playing >>in a bar ? Or a big band performing in a concert hall ? A rock band >>playing an auditorium ? A jazz quartet in your living room ? Each of >>these scenarios has some salient characteristics that you should try to >>describe and understand in relation to your selected effects. Try >>analyzing the vocal sound on some of your favorite recordings in the >>same manner. >> >>Yes, you have to study up on some terminology, but you don't have to >>become a DSP engineer. That's what we have Steve Harris here for anyway. >>;-) And don't worry about understanding everything right away. It's >>enough to know what a compressor does, the rest you'll learn by fiddling >>with settings and *listening* to the results. For instance, I use the >>SC4 compressor but I'm still sort of blank about exactly what the knee >>radius does. Always more to learn. :) >> >> >>>One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to >>>get width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. >>>For comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've >>>found that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for >>>other setups. >> >>GVerb is more complex than I'd advise for a start, but it is a fine >>effect and definitely worth learning. Have you tried Freeverb or any of >>the other 'verbs from the LADSPA collection ? The TAP reverb is also >>superfine (with presets!), but again I'd suggest something even simpler. >> >>If you really have problems with intonation and pitch acuity you can >>always try fixing it in the mix with a pitch shifter plugin and Ardour's >>automation control, but that's getting elaborate. You can also try that >>infamous vocal "fixer" from Antares, but I don't know if it will run >>under any of the current support systems for VST under Linux. It costs >>$$ though, and frankly at that point I'd suggest singing lessons. >> >>You can also use Ardour's excellent editing tools to correct small (and >>not so small?) errors in timing. A bit tedious, but worth the effort. >> >>I listen a lot to the music made by other members of this list. I love >>the sound of Pete Bessman's F4, I'd like to know how he got it. I'm also >>fond of The Girls, their material is great and their singing is perfect >>for it. I like the overall sound they achieve, though it's quite >>different from my aims. And I'd commit heinous and unconscionable acts >>just to be able to play and sound like Steve Doonan. Lots to be learned >>from the folks using the same software (more or less). So many different >>genres are represented at http://lam.fugal.net, it's a terrific >>resource: if you like a particular piece, you can just write to the >>composer and ask how s/he did it. >> >>Well, there's my contribution to the thread. HTH. :) >> >>Best, >> >>dp > > > - -- > > > Libre Audio, Libre Video, Libre Software: www.AGNULA.org > Get DeMuDi, the GNU/Linux distribution for multimedia creation > Download and information: http://demudi.agnula.org/ > > Public key available here: > > key FP 0A65 5E83 F44F 47A5 3DFC 19C5 7779 E411 FD82 303B > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) > > iQEVAwUBQ5g5VGA1EUeMSxn+AQLOBggAiRaP7+pA+taWP0XXA7hywg+Y0h3HX2Ci > sfZNnXo+Hv/HdDG0Ms3Z9IDHiUHwPsWxB2IJQz77Jtfsjk1MuJlmANdFGaGDXHfy > J7m3clM15VFTGiZhR6CwPh82AaviodIg5+hZdBzs9Rb5Wuyjo3KnAnUYCrfhlu6s > xK9fBTyjXMX5jls2gEK5OVD4ImAebiVdyxocSll3VpHmLs7zmAzja44jJYX6eon2 > 5IRUi1fRGCXiLUCDBFSRW2jPw4XzOkbz0n4eLZ7ha4xl6dhf1C7+zc7U6Rkv91j4 > YmiAae7Q8HhSExJJxA7a9ygDTt6EMCw8znCnSl1gTK2kHc4Zars+nQ== > =DfoE > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From pw_lists at slinkp.com Thu Dec 8 10:56:40 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Thu Dec 8 10:57:07 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: <20051208155640.GB9030@slinkp.com> On Thu, Dec 08, 2005 at 09:32:50AM +0100, Esben Stien wrote: > ross@jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) writes: > > > close-micing instruments [..] condensor mic > > We should also be aware that static mics are sensitive to high SPLs' > and might be broken by too high a volume, as I understand it. I am not familiar with the term "static mic". Neither dynamic nor condensor (aka capacitor) mics are inherently fragile at high SPL. You may be thinking of ribbon mics? Those *are* typically fragile and many can be destroyed by high SPL or a simple strong puff of air (but modern ones are more robust than old ones used to be). -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From roberts.noah at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 11:44:32 2005 From: roberts.noah at gmail.com (Noah Roberts) Date: Thu Dec 8 11:44:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] profiling In-Reply-To: <20051208103115.GA14239@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> References: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> <20051208103115.GA14239@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Message-ID: <567aa5f60512080844l445dd5d8jfe55f0a1e40cc30@mail.gmail.com> On 12/8/05, Steve Harris wrote: > On Wed, Dec 07, 2005 at 07:13:30 -0800, Noah Roberts wrote: > > Could the RT patch be interfearing with my ability to run gprof? > > AFAICT I did everything right to use it, used the -pg on compile for > > instance, but my profiles have no time at all in them: > > IIRC gprof works by sampling program activity at some interval. My > experience with realtime code is that it doesnt spend long enough doing > anything in particular to get meaningful results. Well, _my_ code is not realtime. Basically all I am doing is a benchmark of std::string vs. char*. > > I think you will get better results by using cachegrind et al and running > in freewheel mode so it doesn't get kicked off. Hmmm...never heard of those things. Will have to google them later. > > Failing that you can write your own profiling code reasonably easily, just > use gettimeofday before and after ciritcal sections, and sum the results > from each run. Yeah, eventually I did that but it isn't nearly as accurate as a profile. Would certainly like to know how to make gprof work and why it isn't at any rate for future development. I don't often find the need to profile, but sometimes I do and not being able to is a big bummer. From S.W.Harris at ecs.soton.ac.uk Thu Dec 8 11:57:22 2005 From: S.W.Harris at ecs.soton.ac.uk (Steve Harris) Date: Thu Dec 8 11:57:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] profiling In-Reply-To: <567aa5f60512080844l445dd5d8jfe55f0a1e40cc30@mail.gmail.com> References: <567aa5f60512071913g2a2c17dbke38ef921602ca897@mail.gmail.com> <20051208103115.GA14239@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> <567aa5f60512080844l445dd5d8jfe55f0a1e40cc30@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051208165722.GO14239@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> On Thu, Dec 08, 2005 at 08:44:32AM -0800, Noah Roberts wrote: > > Failing that you can write your own profiling code reasonably easily, just > > use gettimeofday before and after ciritcal sections, and sum the results > > from each run. > > Yeah, eventually I did that but it isn't nearly as accurate as a > profile. Would certainly like to know how to make gprof work and why > it isn't at any rate for future development. I don't often find the > need to profile, but sometimes I do and not being able to is a big > bummer. It should be waaaay more accurate than gprof for runs that dont take hours. - Steve From cave.dnb at tiscali.fr Thu Dec 8 12:41:20 2005 From: cave.dnb at tiscali.fr (Nigel Henry) Date: Thu Dec 8 12:41:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <4398532D.5040506@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <200512081447.01188.versuchsanstalt@gmx.de> <4398532D.5040506@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <200512081841.20410.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> On Thursday 08 December 2005 16:37, studio-64 wrote: > Burkhard Woelfel wrote: > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > Hash: SHA1 > > > > On Tuesday 06 December 2005 14:35, Dave Phillips wrote: > >>Bill Allen wrote: > >>>I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > >>>vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > >>>sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. > >> > >>Hi Bill: > >> > >>You also have to remember that you don't hear yourself the way others > >>hear you. I'm not especially fond of my voice, but I know how to hit the > >>right notes and other people seem to like it. > >> > >>The *sound* of a voice can be effective enough as a carrier of > >>personality. Bob Dylan is often used as an example of a not-so-beautiful > >>voice that's perfectly suited to his material. And it's worth mentioning > >>that Dylan does know how to sing (check out Girl From The North Country). > > > > I'd let somebody else sing first, experiment and learn with his or her > > voice. After a bit of training the feeling of embarrassment wrt my own > > voice wouldn't be so much of a distraction. > > > > BTW, a few weeks ago a friend of mine told me that he really liked a > > particular song of mine. The voice, he told me, didn't sound like mine at > > all. Isn't that strange, I was really happy about that. > > > > Oh, the miracles of human perception. > > Strange, this is exactly what happened to me > when I sang on my two tracks, thing is, it doesnt sound like me to me!! > > Bob This is an interesting comment. I find the same when I record speech onto, for instance a cassette recorder. I have an accent coming from the Channel Islands, but don't notice it when I speak. But playing back my recorded voice is very evident. It may have something to do with the very positive feedback you get to the brain when you speak or sing, whether your monitoring your singing/speech with or without headphones. Whereas, when you listen to yourself after making a recording, your brain is not receiving positive feedback from your voice. Your brain through your ears is sort of hearing these sounds for the first time, from another location, and also some delay involved between the recording and the playback. Of course the other quite strange behaviour is, when you are listening to music through the headphones and speak to someone at the same time, you actually speak louder without realising it, indicating again that the brain, by virtue of positive feedback from your voice is controlling the level of your voice. A problem noticeable with folks who have become hearing impaired, or totally deaf. There's obviously a lot of stuff going on that you don't know about when you sing. It's only when you listen to the recording that you become aware of it. Think Karaoke, and you've had a few too many. What would that sound like the next day. (That was just for fun). It's been great reading this thread. Nigel. > > > - - Burkhard > > > >>>What combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best > >>>sound from vocals particularly in Ardour? > >> > >>As you say, there are many to choose from. I like Tim Goetze's Versatile > >>Plate Reverb, it's easy to control and has some sweet spots that > >>complement my voice nicely. I also often use the SC4 compressor > >>(pre-fade) and the TAP Scaling Limiter (post-fade) on the master track. > >> > >>As general advice: Pick an effect, preferably one with only a few > >>controls, and learn what each control does to the sound. In the case of > >>reverbs, think about the ambience you want to create and make your > >>initial settings accordingly. Yes, you'll have to experiment, but IMO > >>that's the best way to learn about these things. > >> > >>>I know that this is one of those subjective questions for which the > >>>best answer is try it out yourself and find what sounds best, but > >>>there are so many plugins (an embarassment of riches), each of which > >>>has many settings, that a brute force search of all the combinations > >>>would take forever - not to mention that after a while, my poor ears > >>>become exhausted with the effort and refuse to hear differences > >>>anymore. So what I'm really looking for is good starting points to > >>>work from. > >> > >>It's easy to be overwhelmed: LADSPA, DSSI, VST/VSTi, all provide that > >>embarassment of riches. But I figure that the pros don't have the time > >>to learn everything about everything, so I don't expect it from myself. > >>I think you should plan carefully: think about what sort of sound you > >>want to project, think about its characteristics, then start working > >>towards it with a minimum number of effects. A little 'verb and some > >>judicious compression go a long way towards making a good basic sound, I > >>find that for my purposes I use little else. Maybe someday I'll find a > >>use for chorus and delays, but they'll probably get used on instruments, > >>not on my voice. > >> > >>A few random tips: Stand when you sing. Use a pop filter (I should > >>follow my own advice). Breathe deeply, you can always erase the noise. > >>Don't raise your chin when you try to reach notes on the high end of > >>your range, it tightens the vocal mechanism and works against your > >>attempt. Relax, you won't sing (or play) well with excess tension. > >>Consider your input chain, i.e., decent microphones, preamp if > >>necessary, good hot signal, etc. Don't record with effects in, you'll > >>fool yourself and it will be harder to fix (I like that Ardour forces > >>that behaviour). Key your music to complement your available range. > >> > >>WRT planning: Do you want to recreate the sound of a small group playing > >>in a bar ? Or a big band performing in a concert hall ? A rock band > >>playing an auditorium ? A jazz quartet in your living room ? Each of > >>these scenarios has some salient characteristics that you should try to > >>describe and understand in relation to your selected effects. Try > >>analyzing the vocal sound on some of your favorite recordings in the > >>same manner. > >> > >>Yes, you have to study up on some terminology, but you don't have to > >>become a DSP engineer. That's what we have Steve Harris here for anyway. > >>;-) And don't worry about understanding everything right away. It's > >>enough to know what a compressor does, the rest you'll learn by fiddling > >>with settings and *listening* to the results. For instance, I use the > >>SC4 compressor but I'm still sort of blank about exactly what the knee > >>radius does. Always more to learn. :) > >> > >>>One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to > >>>get width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. > >>>For comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've > >>>found that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for > >>>other setups. > >> > >>GVerb is more complex than I'd advise for a start, but it is a fine > >>effect and definitely worth learning. Have you tried Freeverb or any of > >>the other 'verbs from the LADSPA collection ? The TAP reverb is also > >>superfine (with presets!), but again I'd suggest something even simpler. > >> > >>If you really have problems with intonation and pitch acuity you can > >>always try fixing it in the mix with a pitch shifter plugin and Ardour's > >>automation control, but that's getting elaborate. You can also try that > >>infamous vocal "fixer" from Antares, but I don't know if it will run > >>under any of the current support systems for VST under Linux. It costs > >>$$ though, and frankly at that point I'd suggest singing lessons. > >> > >>You can also use Ardour's excellent editing tools to correct small (and > >>not so small?) errors in timing. A bit tedious, but worth the effort. > >> > >>I listen a lot to the music made by other members of this list. I love > >>the sound of Pete Bessman's F4, I'd like to know how he got it. I'm also > >>fond of The Girls, their material is great and their singing is perfect > >>for it. I like the overall sound they achieve, though it's quite > >>different from my aims. And I'd commit heinous and unconscionable acts > >>just to be able to play and sound like Steve Doonan. Lots to be learned > >>from the folks using the same software (more or less). So many different > >>genres are represented at http://lam.fugal.net, it's a terrific > >>resource: if you like a particular piece, you can just write to the > >>composer and ask how s/he did it. > >> > >>Well, there's my contribution to the thread. HTH. :) > >> > >>Best, > >> > >>dp > > > > - -- > > > > > > Libre Audio, Libre Video, Libre Software: www.AGNULA.org > > Get DeMuDi, the GNU/Linux distribution for multimedia creation > > Download and information: http://demudi.agnula.org/ > > > > Public key available here: > > > > key FP 0A65 5E83 F44F 47A5 3DFC 19C5 7779 E411 FD82 303B > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) > > > > iQEVAwUBQ5g5VGA1EUeMSxn+AQLOBggAiRaP7+pA+taWP0XXA7hywg+Y0h3HX2Ci > > sfZNnXo+Hv/HdDG0Ms3Z9IDHiUHwPsWxB2IJQz77Jtfsjk1MuJlmANdFGaGDXHfy > > J7m3clM15VFTGiZhR6CwPh82AaviodIg5+hZdBzs9Rb5Wuyjo3KnAnUYCrfhlu6s > > xK9fBTyjXMX5jls2gEK5OVD4ImAebiVdyxocSll3VpHmLs7zmAzja44jJYX6eon2 > > 5IRUi1fRGCXiLUCDBFSRW2jPw4XzOkbz0n4eLZ7ha4xl6dhf1C7+zc7U6Rkv91j4 > > YmiAae7Q8HhSExJJxA7a9ygDTt6EMCw8znCnSl1gTK2kHc4Zars+nQ== > > =DfoE > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From a at gaydenko.com Thu Dec 8 13:35:00 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Thu Dec 8 13:31:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve Message-ID: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> Hi! The aim is to use an artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve to move sound image beyond a head when headphones are in use. I have tried to find such file. Probably my English is poor - I have not found something useful. OTOH, I can not create such file myself. Will anybody be so kind to help me? Thanks in advance! Andrew From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Dec 8 13:54:38 2005 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Thu Dec 8 13:54:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve In-Reply-To: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> References: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> Message-ID: <1134068078.21473.18.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 21:35 +0300, Andrew Gaydenko wrote: > Hi! > > The aim is to use an artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve to move sound image > beyond a head when headphones are in use. I have tried to find such file. Probably > my English is poor - I have not found something useful. OTOH, I can not create such > file myself. > > Will anybody be so kind to help me? http://sound.media.mit.edu/KEMAR.html -- Fernando From yaqtil at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 14:01:20 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Thu Dec 8 14:01:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512081101j7e14f79ax8227d73915ead606@mail.gmail.com> > So from my point of view LS is dead until someone actually speaks up. > This "Ah it's all ok, but we can't tell you why" doesn't sound > convincing at all. Sorry. if they dont want to speakup, we will have to extrapolate...as it is most likely one or two things: * they found someone using LS code in a commercial product without negotiating a relicense first, this could be any of those things like PlugZilla, Receptor, Neko, OASYS, whatever... * Tascam threatened to sue them into oblivion. Given the pricetag of NI's Kontakt, which has GIGA support and disk streaming, theres certainly room in there for some kind of royalty payment, even when you factor out what an expense the enormous payroll listed in the AboutBox must be... if its the former, sorry to hear that for the LS folk's sake, but perhaps they could clarify whether material created with pure LS is permissable under CC or other license.. if it is the latter, that is fairly absurd. if i make a sampler in pd using readsf~ ive instantly violated tascam's 'patent' ? From bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 8 14:30:49 2005 From: bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk (Bungee) Date: Thu Dec 8 14:30:51 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> Message-ID: Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > james@dis-dot-dat.net wrote: > > > Do you mean the one that sounds like bells? If you do, then I'm > > guessing it's... bells. > > I guess that's the one. But I don't think it bells (unless you mean > synthesized bells), actually I'm quite sure esp since I know what > instruments are used on this record (they are: analog synths, fender > rhodes and toy-piano). > > I don't know Jean Michel Jarre too well but I seem to remember the same > sound being used on the Oxygene (the swing one that was a big hit). > Maybe that could ring a bell (pun intended)... I think I go with the majority here, sunthesised bells. Maybe you can get something like it by playing with the bell voices in ZynAddSubFX -- Bungee From reuben.m at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 14:43:55 2005 From: reuben.m at gmail.com (Reuben Martin) Date: Thu Dec 8 14:43:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Synching & triggering w/ Hydrogen In-Reply-To: <43984AB5.4090308@chapelperilous.net> References: <43984AB5.4090308@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: It will start and stop with the transport, but it will not follow tempo changes. The developer claims that the Jack Transport is broken somehow with respect to tempo changes. http://www.hydrogen-music.org/forum/?action=show_thread&thread=274&fid=2&page=1 -Reuben On 12/8/05, Brett McCoy wrote: > (I potsed this to the Hydrogen forum but wanted to get opinions here also) > > I have an elaborate setup for scoring and recording symphonic and > semi-symphonic rock music (along the lines of Therion, eRa, Enigma, > etc). I am using Rosegarden for the main sequencing, Ardour for > recording, a second machine (running Windows) for some virtual > instruments controlled via MIDI... and Hydrogen. > > What I had been doing in the past is scoring the drum parts directly in > Rosegarden, but this is awkward, and matching up the MIDI notes to > Hydrogen instruments is also a pain. > > What I'd like to do is compose the entire drum part in Hydrogen (even if > this means empty measures) and have the drum song triggered > automatically and play back in synch with the other instruments. Will I > be able to keep accurate synchronization with the Jack transport between > Rosegarden and Hydrogen in this manner (and ultimately, with Ardour, > since that is where I am recording)? I have had excellent results > synching between Ardour and Rosegarden, especially with multiple parts > and doing punch ins at different sections of the piece. > > -- Brett > From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Thu Dec 8 14:49:31 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Thu Dec 8 14:49:48 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Synching & triggering w/ Hydrogen In-Reply-To: References: <43984AB5.4090308@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <43988E4B.2010809@chapelperilous.net> Reuben Martin wrote: > It will start and stop with the transport, but it will not follow > tempo changes. The developer claims that the Jack Transport is broken > somehow with respect to tempo changes. > > http://www.hydrogen-music.org/forum/?action=show_thread&thread=274&fid=2&page=1 I guess I'll have to experiment and see what works and doesn't work. > -Reuben > > On 12/8/05, Brett McCoy wrote: > >>(I potsed this to the Hydrogen forum but wanted to get opinions here also) >> >>I have an elaborate setup for scoring and recording symphonic and >>semi-symphonic rock music (along the lines of Therion, eRa, Enigma, >>etc). I am using Rosegarden for the main sequencing, Ardour for >>recording, a second machine (running Windows) for some virtual >>instruments controlled via MIDI... and Hydrogen. >> >>What I had been doing in the past is scoring the drum parts directly in >>Rosegarden, but this is awkward, and matching up the MIDI notes to >>Hydrogen instruments is also a pain. >> >>What I'd like to do is compose the entire drum part in Hydrogen (even if >>this means empty measures) and have the drum song triggered >>automatically and play back in synch with the other instruments. Will I >>be able to keep accurate synchronization with the Jack transport between >>Rosegarden and Hydrogen in this manner (and ultimately, with Ardour, >>since that is where I am recording)? I have had excellent results >>synching between Ardour and Rosegarden, especially with multiple parts >>and doing punch ins at different sections of the piece. >> >>-- Brett >> > > From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Dec 8 15:20:30 2005 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Thu Dec 8 15:20:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 16:09 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/7/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 14:04 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > > LinuxSampler is a good program but has recently considered straying > > > from the Open Source model. Please read the License Agreement included in > > > the CVS version for more info. For these reasons I've ceased using it. My > > > comments are probably a bit dated these days as I've not tried or even > > > paid attention to the program in a few months. > > > > Their CVS server isn't responding, so I can't see the whole License > > Agreement. But I see this on the web page: > > > > LinuxSampler is licensed under the GNU GPL license with the exception > > that COMMERCIAL USE of the souce code, libraries and applications is > > NOT ALLOWED without prior written permission by the LinuxSampler > > authors. If you have questions on the subject please contact us. > > > > This is pretty nasty - if I interpret it correctly, it means that > > LinuxSampler is no longer free software (at least not as defined by the > > FSF, http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html ) and not even freeware, > > since a producer making commercial music would have to pay to use it. > > > > The LinuxSampler hackers are of course free to license their code any > > way they want, but I wish people who add this kind of exceptions to the > > GPL would call it something else instead of "GNU GPL with exception > > foo". That will just confuse people when the license is uncompatible > > with the GPL. > > Yep, this was the problem and you interpret it as many others do. The > Debian folks didn't like this so much that they dropped LS from their > releases. I think that the LS developers weren't taking the commercail > thing quite as far as you are. They seemed more interested in keeping > Synth manufacturers from using the code, which is disappointing sime a > good software company could pick this up and run with it quite > quickly. This would be great for us users, should they every do it. > > Note that this license modification was not in the latest official > release the last time I looked. It was only in the CVS version so > there is an opportunity to fork the database and put a development > team together to keep it truly Open Source, should someone care enough > to do so. When was that? A cvs snapshot that I packaged for experimental purposes dated 2005.01.20 does not have the "commercial usage" exception. Was there any "official" tarball release before 0.3.1? That one (and subsequent ones) come with the GPL but-not-really-GPL license. So no, it is not only CVS. -- Fernando From atte.jensen at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 15:52:17 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Thu Dec 8 15:52:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> Message-ID: <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> Michael T D Nelson wrote: > Just a guess... Try to Google for something like "bell synthesis -labs > -speech". > > http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/demos/dafx02/ > http://www.crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node67.html > http://www.ec.vanderbilt.edu/computermusic/musc216site/Simple.bell.tutorial.html I appreciate the help, but I'm sorry to say that it sound to me like everybody that replied are listening at another sound than the one I'm talking about. Here's another sniplet from the same record with a similar effect. This one sound more like filtered noise with resonance, and I'm more interrested in the first example. This is just to stear away from the bell-thing: http://www.atte.dk/download/sound3.ogg Anyways here's my breakdown of what is heard on http://www.atte.dk/download/sound2.ogg 1) Shaker/egg on downbeats 2) Bass 3) Pad 4) Toy piano playing the chords on downbeats 5) synth lead with bender playing melody 6) fender rhodes in the background 7) some kind of percussion, something like hand played snare drumm 8) about 5 seconds (held untill the end of the sample, although barely audible towards the end) into the sniplet a rising sound, resembling a a wind chime is heard. To me is sounds like you're all listening at the toy piano (which is what it is, I saw the band live in a small club in copenhagen, same toy piano on that tune), but I'm talking about sound #8, the "synthethic wind chime"! Sorry for my poor explanation in the first place, hope that you'll care to listen again, since my initial interrest in the sound, as expressed in the original posting, still holds. And just so straighten that out; I'm not a novice synth tweaker. And I'm not really interrested in say a sample of the sound to use in my music. I want to *understand* how the sound is done. -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From m_nels at gmx.net Thu Dec 8 16:35:08 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Thu Dec 8 16:34:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4398A70C.9000707@gmx.net> Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > To me is sounds like you're all listening at the toy piano (which is > what it is, > I saw the band live in a small club in copenhagen, same toy piano on > that tune), but I'm talking about sound #8, the "synthethic wind chime"! > > Sorry for my poor explanation in the first place, hope that you'll care > to listen again, since my initial interrest in the sound, as expressed > in the original posting, still holds. Ok, I got it now. It does sound a lot like a wind chime, doesn't it? > And just so straighten that out; I'm not a novice synth tweaker. And I'm > not really interrested in say a sample of the sound to use in my music. > I want to > *understand* how the sound is done. Ok. No offence taken, I hope! I'm afraid I don't really have a better answer. Are you sure it's synthesised? I don't have any decent speakers to listen properly at the moment, I'm afraid. In a similar vein to my last post - have you tried googling for "wind chime synthesis"? I haven't any great practical experience of synthesis, but I did just find a few interesting methods. I'm not sure what they would sound like though. You'd probably know better than me. Also, are there any synthesis-related newsgroups or mailing lists where responses might be more useful? Good luck! Michael From bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk Thu Dec 8 17:01:04 2005 From: bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk (Bungee) Date: Thu Dec 8 17:01:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> Message-ID: Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Michael T D Nelson wrote: > > > Just a guess... Try to Google for something like "bell synthesis -labs > > -speech". > > > > http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/demos/dafx02/ > > http://www.crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node67.html > > http://www.ec.vanderbilt.edu/computermusic/musc216site/Simple.bell.tutorial.html > > I appreciate the help, but I'm sorry to say that it sound to me like > everybody that replied are listening at another sound than the one I'm > talking about. Here's another sniplet from the same record with a > similar effect. This one sound more like filtered noise with resonance, > and I'm more interrested in the first example. This is just to stear > away from the bell-thing: > > http://www.atte.dk/download/sound3.ogg > > Anyways here's my breakdown of what is heard on > http://www.atte.dk/download/sound2.ogg > > 1) Shaker/egg on downbeats > 2) Bass > 3) Pad > 4) Toy piano playing the chords on downbeats > 5) synth lead with bender playing melody > 6) fender rhodes in the background > 7) some kind of percussion, something like hand played snare drumm > 8) about 5 seconds (held untill the end of the sample, although barely > audible towards the end) into the sniplet a rising sound, resembling a a > wind chime is heard. > > To me is sounds like you're all listening at the toy piano (which is > what it is, > I saw the band live in a small club in copenhagen, same toy piano on > that tune), but I'm talking about sound #8, the "synthethic wind chime"! > > Sorry for my poor explanation in the first place, hope that you'll care > to listen again, since my initial interrest in the sound, as expressed > in the original posting, still holds. > > And just so straighten that out; I'm not a novice synth tweaker. And I'm > not really interrested in say a sample of the sound to use in my music. > I want to > *understand* how the sound is done. Ah got it! It sounds like a played rapid apeggio. I think I was able to get something similar with the 'pad' bit of Zyn... and with fairly wet long reverb. -- Bungee From atte.jensen at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 17:08:42 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Thu Dec 8 17:08:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <4398A70C.9000707@gmx.net> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> <4398A70C.9000707@gmx.net> Message-ID: <4398AEEA.4030702@gmail.com> Michael T D Nelson wrote: > Ok, I got it now. It does sound a lot like a wind chime, doesn't it? Indeed. > Ok. No offence taken, I hope! No, no... > I'm afraid I don't really have a better answer. Are you sure it's > synthesised? Yes! > I don't have any decent speakers to listen properly at the > moment, I'm afraid. I'm on headphones here. > In a similar vein to my last post - have you tried googling for "wind > chime synthesis"? I haven't any great practical experience of synthesis, > but I did just find a few interesting methods. I'm not sure what they > would sound like though. You'd probably know better than me. I might have to go through google. Often a simple, clear explanation of a knowing person is the best, and I was (still is) hoping for that here... > Also, are there any synthesis-related newsgroups or mailing lists where > responses might be more useful? I'm casually reading rec.music.makers.synth, but mostly people there are interresting in modelA vs modelB or gimme-the-patches-for-download. The level of insight and thoroughness here seems infinitely higher IMHO. -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From pete.leigh at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 17:21:05 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Thu Dec 8 17:21:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 08/12/05, Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > 8) about 5 seconds (held untill the end of the sample, although barely > audible towards the end) into the sniplet a rising sound, resembling a a > wind chime is heard. That's the one my reply was about, I think - synthetic wind chime is a good description.. Still sounds like an FM sound to me - modulating one or more oscs with one or more others at a more or less harmonically related audio frequency, then lots of reverb. There is a slower modulation going on in there too - might be envelopes or lfo modulated vcas on the modulating oscillators working to change the timbre. I associate it more with FM synths like DX7, etc., than analog. That'd be my guess anyway. From set at pobox.com Thu Dec 8 17:22:41 2005 From: set at pobox.com (Paul) Date: Thu Dec 8 17:22:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <1133984793.17901.44.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> <1133984793.17901.44.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051208222241.GB7454@squish.home.loc> Lee Revell , on Wed Dec 07, 2005 [02:46:32 PM] said: > On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 13:18 -0600, Martin McCormick wrote: > > How does one read the MCM number and any other non-audio data > > from a music CD? I want to build a MP3 server for our house and > > definitely do not want to manually enter data from the art work in the > > CD box. > > > > It is my understanding that one can retrieve the MCM catalog > > number and match it against a data base to turn that in to an album > > name and song titles. Is this correct? > > Yes it's called CDDB and any decent music player should have built in > support. > > XMMS does talk to the CDDB right? If not we are a lot further behind > than I thought... > > Lee Hi; Sure it does. The fancier ones of the breed will even download cover art for you. (eg. Amarok) Last week, the LWN 'grumpy editor' series was about music managers: http://lwn.net/Articles/161233/ (scroll down quite a bit) The comments mentioned something that might be interesting for mp3 serving: http://www.musicpd.org/ Its a networkable music playing daemon that has a dozen or so client front ends, web, curses, command line, etc. I see that the OP was able to get some CDDB lookups, but since Im here, Ill mention the util 'cd-discid', and 'cddb-tool' which is part of the 'abcde' package, a command line tool for ripping and encoding. Paul set@pobox.com From markknecht at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 17:43:24 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Thu Dec 8 17:43:27 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> On 12/8/05, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > > Note that this license modification was not in the latest official > > release the last time I looked. It was only in the CVS version so > > there is an opportunity to fork the database and put a development > > team together to keep it truly Open Source, should someone care enough > > to do so. > > When was that? > > A cvs snapshot that I packaged for experimental purposes dated > 2005.01.20 does not have the "commercial usage" exception. I believe it was in March sometime. The LS guys have been pretty forthcoming and have kept people on the list informed about this, to a small extent. They have made a strong statement, which I have not verified, that the tarball releases from linuxsampler.org have the GPL license and only code taken from the CVS server have the change. (Subject to my memory. Don't take anything I say as the gospel truth.) > > Was there any "official" tarball release before 0.3.1? That one (and > subsequent ones) come with the GPL but-not-really-GPL license. So no, it > is not only CVS. Not sure. Now that I look at the web site they have the same LS-0.3.3 file for both stable and unstable. Probably someone is going to have to either check the mailing list archives to find out if they've gone with this license change for good. I no longer subscribe so I'm concerned that my information is getting too out of date. I was told that they would keep me informed but maybe I missed a message. Anyone intersted in further study could easily discover the U.S. patent numbers that were originally licensed to NemeSys. (Not Tascam!) If someone cannot do that for themselves then they probably could figure out someone who does know the numbers and ask so they could read the patents for themselves. Please note that while I am greatly disappointed that all of this has happened I still thinkLS is a really great piece of work and I, for one, still have great respect for all the folks that have done this work. With best regards, Mark From rlrevell at joe-job.com Thu Dec 8 18:25:42 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Thu Dec 8 18:24:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 14:43 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > Anyone intersted in further study could easily discover the U.S. > patent numbers that were originally licensed to NemeSys. (Not Tascam!) > If someone cannot do that for themselves then they probably could > figure out someone who does know the numbers and ask so they could > read the patents for themselves. > > Please note that while I am greatly disappointed that all of this has > happened I still thinkLS is a really great piece of work and I, for > one, still have great respect for all the folks that have done this > work. If the issue really is a patent dispute involving a patent that is 1) a software patent and 2) obvious and therefore invalid, wouldn't this be the first case where a corporation went after a free software project for software patent infringement? And if this were the case shouldn't there be a huge uproar going on? Lee From a at gaydenko.com Thu Dec 8 18:31:16 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Thu Dec 8 18:28:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve In-Reply-To: <1134068078.21473.18.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> References: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> <1134068078.21473.18.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <200512090231.16924@goldspace.net> Fernando, thanks! I have tried different chains of response files from cited site (with and without speakers inverse file) and have head different sounds :-), a sound image became wider, but the aim was not achieved, the sound image still doesn't leave my head. Are there more successful stories? Andrew ======= On Thursday 08 December 2005 21:54, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: ======= On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 21:35 +0300, Andrew Gaydenko wrote: > Hi! > > The aim is to use an artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve to move sound image > beyond a head when headphones are in use. I have tried to find such file. Probably > my English is poor - I have not found something useful. OTOH, I can not create such > file myself. > > Will anybody be so kind to help me? http://sound.media.mit.edu/KEMAR.html -- Fernando From markknecht at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 18:49:35 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Thu Dec 8 18:49:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512081549l794ea5c9o6f77876f415f8ad@mail.gmail.com> On 12/8/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 14:43 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > Anyone intersted in further study could easily discover the U.S. > > patent numbers that were originally licensed to NemeSys. (Not Tascam!) > > If someone cannot do that for themselves then they probably could > > figure out someone who does know the numbers and ask so they could > > read the patents for themselves. > > > > Please note that while I am greatly disappointed that all of this has > > happened I still thinkLS is a really great piece of work and I, for > > one, still have great respect for all the folks that have done this > > work. > > If the issue really is a patent dispute involving a patent that is 1) a > software patent and 2) obvious and therefore invalid, wouldn't this be > the first case where a corporation went after a free software project > for software patent infringement? And if this were the case shouldn't > there be a huge uproar going on? > > Lee Lee, I don't know the answers to your questions but I do not believe that I said that the patent was "obvious and therefore invalid". IANAL and wouldn't want to suggest anything like that. Please note that this may or may not be considered a 'software patent' as disk streaming is involved. With best regards, Mark From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Thu Dec 8 18:51:55 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Thu Dec 8 18:52:15 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512081841.20410.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <200512081447.01188.versuchsanstalt@gmx.de> <4398532D.5040506@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512081841.20410.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> Message-ID: <4398C71B.9000702@walescomputers.co.uk> Nigel Henry wrote: > On Thursday 08 December 2005 16:37, studio-64 wrote: > >>Burkhard Woelfel wrote: >> >>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >>>Hash: SHA1 >>> >>>On Tuesday 06 December 2005 14:35, Dave Phillips wrote: >>> >>>>Bill Allen wrote: >>>> >>>>>I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your >>>>>vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a >>>>>sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. >>>> >>>>Hi Bill: >>>> >>>>You also have to remember that you don't hear yourself the way others >>>>hear you. I'm not especially fond of my voice, but I know how to hit the >>>>right notes and other people seem to like it. >>>> >>>>The *sound* of a voice can be effective enough as a carrier of >>>>personality. Bob Dylan is often used as an example of a not-so-beautiful >>>>voice that's perfectly suited to his material. And it's worth mentioning >>>>that Dylan does know how to sing (check out Girl From The North Country). >>> >>>I'd let somebody else sing first, experiment and learn with his or her >>>voice. After a bit of training the feeling of embarrassment wrt my own >>>voice wouldn't be so much of a distraction. >>> >>>BTW, a few weeks ago a friend of mine told me that he really liked a >>>particular song of mine. The voice, he told me, didn't sound like mine at >>>all. Isn't that strange, I was really happy about that. >>> >>>Oh, the miracles of human perception. >> >>Strange, this is exactly what happened to me >>when I sang on my two tracks, thing is, it doesnt sound like me to me!! >> >>Bob > > > This is an interesting comment. I find the same when I record speech onto, for > instance a cassette recorder. I have an accent coming from the Channel > Islands, but don't notice it when I speak. But playing back my recorded voice > is very evident. It may have something to do with the very positive feedback > you get to the brain when you speak or sing, whether your monitoring your > singing/speech with or without headphones. Whereas, when you listen to > yourself after making a recording, your brain is not receiving positive > feedback from your voice. Your brain through your ears is sort of hearing > these sounds for the first time, from another location, and also some delay > involved between the recording and the playback. Of course the other quite > strange behaviour is, when you are listening to music through the headphones > and speak to someone at the same time, you actually speak louder without > realising it, indicating again that the brain, by virtue of positive feedback > from your voice is controlling the level of your voice. A problem noticeable > with folks who have become hearing impaired, or totally deaf. There's > obviously a lot of stuff going on that you don't know about when you sing. > It's only when you listen to the recording that you become aware of it. > > Think Karaoke, and you've had a few too many. What would that sound like the > next day. (That was just for fun). It's been great reading this thread. > Nigel. > Hi Nigel Good points I have a strong northern accent, which as you say I dont hear really (I now live on Cardiff so I get a few commnents!) I dont tend to sing with an accent (I got a few mentions of the doors re the vocal, again I can't hear the semblance) Good Ole brain doing it's thing!! Cheers Bob >>>- - Burkhard >>> >>> >>>>>What combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best >>>>>sound from vocals particularly in Ardour? >>>> >>>>As you say, there are many to choose from. I like Tim Goetze's Versatile >>>>Plate Reverb, it's easy to control and has some sweet spots that >>>>complement my voice nicely. I also often use the SC4 compressor >>>>(pre-fade) and the TAP Scaling Limiter (post-fade) on the master track. >>>> >>>>As general advice: Pick an effect, preferably one with only a few >>>>controls, and learn what each control does to the sound. In the case of >>>>reverbs, think about the ambience you want to create and make your >>>>initial settings accordingly. Yes, you'll have to experiment, but IMO >>>>that's the best way to learn about these things. >>>> >>>> >>>>>I know that this is one of those subjective questions for which the >>>>>best answer is try it out yourself and find what sounds best, but >>>>>there are so many plugins (an embarassment of riches), each of which >>>>>has many settings, that a brute force search of all the combinations >>>>>would take forever - not to mention that after a while, my poor ears >>>>>become exhausted with the effort and refuse to hear differences >>>>>anymore. So what I'm really looking for is good starting points to >>>>>work from. >>>> >>>>It's easy to be overwhelmed: LADSPA, DSSI, VST/VSTi, all provide that >>>>embarassment of riches. But I figure that the pros don't have the time >>>>to learn everything about everything, so I don't expect it from myself. >>>>I think you should plan carefully: think about what sort of sound you >>>>want to project, think about its characteristics, then start working >>>>towards it with a minimum number of effects. A little 'verb and some >>>>judicious compression go a long way towards making a good basic sound, I >>>>find that for my purposes I use little else. Maybe someday I'll find a >>>>use for chorus and delays, but they'll probably get used on instruments, >>>>not on my voice. >>>> >>>>A few random tips: Stand when you sing. Use a pop filter (I should >>>>follow my own advice). Breathe deeply, you can always erase the noise. >>>>Don't raise your chin when you try to reach notes on the high end of >>>>your range, it tightens the vocal mechanism and works against your >>>>attempt. Relax, you won't sing (or play) well with excess tension. >>>>Consider your input chain, i.e., decent microphones, preamp if >>>>necessary, good hot signal, etc. Don't record with effects in, you'll >>>>fool yourself and it will be harder to fix (I like that Ardour forces >>>>that behaviour). Key your music to complement your available range. >>>> >>>>WRT planning: Do you want to recreate the sound of a small group playing >>>>in a bar ? Or a big band performing in a concert hall ? A rock band >>>>playing an auditorium ? A jazz quartet in your living room ? Each of >>>>these scenarios has some salient characteristics that you should try to >>>>describe and understand in relation to your selected effects. Try >>>>analyzing the vocal sound on some of your favorite recordings in the >>>>same manner. >>>> >>>>Yes, you have to study up on some terminology, but you don't have to >>>>become a DSP engineer. That's what we have Steve Harris here for anyway. >>>>;-) And don't worry about understanding everything right away. It's >>>>enough to know what a compressor does, the rest you'll learn by fiddling >>>>with settings and *listening* to the results. For instance, I use the >>>>SC4 compressor but I'm still sort of blank about exactly what the knee >>>>radius does. Always more to learn. :) >>>> >>>> >>>>>One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to >>>>>get width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. >>>>>For comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've >>>>>found that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for >>>>>other setups. >>>> >>>>GVerb is more complex than I'd advise for a start, but it is a fine >>>>effect and definitely worth learning. Have you tried Freeverb or any of >>>>the other 'verbs from the LADSPA collection ? The TAP reverb is also >>>>superfine (with presets!), but again I'd suggest something even simpler. >>>> >>>>If you really have problems with intonation and pitch acuity you can >>>>always try fixing it in the mix with a pitch shifter plugin and Ardour's >>>>automation control, but that's getting elaborate. You can also try that >>>>infamous vocal "fixer" from Antares, but I don't know if it will run >>>>under any of the current support systems for VST under Linux. It costs >>>>$$ though, and frankly at that point I'd suggest singing lessons. >>>> >>>>You can also use Ardour's excellent editing tools to correct small (and >>>>not so small?) errors in timing. A bit tedious, but worth the effort. >>>> >>>>I listen a lot to the music made by other members of this list. I love >>>>the sound of Pete Bessman's F4, I'd like to know how he got it. I'm also >>>>fond of The Girls, their material is great and their singing is perfect >>>>for it. I like the overall sound they achieve, though it's quite >>>>different from my aims. And I'd commit heinous and unconscionable acts >>>>just to be able to play and sound like Steve Doonan. Lots to be learned >>> >>>>from the folks using the same software (more or less). So many different >>> >>>>genres are represented at http://lam.fugal.net, it's a terrific >>>>resource: if you like a particular piece, you can just write to the >>>>composer and ask how s/he did it. >>>> >>>>Well, there's my contribution to the thread. HTH. :) >>>> >>>>Best, >>>> >>>>dp >>> >>>- -- >>> >>> >>> Libre Audio, Libre Video, Libre Software: www.AGNULA.org >>> Get DeMuDi, the GNU/Linux distribution for multimedia creation >>> Download and information: http://demudi.agnula.org/ >>> >>> Public key available here: >>> >>>key FP 0A65 5E83 F44F 47A5 3DFC 19C5 7779 E411 FD82 303B >>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >>>Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux) >>> >>>iQEVAwUBQ5g5VGA1EUeMSxn+AQLOBggAiRaP7+pA+taWP0XXA7hywg+Y0h3HX2Ci >>>sfZNnXo+Hv/HdDG0Ms3Z9IDHiUHwPsWxB2IJQz77Jtfsjk1MuJlmANdFGaGDXHfy >>>J7m3clM15VFTGiZhR6CwPh82AaviodIg5+hZdBzs9Rb5Wuyjo3KnAnUYCrfhlu6s >>>xK9fBTyjXMX5jls2gEK5OVD4ImAebiVdyxocSll3VpHmLs7zmAzja44jJYX6eon2 >>>5IRUi1fRGCXiLUCDBFSRW2jPw4XzOkbz0n4eLZ7ha4xl6dhf1C7+zc7U6Rkv91j4 >>>YmiAae7Q8HhSExJJxA7a9ygDTt6EMCw8znCnSl1gTK2kHc4Zars+nQ== >>>=DfoE >>>-----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Thu Dec 8 19:20:00 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Thu Dec 8 19:17:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1134087600.9027.4.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 18:25 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 14:43 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > Anyone intersted in further study could easily discover the U.S. > > patent numbers that were originally licensed to NemeSys. (Not Tascam!) > > If someone cannot do that for themselves then they probably could > > figure out someone who does know the numbers and ask so they could > > read the patents for themselves. The patent was licensed to NemeSys, but it is owned by Conexant. http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=/netahtml/srchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=6008446.WKU.&OS=PN/6008446&RS=PN/6008446 > If the issue really is a patent dispute involving a patent that is 1) a > software patent and 2) obvious and therefore invalid, wouldn't this be > the first case where a corporation went after a free software project > for software patent infringement? And if this were the case shouldn't > there be a huge uproar going on? The patent is very obvious - I came up with the same idea about 30 seconds after hearing about the problem of a low latency sampler with huge samples, and I'm not even particularly clever. I don't know enough about US patent law to know how complex or original something has to be in order to be a valid patent, but if I was a US citizen I would definitely write some angry mails to the patent and trademark office. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051209/e52d0619/attachment.bin From b0ef at esben-stien.name Thu Dec 8 21:23:03 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Thu Dec 8 19:28:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051208155640.GB9030@slinkp.com> (Paul Winkler's message of "Thu, 8 Dec 2005 10:56:40 -0500") References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <20051208155640.GB9030@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <87ek4n2em0.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Paul Winkler writes: > I am not familiar with the term "static mic". The static microphone uses a capacitive membrane; a condensor mic. > Neither dynamic nor condensor (aka capacitor) mics are inherently > fragile at high SPL. This is not the way I understand it. The membrane and it's mounting are fragile in such a manner that too high a volume, or in the extreme, beat-boxing, loud drumming or dropping in on the floor, might brake the mic beyond repair (static mics are most often damaged by accidentally being dropped on the floor). -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From allan_wind at lifeintegrity.com Thu Dec 8 20:43:21 2005 From: allan_wind at lifeintegrity.com (Allan Wind) Date: Thu Dec 8 20:43:29 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051209014321.GB25048@dyndns.org> On 2005-12-08T14:43:24-0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > Anyone intersted in further study could easily discover the U.S. > patent numbers that were originally licensed to NemeSys. (Not Tascam!) Nemesis? :-) /Allan -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051208/cfdbf943/attachment.bin From pw_lists at slinkp.com Thu Dec 8 20:57:56 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Thu Dec 8 20:58:07 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <87ek4n2em0.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <20051208155640.GB9030@slinkp.com> <87ek4n2em0.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: <20051209015755.GA30387@slinkp.com> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 03:23:03AM +0100, Esben Stien wrote: > Paul Winkler writes: > > > I am not familiar with the term "static mic". > > The static microphone uses a capacitive membrane; a condensor mic. Ah, thanks, maybe it's just not a common term in the US. > > Neither dynamic nor condensor (aka capacitor) mics are inherently > > fragile at high SPL. > > This is not the way I understand it. Well, there are plenty of condenser mics that can handle 140 dB SPL without harm or audible distortion. That's extremely loud. Of course it depends on the mic in question, but even my cheap MXL condenser mics are rated at 130 dB at 0.5% THD, which is still much louder than a typical rock concert. Mechanical fragility if you drop it is another question entirely. I wouldn't want to drop one of these cheap MXL mics. Not that they're badly made, but they ARE cheap. Of course, if in doubt, be cautious. I did once try a small-diaphragm Shure SM81 mic close up to a loud bass guitar cabinet. It distorted badly, and we quickly switched to a different mic for fear of damaging it. I am not sure whether the problem was the mic, the preamp, or operator error. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From ross at jose.lug.udel.edu Thu Dec 8 20:58:46 2005 From: ross at jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) Date: Thu Dec 8 20:58:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <87ek4n2em0.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <20051208155640.GB9030@slinkp.com> <87ek4n2em0.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: <20051209015846.GA24535@jose.lug.udel.edu> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 03:23:03AM +0100, Esben Stien wrote: > This is not the way I understand it. The membrane and it's mounting > are fragile in such a manner that too high a volume, or in the > extreme, beat-boxing, loud drumming or dropping in on the floor, might > brake the mic beyond repair (static mics are most often damaged by > accidentally being dropped on the floor). I definitely believe that dropping them would damage them. Not many mics besides an SM57 I'd willingly drop and expect to have them working ::-) But I'll vouch that many condensors are plenty tough with loud stuff! Mine have been through lots of drum tracking, plenty of it clipping! -- Ross Vandegrift ross@lug.udel.edu "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." --St. Augustine, De Genesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37 From pw_lists at slinkp.com Thu Dec 8 21:07:14 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Thu Dec 8 21:07:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051209015846.GA24535@jose.lug.udel.edu> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <20051208155640.GB9030@slinkp.com> <87ek4n2em0.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <20051209015846.GA24535@jose.lug.udel.edu> Message-ID: <20051209020714.GB30387@slinkp.com> On Thu, Dec 08, 2005 at 08:58:46PM -0500, Ross Vandegrift wrote: > On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 03:23:03AM +0100, Esben Stien wrote: > > This is not the way I understand it. The membrane and it's mounting > > are fragile in such a manner that too high a volume, or in the > > extreme, beat-boxing, loud drumming or dropping in on the floor, might > > brake the mic beyond repair (static mics are most often damaged by > > accidentally being dropped on the floor). > > I definitely believe that dropping them would damage them. Not many > mics besides an SM57 I'd willingly drop and expect to have them > working ::-) 15 years ago I dropped an SM57 off a mic stand, six feet onto a wooden porch floor, from which it rolled off the edge into a 20-foot-deep ravine. Found it buried head-down in the ground, carried it back up, dusted it off, plugged it in, and it worked (and still does). The SM58 is similarly legendary. It was Roger Daltrey's preference for a reason. Sennheiser 421 is pretty sturdy too! -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Thu Dec 8 21:22:52 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Thu Dec 8 21:20:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1134094972.4204.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 18:25 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 14:43 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > Anyone intersted in further study could easily discover the U.S. > > patent numbers that were originally licensed to NemeSys. (Not Tascam!) > > If someone cannot do that for themselves then they probably could > > figure out someone who does know the numbers and ask so they could > > read the patents for themselves. > > > > Please note that while I am greatly disappointed that all of this has > > happened I still thinkLS is a really great piece of work and I, for > > one, still have great respect for all the folks that have done this > > work. > > If the issue really is a patent dispute involving a patent that is 1) a AFAIK, it has nothing whatsoever to do with a patent issue. That question does exist for LS, but I do not believe (and I am not certain here) that it is related to the reason for the license change in CVS. --p From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Dec 8 21:42:19 2005 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Thu Dec 8 21:42:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134094972.4204.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134073230.21473.29.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <5bdc1c8b0512081443t7ac132cbg424a0b3dee082c97@mail.gmail.com> <1134084343.6188.40.camel@mindpipe> <1134094972.4204.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1134096139.21473.39.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 21:22 -0500, Paul Davis wrote: > On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 18:25 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 14:43 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > > Anyone intersted in further study could easily discover the U.S. > > > patent numbers that were originally licensed to NemeSys. (Not Tascam!) > > > If someone cannot do that for themselves then they probably could > > > figure out someone who does know the numbers and ask so they could > > > read the patents for themselves. > > > > > > Please note that while I am greatly disappointed that all of this has > > > happened I still thinkLS is a really great piece of work and I, for > > > one, still have great respect for all the folks that have done this > > > work. > > > > If the issue really is a patent dispute involving a patent that is 1) a > > AFAIK, it has nothing whatsoever to do with a patent issue. That > question does exist for LS, but I do not believe (and I am not certain > here) that it is related to the reason for the license change in CVS. In CVS a while back, I suppose. AFAIK all 0.3.x (x >= 1) tarballs have the same non-GPL license. -- Fernando From salvuz_78 at virgilio.it Thu Dec 8 22:13:20 2005 From: salvuz_78 at virgilio.it (Salvatore Di Pietro) Date: Thu Dec 8 22:13:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Synching & triggering w/ Hydrogen In-Reply-To: References: <43984AB5.4090308@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <4398F650.4030309@virgilio.it> Reuben Martin wrote: > It will start and stop with the transport, but it will not follow > tempo changes. The developer claims that the Jack Transport is broken > somehow with respect to tempo changes. > > http://www.hydrogen-music.org/forum/?action=show_thread&thread=274&fid=2&page=1 > > -Reuben Well... As of Hydrogen 0.9.2, to re-enable tempo-changes awareness, I just uncommented the block that reads "TickSize and BPM..." in /src/lib/drivers/JackDriver.cpp. Rebuild and you're set. Or at least, for me it works. Dunno why it is commented out, it used to work in the past IIRC... -- salvuz POST FATA RESVRGO Linux registered user #291700 | machine #174619 get counted on ---> http://counter.li.org/ <--- From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Thu Dec 8 22:21:37 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Thu Dec 8 22:22:17 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051209015755.GA30387@slinkp.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <20051207214213.GA17509@jose.lug.udel.edu> <87y82wvvil.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <20051208155640.GB9030@slinkp.com> <87ek4n2em0.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> <20051209015755.GA30387@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <1134098497.3194.4.camel@eviltwin> On Thu, 2005-12-08 at 20:57 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 03:23:03AM +0100, Esben Stien wrote: > > Paul Winkler writes: > > > > > I am not familiar with the term "static mic". > > > > The static microphone uses a capacitive membrane; a condensor mic. > > Ah, thanks, maybe it's just not a common term in the US. > > > > Neither dynamic nor condensor (aka capacitor) mics are inherently > > > fragile at high SPL. > > > > This is not the way I understand it. > > Well, there are plenty of condenser mics that can handle 140 dB SPL > without harm or audible distortion. That's extremely loud. Of course it > depends on the mic in question, but even my cheap MXL condenser mics are > rated at 130 dB at 0.5% THD, which is still much louder than a typical > rock concert. > > Mechanical fragility if you drop it is another question entirely. > I wouldn't want to drop one of these cheap MXL mics. Not that > they're badly made, but they ARE cheap. > OT - I recently purchased a Rode S1 condenser mic. It's mostly for stage use although it works great for instruments in the studio. Rode guarantees it for 5 years no matter what happens to it - you can beat it to death with a hammer if you want. Anyway, about the third gig I used it some drunk staggered up to the stage during a break and knocked my mic stand over. The mic hit the floor from about 6 feet up directly on the ball. It sounded like someone fired a cannon. Didn't do a single bit of damage to the mic other than denting the screen just slightly. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From loki.davison at gmail.com Thu Dec 8 23:43:38 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Thu Dec 8 23:43:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/9/05, Pete Leigh wrote: > On 08/12/05, Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > > > 8) about 5 seconds (held untill the end of the sample, although barely > > audible towards the end) into the sniplet a rising sound, resembling a a > > wind chime is heard. > > That's the one my reply was about, I think - synthetic wind chime is > a good description.. > > Still sounds like an FM sound to me - modulating one > or more oscs with one or more others at a more or less > harmonically related audio frequency, then lots of reverb. > > There is a slower modulation going on in there too - might > be envelopes or lfo modulated vcas on the modulating oscillators > working to change the timbre. > > I associate it more with FM synths like DX7, etc., than analog. > > That'd be my guess anyway. > > My summary still holds, however my roland MKS7, an analog synth has a preset that sounds a lot like that, so it is doable with analog gear as well. Ring mod is a good bet for that sound, though hard to get the right freqs. From bwanab+lau at juraview.com Fri Dec 9 05:58:49 2005 From: bwanab+lau at juraview.com (Bill Allen) Date: Fri Dec 9 05:58:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512081841.20410.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <200512081447.01188.versuchsanstalt@gmx.de> <4398532D.5040506@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512081841.20410.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> Message-ID: <43996369.9080304@juraview.com> Nigel Henry wrote: > >This is an interesting comment. I find the same when I record speech onto, for >instance a cassette recorder. I have an accent coming from the Channel >Islands, but don't notice it when I speak. But playing back my recorded voice >is very evident. It may have something to do with the very positive feedback >you get to the brain when you speak or sing, whether your monitoring your >singing/speech with or without headphones. Whereas, when you listen to >yourself after making a recording, your brain is not receiving positive >feedback from your voice. Your brain through your ears is sort of hearing >these sounds for the first time, from another location, and also some delay >involved between the recording and the playback. Of course the other quite >strange behaviour is, when you are listening to music through the headphones >and speak to someone at the same time, you actually speak louder without >realising it, indicating again that the brain, by virtue of positive feedback >from your voice is controlling the level of your voice. A problem noticeable >with folks who have become hearing impaired, or totally deaf. There's >obviously a lot of stuff going on that you don't know about when you sing. >It's only when you listen to the recording that you become aware of it. > >Think Karaoke, and you've had a few too many. What would that sound like the >next day. (That was just for fun). It's been great reading this thread. >Nigel. > > I've read before that a good part of the reason that we don't hear ourselves as others do is literally because we don't hear ourselves as others do - others perceive our voice directly from mouth to ear. When you speak, you hear yourself primarily through your skull and only secondarily through your ear. It gives a completely false impression. I play the sax and that has the same effect and maybe even stronger due to the hard grip of the teeth on the mouthpiece. I always prefer to monitor through headphones so I can hear the sound as others will hear it. Regards, Bill From bwanab+lau at juraview.com Fri Dec 9 06:11:27 2005 From: bwanab+lau at juraview.com (Bill Allen) Date: Fri Dec 9 06:11:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Where to put your plugins Message-ID: <4399665F.7080207@juraview.com> Another question that might be generic, but I'm asking specifically in the case of ardour. Why does one choose to put which plugins pre-fader or post-fader. In other words, which plugins work best pre-fader and which work best post-fader? Are there general rules that one can apply? For example I would think that compression should be pre-fader since it wouldn't seem to make sense to be compressing after you've set levels. Bill From arnold.krille at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 06:29:16 2005 From: arnold.krille at gmail.com (Arnold Krille) Date: Fri Dec 9 06:29:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Where to put your plugins In-Reply-To: <4399665F.7080207@juraview.com> References: <4399665F.7080207@juraview.com> Message-ID: <2def88b80512090329h26291882g@mail.gmail.com> 2005/12/9, Bill Allen : > Another question that might be generic, but I'm asking specifically in > the case of ardour. Why does one choose to put which plugins pre-fader > or post-fader. In other words, which plugins work best pre-fader and > which work best post-fader? Are there general rules that one can apply? > For example I would think that compression should be pre-fader since it > wouldn't seem to make sense to be compressing after you've set levels. As far as I know: Plugins that modify the original sound and where you (possibly) don't want the original sound to be still there are put pre-fader, everything else post-fader. Classic setup seems to be: - pre-fader: Gates, Compressors, basicly any kind of dynamics, EQ's, Chorus/Flanger/etc, DeEsser, Denoiser, some delays, send to monitor - post-fader: (either as one effect per channel or send-to-bus) Reverb, Delay, some choruses... For example the Jamin-insert in my setup is always pre-fader in the master-channel... But there is an even bigger rule than the things listed above: If it sounds right, its right! Keep on rocking, Arnold -- visit http://dillenburg.dyndns.org/~arnold/ --- Wenn man mit Raubkopien Bands wie Brosis oder Britney Spears wirklich verhindern k?nnte, w?rde ich mir noch heute einen Stapel Brenner und einen Sack Rohlinge kaufen. From carotinobg at yahoo.it Fri Dec 9 07:40:36 2005 From: carotinobg at yahoo.it (Carotinho) Date: Fri Dec 9 07:38:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512081841.20410.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <4398532D.5040506@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512081841.20410.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> Message-ID: <200512091340.37053.carotinobg@yahoo.it> Hi! > It may have something to do with the very positive > feedback you get to the brain when you speak or sing, whether your > monitoring your singing/speech with or without headphones. Maybe, but mainly the reason is another: the ears' inner tubes connects the external ear to the jaw, which is a very rigid bone. So, when you speak, you hear also the voice resonating inside your mouth. Actually, a trick for singers who are not accostumed to this difference between the perception of theri own voice, is to let them hear the recording at a very high sound pressure, so that the sound waves hit the jaw and make it resonating. Byez! Carotinho ___________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger: chiamate gratuite in tutto il mondo http://it.messenger.yahoo.com From v2 at iki.fi Fri Dec 9 08:27:48 2005 From: v2 at iki.fi (Sampo Savolainen) Date: Fri Dec 9 08:27:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Where to put your plugins Message-ID: <1134134868.4399865414e9f@www2.helsinki.fi> Quoting Bill Allen : > Another question that might be generic, but I'm asking specifically in > the case of ardour. Why does one choose to put which plugins pre-fader > or post-fader. In other words, which plugins work best pre-fader and > which work best post-fader? Are there general rules that one can apply? > For example I would think that compression should be pre-fader since it > wouldn't seem to make sense to be compressing after you've set levels. You put the plugins pre-fader which you don't want the gain setting of that track/bus to have an affect on. Say you create a really tight gate on a snare which perfectly lets all snare hits pass but silence everything else. Then you mix the rest of the song and suddenly feel that the snare is too loud, and turn the gain down. Suddenly you are missing snare hits as the gate is fed a lower signal than originally. If you have a send from a track to a rever bus. You will most probably want the send post-fader, so that the amount of signal sent to the reverb is relative to the gain on the track. Sampo From core at jacklab.net Fri Dec 9 10:44:11 2005 From: core at jacklab.net (Michael Bohle) Date: Fri Dec 9 10:44:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Who has experiences with PAM? Message-ID: <1134143051.6201.1.camel@jacklab.metanet> I am looking for users and developers which deal with audio RT kernel items. I used RT-LSM till now to regulate the user audio rights. http://www.opensuse.org/index.php/RT_Kernel_Instructions It is all about that openSUSE contains an audio distribution. www.opensuse.org/JackLab - www.jacklab.net This requires a SUSE-kernel according to the standard, which is patched for "rt full preemt". This Kernel will be available in our apt4rpm-repository at gwdg.de. Takashi Iwai and Matthias Nargorni has made clear to me, that RT-LSM is obsolent and PAM should be used instead. In addition, PAM is already available in the current SUSE Kernel. Who has experiences with PAM for SCHED_FIFO priorities ? Who could help to arrange dealing with PAM and RT for musicians? In generally, who can help to tune up the suse standard kernel to audio rt ? Finaly there will be a very userfriendly audio distribution based on openSUSE. Regards, Michael From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Fri Dec 9 11:36:15 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Fri Dec 9 11:19:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] new songs on-line Message-ID: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> Greetings: I've put two new recordings on-line: http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. I've also revised and updated this page: http://linux-sound.org/ardour-music.html I've removed two pieces from that page and added the new songs. I've also updated the other Ogg files on the site, they've been remixed in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. Blessings upon the heads of all Linux audio software developers ! :) I hope you enjoy the new material. It's Over is an original (and has been linked on the LAM site), Tomorrow Night is my rendition of a ballad by Lonnie Johnson. Comments and constructive criticisms are always welcome. Best, dp From x at branwelt.de Fri Dec 9 11:20:26 2005 From: x at branwelt.de (Emanuel Rumpf) Date: Fri Dec 9 11:22:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Who has experiences with PAM? In-Reply-To: <1134143051.6201.1.camel@jacklab.metanet> References: <1134143051.6201.1.camel@jacklab.metanet> Message-ID: <4399AECA.9090804@branwelt.de> Michael Bohle wrote: >Who has experiences with PAM for SCHED_FIFO priorities ? > > I have not much experience with PAM, but found this page that could be helpfull. regards, emanuel http://alsa.opensrc.org/RealtimeKernelAndPAM From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Fri Dec 9 11:36:15 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Fri Dec 9 11:32:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] [ardour-users] new songs on-line Message-ID: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> Greetings: I've put two new recordings on-line: http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. I've also revised and updated this page: http://linux-sound.org/ardour-music.html I've removed two pieces from that page and added the new songs. I've also updated the other Ogg files on the site, they've been remixed in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. Blessings upon the heads of all Linux audio software developers ! :) I hope you enjoy the new material. It's Over is an original (and has been linked on the LAM site), Tomorrow Night is my rendition of a ballad by Lonnie Johnson. Comments and constructive criticisms are always welcome. Best, dp _______________________________________________ ardour-users mailing list ardour-users@lists.ardour.org http://lists.ardour.org/listinfo.cgi/ardour-users-ardour.org This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. From pw_lists at slinkp.com Fri Dec 9 11:40:33 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Fri Dec 9 11:40:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Oscilloscope with XY measurement? (Lissajous patterns) Message-ID: <20051209164033.GB8696@slinkp.com> Hi, I'm wondering if there's a Jack-capable oscilloscope app anywhere that can show 2 inputs in XY mode? so you can see lissajous patterns? like on this page: http://oscilloscope-tutorials.com/Oscilloscope/meastech.asp thanks! -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From roberts.noah at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 12:09:42 2005 From: roberts.noah at gmail.com (Noah Roberts) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:09:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Who has experiences with PAM? In-Reply-To: <4399AECA.9090804@branwelt.de> References: <1134143051.6201.1.camel@jacklab.metanet> <4399AECA.9090804@branwelt.de> Message-ID: <567aa5f60512090909w2b6038fjc80d94bb4f1645a7@mail.gmail.com> On 12/9/05, Emanuel Rumpf wrote: > > Michael Bohle wrote: > > >Who has experiences with PAM for SCHED_FIFO priorities ? > > > > > I have not much experience with PAM, but found this page that could be > helpfull. regards, emanuel > http://alsa.opensrc.org/RealtimeKernelAndPAM I had trouble getting the pam patch too. I think I have it in my entry for the Asus A6U laptop in gentoo-wiki.com - but I can't get there right now. From pw_lists at slinkp.com Fri Dec 9 12:27:25 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:27:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > Greetings: > > I've put two new recordings on-line: > > http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg > > http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg > > Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. Great stuff as always, Dave. One criticism - get a mic for that guitar! That piezo sound always bothers me :) -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From pw_lists at slinkp.com Fri Dec 9 12:27:25 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:33:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > Greetings: > > I've put two new recordings on-line: > > http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg > > http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg > > Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. Great stuff as always, Dave. One criticism - get a mic for that guitar! That piezo sound always bothers me :) -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com _______________________________________________ ardour-users mailing list ardour-users@lists.ardour.org http://lists.ardour.org/listinfo.cgi/ardour-users-ardour.org This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. From S.W.Harris at ecs.soton.ac.uk Fri Dec 9 12:42:57 2005 From: S.W.Harris at ecs.soton.ac.uk (Steve Harris) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:43:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Oscilloscope with XY measurement? (Lissajous patterns) In-Reply-To: <20051209164033.GB8696@slinkp.com> References: <20051209164033.GB8696@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <20051209174257.GA3747@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:40:33 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > Hi, > > I'm wondering if there's a Jack-capable oscilloscope app > anywhere that can show 2 inputs in XY mode? so you can > see lissajous patterns? > like on this page: > > http://oscilloscope-tutorials.com/Oscilloscope/meastech.asp That's what meterbridge's jellyfish meter does: http://plugin.org.uk/meterbridge/jf.png Though its rotated through 45degrees to make it easier to read audio problems with it. Unrotating it and/or reducing the fade time would be easy hacks. - Steve From tito at rumford.de Fri Dec 9 12:41:20 2005 From: tito at rumford.de (Wolfgang Woehl) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:44:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051209020714.GB30387@slinkp.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <20051209015846.GA24535@jose.lug.udel.edu> <20051209020714.GB30387@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <200512091841.20285.tito@rumford.de> Paul Winkler : > 15 years ago I dropped an SM57 off a mic stand, six feet onto a > wooden porch floor, from which it rolled off the edge into a > 20-foot-deep ravine. Found it buried head-down in the ground, > carried it back up, dusted it off, plugged it in, and it worked (and > still does). And the SM57 still thinking "Do *that* again". It should get a pension for the stunt. Hey Paul, that recording of "Don't get sad" was beautiful. Good vocal sound :) Can she sing! Wolfgang From fbar at footils.org Fri Dec 9 12:58:18 2005 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri Dec 9 12:58:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Oscilloscope with XY measurement? (Lissajous patterns) In-Reply-To: <20051209174257.GA3747@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> References: <20051209164033.GB8696@slinkp.com> <20051209174257.GA3747@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Message-ID: <20051209175818.GX10369@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Steve Harris hat gesagt: // Steve Harris wrote: > On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:40:33 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > > I'm wondering if there's a Jack-capable oscilloscope app > > anywhere that can show 2 inputs in XY mode? so you can > > see lissajous patterns? > > like on this page: > > > > http://oscilloscope-tutorials.com/Oscilloscope/meastech.asp > > That's what meterbridge's jellyfish meter does: > http://plugin.org.uk/meterbridge/jf.png Rezound, the editor, has one, too. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__ From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Fri Dec 9 13:26:39 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Fri Dec 9 13:09:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <4399CC5F.2020101@woh.rr.com> Paul Winkler wrote: >On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > > >>Greetings: >> >> I've put two new recordings on-line: >> >> http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg >> >> http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg >> >> Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. >> >> > >Great stuff as always, Dave. >One criticism - get a mic for that guitar! >That piezo sound always bothers me :) > > > It *is* a crappy sound, isn't it ? I think of it as the OPL3 of electroacoustics. :) Well, a decent instrument costs more dinero than I ever have at any given time. Ditto for a decent mic. The guitar sounds just as bad through one of my mics anyway, it's a real POS. I'm still on the lookout for a good preamp. I'm considering an M-Audio Omni I/O box, waiting for a great deal to show up on eBay. Maybe that could help the sound of the guitar too ? As always, thanks for lending your ears, Paul. Btw, I loved Abby's voice on the track you posted recently, she's an excellent singer, recorded nicely. Best, dp From t_w_ at freenet.de Fri Dec 9 13:19:18 2005 From: t_w_ at freenet.de (Thorsten Wilms) Date: Fri Dec 9 13:19:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20051209181918.GB15524@charly.SWORD> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > Greetings: > > I've put two new recordings on-line: > > http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg Great Vocals, just right. There's some strange stereo issue with the guitar, it seems to jump to one side at times. The guitar sound is a bit overly sharp (maybe this is the piezo sound ... ain't got a clue about guitars), but the playing is all fine. The drum-programming is quite good, the sounds are too ... uhm ... compact and lack room, I think. Dave, I would love trying to program a different style of beats to a drumless version of this, so I would be pleased if you would make such a mix available and give allowance :) > http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg Just not in the mood to get into this one, but it's solid quality for sure. Thanks for sharing! --- Thorsten Wilms From jh at brainiac.com Fri Dec 9 13:41:07 2005 From: jh at brainiac.com (Joe Hartley) Date: Fri Dec 9 13:41:17 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <4399CC5F.2020101@woh.rr.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> <4399CC5F.2020101@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20051209134107.709f680d.jh@brainiac.com> On Fri, 09 Dec 2005 13:26:39 -0500 Dave Phillips wrote: > I'm still on the lookout for a good preamp. I'm considering an M-Audio > Omni I/O box, waiting for a great deal to show up on eBay. Maybe that > could help the sound of the guitar too ? I was always very pleased with the preamps in the M-Audio Omni back when I had the Delta 66. I'm saving up to get a RNP (Really Nice Preamp) from FMR Audio. I'd have had it already, but I got sidetracked by this l'il number: http://m-audio.com/products/en_us/MicroTrack2496-main.html (It was $100 off at Banjo Center recently.) It's worked flawlessly with Linux so far, mounting as a USB drive and allowing easy file transfers. I take it on its first outing for a field recording tonight. -- ====================================================================== Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh@brainiac.com Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa From tito at rumford.de Fri Dec 9 13:46:33 2005 From: tito at rumford.de (Wolfgang Woehl) Date: Fri Dec 9 13:46:29 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve In-Reply-To: <200512090231.16924@goldspace.net> References: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> <1134068078.21473.18.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <200512090231.16924@goldspace.net> Message-ID: <200512091946.33572.tito@rumford.de> Andrew, current edition of the german computer magazine "c't" has an article on virtual spatialization. They mention "Dolby headphone (tm)" and another effort by Creative (makers of the soundblaster stuff). What they say about results perfectly dampens any higher expectations. Reading the thing makes me doubt that simply convolving with a room response would do what you want. "Kunstkopf", a very old technique, might be worth googling for. And in the back of my mind there's a faint note about David R. Clark (davidrclark@earthlink.net) knowing things about headphone spatialization. He used to be on LAU. Wolfgang From ninjadroid at gazuga.net Fri Dec 9 14:12:12 2005 From: ninjadroid at gazuga.net (Pete Bessman) Date: Fri Dec 9 14:12:24 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1134155533.9906.60.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 19:05 -0500, Allan Wind wrote: > Yep. Alternatives? Depends on your needs. SimSam (http://simsam.sf.net) and Specimen (http://gazuga.net) are both samplers, but they're not designed for Gig file importation et al, nor do they have client-server separation. Both are GPL'd. If you need drum machine functionality, Hydrogen (http://hydrogen- music.org) is the cat's meow. But as far as huge, multi-sample instruments goes, I don't think there is a replacement (although I intend to add that functionality to Specimen in, y'know, "The Future"). -- Pete Bessman http://gazuga.net "So this baby seal walks into a club." From burkhard.ritter at stud-mail.uni-wuerzburg.de Fri Dec 9 14:12:19 2005 From: burkhard.ritter at stud-mail.uni-wuerzburg.de (Burkhard Ritter) Date: Fri Dec 9 14:12:34 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Who has experiences with PAM? In-Reply-To: <1134143051.6201.1.camel@jacklab.metanet> References: <1134143051.6201.1.camel@jacklab.metanet> Message-ID: <20051209191218.GA3978@muh> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 04:44:11PM +0100, Michael Bohle wrote: > I am looking for users and developers which deal with audio RT kernel > items. I used RT-LSM till now to regulate the user audio rights. > http://www.opensuse.org/index.php/RT_Kernel_Instructions > > It is all about that openSUSE contains an audio distribution. > www.opensuse.org/JackLab - www.jacklab.net > This requires a SUSE-kernel according to the standard, which is patched > for "rt full preemt". This Kernel will be available in our > apt4rpm-repository at gwdg.de. > > Takashi Iwai and Matthias Nargorni has made clear to me, that RT-LSM is > obsolent and PAM should be used instead. In addition, PAM is already > available in the current SUSE Kernel. > > Who has experiences with PAM for SCHED_FIFO priorities ? > Who could help to arrange dealing with PAM and RT for musicians? > In generally, who can help to tune up the suse standard kernel to audio > rt ? > > Finaly there will be a very userfriendly audio distribution based on > openSUSE. > > Regards, > Michael > If you are using a recent kernel (>=2.6.12) and a recent pam-package (>=0.80) then, if I am right, everything sould already be working. You would adjust the limits.conf to contain something like @audio - rtprio 100 @audio - nice -10 @audio - memlock 4000000 Thus the group audio could run programs with realtime privileges. Note, that I myself still use an older patched pam version (apparently "rt_priority" changed to "rtprio") and therefore have not tested the above suggestions. If the suse-pam-package is too old, it would eventually be easier to build a new one (>=0.80) than to patch the old. Hope that help, Burkhard From ninjadroid at gazuga.net Fri Dec 9 14:14:20 2005 From: ninjadroid at gazuga.net (Pete Bessman) Date: Fri Dec 9 14:14:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> Message-ID: <1134155660.9906.62.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 19:05 -0500, Allan Wind wrote: > Yep. Alternatives? Oh, and there's also Chionic (http://www.reduz.com.ar/chionic/). I haven't looked at it much, but it might do what you need. It's written by the same guy who did CheeseTracker, and even uses the same underlying engine, so you can be assured that it's quality. -- Pete Bessman http://gazuga.net "So this baby seal walks into a club." From ninjadroid at gazuga.net Fri Dec 9 14:19:56 2005 From: ninjadroid at gazuga.net (Pete Bessman) Date: Fri Dec 9 14:19:59 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512071741l75526bf5x91e57e2ee48b33a5@mail.gmail.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <20051207062427.310fb34d.jh@brainiac.com> <1133984995.17901.49.camel@mindpipe> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071251p4e569711vedbedd40ffe7e362@mail.gmail.com> <1133990481.957.3.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071338y1e342228vefbbb5aeeec1ce2c@mail.gmail.com> <1133994512.957.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071541l4a4ea2e8h9373e16103616727@mail.gmail.com> <1134000909.957.26.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071741l75526bf5x91e57e2ee48b33a5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134155996.9906.64.camel@localhost.localdomain> http://gazuga.net/stuph/00030578.jpg Longest. Thread. Ever. ;-) -- Pete Bessman http://gazuga.net "So this baby seal walks into a club." From steiner at block4.com Fri Dec 9 14:36:46 2005 From: steiner at block4.com (Malte Steiner) Date: Fri Dec 9 14:36:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] UA-100 Message-ID: <4399DCCE.6080606@block4.com> Hello, did anyone still have a Roland/Edirol UA-100 running under Linux? Its recognized as Alsa device and Jack also has it available but as soon as I started to use audio on it a heavy digital feedback built up, which sounds interesting but is artisticly pretty limited over a while. There are some OSS drivers and editor software but they fail for me to compile for a rather recent Kernel (2.6.12-686). Of course UA-100 runs fine under Windows XP on the same computer. I tried to run the editor for it with WINE but it can't see it. Thanks for any help, Malte -- Malte Steiner media art + development -www.block4.com- From creisor at gmail.com Fri Dec 9 14:56:33 2005 From: creisor at gmail.com (Chris Reisor) Date: Fri Dec 9 14:56:39 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <43974C03.2030304@chapelperilous.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133898450.29084.20.camel@mindpipe> <1133937284.7030.1.camel@eviltwin> <1133984872.17901.47.camel@mindpipe> <43974082.8030801@chapelperilous.net> <1133987843.17901.63.camel@mindpipe> <43974C03.2030304@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <3e1f2d940512091156m361b2e32uc038c94156c53ae3@mail.gmail.com> On 12/7/05, Brett McCoy wrote: > Lee Revell wrote: > > >>I'm not sure I've heard this effect... what other songs have used it? > > > > > > The most obnoxious, in your face example I have heard recently is this > > R&B tune, "I'm Sprung". Check gnutella or turn on MTV for 5 minutes. > > I found it... very annoying effect. I think that's the same thing used > on that one Audioslave song near the end... it's like someone is using a > whammy bar on the voice > > -- Brett > On the other hand, Imogen Heap's vocoder-heavy (I think) "Hide and Seek" makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand straight up. Anybody know what she's doing there? From bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk Fri Dec 9 15:23:16 2005 From: bungee at erodin.demon.co.uk (Bungee) Date: Fri Dec 9 15:23:16 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve In-Reply-To: <200512091946.33572.tito@rumford.de> References: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> <1134068078.21473.18.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <200512090231.16924@goldspace.net> <200512091946.33572.tito@rumford.de> Message-ID: Wolfgang Woehl wrote: > Andrew, current edition of the german computer magazine "c't" has an > article on virtual spatialization. They mention "Dolby headphone (tm)" > and another effort by Creative (makers of the soundblaster stuff). What > they say about results perfectly dampens any higher expectations. > > Reading the thing makes me doubt that simply convolving with a room > response would do what you want. "Kunstkopf", a very old technique, > might be worth googling for. And in the back of my mind there's a faint > note about David R. Clark (davidrclark@earthlink.net) knowing things > about headphone spatialization. He used to be on LAU. > > Wolfgang I don't know if this helps in anyway but I remeber reading some articles in the late 70s for 'real world' headphone drive circuits. One issue was that phones don't allow the normal leakage to both ears at middle and low frequencies like loudspeakers do. The suggested solution to this was resistors in series with both channels and an inductor from one to the other so that at low frequenceis the channels were effectively joined, becoming more separated at higher frequencies. There was also a lot of discussion surrounding this about phase differences etc. based on the different path lengths being about 8 inches. There was some very heavy stuff! For what was termed as expanding the stereo picture (which is what I think th OP is talking about) it was suggested that transformers be used to inject a small ANTIPHASE percentage of the R into the L channel and vice-versa. I vaugely remember someone producing a drawing (wireless world?) that combined these features with variable controls. The one that made me laugh was 'head density' Presumably, with the appropriate filters these ideas should be possible in software. -- Bungee From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Fri Dec 9 15:31:16 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Fri Dec 9 15:32:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <4399CC5F.2020101@woh.rr.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> <4399CC5F.2020101@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <4399E994.9040601@walescomputers.co.uk> Hi RE the mics Have a listen to 'Hold back the tide' here. http://www.projectoverseer.biz/music/bands/92/music.php If you like the acoustic sound let me know, before you start buying pre amps. Cheers Bob Dave Phillips wrote: > Paul Winkler wrote: > >> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: >> >> >>> Greetings: >>> >>> I've put two new recordings on-line: >>> >>> http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg >>> >>> http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg >>> >>> Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. >>> >> >> >> Great stuff as always, Dave. >> One criticism - get a mic for that guitar! >> That piezo sound always bothers me :) >> >> >> > It *is* a crappy sound, isn't it ? I think of it as the OPL3 of > electroacoustics. :) > > Well, a decent instrument costs more dinero than I ever have at any > given time. Ditto for a decent mic. The guitar sounds just as bad > through one of my mics anyway, it's a real POS. > > I'm still on the lookout for a good preamp. I'm considering an M-Audio > Omni I/O box, waiting for a great deal to show up on eBay. Maybe that > could help the sound of the guitar too ? > > As always, thanks for lending your ears, Paul. Btw, I loved Abby's voice > on the track you posted recently, she's an excellent singer, recorded > nicely. > > Best, > > dp > > From pw_lists at slinkp.com Fri Dec 9 15:35:53 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Fri Dec 9 15:35:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Oscilloscope with XY measurement? (Lissajous patterns) In-Reply-To: <20051209174257.GA3747@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> References: <20051209164033.GB8696@slinkp.com> <20051209174257.GA3747@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk> Message-ID: <20051209203553.GB29655@slinkp.com> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 05:42:57PM +0000, Steve Harris wrote: > On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:40:33 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > > Hi, > > > > I'm wondering if there's a Jack-capable oscilloscope app > > anywhere that can show 2 inputs in XY mode? so you can > > see lissajous patterns? > > like on this page: > > > > http://oscilloscope-tutorials.com/Oscilloscope/meastech.asp > > That's what meterbridge's jellyfish meter does: > http://plugin.org.uk/meterbridge/jf.png Sweet! Perfect, thanks. > Though its rotated through 45degrees to make it easier to read audio > problems with it. > > Unrotating it and/or reducing the fade time would be easy hacks. Fade time might be nice to configure, but the rotation is fine as-is IMO. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From pw_lists at slinkp.com Fri Dec 9 16:15:56 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Fri Dec 9 16:16:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <4399E994.9040601@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> <4399CC5F.2020101@woh.rr.com> <4399E994.9040601@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <20051209211556.GD29655@slinkp.com> On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 08:31:16PM +0000, studio-64 wrote: > Hi RE the mics > Have a listen to 'Hold back the tide' here. > > http://www.projectoverseer.biz/music/bands/92/music.php > > If you like the acoustic sound let me know, > before you start buying pre amps. I dig it. Great guitar sound. In fact good sound all around. There's some kinda really really high, almost ultrasonic thing going on with the vocals though. An almost subliminal whine that is a little bit irritating. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Fri Dec 9 16:53:18 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Fri Dec 9 16:53:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <20051209211556.GD29655@slinkp.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> <4399CC5F.2020101@woh.rr.com> <4399E994.9040601@walescomputers.co.uk> <20051209211556.GD29655@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <4399FCCE.7080404@walescomputers.co.uk> Hi Paul I'll check out the Wav file first thing and see if it's on there. If not it must be the encoding on the site, Mp3 thing, (I've been using Ogg mostly and will sort it out with them) I used two Behringer B-5 Mics into the DDX with Phamtom and into Ardour. (yep I was sat at the desk reaching over the guitar!!) Got to say I was impressed by the sound I got, hopefully things will be better when I get the studio built! Cheers For the comments Bob Paul Winkler wrote: > On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 08:31:16PM +0000, studio-64 wrote: > >>Hi RE the mics >>Have a listen to 'Hold back the tide' here. >> >>http://www.projectoverseer.biz/music/bands/92/music.php >> >>If you like the acoustic sound let me know, >>before you start buying pre amps. > > > I dig it. Great guitar sound. In fact good sound all around. > > There's some kinda really really high, almost ultrasonic thing > going on with the vocals though. An almost subliminal whine > that is a little bit irritating. > From m_nels at gmx.net Fri Dec 9 17:11:47 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Fri Dec 9 17:11:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <4398AEEA.4030702@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <4397ED70.7070306@gmail.com> <20051208091701.GB3013@phlunky.Belkin> <439803EA.7000401@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> <4398A70C.9000707@gmx.net> <4398AEEA.4030702@gmail.com> Message-ID: <439A0123.2060304@gmx.net> Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Michael T D Nelson wrote: >> I'm afraid I don't really have a better answer. Are you sure it's >> synthesised? > > Yes! Sorry, I actually thought I'd deleted that sentence from my post. I gave the sound a better listen half-way through writing the post. It is indeed obviously synthesised. It's a cool sound. Michael From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Fri Dec 9 19:45:45 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Fri Dec 9 19:29:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <20051209181918.GB15524@charly.SWORD> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209181918.GB15524@charly.SWORD> Message-ID: <439A2539.4030402@woh.rr.com> Thorsten Wilms wrote: >On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > > >>Greetings: >> >> I've put two new recordings on-line: >> >> http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg >> >> > >Great Vocals, just right. >There's some strange stereo issue with the guitar, it seems to >jump to one side at times. The guitar sound is a bit overly >sharp (maybe this is the piezo sound ... ain't got a clue about >guitars), but the playing is all fine. > > Hi Thorsten: Thanks for listening and for your comments. I agree with Paul W re: the guitar sound, but I also think it's just hopeless with or without the electronics. It's a cutaway acoustic, not a solid top, so its un-amp'd sound is as cheesy as its electronically enhanced sound. >The drum-programming is quite good, the sounds are too ... uhm >... compact and lack room, I think. > > MIDI drums, via the default 8MB soundfont for the SBLive. I'm one of the laziest musicians on the planet. >Dave, I would love trying to program a different style of beats >to a drumless version of this, so I would be pleased if you >would make such a mix available and give allowance :) > > > I'd like to try this sort of thing. I'll rework it this weekend and will let you know when/where it's available. >> http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg >> >> > >Just not in the mood to get into this one, but it's solid >quality for sure. > > Well, this kind of tune is an acquired taste. It's one of my Mom's favorite's, and Christmas is coming soon, so I must keep Mom happy. ;-) Thank you for listening to my stuff. We'll try the collaboration, it'll be fun. Best, dp > >Thanks for sharing! > >--- >Thorsten Wilms > > > From kwsml at rogers.com Fri Dec 9 22:15:00 2005 From: kwsml at rogers.com (Kevin Street) Date: Fri Dec 9 22:15:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> References: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> Message-ID: <439A4834.10904@rogers.com> Martin McCormick wrote: > How does one read the MCM number and any other non-audio data > from a music CD? I want to build a MP3 server for our house and > definitely do not want to manually enter data from the art work in the > CD box. ... > I am home-brewing this server which will probably end up being > a collection of shell scripts and C applications written by me but I > realized that I wasn't sure how to let the CD's own data speak for > themselves. I see you've got lots of answers on how to rip and get the cd info out of the online databases. For the mp3 server part you might want to look at slimserver. http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_features.html It's designed for the slim devices hardware players (which are excellent) but the server itself is open source and works with any streaming software player as well. Works great on Linux. From camro15 at gmx.de Fri Dec 9 22:29:05 2005 From: camro15 at gmx.de (Marco =?iso-8859-1?q?Schaffh=F6fer?=) Date: Fri Dec 9 22:32:17 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] M-Audio Audiophile 192 In-Reply-To: <4389FE41.8070705@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <4389FE41.8070705@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <200512100429.05490@plasmon.prima.de> Hello list, I'm using Linux (Red Hat 9, Fedora Core) for several years and I'm reading this list for some time, but I have no experience in using Linux audio yet. So I am looking for a reliable soundcard, which could be used as a midi-controlled softwaresyntesizer, looking forward to making my first steps as a LAU :-) The M-Audio Audiophile soundcards seemed to be an appropriate choice. Am Sonntag 27 November 2005 19:43 schrieb studio-64: > HI > Yes > Envy24controll can access the card for Linux. > I use it with Agnula. But Ctirad answered that the Audiophile 192 is not supported by Alsa. So, who is wrong? Looking on the ALSA pages, it seems that Ctirad is right. On the other hand, M-Audio states that ALSA is supporting the "Audiophile" without distinguishing between both cards. As I am to make a decision between the "2496" and the "192" too, I would be glad if someone could clarify this point. Who has an Audiophile 192 running? Moreover I would like to know the differences between both cards (except from the sampling rate). Are there any benefits using the Audiophile 192 compared to the 2496? TIA Marco From tito at rumford.de Sat Dec 10 05:28:34 2005 From: tito at rumford.de (Wolfgang Woehl) Date: Sat Dec 10 05:29:41 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <3e1f2d940512091156m361b2e32uc038c94156c53ae3@mail.gmail.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43974C03.2030304@chapelperilous.net> <3e1f2d940512091156m361b2e32uc038c94156c53ae3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512101128.34605.tito@rumford.de> Chris Reisor : > On the other hand, Imogen Heap's vocoder-heavy (I think) "Hide and > Seek" makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand straight up. > Anybody know what she's doing there? Sounds like basically rocking it out on a Melodyne canvas. With Melodyne you can mousegrab pitch, formants etc. It makes what you could do with a vocoder too very accessible. Hell, I wish she had just sung it. Wolfgang From jmstone at dsl.pipex.com Sat Dec 10 09:38:52 2005 From: jmstone at dsl.pipex.com (James Stone) Date: Sat Dec 10 09:41:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <20051208122531.06328cea@mango.fruits.de> <439826D5.2020606@woh.rr.com> <1134045308.9617.22.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: > A software patent? Then maybe EU citizens could be exempted from the > non-commercial restriction (at least until Virgin and friends have bought > enough MEPs). Not that it would make any practical difference to me, I'm > not going to write any music that anyone would want to buy any time soon. It's not a restriction on selling your music made with the software, it is a restriction on commercial sale of the software itself. James From jmstone at dsl.pipex.com Sat Dec 10 09:47:13 2005 From: jmstone at dsl.pipex.com (James Stone) Date: Sat Dec 10 09:49:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <20051208000554.GB11608@dyndns.org> <5bdc1c8b0512071745m7b1d79fctfb6c40b83c883bc9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 07 Dec 2005 22:51:42 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: >> LS is a good program. I sincerely hope the developers will remove this >> language one of these days. Until then I'm a Windows sampler user. >> >> Cheers, >> Mark > > I've been eyeballing a Yamaha A5000 for this very reason. What is most > irritating is that, while the gig library has seen a lot of activity, the > Akai library has been neglected. I see no reason why those two features > can't be worked on in parallel, but IANAP(rogrammer). It's a shame, > considering that, from my vantage point at least, the Akai library is > massive and would make LS a very popular program. I think wired (website currently down) is aiming for Akai support, but since I don't have any Akai samples, I can't test it. James From jmstone at dsl.pipex.com Sat Dec 10 09:41:49 2005 From: jmstone at dsl.pipex.com (James Stone) Date: Sat Dec 10 09:52:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Thu, 08 Dec 2005 08:33:58 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > On 08/12/05, Paul Davis > wrote: > >> there is more going on there than almost nobody on this list except for >> the LS authors and myself is aware of. it would be wise for everyone to >> not judge this admittedly very unpleasant change in the license without >> being aware of the reasons why it occured. unfortunately, it is not >> possible to explain any more. > > Still, without explaining any more, would it be an idea for the authors to > indicate what their likely response would be under some easily imaginable > scenarios, like: "I'm about to release a commercial album where linux > sampler was used in production. May I?" >From my understanding, it is the commercial exploitation of the software, rather than the sale of music written with the software that they are trying to limit: so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell it with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, which they would not be able to do under the GPL. James From reubenf at sonic.net Sat Dec 10 11:53:20 2005 From: reubenf at sonic.net (reuben) Date: Sat Dec 10 11:52:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] qjackctl & set_rtlimits Message-ID: <439B0800.3080508@sonic.net> (Not terribly surprisingly) I can't get the Agnula low latency kernel working on my Ubuntu box (the nvidia drivers are not happy!) So, I figured I'd attempt the set_rtlimits approach. Starting jackd with: set_rtlimits -d -r=10 /usr/bin/jackd -dalsa -dhw:1 -r44100 -p1024 -n2 *almost* gets rid of xruns. What are more appropriate settings? I've tried everything from -r=1 to -r=100. Nothing completely eliminated xruns. Second, how do I configure qjackctl to use set_rtlimits, if this is indeed the best approach? I see hooks for start & stop scripts, but nothing to modify the command. Thanks Reuben From mista.tapas at gmx.net Sat Dec 10 12:21:05 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Sat Dec 10 12:21:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] qjackctl & set_rtlimits In-Reply-To: <439B0800.3080508@sonic.net> References: <439B0800.3080508@sonic.net> Message-ID: <20051210182105.23d20ef2@mango.fruits.de> On Sat, 10 Dec 2005 08:53:20 -0800 reuben wrote: > (Not terribly surprisingly) I can't get the Agnula low latency kernel > working on my Ubuntu box (the nvidia drivers are not happy!) > > So, I figured I'd attempt the set_rtlimits approach. > > Starting jackd with: > set_rtlimits -d -r=10 /usr/bin/jackd -dalsa -dhw:1 -r44100 -p1024 -n2 > > *almost* gets rid of xruns. What are more appropriate settings? I've > tried everything from -r=1 to -r=100. Nothing completely eliminated xruns. > > Second, how do I configure qjackctl to use set_rtlimits, if this is > indeed the best approach? I see hooks for start & stop scripts, but > nothing to modify the command. Hi, i sense some confusion on your part. Let's first clarify what steps are necessary to get good low latency on a linux system: 1) get jack to run with SCHED_FIFO scheduling. This scheduling class is often also called "realtime scheduling" (there's more realtime scheduling classes besides SCHED_FIFO, but these don't concern us at the moment). run jackd with the -R option to achieve this goal (see man jackd). Normally only root is allowed to run processes with realtime scheduling, so we need a way to make ordinary users able to do this, too. There's two common ways on 2.6.x systems: - realtime lsm this is a kernel module which is easy to setup. ubuntu should have it, too. If not, file a featuer request. - rt_limits this is a more general approach which fits better into the linux security architecture than the realtime lsm. Or at least some argue so :) For the time being realtime lsm support is much better in many distros than rt_limits, so i'd recommend going that route. Ok, now we have jackd running with the -R option. This should lead to quite good results even on vanilla 2.6.x kernels. So go ahead and get this to work first. I suppose running with 2*256 frames should be possible pretty much xrun free, given that you don't put too much other load on the system. 2) If you want rock solid jack performance, undisturbed by heavy disk/network/video/whatever-load you should get a realtime preemption kernel. Besides reducing the worst case code path latencies through the kernel, it offers a way to effectively prioritize IRQs. I won't go into the details here (search the archives of this ML and lkml or browse my little page (see signature)), but basically it goes like this: - make soundcard irq highest prio in the system (i.e. 98). - run jackd with prio higher than all irqs other than your soundcard's (use -R -P 70 for example) With such a system it is i.e. possible to compile a kernel, watch some videos, d/l stuff via the network, do a find / or two and at the same time run jackd and some clients completely xrun free (given that the clients are well coded and don't produce any by themself) even at periodsizes of 32 or even 16 frames. So, how you continue further depends on your needs.. Regards, Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From reubenf at sonic.net Sat Dec 10 14:54:10 2005 From: reubenf at sonic.net (reuben) Date: Sat Dec 10 14:53:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] qjackctl & set_rtlimits In-Reply-To: <20051210204523.3af6a611@mango.fruits.de> References: <439B0800.3080508@sonic.net> <20051210182105.23d20ef2@mango.fruits.de> <439B17D4.4070801@sonic.net> <20051210204523.3af6a611@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <439B3262.7090407@sonic.net> Florian Schmidt wrote: >>>run jackd with the -R option to achieve this goal (see man jackd). >>> >>> >>OK, I have that running, but I am still getting xruns. >> >> >This is bad andreally shouldn't happen. Please show me the output of > >ps -C jackd -cmL > >when jackd is running with -R > > > qjackctl starts jackd w/ /usr/bin/jackd -R -dalsa -dhw:1 -r44100 -p1024 -n2 ps -C jackd -cmL gives: PID LWP CLS PRI TTY TIME CMD 11748 - - - ? 00:00:00 jackd - 11748 TS 21 - 00:00:00 - - 11749 TS 23 - 00:00:00 - - 11750 FF 60 - 00:00:00 - - 11751 FF 50 - 00:00:00 - >I see, you are running on AMD64. I don't have any experience with these >systems, but there were some recent reports of difficulties with AMD64 >boxes. Anybody who followed these more closely like to chime in? > > Actually, to be precise, I am running a 32bit distro (Kubuntu) on AMD64. I ran a 64bit distro for a while, but there are various missing niceties that my wife couldn't do without. (Flash, blah blah). Thanks, Reuben From a at gaydenko.com Sat Dec 10 15:10:55 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Sat Dec 10 15:07:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve In-Reply-To: <200512091946.33572.tito@rumford.de> References: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> <200512090231.16924@goldspace.net> <200512091946.33572.tito@rumford.de> Message-ID: <200512102310.55342@goldspace.net> Wolfgang, Thanks! I'll see, think and try :-) Andrew ======= On Friday 09 December 2005 21:46, Wolfgang Woehl wrote: ======= Andrew, current edition of the german computer magazine "c't" has an article on virtual spatialization. They mention "Dolby headphone (tm)" and another effort by Creative (makers of the soundblaster stuff). What they say about results perfectly dampens any higher expectations. Reading the thing makes me doubt that simply convolving with a room response would do what you want. "Kunstkopf", a very old technique, might be worth googling for. And in the back of my mind there's a faint note about David R. Clark (davidrclark@earthlink.net) knowing things about headphone spatialization. He used to be on LAU. Wolfgang From a at gaydenko.com Sat Dec 10 15:19:26 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Sat Dec 10 15:15:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] artificial-head IR-file for jack_convolve In-Reply-To: References: <200512082135.00843@goldspace.net> <200512091946.33572.tito@rumford.de> Message-ID: <200512102319.26508@goldspace.net> Bungee, I don't say about stereo sound image. The aim is to move virtual sound image _beyond_ a head. A decision must work with mono stream too (as you are listening to a single real speaker). Take headphones and apply any kind of LCR filters - you will get a sound image between your ears. Andrew ======= On Friday 09 December 2005 23:23, Bungee wrote: ======= Wolfgang Woehl wrote: > Andrew, current edition of the german computer magazine "c't" has an > article on virtual spatialization. They mention "Dolby headphone (tm)" > and another effort by Creative (makers of the soundblaster stuff). What > they say about results perfectly dampens any higher expectations. > > Reading the thing makes me doubt that simply convolving with a room > response would do what you want. "Kunstkopf", a very old technique, > might be worth googling for. And in the back of my mind there's a faint > note about David R. Clark (davidrclark@earthlink.net) knowing things > about headphone spatialization. He used to be on LAU. > > Wolfgang I don't know if this helps in anyway but I remeber reading some articles in the late 70s for 'real world' headphone drive circuits. One issue was that phones don't allow the normal leakage to both ears at middle and low frequencies like loudspeakers do. The suggested solution to this was resistors in series with both channels and an inductor from one to the other so that at low frequenceis the channels were effectively joined, becoming more separated at higher frequencies. There was also a lot of discussion surrounding this about phase differences etc. based on the different path lengths being about 8 inches. There was some very heavy stuff! For what was termed as expanding the stereo picture (which is what I think th OP is talking about) it was suggested that transformers be used to inject a small ANTIPHASE percentage of the R into the L channel and vice-versa. I vaugely remember someone producing a drawing (wireless world?) that combined these features with variable controls. The one that made me laugh was 'head density' Presumably, with the appropriate filters these ideas should be possible in software. -- Bungee From rlrevell at joe-job.com Sat Dec 10 15:34:57 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Sat Dec 10 15:33:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] qjackctl & set_rtlimits In-Reply-To: <20051210182105.23d20ef2@mango.fruits.de> References: <439B0800.3080508@sonic.net> <20051210182105.23d20ef2@mango.fruits.de> Message-ID: <1134246897.18432.110.camel@mindpipe> On Sat, 2005-12-10 at 18:21 +0100, Florian Schmidt wrote: > suppose running with 2*256 frames should be > possible pretty much xrun free, given that you don't put too much > other load on the system. My tests show that the standard 2.6.14 kernel will cause xruns of up to 10ms. You can get this down to 1ms or so by doing: sysctl -w net.core.netdev_max_backlog=5 (prevents network tx/rx softirqs from causing xruns) echo 32 > /sys/block/hd*/queue/max_sectors_kb (prevent long running disk IRQ handlers from causing xruns) These results are completely reproducible on my system. They will probably lower disk and network throughput a little, but any low latency solution will. Lee From yaqtil at gmail.com Sat Dec 10 15:41:27 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Sat Dec 10 15:41:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [linux-audio-announce] GStreamer 0.10 is here!! In-Reply-To: <1133807967.3220.40.camel@wildsrc.fluendo.lan> References: <1133807967.3220.40.camel@wildsrc.fluendo.lan> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512101241u3700e064h704160372d0e1b58@mail.gmail.com> > http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/releases/gst-plugins-good/0.10.0.html > http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/releases/gst-plugins-ugly/0.10.0.html > http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/releases/gst-plugins-bad/0.10.0.html am i the only one that loves this new naming scheme? we should start using it for everything..just imagine navigating to your local download mirror and finding a new dir under distro, with 'good' containing debian / slackware / gentoo, suse ubuntu et al tucked under 'bad', and redhat tucked under 'ugly'. or perhaps for audio libraries/engines it could be: good: jack bad: arts gstreamer kdemm oss portaudio xine ugly: coreaudio cheers gstreamer folks, 10% of the way to 1.0, but i suspect 70% towards letting me consolidate the 'bad' category to one item instead of 6 ;) From pete.leigh at gmail.com Sat Dec 10 15:49:34 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Sat Dec 10 15:49:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On 10/12/05, James Stone wrote: > On Thu, 08 Dec 2005 08:33:58 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > > Still, without explaining any more, would it be an idea for the authors to > > indicate what their likely response would be under some easily imaginable > > scenarios, like: "I'm about to release a commercial album where linux > > sampler was used in production. May I?" > >From my understanding, it is the commercial exploitation of the software, > rather than the sale of music written with the software that they are > trying to limit: so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell it > with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, > which they would not be able to do under the GPL. Hi James, I hope (and am quite prepared to believe) you're right. Just that it doesn't specifically say that - it just says "commercial use [...] is not allowed", which is a little vague. That's why I'm suggesting a clarification for those unwilling to make assumptions might be a good idea :-) Cheers, - Pete. From rlrevell at joe-job.com Sat Dec 10 16:00:31 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Sat Dec 10 16:01:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1134248431.18432.129.camel@mindpipe> On Sat, 2005-12-10 at 20:49 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > On 10/12/05, James Stone wrote: > > On Thu, 08 Dec 2005 08:33:58 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > > > > Still, without explaining any more, would it be an idea for the authors to > > > indicate what their likely response would be under some easily imaginable > > > scenarios, like: "I'm about to release a commercial album where linux > > > sampler was used in production. May I?" > > > >From my understanding, it is the commercial exploitation of the software, > > rather than the sale of music written with the software that they are > > trying to limit: so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell it > > with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, > > which they would not be able to do under the GPL. > > Hi James, > > I hope (and am quite prepared to believe) you're right. Just that it > doesn't specifically say that - it just says "commercial use [...] is > not allowed", which is a little vague. That's why I'm suggesting a > clarification for those unwilling to make assumptions might be > a good idea :-) > Rather than speculate any further someone really should ask them. If they mean "commercial distribution of the software" they need to say that rather than "commercial use" which I suspect is too vague to have an unambiguous legal definition. Lee From markknecht at gmail.com Sat Dec 10 21:13:52 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sat Dec 10 21:13:57 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <1134248431.18432.129.camel@mindpipe> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134248431.18432.129.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512101813v9079798v36bb2a7e4ffbe5ae@mail.gmail.com> On 12/10/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Sat, 2005-12-10 at 20:49 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > > On 10/12/05, James Stone wrote: > > > On Thu, 08 Dec 2005 08:33:58 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > > > > > > Still, without explaining any more, would it be an idea for the authors to > > > > indicate what their likely response would be under some easily imaginable > > > > scenarios, like: "I'm about to release a commercial album where linux > > > > sampler was used in production. May I?" > > > > > >From my understanding, it is the commercial exploitation of the software, > > > rather than the sale of music written with the software that they are > > > trying to limit: so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell it > > > with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, > > > which they would not be able to do under the GPL. > > > > Hi James, > > > > I hope (and am quite prepared to believe) you're right. Just that it > > doesn't specifically say that - it just says "commercial use [...] is > > not allowed", which is a little vague. That's why I'm suggesting a > > clarification for those unwilling to make assumptions might be > > a good idea :-) > > > > Rather than speculate any further someone really should ask them. If > they mean "commercial distribution of the software" they need to say > that rather than "commercial use" which I suspect is too vague to have > an unambiguous legal definition. > > Lee > > Lee & others, I may be wrong but I believe that the answers to this are in the archives if someone wanted to go through them and find it. The proble with asking is that while the answer may be true today it may not be true in the future. - Mark From jmstone at dsl.pipex.com Sun Dec 11 03:10:50 2005 From: jmstone at dsl.pipex.com (James Stone) Date: Sun Dec 11 03:12:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Re: Linux Sampler References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On Sat, 10 Dec 2005 20:49:34 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > On 10/12/05, James Stone > wrote: >> On Thu, 08 Dec 2005 08:33:58 +0000, Pete Leigh wrote: > >> > Still, without explaining any more, would it be an idea for the >> > authors to indicate what their likely response would be under some >> > easily imaginable scenarios, like: "I'm about to release a commercial >> > album where linux sampler was used in production. May I?" > >> >From my understanding, it is the commercial exploitation of the >> >software, >> rather than the sale of music written with the software that they are >> trying to limit: so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell >> it with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, >> which they would not be able to do under the GPL. > > Hi James, > > I hope (and am quite prepared to believe) you're right. Just that it > doesn't specifically say that - it just says "commercial use [...] is not > allowed", which is a little vague. That's why I'm suggesting a > clarification for those unwilling to make assumptions might be a good idea > :-) > > Cheers, > > - Pete. Here is an excerpt from an email on 5th September title Re: [Linuxsampler-devel] GPL tainting and [linuxsampler license] from LS project leader, and author of libgig (Christian Shoenebeck) posted to the LS-Dev email list The idea about such a possible new license was to allow "direct" commercial usage of LS only if the commercial actor supported this or another (important) open source project either directly by contributing code or indirectly by funding the respective project. So somebody who supported e.g. the GCC, ALSA or Jack Audio Connection Kit project might also be allowed to use LS commercially. "Commercial usage" would of course only mean products based on LS, it would of course not mean using LS e.g. for commercial music production or something. Such a license wouldn't mean anything negative for the user, but might "motivate" or force ;) more people to contribute to this or another open source project, so personally I would find such a license more beneficial (than GPL for example) for the open source community in general. James From kouhia at nic.funet.fi Sun Dec 11 09:20:47 2005 From: kouhia at nic.funet.fi (Juhana Sadeharju) Date: Sun Dec 11 09:20:52 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: How to get good vocal sound Message-ID: I have recently asked this question too. I would like to write an effect specially tuned to create a good vocal sound. Clear but spacious effect. Dattorro's plate reverb is of Lexicon plate type. I would use that for vocals. Is Tim Goetze's Versatile Plate Reverb an implementation of Dattorro's? I have implemented it too if anyone would like to have the code. Juhana -- http://music.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-graphics-dev for developers of open source graphics software From kouhia at nic.funet.fi Sun Dec 11 09:20:50 2005 From: kouhia at nic.funet.fi (Juhana Sadeharju) Date: Sun Dec 11 09:20:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler Message-ID: Hello. Could anyone extract the last pure GPL version of Linuxsampler out of CVS? Perhaps one of the LS developers could do that (as they know the versions)? Do the same with libgig etc. if they have experienced similar change. One should also collect the bug reports of LS and the mailing list archives after the license change. I have blamed LS developers for not making the development documentation available via their public webpage. Now it hits hard as the developers of alternative version need to reverse engineer Gigasampler all over again for the missing parts. If LS developers could make all dev documents up to today available for the alternative developers, would that be nice. The dev docs would help them to catch up the LS as soon as possible. Do you see any problem in this kind of arrangement? I don't. (But if LS eventually becomes pure-GPL, all this trouble is not necessary.) Juhana -- http://music.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-graphics-dev for developers of open source graphics software From markknecht at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 09:54:20 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sun Dec 11 09:54:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512110654k3aa66b85h32e10e7c16cab251@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I think I have a version here that is very close to the last GPL version. (The machine is in the bedroom and my wife is asleep. I'll check later.) I am sure that we can get an old version from CVS that represents the design just prior to the license change assuming no one has mucked with the state of the repository. QUESTION: If the current LS is based on a version that was, at one time, Open Source, doesn't GPL provide that the Open Source version must be made available to those that want it? If some set of developers are interested in carrying on development, with an up front agreement to keep the results Open Source, then you can count on me to do continued testing of LS2 and comparison with GigaStudio. With best regards, Mark On 12/11/05, Juhana Sadeharju wrote: > > Hello. > Could anyone extract the last pure GPL version of Linuxsampler > out of CVS? Perhaps one of the LS developers could do that > (as they know the versions)? > > Do the same with libgig etc. if they have experienced similar > change. > > One should also collect the bug reports of LS and the mailing list > archives after the license change. > > I have blamed LS developers for not making the development > documentation available via their public webpage. Now it > hits hard as the developers of alternative version need to > reverse engineer Gigasampler all over again for the missing > parts. > > If LS developers could make all dev documents up to today > available for the alternative developers, would that be nice. > The dev docs would help them to catch up the LS as soon > as possible. > > Do you see any problem in this kind of arrangement? I don't. > (But if LS eventually becomes pure-GPL, all this trouble is > not necessary.) > > Juhana > -- > http://music.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-graphics-dev > for developers of open source graphics software > From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Sun Dec 11 10:09:45 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Sun Dec 11 10:07:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512110654k3aa66b85h32e10e7c16cab251@mail.gmail.com> References: <5bdc1c8b0512110654k3aa66b85h32e10e7c16cab251@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134313785.7447.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Sun, 2005-12-11 at 06:54 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > QUESTION: If the current LS is based on a version that was, at one > time, Open Source, doesn't GPL provide that the Open Source version > must be made available to those that want it? Only to people who already have a binary built from that source. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051211/c62693de/attachment.bin From m_nels at gmx.net Sun Dec 11 12:50:40 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Sun Dec 11 12:50:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up Message-ID: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> Hi all, I have a quick question... I'd like to automate the start-up of all the programs which are needed to play my collection of music. The aim is to make it easier for other users of my machine (who aren't so familiar with Linux). At the moment, I've written a simple bash script which starts qjackctl, xmms and konqueror pointing at the folder with my music in. This works fine, but the user still has to click 'Start' on qjackctl. Can I automate this somehow? I know that I can start jack straight from the script, but sometimes I like having the GUI. Thanks Michael From pete.leigh at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 13:15:03 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Sun Dec 11 13:15:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up In-Reply-To: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> References: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> Message-ID: On 11/12/05, Michael T D Nelson wrote: > At the moment, I've written a simple bash script which starts qjackctl, > xmms and konqueror pointing at the folder with my music in. > This works fine, but the user still has to click 'Start' on qjackctl. > Can I automate this somehow? > I know that I can start jack straight from the script, but sometimes I > like having the GUI. If jackd is already running when qjackctl starts, there's no need to press qjackctl's start button (qjackctl will notice jackd is running and behave accordingly..) Alternatively, there's a "start JACK audio server on application startup" option in qjackctl's options dialog, under the "misc" tab. Haven't tried that personally, but don't see why it shouldn't work... - Pete From m_nels at gmx.net Sun Dec 11 13:40:03 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Sun Dec 11 13:39:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up In-Reply-To: References: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> Message-ID: <439C7283.6040004@gmx.net> Pete Leigh wrote: > If jackd is already running when qjackctl starts, there's no need to > press qjackctl's start button (qjackctl will notice jackd is running > and behave accordingly..) > > Alternatively, there's a "start JACK audio server on application > startup" option in qjackctl's options dialog, under the "misc" tab. > Haven't tried that personally, but don't see why it shouldn't work... Thanks very much. Both options sound just right. Someone complained the other day when she wanted to play music on my machine, and I told her how to start qjackctl, xmms and open konqueror (because the xmms "open file" window is a bit dated, and I thought she'd prefer the look of konqueror). She said that it was easier in Windows. So I just felt the need to demonstrate how cool the alternatives are. Thanks Michael From atte.jensen at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 16:37:05 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Sun Dec 11 16:37:16 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency Message-ID: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> Hi Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which formula should I use for transposing x semitones up/down? So which frequency would the Bb a half step higher for instance have? What about cents (1/100's of half steps)? -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From mista.tapas at gmx.net Sun Dec 11 17:13:20 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Sun Dec 11 17:13:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency In-Reply-To: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> References: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051211231320.4e22f9ac@mango.fruits.de> On Sun, 11 Dec 2005 22:37:05 +0100 Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Hi > > Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which formula should I > use for transposing x semitones up/down? So which frequency would the Bb > a half step higher for instance have? What about cents (1/100's of half > steps)? One half step in equal tempered tuning is the frequency ratio of 1:2^(1/12) a.k.a the twelfth root of two. So, for an octave you get: 1:(2^(1/12) * 2^(1/12) * .... * 2^(1/12)) = 1:(2^(1/12))^12 = 1:2 :) And for any interval of n semitones you get a frequency ratio of: 1:(2^(1/12))^n = 1:2^(n/12) Sorry, i don't know about cents. It might be the 100th root of 2^(1/12) a.k.a 1:(2^(1/12))^(1/100) = 1:2^(1/1200). So when you go 1200 cents (1:2^(1200/1200) = 1:2) you have again the octave. No guarantee on that though. Regards, Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Sun Dec 11 17:17:51 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Sun Dec 11 17:15:27 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency In-Reply-To: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> References: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134339471.7447.6.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Sun, 2005-12-11 at 22:37 +0100, Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which formula should I > use for transposing x semitones up/down? So which frequency would the Bb > a half step higher for instance have? What about cents (1/100's of half > steps)? To transpose X semitones up, multiply the frequency with 2^(X/12). To transpose down, just use a negative X. For C cents it should be 2^(C/1200). Bb above A440 has the frequency 440 * 2^(1/12) = 466.16. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051211/7c9f9fa6/attachment.bin From cesare at poeticstudios.com Sun Dec 11 17:22:52 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Sun Dec 11 17:23:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency In-Reply-To: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> References: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> Message-ID: <439CA6BC.8090406@poeticstudios.com> Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Hi > > Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which formula should I > use for transposing x semitones up/down? So which frequency would the > Bb a half step higher for instance have? What about cents (1/100's of > half steps)? > You know that every note has a frequency which is twice the frequency of the same note an octave below. You have too go from the A at 440 hz to the A at 880 hz with 12 equal steps. So, for each semitone you have to multiply the frequency of the previous note by the twelfth root of two (approx. 1.059463094). See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelfth_root_of_two c www.cesaremarilungo.com From pete.leigh at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 17:24:12 2005 From: pete.leigh at gmail.com (Pete Leigh) Date: Sun Dec 11 17:24:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency In-Reply-To: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> References: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 11/12/05, Atte Andr? Jensen wrote: > Hi > > Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which > formula should I use for transposing x semitones up/down? > So which frequency would the Bb a half step higher for > instance have? What about cents (1/100's of half steps)? If A is 440 then the A an octave up (call it A') is 2 x 440 = 880. To go from A to A' in 12 equal steps (we're assuming equal temperament), we need an interval, call it I, so that multiplying by I will give the frequency a semitone higher, and doing that 12 times will go up one octave: A x I x I x I x I x I x I x I x I x I x I x I x I = A', so, rearranging: I^12 = A' / A but A' / A = 440/880 = 2. So I^12 = 2. So I is the twelfth root of 2. Multiply the frequency of a note by that and you get the frequency a semitone higher. The twelfth root of two is approximately 1.05946309436, or, as kcalc has it: 1.059463094359295264523454505045663154306 ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelfth_root_of_two ) To go up one cent, the same logic indicates you'd multiply by the 1,200th root of two, since there are 100 cents in a semitone. kcalc tells me it's: 1.000577789506554859250142541782224725466 ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cent_%28music%29 ) - Pete. From atte.jensen at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 17:27:30 2005 From: atte.jensen at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Atte_Andr=E9_Jensen?=) Date: Sun Dec 11 17:27:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency In-Reply-To: <1134339471.7447.6.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> <1134339471.7447.6.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <439CA7D2.1010003@gmail.com> Lars Luthman wrote: > To transpose X semitones up, multiply the frequency with 2^(X/12). To > transpose down, just use a negative X. For C cents it should be > 2^(C/1200). Thanks alot guys. Right now I just needed the formula, but I'm hoping to find time during christmas to write a ladspa plugin that transposes using this formula. Don't know nothing about ladspa, but as far as I ca tell this super simple transpose-plugin should provide the easies possible way into ladspa for me. If I can't figure this one out I can't figure nothing out... -- peace, love & harmony Atte http://www.atte.dk From yaqtil at gmail.com Sun Dec 11 17:53:30 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Sun Dec 11 17:53:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up In-Reply-To: <439C7283.6040004@gmx.net> References: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> <439C7283.6040004@gmx.net> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512111453j4b24e867je6f6b82424a869ac@mail.gmail.com> > > Alternatively, there's a "start JACK audio server on application > > startup" option in qjackctl's options dialog, under the "misc" tab. > > Haven't tried that personally, but don't see why it shouldn't work... i could never get this going properly. i mean it almost worked, but it generally either failed to kill jackd on quit, or killed jackd when i didnt want it to, or failed to notice a jackd was already running when it was launched so it launched another one. regardless of the checkbox es it had a mind of its own. in other words, you should check out jack.ctl from rohan drape's sw-[0-9]{2} collection. it can even launch other apps right after jack, like jack.plumbing, or xmms, or whatever... > Someone complained the other day when she wanted to play music on my > machine, and I told her how to start qjackctl, xmms and open konqueror > (because the xmms "open file" window is a bit dated, and I thought she'd > prefer the look of konqueror). show her amarok (since you already have KDE, it should be fairly quick to setup). its better than foobar2000 and at least as good as iTunes...xmms...what year is this? > She said that it was easier in Windows. So I just felt the need to > demonstrate how cool the alternatives are. cheers From fullgo at dellorfano.net Sun Dec 11 18:28:25 2005 From: fullgo at dellorfano.net (Joseph Dell'Orfano) Date: Sun Dec 11 18:28:34 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <1134343705.13588.16.camel@Mike> These songs are great. I know it's off topic, but I wanted to briefly reply to Paul's comment. In my opinion, the guitar sound is great. It's clearly not a nicely miked acoustic, but it the sound works well with both pieces. However, I do agree that a cond. mike would really help out with the vocal quality which sounded a bit thin. This may simply be my player, but I don't think so. I bet that if you sang into a nice condenser mike, your vocals would be so amazing that the piezo sound would stop bothering Paul! By the way, Amplitube works perfectly under jack-fst. It is a very full featured amp modeling program. It has opened a huge number of musical doors for me. Hopefully when I walk through these doors I can post some tunes for y'all! Thanks for posting these tunes! -Joe On Fri, 2005-12-09 at 12:27 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > > Greetings: > > > > I've put two new recordings on-line: > > > > http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg > > > > http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg > > > > Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. > > Great stuff as always, Dave. > One criticism - get a mic for that guitar! > That piezo sound always bothers me :) > -- Joseph Dell'Orfano From fullgo at dellorfano.net Sun Dec 11 18:28:25 2005 From: fullgo at dellorfano.net (Joseph Dell'Orfano) Date: Sun Dec 11 18:32:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: [ardour-users] new songs on-line In-Reply-To: <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> References: <4399B27F.1050004@woh.rr.com> <20051209172725.GD8696@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <1134343705.13588.16.camel@Mike> These songs are great. I know it's off topic, but I wanted to briefly reply to Paul's comment. In my opinion, the guitar sound is great. It's clearly not a nicely miked acoustic, but it the sound works well with both pieces. However, I do agree that a cond. mike would really help out with the vocal quality which sounded a bit thin. This may simply be my player, but I don't think so. I bet that if you sang into a nice condenser mike, your vocals would be so amazing that the piezo sound would stop bothering Paul! By the way, Amplitube works perfectly under jack-fst. It is a very full featured amp modeling program. It has opened a huge number of musical doors for me. Hopefully when I walk through these doors I can post some tunes for y'all! Thanks for posting these tunes! -Joe On Fri, 2005-12-09 at 12:27 -0500, Paul Winkler wrote: > On Fri, Dec 09, 2005 at 11:36:15AM -0500, Dave Phillips wrote: > > Greetings: > > > > I've put two new recordings on-line: > > > > http://linux-sound.org/itsover.ogg > > > > http://linux-sound.org/tomorrownight.ogg > > > > Both pieces recorded in Ardour and mastered with JAMin. > > Great stuff as always, Dave. > One criticism - get a mic for that guitar! > That piezo sound always bothers me :) > -- Joseph Dell'Orfano _______________________________________________ ardour-users mailing list ardour-users@lists.ardour.org http://lists.ardour.org/listinfo.cgi/ardour-users-ardour.org This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. From phanatic at volny.cz Sun Dec 11 19:07:09 2005 From: phanatic at volny.cz (Ctirad Fertr) Date: Sun Dec 11 19:01:38 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] M-Audio Audiophile 192 In-Reply-To: <200512100429.05490@plasmon.prima.de> References: <4389FE41.8070705@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512100429.05490@plasmon.prima.de> Message-ID: <200512120107.10042.phanatic@volny.cz> Dne sobota 10 prosince 2005 04:29 Marco Schaffh?fer napsal(a): Hello, > Moreover I would like to know the differences between both cards (except > from the sampling rate). Are there any benefits using the Audiophile 192 > compared to the 2496? audiophile 192 has balanced I/O and slightly better converters. However, some people say it sounds worse than audiophile 2496 or even that it's noisy. I read many reviews and comments and it seems, that there is really something wrong with this card. I would definitely focus on a differrent one. Regards, Ctirad From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Sun Dec 11 19:15:07 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Sun Dec 11 19:12:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up In-Reply-To: <21e8fdff0512111453j4b24e867je6f6b82424a869ac@mail.gmail.com> References: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> <439C7283.6040004@gmx.net> <21e8fdff0512111453j4b24e867je6f6b82424a869ac@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134346507.7447.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Sun, 2005-12-11 at 22:53 +0000, c wrote: > > > Alternatively, there's a "start JACK audio server on application > > > startup" option in qjackctl's options dialog, under the "misc" tab. > > > Haven't tried that personally, but don't see why it shouldn't work... > > i could never get this going properly. i mean it almost worked, but it > generally either failed to kill jackd on quit, or killed jackd when i > didnt want it to, or failed to notice a jackd was already running when > it was launched so it launched another one. regardless of the checkbox > es it had a mind of its own. It has always worked perfectly for me. I have that box and the "Enable system tray icon" box checked (and qjackctl saved in my KDE session), so when I start KDE I have a small plug icon sitting in the system tray from which I can get to the connection window, and jackd is started and ready to go. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051212/ae0a8614/attachment.bin From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 11 19:24:52 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 11 19:24:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up In-Reply-To: <1134346507.7447.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> <21e8fdff0512111453j4b24e867je6f6b82424a869ac@mail.gmail.com> <1134346507.7447.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <200512120124.52170.ce@christeck.de> > It has always worked perfectly for me. I have that box and the > "Enable system tray icon" box checked (and qjackctl saved in my KDE > session), so when I start KDE I have a small plug icon sitting in the > system tray from which I can get to the connection window, and jackd > is started and ready to go. same for me. Added qjackctl to the KDE autostart folder (I personally dislike seesion management) and it works very well this way (except the USB audio card isn't available ;-) . Best regards ce From clemens at ladisch.de Mon Dec 12 04:07:49 2005 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Mon Dec 12 04:08:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] UA-100 In-Reply-To: <4399DCCE.6080606@block4.com> References: <4399DCCE.6080606@block4.com> Message-ID: <1134378469.439d3de53d9e6@webmail.uni-halle.de> Malte Steiner wrote: > did anyone still have a Roland/Edirol UA-100 running under Linux? Last known usage was three years ago. > Its recognized as Alsa device and Jack also has it available but as soon > as I started to use audio on it a heavy digital feedback built up, which > sounds interesting but is artisticly pretty limited over a while. Does it have some hardware switch to change the sample format? The driver hardcodes four channels of 16-bit data at 44.1 kHz. What is the output of "lsusb -v" for this device? > I tried to run the editor for it with WINE but it can't see it. WINE cannot emulate custom hardware drivers. Regards, Clemens From rncbc at rncbc.org Mon Dec 12 04:10:54 2005 From: rncbc at rncbc.org (Rui Nuno Capela) Date: Mon Dec 12 04:11:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up In-Reply-To: <200512120124.52170.ce@christeck.de> References: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> <21e8fdff0512111453j4b24e867je6f6b82424a869ac@mail.gmail.com> <1134346507.7447.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <200512120124.52170.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <25830.195.245.190.93.1134378654.squirrel@www.rncbc.org> > >> It has always worked perfectly for me. I have that box and the >> "Enable system tray icon" box checked (and qjackctl saved in my KDE >> session), so when I start KDE I have a small plug icon sitting in the >> system tray from which I can get to the connection window, and jackd >> is started and ready to go. > > same for me. Added qjackctl to the KDE autostart folder (I personally > dislike seesion management) and it works very well this way (except the > USB audio card isn't available ;-) . > There's yet another option: start your jack-enabled application as a qjackctl command line argument, `qjackctl `. This way, qjackctl will show up and start jackd automagically before launching in turn. If jackd is found already running, it will just launch and exit graciously. AFAICT this feature has been in effect as far the planetccrma desktop menus goes on all jack applications, after some kind request from Fernando's. Cheers. -- rncbc aka Rui Nuno Capela rncbc@rncbc.org From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Mon Dec 12 04:36:03 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (frank smith) Date: Mon Dec 12 04:38:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] M-Audio Audiophile 192 In-Reply-To: <200512120107.10042.phanatic@volny.cz> References: <4389FE41.8070705@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512100429.05490@plasmon.prima.de> <200512120107.10042.phanatic@volny.cz> Message-ID: <439D4483.60104@walescomputers.co.uk> Hi I have the 2496 Audiophile ( I didnt know about the 192) I have it running under Agnula Demudi with Envy24 controll. I have had no problems running this on Linux, and I use it on my mastering machine using the Spdiff in and out. cheers Bob Ctirad Fertr wrote: >Dne sobota 10 prosince 2005 04:29 Marco Schaffh?fer napsal(a): > >Hello, > > > >>Moreover I would like to know the differences between both cards (except >>from the sampling rate). Are there any benefits using the Audiophile 192 >>compared to the 2496? >> >> > >audiophile 192 has balanced I/O and slightly better converters. However, some >people say it sounds worse than audiophile 2496 or even that it's noisy. I >read many reviews and comments and it seems, that there is really something >wrong with this card. I would definitely focus on a differrent one. > >Regards, > >Ctirad > > > > > > > > From m_nels at gmx.net Mon Dec 12 05:57:41 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Mon Dec 12 05:57:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Automating qjackctl & xmms start-up In-Reply-To: <25830.195.245.190.93.1134378654.squirrel@www.rncbc.org> References: <439C66F0.5050602@gmx.net> <21e8fdff0512111453j4b24e867je6f6b82424a869ac@mail.gmail.com> <1134346507.7447.11.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <200512120124.52170.ce@christeck.de> <25830.195.245.190.93.1134378654.squirrel@www.rncbc.org> Message-ID: <439D57A5.8090105@gmx.net> Rui Nuno Capela wrote: > There's yet another option: start your jack-enabled application as a > qjackctl command line argument, `qjackctl `. This way, qjackctl > will show up and start jackd automagically before launching in > turn. If jackd is found already running, it will just launch > and exit graciously. Thanks everyone for your replies! I'm very grateful to everyone who has contributed - this software makes my computer more useful than it was, and I find more things which I can do every day. Anyway, about Amarok - I was intending to give it a go some time soon. I've been putting that off until I've finished putting my Athlon machine back together with a faster CPU, more RAM and all of my media files. This other machine is a P3 700, which I am using as a multi-purpose machine until then, so it can be a little heavily loaded. Also, she's used to Winamp in Windows - so XMMS seems a logical step for now... Thanks again, Michael Nelson From pgclarke at beeb.net Mon Dec 12 07:54:07 2005 From: pgclarke at beeb.net (Peter Clarke) Date: Mon Dec 12 07:56:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: linux-audio-user Digest, Vol 27, Issue 38 In-Reply-To: <200512112300.jBBMxu7m018237@roar.music.columbia.edu> References: <200512112300.jBBMxu7m018237@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <200512122054.07754.pgclarke@beeb.net> On Monday 12 December 2005 07:00, linux-audio-user-request@music.columbia.edu wrote: Atte wrote: > Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which > formula should I use for transposing x semitones up/down? > So which frequency would the Bb a half step higher for > instance have? What about cents (1/100's of half steps)? The exact formula is that, to go up a semitone, you multiply the frequency by the 12th root of 2, that is 2 to the power of 1/12. I'm not sure how it works with cents, but I'm guessing that the ratio is 2 to the power of 1/1200. Peter Clarke From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 11:30:14 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 11:30:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] how to synthesize this sound In-Reply-To: <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> References: <4397630C.8090806@gmail.com> <43980728.2050100@gmx.net> <43989D01.8020609@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512121630.14485.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Thursday 08 December 2005 20:52, Atte Andr? Jensen was like: > I appreciate the help, but I'm sorry to say that it sound to me like > everybody that replied are listening at another sound than the one I'm > talking about. Here's another sniplet from the same record with a > similar effect. This one sound more like filtered noise with resonance, > and I'm more interrested in the first example. This is just to stear > away from the bell-thing: > > http://www.atte.dk/download/sound3.ogg > > Anyways here's my breakdown of what is heard on > http://www.atte.dk/download/sound2.ogg > > 1) Shaker/egg on downbeats > 2) Bass > 3) Pad > 4) Toy piano playing the chords on downbeats > 5) synth lead with bender playing melody > 6) fender rhodes in the background > 7) some kind of percussion, something like hand played snare drumm > 8) about 5 seconds (held untill the end of the sample, although barely > audible towards the end) into the sniplet a rising sound, resembling a a > wind chime is heard. > > To me is sounds like you're all listening at the toy piano (which is > what it is, > I saw the band live in a small club in copenhagen, same toy piano on > that tune), but I'm talking about sound #8, the "synthethic wind chime"! > > Sorry for my poor explanation in the first place, hope that you'll care > to listen again, since my initial interrest in the sound, as expressed > in the original posting, still holds. > > And just so straighten that out; I'm not a novice synth tweaker. And I'm > not really interrested in say a sample of the sound to use in my music. > I want to > *understand* how the sound is done. Before I read all the rest of this rather long thread. I hear two distinct sounds here. The first is some high pitched bell sound with distinct fast repeats, either sequenced or caused by some delay effect (could be a bit of both). The second sounds like a standard filter sweep with the resonance turned up and square wave modulation applied (sound3). This is more straightforward to do on an analogue synth with real oscillators. Ring modulation and subtle detuning could be used to give a more bell-like sound. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From pmcaragao-ag at yahoo.com Mon Dec 12 11:35:14 2005 From: pmcaragao-ag at yahoo.com (Paulo Marcel Coelho Aragao) Date: Mon Dec 12 11:35:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] No sound from streaming audio + ALSA Message-ID: <20051212163514.GC3995@cortazar> Hi, I recently switched from OSS to ALSA and no sound comes from streaming audio. CD playing with xmms or cdplay works correctly. Streaming audio with xmms or gxine produces no sound. I can see that the server was contacted and the player is reproducing the stream, but only a hissing sound comes from the loudspeakers. I ruled out mixer problems because CD playing produces sound. I'm running Debian sid, kernel 2.6.14-2-686, on a Fujitsu E342 laptop, with onboard ES1879-chip Soundblaster-compatible soundcard. I've attached the output of the http://alsa.opensrc.org//aadebug.txt script. I'm really puzzled why CD playing produces sound but streaming audio doesn't. I googled on 'alsa streaming audio sound linux' and was surprised that nobody seemed to have bumped into this. Could anybody give me any leads on how to pursue this problem further ? Thanks for your attention, Paulo -------------- next part -------------- ALSA Audio Debug v0.1.0 - Mon Dec 12 14:34:38 BRDT 2005 http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php?page=aadebug http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.txt Kernel ---------------------------------------------------- Linux cortazar 2.6.14-2-686 #2 Fri Dec 9 10:11:34 UTC 2005 i686 GNU/Linux Loaded Modules -------------------------------------------- snd_es18xx 31496 1 snd_pcm 92392 1 snd_es18xx snd_page_alloc 10952 1 snd_pcm snd_opl3_lib 10848 1 snd_es18xx snd_timer 24708 2 snd_pcm,snd_opl3_lib snd_hwdep 9184 1 snd_opl3_lib snd_mpu401_uart 7328 1 snd_es18xx snd_rawmidi 24896 1 snd_mpu401_uart snd_seq_device 8748 2 snd_opl3_lib,snd_rawmidi snd 55940 10 snd_es18xx,snd_pcm,snd_opl3_lib,snd_timer,snd_hwdep,snd_mpu401_uart,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq_device Modprobe Conf --------------------------------------------- alias char-major-14-* soundcore Proc Asound ----------------------------------------------- Advanced Linux Sound Architecture Driver Version 1.0.10rc1 (Mon Sep 12 08:13:09 2005 UTC). 0 [ES1879 ]: ES1879 - ESS AudioDrive ES1879 ESS AudioDrive ES1879 at 0x220, irq 5, dma1 1, dma2 5 8: [0- 0]: raw midi 4: [0- 0]: hardware dependent 16: [0- 0]: digital audio playback 24: [0- 0]: digital audio capture 0: [0- 0]: ctl 33: : timer 00-00: OPL3 FM 00-00: ES1879 : ESS AudioDrive ES1879 : playback 2 : capture 1 cat: /proc/asound/seq/clients: No such file or directory Dev Snd --------------------------------------------------- controlC0 hwC0D0 midiC0D0 pcmC0D0c pcmC0D0p timer CPU ------------------------------------------------------- model name : Celeron (Mendocino) cpu MHz : 298.677 RAM ------------------------------------------------------- MemTotal: 159172 kB SwapTotal: 313256 kB Hardware -------------------------------------------------- 0000:00:00.0 Host bridge: Intel Corporation 440BX/ZX/DX - 82443BX/ZX/DX Host bridge (AGP disabled) (rev 03) From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 11:40:53 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 11:41:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency In-Reply-To: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> References: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512121640.53963.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Sunday 11 December 2005 21:37, Atte Andr? Jensen was like: > Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which formula should I > use for transposing x semitones up/down? So which frequency would the Bb > a half step higher for instance have? What about cents (1/100's of half > steps)? It's something like: Pitch (Hz) = log(27.5/log(2)) + chromatic_note/12 for 12Tet, but I would check this out as I'm slightly mathematically dyslexic. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Mon Dec 12 11:47:43 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Mon Dec 12 11:45:33 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals Message-ID: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> ( LAU folk: this is an initial outline of an email I want to dispatch to the desktop-architects list in the very near future. Your comments are eagerly sought. Note that this section specifically seeks to avoid any discussion of implementations or specific approachs. I would like to fully flesh out the list of tasks ASAP ) Making Sound Just Work ------------------------ One of the "second tier" of requirements mentioned several times at the OSDL Portland Linux Desktop Architects workshop was "making audio on Linux just work". Many people find it easy to leave this requirement lying around in various lists of goals and requirements, but before we can make any progress on defining a plan to implement the goal, we first need to define it rather more precisely. DEFINING THE GOAL ================= The list below is a set of tasks that a user could reasonably expect to perform on a computer running Linux that has access to zero, one or more audio interfaces. The desired task should either work, or produce a sensible and comprehensible error message explaining why it failed. For example, attempting to control input gain on a device that has no hardware mixer should explain that the device has no controls for input gain. PLAYBACK - play a compressed audio file * user driven (e.g. play(1)) * app driven (e.g. {kde,gnome_play}_audiofile()) - play a PCM encoded audio file (specifics as above) - hear system sounds - VOIP - game audio - music composition - music editing - video post production RECORDING - record from hardware inputs * use default audio interface * use other audio interface * specify which h/w input to use * control input gain - record from other application(s) - record from live (network-delivered) compressed audio streams MIXING - control h/w mixer device (if any) * allow use of a generic app for this * NOTE to non-audio-focused readers: the h/w mixer is part of the audio interface that is used to control signal levels, input selection for recording, and other h/w specific features. Some pro-audio interfaces do not have a h/w mixer, most consumer ones do. It has almost nothing to do with "hardware mixing" which describes the ability of the h/w to mix together multiple software-delivered audio data streams. - multiple applications using soundcard simultaneously - control application volumes independently - provide necessary apps for controlling specialized hardware (e.g. RME HDSP, ice1712, ice1724, liveFX) ROUTING - route audio to specific h/w among several installed devices - route audio between applications - route audio across network MULTIUSER - which of the above should work in a multi-user scenario? MISC - use multiple soundcards as a single logical device From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 12:08:31 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 12:08:38 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> Message-ID: <200512121708.32341.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Tuesday 06 December 2005 11:05, Bill Allen was like: > I've been struggling with a technique problem. How do you get your > vocals to sound good? I know that you can't make a silk purse from a > sow's ear, but you can make the best of what you've got. What > combination of plugins and settings do you use to get the best sound > from vocals particularly in Ardour? I know that this is one of those > subjective questions for which the best answer is try it out yourself > and find what sounds best, but there are so many plugins (an > embarassment of riches), each of which has many settings, that a brute > force search of all the combinations would take forever - not to mention > that after a while, my poor ears become exhausted with the effort and > refuse to hear differences anymore. So what I'm really looking for is > good starting points to work from. > > One combination that I like is GVerb to get depth and L/C/R Delay to get > width. Even with those two getting the settings right takes time. For > comunication, I've included a jack rack with some settings I've found > that work OK. I would love your critiques and suggestions for other setups. I know this isn't really what you were asking but: I would recommend going easy on the effects, especially avoiding delays between about 30 and 120mS long. The most and only really useful plugin in the sc4 compressor, which I use rather a lot. Beyond that, the important thing is to get your vocals in time and in tune. In that order. If your timing is good, people's ears will assume that the tuning is also. ;) Getting timing right is a question of listening mostly. Things you can do to help tuning are: Relax, practice breathing from your diaphragm (belly), this is the only part of you that should be making an effort, you use your whole body when singing, so don't cramp your style when you record. Keep your throat and vocal cords as relaxed as possible and remember that it opens top to bottom, not widthways, therefore if you need to stretch, stretch upwards towards the top of your head. Some people like to imagine a silver cord extending upwards from their spine up through the top of the head, from which your whole body hangs, very relaxed. This is the direction to think in if you need to improve tuning. Finally concentrate on the resonant cavities in your face, either side of the nose and around the eyes. Use your eyes to focus that sound, in this case on the microphone. Use a pop shield if you tend to splutter. Getting the right position relative to the mic can make a big difference to the quality of what you record. Here you have to experiment and let your ears guide you. Pulling a few monster gurning faces before you start can help get your face muscles toned. Again, relax and have fun. It seems to be critical to use a good pre-amp and of course a decent microphone helps. Try to avoid using effects plugins to cover up imperfections that only you can hear. ;) One good confident delivery can save much frustrated remixing. Or as I like to put it: Most people find a leather wallet much more useful anyway. ;) -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 12:16:32 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 12:16:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <43959848.5070300@chapelperilous.net> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <200512121716.33244.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Tuesday 06 December 2005 17:48, Paul Winkler was like: > http://slinkp.com/~paul/dont_get_sad_mix_20051206.mp3 > > > I played guitar and sang backups (badly), my wife sang lead > (beautifully). > > And no, we didn't write that, it's a cover of an Ida song. > I wish I wrote that. *sigh* That's beautiful. I needed to hear that right now. -- *sniff* tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 12:23:00 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 12:23:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: References: <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4395E7D4.5020700@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <200512121723.01117.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Wednesday 07 December 2005 07:40, Loki Davison was like: > I'm shocked no one has mentioned jack_convolve, or dssi_convolve yet. > A truly wonderful reverb that works well on everything with the right > choice of impulse. Though i haven't tried it that much on vocals. It's > by far the best sounding reverb i've ever heard and is all round > wonderful ;-). It's actually not that heavy on cpu either. I'm glad you did though. I haven't really dug into the world of convolution, I suspect that it's the way to get the kind of reverb effects that I'm after. Consider the hint taken here. :) -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 12:39:46 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 12:39:55 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <200512121739.47376.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Wednesday 07 December 2005 21:19, guy was like: > but it does raise aesthetic/ethical ?issues about > music as a result of ones ability versus music as a result of ones vision. I disagree. It's the same as all new technology. It's cool if you either a) are the first person to do it or b) are cleverer about it than the last person who tried it AND it's musically relevant. Technology and ability are all means toward the ends of realising your visions. Using Linux deals with most of the ethical issues. So, it's not so much that you can't produce Boy Bands using Linux, just that Linux is a bit more picky about its Boy Bands. ;] -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From creisor at gmail.com Mon Dec 12 12:53:24 2005 From: creisor at gmail.com (Chris Reisor) Date: Mon Dec 12 12:53:35 2005 Subject: vocal effect (was Re: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound) In-Reply-To: <200512121739.47376.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <1133987672.957.1.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <439751FA.8070404@tiscali.co.uk> <200512121739.47376.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <3e1f2d940512120953x151050dbse15ae5c35dc15817@mail.gmail.com> On 12/12/05, tim hall wrote: > On Wednesday 07 December 2005 21:19, guy was like: > > but it does raise aesthetic/ethical issues about > > music as a result of ones ability versus music as a result of ones vision. > > I disagree. It's the same as all new technology. It's cool if you either a) > are the first person to do it or b) are cleverer about it than the last > person who tried it AND it's musically relevant. Technology and ability are > all means toward the ends of realising your visions. Using Linux deals with > most of the ethical issues. > > So, it's not so much that you can't produce Boy Bands using Linux, just that > Linux is a bit more picky about its Boy Bands. ;] > -- > cheers, > > tim hall > http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim > > Amen, brother. Who cares how a sound was achieved, as long as the result blows your mind? The world of electronica, for instance, is as dense and full of garbage as the world of porn, but when there's soul behind it, it vibrates right through the cables and wires and into your consciousness. (I'm thinking of U.N.K.L.E. and Massive Attack as I write this) --chris reisor From julien at c-lab.de Mon Dec 12 12:58:27 2005 From: julien at c-lab.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Mon Dec 12 12:58:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi! I'm a - well - bad singer and I usually do the following with good effect: take a short (20-30ms) lr-delay with only two delays, sometimes use the CAPS chorus with a frequency of 3-4 Hz before this and after that add the g2verb after that, with the reverb-settings appropriate for the recording. For more spacious effect I sometimes apply a long (200-400ms) stereo-delay after that. The chorus can give some more volume, the first short stereo-delay gives more wideness to the voice as-is, and the reverb and delay after that give good, big ambience. This may not be very pretty - I don't know - but it sounds ok. Of course good compression before that can have its part in it, depending on what you're singing and where it should be used. The effects I use are ecasound internal -etd (stereo-delay) like this: -etd:32,2,2,50,50 (32ms delaytime, lleft-to-right mode, 2 delays, 50% mix and 50% feedback. Caps chorus 1767 (don't ask me for params, I have to reread them everytime. g2verb 1950 like that in ecasound commandline: -eli:1950,45,2.8,0.4,0.5,0,-19,-22 (nice and big) Other good possibilities for reverb (if you have high-quality recording like in classical music) are csound/dssi-convolve and a sampled impulse respose. Well for me this always worked out quite ok. HTH. Kindest regards Julien -------- Music was my first love and it will be my last (John Miles) ======== FIND MY WEB-PROJECT AT: ======== http://ltsb.sourceforge.net - the Linux TextBased Studio guide From tylere at mailshack.com Mon Dec 12 12:59:27 2005 From: tylere at mailshack.com (Tyler Eaves) Date: Mon Dec 12 12:59:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] transposing frequency In-Reply-To: <200512121640.53963.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <439C9C01.5040307@gmail.com> <200512121640.53963.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: On Mon, 12 Dec 2005 11:40:53 -0500, tim hall wrote: > On Sunday 11 December 2005 21:37, Atte Andr? Jensen was like: >> Suppose I have an A with a frequency of 440 hz. Which formula should I >> use for transposing x semitones up/down? So which frequency would the Bb >> a half step higher for instance have? What about cents (1/100's of half >> steps)? > > It's something like: > Pitch (Hz) = log(27.5/log(2)) + chromatic_note/12 > for 12Tet, but I would check this out as I'm slightly mathematically > dyslexic. The fundamental multiplier is is the 12th root of 2. -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ From adphillips at gmail.com Mon Dec 12 13:24:49 2005 From: adphillips at gmail.com (Aaron Phillips) Date: Mon Dec 12 13:24:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512121708.32341.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <200512121708.32341.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <6414696f0512121024s9b95f88x312247ed24a97989@mail.gmail.com> On 12/12/05, tim hall wrote:> Getting the right position relative to the mic can make a big difference to> the quality of what you record. Thanks for mentioning mic positioning. I am just beginning to recordvocals and have questions about the distance my vocalist should befrom the mic. I have had a bit of trouble with a sizzling/distortedsound and I'm not sure if it is due to the mic itself being overloadedor if this is compressor noise/bad compressor.I am using a StudioProjects C1 & Maudio omni I/O box (w/ mic preamp) &DBX XL166 compressor.I'd appreciate any advice.Thanks,Aaron From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 13:49:33 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 13:50:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <6414696f0512121024s9b95f88x312247ed24a97989@mail.gmail.com> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <200512121708.32341.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <6414696f0512121024s9b95f88x312247ed24a97989@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512121849.34532.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Monday 12 December 2005 18:24, Aaron Phillips was like: > On 12/12/05, tim hall wrote:> Getting the > right position relative to the mic can make a big difference to> the > quality of what you record. Thanks for mentioning mic positioning. ?I am > just beginning to recordvocals and have questions about the distance my > vocalist should befrom the mic. ?I have had a bit of trouble with a > sizzling/distortedsound and I'm not sure if it is due to the mic itself > being overloadedor if this is compressor noise/bad compressor.I am using a > StudioProjects C1 & Maudio omni I/O box (w/ mic preamp) &DBX XL166 > compressor.I'd appreciate any advice.Thanks,Aaron Somewhere around a span or a foot is usually about right. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From reuben.m at gmail.com Mon Dec 12 14:24:06 2005 From: reuben.m at gmail.com (Reuben Martin) Date: Mon Dec 12 14:24:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On 12/12/05, Paul Davis wrote: > ROUTING > > - route audio to specific h/w among several installed devices > - route audio between applications > - route audio across network > I've seen cases where apps won't work correctly without an audio device present, even though it may not really use / need it. (e.g. streaming) - route audio without using h/w (regardless to weather or not h/w is available) >MISC > > - use multiple soundcards as a single logical device - use multiple sub-devices as single logical device From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 12 14:47:24 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Mon Dec 12 14:47:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Has anybody used LMMS? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20051212194724.56033.qmail@web52602.mail.yahoo.com> Has anybody used LMMS? It looks like GarageBand, but does it work any better? http://lmms.sourceforge.net/home.php __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 15:47:20 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 15:47:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <20051203200218.76703.qmail@web81807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <5bdc1c8b0512031728n2cd25502m78449c8ee7e7330a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512122047.20637.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Sunday 04 December 2005 01:28, Mark Knecht was like: > 1) If I want *exactly* what Fernando provides on the Planet site, no > more and no less, then PlanetCCRMA is the best I know of. It's well > supported in the audio area by a great guy. It has a good mailing list > with helpful people. (Of which I hope I'm one once in awhile anyway.) > Overall very positive, but it has two downsides: > > a) If you need ANYTHING that's not part of the Planet apt system then > be prepared for RPM hell. At least that's my experience. Email, DVD > stuff, etc. > > b) Pick your Fedora version and be prepared to upgrade, upgrade, > upgrade. Every release of FC# is an opportunity to rebuild your system > from scratch. I know some folks report that they just do an upgrade > and it works for them but I'm sure that not a single one ever worked > for me. That's an interesting appraisal. Rather than wave my DebPomPoms, I'd like to offer this by way of comparison: 1) If your hardware is useable with the drivers available under Debian's strict definition of 'free' then AGNULA/DeMuDi is a good all round solution. If you're happy to use the softwares and versions that Free selects to be included in the distro, which gives you a fairly wide choice of useful applications, then you'll enjoy not having to worry about fiddling around in order to make things work. Other positives similar to CCRMA. a) If you need anything that's not included in DeMuDi itself, you can get it straight from the Debian repositories. b) It usually upgrades reasonably smoothly. The catch? Well, I've been using it 3 years and never looked back. If I had time, I'd build a Gentoo system, based largely on reports from this list. I run on recycled tower systems, so I can afford to be a bit gung-ho about it. c) Some hardware either isn't supported or can be a complete PITA to get working. If you fall into that category, you may suffer as much pain and hardship as someone using any other system. Fortunately it shouldn't take weeks to figure out whether it's likely to work or not. d) Debian is notorious for always being slightly out of date, this has improved a bit since the release of 'sarge'. However, if you want to run the latest or CVS versions of, for example, Ardour, Rosegarden or some of the wonderful new applications discussed on this list you're going to have to get your hands dirty doing some real compiling. It's at this point you have to decide whether you actively like the way Debian does things (very command-line oriented, GUIs are often optional extras and are expected to behave themselves, for example). I can imagine there is a point where you might as well be running Gentoo. I just haven't reached that yet. ;) -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 16:17:05 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 16:17:11 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Monday 05 December 2005 02:16, Josh Lawrence was like: > I think that it is very suitable, *if* you know how to create your own > kernel that allows for jack, et al to run with preemptable > capabilities. ?I am not very knowledgeable with compiling kernels, so > I had to wait until someone else provided a how-to for getting my own > kernel. > > Quite the contrary, I see big things on the horizon for Ubuntu. ?This > might be heresy, but I would like for Agnula to merge its efforts in > with Ubuntu, thus making both distributions more complete. A/DeMuDi already uses a fair amount of Ubuntu packages and there has been considerable testing of DeMuDi + Ubuntu systems. I confess I don't know how it compares. Both are Debian based distros, DeMuDi is specifically a Custom Debian Distribution. I find Ubuntu a bit too Mandrake-like for my tastes, but I can see how other people might like that. I would start getting annoyed if I suddenly found I couldn't log in as root after upgrading and was tied to a GNOME desktop with all my essential services turned off!-] DeMuDi exists because the focus on multimedia integration wasn't there in the parent distro. It will continue to exist until such time as Debian or Ubuntu or whatever ships with ("pro") audio applications that simply work out of the box. Merging AGNULA with Canonical seems an unlikely business proposition to me, but who knows? I've not seen an awful lot of interest from the Ubuntu camp, but then I wasn't really paying attention. Ooh! I just got deja-vu. ;) I would welcome any efforts from Ubuntu to become more compatible with DeMuDi. Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 16:40:34 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 16:40:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512041106v546f81f7q4b9cc9b0740719e9@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1133661494.16477.83.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <5bdc1c8b0512041106v546f81f7q4b9cc9b0740719e9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512122140.34813.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Sunday 04 December 2005 19:06, Mark Knecht was like: > Yeah, most probably you are correct, but it's my unfortunatel view of > the world of prepackaged distros. They work really well when I use > exactly what they provide. As soon as I go outside of that boundry > they get dodgy in my experience. This is also true of Debian and DeMuDi to a certain extent, it's just that the boundary is way bigger. I think it's useful to try to quantify the differences between distros, rather than simply state our (DeMuDi rocks!-) value judgements. PlanetCCRMA, seems more up to date and focussed. I'm only offering my observations because (I can't resist and) I hope it will be useful to someone like Brian attempting to decide which distro next. I have nothing but the utmost respect and gratitude for the work that people like Fernando and Free and many others on this list have done to make this software available for ordinary musicians. Snuh. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 17:07:19 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 17:07:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <1133987098.9954.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> <1133984793.17901.44.camel@mindpipe> <1133987098.9954.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <200512122207.20524.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Wednesday 07 December 2005 20:24, Paul Davis was like: > > XMMS does talk to the CDDB right? ?If not we are a lot further behind > > than I thought... Erm, I'm not sure that it does directly ... I figure I must have some old version as it still uses gtk+-1.2 ;p > but here is the greatest thing of all: > > freedb.org (and probably cddb too) do *not* use the MCM number because > there are duplicates. instead, it does the absolutely *brilliant* thing > of creating an ID for the CD based on the length and number of tracks, > which is almost guaranteed to be unique. I guessed that due to the number of times it's got it wrong, amusingly. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From rlrevell at joe-job.com Mon Dec 12 17:30:34 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Mon Dec 12 17:28:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Music CD Data Base In-Reply-To: <200512122207.20524.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <200512071918.jB7JIchn052571@dc.cis.okstate.edu> <1133984793.17901.44.camel@mindpipe> <1133987098.9954.26.camel@localhost.localdomain> <200512122207.20524.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <1134426634.17058.8.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-12 at 22:07 +0000, tim hall wrote: > On Wednesday 07 December 2005 20:24, Paul Davis was like: > > > XMMS does talk to the CDDB right? If not we are a lot further behind > > > than I thought... > > Erm, I'm not sure that it does directly ... > I figure I must have some old version as it still uses gtk+-1.2 ;p > AFAIK no one ever ported xmms to GTK 2.x. The project seems dead. Maybe the code was such a mess that it's easier to write a new player. Lee From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 17:48:43 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 17:48:57 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <200512122248.44274.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Monday 12 December 2005 16:47, Paul Davis was like: > ?RECORDING > ? ? ? > ? ? ? ? ? - record from hardware inputs > ???????? ? ? ?* use default audio interface > ???????? ? ? ?* use other audio interface > ???????? ? ? ?* specify which h/w input to use > ???????? ? ? ?* control input gain > ???????? ?- record from other application(s) > ???????? ?- record from live (network-delivered) compressed audio > ? ? ? ? ? ?????? ?streams If, I understand correctly, you're talking to desktop designers, sound capable systems should have clear icons on the toolbar or wherever for sound mixer and simple record button as standard. I also find having a 'Restart Sound System' menu item rather useful at times. Applications also need to give sensible error messages in the case that ALSA is un/misconfigured, prompting them to rerun alsaconf or whatever. I have found inclusion of the aadebug script immensely useful so put that as: - provide a standard interface for debugging/configuring the sound system Or something like that. I'd be interested to hear how this discussion goes. Keep us posted please. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From reubenf at sonic.net Mon Dec 12 17:55:56 2005 From: reubenf at sonic.net (reubenf@sonic.net) Date: Mon Dec 12 17:55:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <23537.216.239.124.38.1134428156.squirrel@webmail.sonic.net> > > Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? Not, IME, if you're using the Ubuntu nvidia drivers. I know I could compile my own nvidia driver (have done in the past on other distros) but I'm experimenting with other RT stuff 1st. From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Mon Dec 12 18:26:03 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Mon Dec 12 18:26:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <23537.216.239.124.38.1134428156.squirrel@webmail.sonic.net> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <23537.216.239.124.38.1134428156.squirrel@webmail.sonic.net> Message-ID: <200512122326.04005.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Monday 12 December 2005 22:55, reubenf@sonic.net was like: > > Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? > > Not, IME, if you're using the Ubuntu nvidia drivers. I know I could > compile my own nvidia driver (have done in the past on other distros) but > I'm experimenting with other RT stuff 1st. Gotcha! -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From yaqtil at gmail.com Mon Dec 12 18:49:10 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Mon Dec 12 18:49:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Has anybody used LMMS? In-Reply-To: <20051212194724.56033.qmail@web52602.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051212194724.56033.qmail@web52602.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512121549v53e49ad3if44910c2aca676ff@mail.gmail.com> On 12/12/05, Sean Edwards wrote: > Has anybody used LMMS? It looks like GarageBand actually it looks like Fruity Loops: http://lmms.sourceforge.net/screenshots.php vs http://www.flstudio.com/documents/SUB_23.html > , but > does it work any better? garageband doesn't work well? i wouldnt know, LMMS, WIRED, and FreeCycle all refusd to compile.. From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 12 22:29:23 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Mon Dec 12 22:29:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Has anybody used LMMS? In-Reply-To: <21e8fdff0512121549v53e49ad3if44910c2aca676ff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051213032923.66805.qmail@web52611.mail.yahoo.com> I had a PowerBook G4 with 1GB RAM and could not have more than 3 instruments active in GarageBand. The reason why GarageBand is so cheap ($42US when I got it) is that it is designed to sell hardware. I didn't compile LMMS, I installed it from Debian Testing binary package. --- c wrote: > > garageband doesn't work well? i wouldnt know, LMMS, > WIRED, and > FreeCycle all refusd to compile.. > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From alewis at systemsfusion.com Tue Dec 13 00:13:24 2005 From: alewis at systemsfusion.com (Andrew Lewis) Date: Tue Dec 13 00:13:48 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Has anybody used LMMS? In-Reply-To: <20051212194724.56033.qmail@web52602.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051212194724.56033.qmail@web52602.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <439E5874.5070109@systemsfusion.com> Sean Edwards wrote: > Has anybody used LMMS? I've used it. :) It's still fairly early in it's development. ALSA MIDI support, VSTi support were recently added - haven't tried. JACK and LADSPA support are still to come. The program isn't exactly crash-free, but is usable & quite fun once you get used to it... Why not check it out from CVS and try it for yourself? ;) -- Andrew Lewis Customer Services SystemsFusion, Inc Phone: +27 11 328 9700 Fax: +27 11 328 9799 Support: +27 11 328 9790 Email: alewis@systemsfusion.com The information in this e-mail is confidential and is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this e-mail by anyone else is unauthorised. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action taken or omitted in reliance on this, is prohibited and may be unlawful. From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Tue Dec 13 06:41:51 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Tue Dec 13 06:42:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Has anybody used LMMS? In-Reply-To: <20051213032923.66805.qmail@web52611.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051213032923.66805.qmail@web52611.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200512131141.52419.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Tuesday 13 December 2005 03:29, Sean Edwards was like: > I didn't compile LMMS, I installed it from Debian > Testing binary package. WooHoo! suddenly I become interested. That's a turnaround, having a package in Debian while everyone else is still having to compile it. I shall be glancing out of the window all day, checking for flying pigs. ;) -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From sstubbs at shout.net Tue Dec 13 03:03:08 2005 From: sstubbs at shout.net (The Other) Date: Tue Dec 13 09:04:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512121716.33244.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <200512121716.33244.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <200512130803.08955.sstubbs@shout.net> On Monday 12 December 2005 05:16 pm, tim hall wrote: > On Tuesday 06 December 2005 17:48, Paul Winkler was like: > > http://slinkp.com/~paul/dont_get_sad_mix_20051206.mp3 > > > > > > I played guitar and sang backups (badly), my wife sang lead > > (beautifully). Yes, your wife sings melodically and very well. Congratulations. A creative suggestion: if the lyrics are important and need to be heard, perhaps she could articulate more on the consonants. Legato singing is not an easy technique, but it can be mastered. Google might bring up some legato tutorial techniques for you. I don't think your backup singing was done badly, but was done without confidence or you were trying to sing quietly. A creative suggestion: record your backup track separately. Put a lot more volume into your singing when recording. You can adjust to the proper level in the mixdown. Except for opera trained women, male singers will outpower female singers 95% of the time. Singing quietly is one of the toughest techniques to master, even harder than legato singing. So why give yourself more difficulty than you need to? Record your wife first, then record yourself. Put as much vocal power into your take as is musically appropriate, then at mixdown balance the takes. Hope this Helps, Stephen. From a at gaydenko.com Tue Dec 13 09:15:00 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Tue Dec 13 09:11:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] wav to spectrum-image Message-ID: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> Hi! Is there some kind of tool to get a spectrum image for a given sound file? OK, I can start the jaaa, connect it with a player and get average after the song is finished. But it's too long to wait :-) Andrew From jjbenham at chicagoguitar.com Tue Dec 13 09:03:53 2005 From: jjbenham at chicagoguitar.com (Jeremiah Benham) Date: Tue Dec 13 09:17:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> Message-ID: <20051213140353.GA15434@chicagoguitar.com> On Tue, Dec 13, 2005 at 05:15:00PM +0300, Andrew Gaydenko wrote: > Hi! > > Is there some kind of tool to get a spectrum image for a given sound file? > ceres3 and snd will will do that. I believe audacity does that also. Jeremiah From dubphil at free.fr Tue Dec 13 11:25:30 2005 From: dubphil at free.fr (Dubphil) Date: Tue Dec 13 09:30:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <20051213140353.GA15434@chicagoguitar.com> References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <20051213140353.GA15434@chicagoguitar.com> Message-ID: <18975.80.124.137.201.1134491130.squirrel@80.124.137.201> > On Tue, Dec 13, 2005 at 05:15:00PM +0300, Andrew Gaydenko wrote: >> Hi! >> >> Is there some kind of tool to get a spectrum image for a given sound >> file? >> > > ceres3 and snd will will do that. I believe audacity does that also. > > Jeremiah > > > Do you mean a command line tool ? if yes you can use the james beauchamp tool call SNDAN http://ems.music.uiuc.edu/~beaucham/ . I use it to convert on the fly wav files to spectrum thumbnails of the samples for my website oneshotsamples.com . Regards Philippe From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Tue Dec 13 09:44:11 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Tue Dec 13 09:41:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> Message-ID: <1134485051.7566.5.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 17:15 +0300, Andrew Gaydenko wrote: > Is there some kind of tool to get a spectrum image for a given sound file? > > OK, I can start the jaaa, connect it with a player and get average after > the song is finished. But it's too long to wait :-) Aren't there any players that work in freewheeling mode? -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051213/1bd75579/attachment.bin From pw_lists at slinkp.com Tue Dec 13 09:45:32 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Tue Dec 13 09:45:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512130803.08955.sstubbs@shout.net> References: <43957095.10806@juraview.com> <20051206174828.GA9030@slinkp.com> <200512121716.33244.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <200512130803.08955.sstubbs@shout.net> Message-ID: <20051213144532.GA8926@slinkp.com> On Tue, Dec 13, 2005 at 08:03:08AM +0000, The Other wrote: > I don't think your backup singing was done badly, but was done without > confidence or you were trying to sing quietly. A creative > suggestion: record your backup track separately. Put a lot more > volume into your singing when recording. You can adjust to the > proper level in the mixdown. Yeah, we recorded at the same time and I was trying to be quiet, she's got a very soft voice. Also we were imitating the original recording which has a very gentle sound. Thanks for the tips. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From hardbop200 at gmail.com Tue Dec 13 11:08:09 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Tue Dec 13 11:08:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: On 12/12/05, tim hall wrote: >I would start getting annoyed if > I suddenly found I couldn't log in as root after upgrading and was tied to a > GNOME desktop with all my essential services turned off!-] Yes, that is certainly a consideration. You can install fluxbox and openbox, but I can attest that if you install flux, you will be left to build all of your menus by yourself. As much as I enjoy tinkering around with my computer, building the perfect menu is something I would rather leave to someone else :) > Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? > -- I haven't tried, but I can tell you that I just *finally* got my Radeon 9200 working with a standard Ubuntu kernel, so it is unlikely that I'm going to mess with that anytime soon. I think the best option for me is to start bugging the Ubuntu developers to start making "official" RT kernels available. -- Josh Lawrence http://www.hardbop200.com From loki.davison at gmail.com Tue Dec 13 11:39:56 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Tue Dec 13 11:40:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <1134485051.7566.5.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <1134485051.7566.5.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 17:15 +0300, Andrew Gaydenko wrote: > > Is there some kind of tool to get a spectrum image for a given sound file? > > > > OK, I can start the jaaa, connect it with a player and get average after > > the song is finished. But it's too long to wait :-) > > Aren't there any players that work in freewheeling mode? > > -- > Lars Luthman > PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php > Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E > > You can use baudline, which is pretty damn fantastic. Or if you want to produce postscript, for printing, etc the i've got a set of scripts you can have. It's pretty fast. Loki From a at gaydenko.com Tue Dec 13 11:44:43 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Tue Dec 13 11:41:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <18975.80.124.137.201.1134491130.squirrel@80.124.137.201> References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <20051213140353.GA15434@chicagoguitar.com> <18975.80.124.137.201.1134491130.squirrel@80.124.137.201> Message-ID: <200512131944.43436@goldspace.net> Thanks to all for all suggestions! Philippe, You are right: CL tool is the most appropriate for me. I have got the SNDAN src already, and is going to try to build/use this package. Andrew ======= On Tuesday 13 December 2005 19:25, Dubphil wrote: ======= > On Tue, Dec 13, 2005 at 05:15:00PM +0300, Andrew Gaydenko wrote: >> Hi! >> >> Is there some kind of tool to get a spectrum image for a given sound >> file? >> > > ceres3 and snd will will do that. I believe audacity does that also. > > Jeremiah > > > Do you mean a command line tool ? if yes you can use the james beauchamp tool call SNDAN http://ems.music.uiuc.edu/~beaucham/ . I use it to convert on the fly wav files to spectrum thumbnails of the samples for my website oneshotsamples.com . Regards Philippe From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Tue Dec 13 11:42:55 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Tue Dec 13 11:43:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <200512131642.56180.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Tuesday 13 December 2005 16:08, Josh Lawrence was like: > On 12/12/05, tim hall wrote: > >I would start getting annoyed if > > I suddenly found I couldn't log in as root after upgrading and was tied > > to a GNOME desktop with all my essential services turned off!-] > > Yes, that is certainly a consideration. You can install fluxbox and > openbox, but I can attest that if you install flux, you will be left > to build all of your menus by yourself. As much as I enjoy tinkering > around with my computer, building the perfect menu is something I > would rather leave to someone else :) I had problems installing other favourite parts of my desktop either rox or fbpanel, I don't remember which. As my meagre contribution to the distro has basically involved helping to rationalise the menu system around music apps I'd be sad to see that work wasted. I've got lots of respect for what Ubuntu do, but I find that DeMuDi gives me more flexibility with audio given the main priority from the outset. > > Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? > > -- > > I haven't tried, but I can tell you that I just *finally* got my > Radeon 9200 working with a standard Ubuntu kernel, so it is unlikely > that I'm going to mess with that anytime soon. I think the best > option for me is to start bugging the Ubuntu developers to start > making "official" RT kernels available. It's probably worth them taking a look at the work Free and others have done in making reliable multimedia kernels for debian based systems. I'm sure there's lots of room for mutually beneficial exchanges of ideas and information here. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From rlrevell at joe-job.com Tue Dec 13 13:59:28 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Tue Dec 13 14:01:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 10:08 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: > > Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? > > -- > I haven't tried, but I can tell you that I just *finally* got my > Radeon 9200 working with a standard Ubuntu kernel, so it is unlikely > that I'm going to mess with that anytime soon. I think the best > option for me is to start bugging the Ubuntu developers to start > making "official" RT kernels available. If by "got my Radeon 9200 working" you mean "you got the proprietary ATI driver to work" then nope, this will never "work" with the RT kernel. If you're willing to drop your insistence on using prioprietary drivers and/or buying hardware that requires them, then you're in good shape! That's one of the many reasons why proprietary drivers are evil and rude, they tie you to a limited number of kernel version and thus prevent any progress from happening. Lee From epprecht at solnet.ch Tue Dec 13 15:52:52 2005 From: epprecht at solnet.ch (Robert Epprecht) Date: Tue Dec 13 15:57:24 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> (Paul Davis's message of "Mon, 12 Dec 2005 11:47:43 -0500") References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <86lkyosorf.fsf@solnet.ch> Paul Davis writes: > Making Sound Just Work > ------------------------ > - multiple applications using soundcard simultaneously Yes, but maybe also this: Possibility to give access to the soundcard only to one application (or a list of applications) excluding all others. Robert Epprecht From rlrevell at joe-job.com Tue Dec 13 16:12:20 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Tue Dec 13 16:10:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <86lkyosorf.fsf@solnet.ch> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <86lkyosorf.fsf@solnet.ch> Message-ID: <1134508341.19097.41.camel@mindpipe> On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 21:52 +0100, Robert Epprecht wrote: > Paul Davis writes: > > > Making Sound Just Work > > ------------------------ > > > - multiple applications using soundcard simultaneously > > > Yes, but maybe also this: > > Possibility to give access to the soundcard only to one application (or a > list of applications) excluding all others. That's easy, the app that needs exclusive access just opens the hardware device directly rather than using the default PCM. There's no way to prevent multiple access on devices that support hardware mixing. Lee From dlc at radix.net Tue Dec 13 16:37:22 2005 From: dlc at radix.net (David L. Craig) Date: Tue Dec 13 16:37:34 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Connecting alsaplayer to jack Message-ID: <20051213213722.GA21978@saltmine.radix.net> I've gotten jack to run via sudo on my Gentoo system but when I attempt sudo alsaplayer -r -o jack I get: Failed to load output plugin "jack". Trying defaults. I'm guessing I'm missing an ebuild, but I think I have all the right ones with "jack in the name, as emerge --search jack yields: [ Results for search key : jack ] [ Applications found : 12 ] * app-crypt/jacksum Latest version available: 1.6.0 Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ] Size of downloaded files: 401 kB Homepage: http://www.jonelo.de/java/jacksum/ Description: Java utility for computing and verifying checksums: CRC*, MD*, RIPEMD*, SHA*, TIGER*, WHIRLPOOL License: GPL-2 * media-libs/bio2jack Latest version available: 0.4 Latest version installed: 0.4 Size of downloaded files: 466 kB Homepage: http://bio2jack.sourceforge.net/ Description: A library for porting blocked I/O OSS/ALSA audio applications to JACK License: GPL-2 * media-libs/libjackasyn Latest version available: 0.10 Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ] Size of downloaded files: 69 kB Homepage: http://gige.xdv.org/soft/libjackasyn Description: An application/library for connecting OSS apps to Jackit. License: GPL-2 * media-plugins/alsa-jack Latest version available: 1.0.10_rc1 Latest version installed: 1.0.10_rc1 Size of downloaded files: 190 kB Homepage: http://www.alsa-project.org/ Description: JACK pcm plugin License: GPL-2 LGPL-2.1 * media-plugins/xmms-jack Latest version available: 0.10 Latest version installed: 0.10 Size of downloaded files: 569 kB Homepage: http://xmms-jack.sourceforge.net/ Description: a jack audio output plugin for XMMS License: GPL-2 * media-sound/jack Latest version available: 3.0.0 Latest version installed: 3.0.0 Size of downloaded files: 304 kB Homepage: http://www.home.unix-ag.org/arne/jack/ Description: A frontend for several cd-rippers and mp3 encoders License: GPL-2 * media-sound/jack-audio-connection-kit Latest version available: 0.99.0-r1 Latest version installed: 0.99.0-r1 Size of downloaded files: 705 kB Homepage: http://jackit.sourceforge.net/ Description: A low-latency audio server License: GPL-2 LGPL-2.1 * media-sound/jack-rack Latest version available: 1.4.3 Latest version installed: 1.4.3 Size of downloaded files: 337 kB Homepage: http://arb.bash.sh/~rah/software/jack-rack/ Description: JACK Rack is an effects rack for the JACK low latency audio API. License: GPL-2 * media-sound/qjackconnect Latest version available: 0.0.3b-r1 Latest version installed: 0.0.3b-r1 Size of downloaded files: 11 kB Homepage: http://www.suse.de/~mana/jack.html Description: A QT based patchbay for the JACK Audio Connection Kit License: GPL-2 * media-sound/qjackctl Latest version available: 0.2.14 Latest version installed: 0.2.14 Size of downloaded files: 229 kB Homepage: http://qjackctl.sf.net/ Description: A Qt application to control the JACK Audio Connection Kit and ALSA sequencer connections. License: GPL-2 * net-dns/dnshijacker Latest version available: 1.3-r1 Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ] Size of downloaded files: 23 kB Homepage: http://pedram.redhive.com/projects.php Description: a libnet/libpcap based packet sniffer and spoofer License: GPL-2 * net-misc/klapjack [ Masked ] Latest version available: 0.4.2 Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ] Size of downloaded files: 559 kB Homepage: http://klapjack.sourceforge.net/ Description: KDE client for the online journal site LiveJournal License: GPL-2 I'm running kernel 2.6.14-r4 if it matters. Any thoughts on what my problem might be? -- May the LORD God bless you exceedingly abundantly! Dave Craig - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - "'So the universe is not quite as you thought it was. You'd better rearrange your beliefs, then. Because you certainly can't rearrange the universe.'" --from _Nightfall_ by Asimov/Silverberg From vininim at gmail.com Tue Dec 13 17:07:50 2005 From: vininim at gmail.com (Vinicius Santos) Date: Tue Dec 13 17:07:57 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Connecting alsaplayer to jack In-Reply-To: <20051213213722.GA21978@saltmine.radix.net> References: <20051213213722.GA21978@saltmine.radix.net> Message-ID: On 12/13/05, David L. Craig wrote:> I've gotten jack to run via sudo on my Gentoo system but when> I attempt sudo alsaplayer -r -o jack I get:>> Failed to load output plugin "jack". Trying defaults.[snip] Beside having media-sound/jack-audio-connection-kit installed, youneed also to run its daemon jackd. From ce at christeck.de Tue Dec 13 17:23:02 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Tue Dec 13 17:23:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <200512132323.02234.ce@christeck.de> > PLAYBACK > ? ? ? ? ? > ? ? ? ? ? - play a compressed audio file > ???????? ? ? ? ?* user driven (e.g. play(1)) > ????????????????* app driven (e.g. {kde,gnome_play}_audiofile()) > ???????? ?- play a PCM encoded audio file (specifics as above) > ???????? ?- hear system sounds > ???????? ?- VOIP > ???????? ?- game audio > ???????? ?- music composition > ???????? ?- music editing > ???????? ?- video post production - Watching DVD with n.1 sound - Easy MIDI file playback (Timidity comes to my mind) - Play along with prerecorded audio (playing guitar/synths along ogg files) - Play along with sequenced audio (playing guitar/synths along arrangements including MIDI/audio) - Karaoke > ?RECORDING > ? ? ? > ? ? ? ? ? - record from hardware inputs > ???????? ? ? ?* use default audio interface > ???????? ? ? ?* use other audio interface > ???????? ? ? ?* specify which h/w input to use > ???????? ? ? ?* control input gain > ???????? ?- record from other application(s) e.g. recording VIOP calls - answering machine > ???????? ?- record from live (network-delivered) compressed audio > ? ? ? ? ? ?????? ?streams [...] > ?ROUTING > > ? ? ? ? ? - route audio to specific h/w among several installed > devices > - route audio between applications > ???????? ?- route audio across network - easy sharing of audio across networks (see iTunes) > ???????? ? > ?MULTIUSER > > ? ? ? ? ? - which of the above should work in a multi-user scenario? > > ?MISC > ? ? ? > ? ? ? ? ? - use multiple soundcards as a single logical device - unplug USB & Firewire devices even if they are in use (I even sometimes forget that jackd is still running and unplug my USB device, and my system isn't very happy about this ;-) - Easy access to Master Volume/Mute functions (e.g. muting audio playback when Phone/VOIP is ringing) Best regards ce From dlc at radix.net Tue Dec 13 17:41:05 2005 From: dlc at radix.net (David L. Craig) Date: Tue Dec 13 17:41:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Connecting alsaplayer to jack In-Reply-To: References: <20051213213722.GA21978@saltmine.radix.net> Message-ID: <20051213224105.GA22919@saltmine.radix.net> On Tue, Dec 13, 2005 at 08:07:50PM -0200, Vinicius Santos wrote: > > On 12/13/05, David L. Craig wrote: > > I've gotten jack to run via sudo on my Gentoo system but when > > I attempt sudo alsaplayer -r -o jack I get: > > > > Failed to load output plugin "jack". Trying defaults.[snip] > > > Beside having media-sound/jack-audio-connection-kit installed, > youneed also to run its daemon jackd. jackd IS running when I attempt the alsaplayer invocation, as configured, started, and monitored via sudo qjackctl. -- May the LORD God bless you exceedingly abundantly! Dave Craig - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - "'So the universe is not quite as you thought it was. You'd better rearrange your beliefs, then. Because you certainly can't rearrange the universe.'" --from _Nightfall_ by Asimov/Silverberg From dlc at radix.net Tue Dec 13 17:55:47 2005 From: dlc at radix.net (David L. Craig) Date: Tue Dec 13 17:55:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Connecting alsaplayer to jack In-Reply-To: References: <20051213213722.GA21978@saltmine.radix.net> Message-ID: <20051213225547.GA268@saltmine.radix.net> I think I've got it. It seems jack-aware ebuilds need "jack" in the USE flags and I was mistaken that I had added that to my /etc/make.conf file. Now to rebuild all my sound apps... -- May the LORD God bless you exceedingly abundantly! Dave Craig - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - "'So the universe is not quite as you thought it was. You'd better rearrange your beliefs, then. Because you certainly can't rearrange the universe.'" --from _Nightfall_ by Asimov/Silverberg From cesare at poeticstudios.com Tue Dec 13 18:56:41 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Tue Dec 13 18:56:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. Message-ID: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> So far I have a nice (but not impressive) soundfont downloaded here: http://www.hum.aau.dk/~bovbjerg/piano4.html I'm on a 64k isdn connection so I can't download and try every free sample on the net. While experimenting to achieve a more natural sound I tried dssi_convolve with some IRs downloaded from noisevault.com and got a nicer result. Now, I've just been inspired by the Florian Shmidth dssi_convolve entry on his blog and I decided to create an om patch with everything I need to have a realistic piano, with: - the samples already loaded when I open the patch (I think I can use fluidsynth-dssi, with a good soundfont); - the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); - it would be great to simulate also the resonance of other notes when the damper pedal is pressed or other keys are already pressed; - it would be great also to simulate a true hammer action; I think it would be good for the community to have something similar or better than the Steinberg The Grand VSTi. What's your opinion? Can you help me? Or I am doing something that's already been done? In this case, where can I find it? Regards, c. - www.cesaremarilungo.com From pmcaragao-ag at yahoo.com Tue Dec 13 19:01:42 2005 From: pmcaragao-ag at yahoo.com (Paulo Marcel Coelho Aragao) Date: Tue Dec 13 19:01:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: No sound from streaming audio + ALSA In-Reply-To: <20051212163514.GC3995@cortazar> References: <20051212163514.GC3995@cortazar> Message-ID: <20051214000142.GH3600@cortazar> Paulo Marcel Coelho Aragao wrote on Dec, 12: > I recently switched from OSS to ALSA and no sound comes from streaming > audio. CD playing with xmms or cdplay works correctly. Streaming audio with > xmms or gxine produces no sound. I can see that the server was contacted and > the player is reproducing the stream, but only a hissing sound comes from > the loudspeakers. I ruled out mixer problems because CD playing produces > sound. [...] I'm more puzzled now: I traced aplay, which produces sound, and gxine, which doesn't produce sound. aplay plays a wav file, and gxine a rtsp:// stream. I can see that both open /dev/snd/pcmC0D0p, and repeatedly ioctl the file descriptor returned by open. I presume that these ioctl send the sound to the ALSA driver, because I didn't see any write against the file descriptor. The trace from both programs have a similar structure, but gxine produces no sound and aplay does. As I mentioned before, all mixer controls, but Master, are set at maximum value. It must be something really obvious that I'm missing through sheer ignorance of the whole process. Could anybody shed some light on this ? Thanks for bearing with me Paulo From loki.davison at gmail.com Tue Dec 13 19:11:43 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Tue Dec 13 19:11:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 10:08 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: > > > Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? > > > -- > > I haven't tried, but I can tell you that I just *finally* got my > > Radeon 9200 working with a standard Ubuntu kernel, so it is unlikely > > that I'm going to mess with that anytime soon. I think the best > > option for me is to start bugging the Ubuntu developers to start > > making "official" RT kernels available. > > If by "got my Radeon 9200 working" you mean "you got the proprietary ATI > driver to work" then nope, this will never "work" with the RT kernel. > If you're willing to drop your insistence on using prioprietary drivers > and/or buying hardware that requires them, then you're in good shape! > > That's one of the many reasons why proprietary drivers are evil and > rude, they tie you to a limited number of kernel version and thus > prevent any progress from happening. > > Lee > > are you a one reply beast or what? I admit many of your hints are useful but what do you suggest people who want hardware opengl use? if you can create, i.e design and build, a card with comparable (3D) performance to my nvidia pci-e 6600le sli, write open source drivers, for around 30 euro, i.e the price i payed for my nvidia, i'd be very happy to buy one from you, as would the rest of us. Otherwise i'll stick with my nvidia. Loki p.s yes, i make music and play red orchestra on the same machine, i'm sorry i'm a bad person. My only other computer a 650 p3 isn't really up to either task. From ce at christeck.de Tue Dec 13 19:14:23 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Tue Dec 13 19:13:27 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> > I think it would be good for the community to have something similar > or better than the Steinberg The Grand VSTi. What's your opinion? I agree that a good piano would be a cool thing, but equally (or even more for my personal taste) I'd be interested in a *really* good Fender Rhodes Piano (in the optimum case a bit Chick Corea like). But for the latter one I guess it would make sense to have a virtually synthesized one instead of a sampled one. Best regards ce From loki.davison at gmail.com Tue Dec 13 19:14:37 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Tue Dec 13 19:14:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: How to get good vocal sound In-Reply-To: <200512121723.01117.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <20051206184614.87406.qmail@web32411.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4395E7D4.5020700@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512121723.01117.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: On 12/13/05, tim hall wrote: > On Wednesday 07 December 2005 07:40, Loki Davison was like: > > I'm shocked no one has mentioned jack_convolve, or dssi_convolve yet. > > A truly wonderful reverb that works well on everything with the right > > choice of impulse. Though i haven't tried it that much on vocals. It's > > by far the best sounding reverb i've ever heard and is all round > > wonderful ;-). It's actually not that heavy on cpu either. > > I'm glad you did though. I haven't really dug into the world of convolution, > I > suspect that it's the way to get the kind of reverb effects that I'm after. > Consider the hint taken here. :) > -- > cheers, > > tim hall > http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim > It's really, really flexible and a great range of reverbs are on the net. Great for that lost in a big dark cave vibe. Loki From b0ef at esben-stien.name Tue Dec 13 22:13:24 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Tue Dec 13 20:23:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <86lkyosorf.fsf@solnet.ch> (Robert Epprecht's message of "Tue, 13 Dec 2005 21:52:52 +0100") References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <86lkyosorf.fsf@solnet.ch> Message-ID: <87acf4id63.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Robert Epprecht writes: > Possibility to give access to the soundcard only to one application > (or a list of applications) excluding all others. Maybe this could be done in a netfilter fashion;). No apps should care about access to the actual soundcard, btw. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From b0ef at esben-stien.name Tue Dec 13 22:18:28 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Tue Dec 13 20:24:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> (Paul Davis's message of "Mon, 12 Dec 2005 11:47:43 -0500") References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <8764psicxn.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Paul Davis writes: > control h/w mixer device (if any) I think we need to fit advanced devices, such as the HDSP into the ALSA API. I understand that this device is more of an exception, but it should be possible to present this device to the user through ALSA. As it is now, we can't control this device through the ALSA API with simple alsa commands. I think this is very bad as it gives little power to the blind and power users. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From rlrevell at joe-job.com Tue Dec 13 21:12:31 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Tue Dec 13 21:10:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <8764psicxn.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <8764psicxn.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: <1134526351.19097.47.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 04:18 +0100, Esben Stien wrote: > Paul Davis writes: > > > control h/w mixer device (if any) > > I think we need to fit advanced devices, such as the HDSP into the > ALSA API. I understand that this device is more of an exception, but > it should be possible to present this device to the user through > ALSA. As it is now, we can't control this device through the ALSA API > with simple alsa commands. I think this is very bad as it gives little > power to the blind and power users. > Yes, exactly. The ALSA developers admit that the mixer API is currently only sufficient for cheap AC97 type devices, and needs work. Someone needs to spec out exactly what is missing from the ALSA mixer API that makes the variety of hardware dependent mixer apps necessary. Lee From lau at kudla.org Tue Dec 13 21:28:52 2005 From: lau at kudla.org (Rob) Date: Tue Dec 13 21:35:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> On Tue December 13 2005 19:11, Loki Davison wrote: > opengl use? if you can create, i.e design and build, a card > with comparable (3D) performance to my nvidia pci-e 6600le > sli, write open source drivers, for around 30 euro, i.e the > price i payed for my nvidia, i'd be very happy to buy one from > you, as would the rest of us. Otherwise i'll stick with my > nvidia. Lee wasn't suggesting you drop your use of nvidia.... he was suggesting that if you want proprietary video drivers, and you're dissatisfied with your machine's realtime performance, you're either going to have to lobby nvidia (or ati) to make their stuff work with realtime kernels, since they have access to their code and the kernel guys don't, or you're going to have to suck it up. I remember having to turn down my graphics acceleration settings to reduce xruns in my distant Windows past, so it's not like the situation is unique to free software. Rob From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Tue Dec 13 22:06:39 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Tue Dec 13 22:04:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> Message-ID: <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 21:28 -0500, Rob wrote: > On Tue December 13 2005 19:11, Loki Davison wrote: > > opengl use? if you can create, i.e design and build, a card > > with comparable (3D) performance to my nvidia pci-e 6600le > > sli, write open source drivers, for around 30 euro, i.e the > > price i payed for my nvidia, i'd be very happy to buy one from > > you, as would the rest of us. Otherwise i'll stick with my > > nvidia. > > Lee wasn't suggesting you drop your use of nvidia.... he was > suggesting that if you want proprietary video drivers, and > you're dissatisfied with your machine's realtime performance, > you're either going to have to lobby nvidia (or ati) to make > their stuff work with realtime kernels, since they have access > to their code and the kernel guys don't, or you're going to have > to suck it up. i don't know anything about the ATI drivers, but the nvidia ones work fine on an RT kernel. they provide a stub/wrapper that is recompiled as part of driver installation. hence, the actual driver interface is always built against your actual kernel, but it just proxies into the real code. obviously, they have to have a driver for a kernel close to the one that you applied the RT patch to, but this so far has not been a problem. --p From b0ef at esben-stien.name Wed Dec 14 00:07:13 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Tue Dec 13 22:13:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: (Loki Davison's message of "Wed, 14 Dec 2005 03:39:56 +1100") References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <1134485051.7566.5.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <87vexsferi.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Loki Davison writes: > You can use baudline Be adviced that baudline is not free software today. I sent a mail to the author about releasing the source under a free license. He replied that this was a planned thing. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From b0ef at esben-stien.name Wed Dec 14 00:10:32 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Tue Dec 13 22:16:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <18975.80.124.137.201.1134491130.squirrel@80.124.137.201> (dubphil@free.fr's message of "Tue, 13 Dec 2005 16:25:30 -0000 (UCT)") References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <20051213140353.GA15434@chicagoguitar.com> <18975.80.124.137.201.1134491130.squirrel@80.124.137.201> Message-ID: <87r78gfelz.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> "Dubphil" writes: > you can use [..] SNDAN What is the license for this software? This would be really great to use in nautilus to generate icons for audio files. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From loki.davison at gmail.com Tue Dec 13 23:29:58 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Tue Dec 13 23:30:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <87vexsferi.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <1134485051.7566.5.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <87vexsferi.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Esben Stien wrote: > Loki Davison writes: > > > You can use baudline > > Be adviced that baudline is not free software today. I sent a mail to > the author about releasing the source under a free license. He replied > that this was a planned thing. > > -- > Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a > http://www. s t n m > irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact > [sip|iax]: e e > jid:b0ef@ n n > did he... from the faq... So the answer to the question of open sourcing baudline is unfortunately no. We can't do it. Such a move would completely destroy our business plan and our company. As a consolation to the community, SigBlips is involved in some open source activities such as X11 improvements, Linux audio driver maintenance, and real-time scheduling development work. http://www.baudline.com/faq.html This however doesn't change the fact it's the most usable and useful analysis prog on earth. It's great for finding freq of fundemental, partials etc and lots of other useful info, and the mystery signal section of the site is great! Loki From loki.davison at gmail.com Tue Dec 13 23:37:44 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Tue Dec 13 23:37:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Paul Davis wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 21:28 -0500, Rob wrote: > > On Tue December 13 2005 19:11, Loki Davison wrote: > > > opengl use? if you can create, i.e design and build, a card > > > with comparable (3D) performance to my nvidia pci-e 6600le > > > sli, write open source drivers, for around 30 euro, i.e the > > > price i payed for my nvidia, i'd be very happy to buy one from > > > you, as would the rest of us. Otherwise i'll stick with my > > > nvidia. > > > > Lee wasn't suggesting you drop your use of nvidia.... he was > > suggesting that if you want proprietary video drivers, and > > you're dissatisfied with your machine's realtime performance, > > you're either going to have to lobby nvidia (or ati) to make > > their stuff work with realtime kernels, since they have access > > to their code and the kernel guys don't, or you're going to have > > to suck it up. > > i don't know anything about the ATI drivers, but the nvidia ones work > fine on an RT kernel. they provide a stub/wrapper that is recompiled as > part of driver installation. hence, the actual driver interface is > always built against your actual kernel, but it just proxies into the > real code. obviously, they have to have a driver for a kernel close to > the one that you applied the RT patch to, but this so far has not been a > problem. > > --p > > yeah, i use ingos RT, 64 bit and the nvidia 64 bit drivers. Though actually the one i'm using now isn't 100% stable. Loki From b0ef at esben-stien.name Wed Dec 14 04:30:05 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Wed Dec 14 02:36:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: (Loki Davison's message of "Wed, 14 Dec 2005 15:29:58 +1100") References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <1134485051.7566.5.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <87vexsferi.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: <87bqzkdo0y.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Loki Davison writes: > did he... Indeed. > from the faq... I'm perfectly aware of what the FAQ says, but Erik Olson from Sigblips told me 27th of November, 2005 that they intended for baudline to be released under the GPL. I hope this will happen soon, so that I may try baudline. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From dubphil at free.fr Wed Dec 14 05:51:52 2005 From: dubphil at free.fr (Dubphil) Date: Wed Dec 14 03:56:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] wav to spectrum-image In-Reply-To: <87r78gfelz.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> References: <200512131715.00590@goldspace.net> <20051213140353.GA15434@chicagoguitar.com> <18975.80.124.137.201.1134491130.squirrel@80.124.137.201> <87r78gfelz.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Message-ID: <26591.80.124.137.201.1134557512.squirrel@80.124.137.201> > What is the license for this software? I have the 1999 version, don't know if there is a more recent version... And in this version it is only mentioned "All rights reserved". In fact user must ask to James Beauchamp in order to get the package. > > This would be really great to use in nautilus to generate icons for > audio files. > humm I probably didn't say the right term when I said "on the fly" the spectrum is made once after the uploading of the sample. An eps file is created then convert to jpeg by imagemagick, and the image is stored on the disk. In addition, the average size of the samples are 512ko so things are done pretty fast. I don't know what could be done with significant larger audio files. Nevertheless we could find a better way to handle icons of audio file by Nautilus ;) Regards Philippe -- > Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a > http://www. s t n m > irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact > [sip|iax]: e e > jid:b0ef@ n n > > From mista.tapas at gmx.net Wed Dec 14 05:14:44 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Wed Dec 14 05:14:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <20051214111444.21d24b72@mango.fruits.de> On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 22:06:39 -0500 Paul Davis wrote: > i don't know anything about the ATI drivers, but the nvidia ones work > fine on an RT kernel. they provide a stub/wrapper that is recompiled as > part of driver installation. hence, the actual driver interface is > always built against your actual kernel, but it just proxies into the > real code. obviously, they have to have a driver for a kernel close to > the one that you applied the RT patch to, but this so far has not been a > problem. One might get this impression when not installing kernel debugging messages with RT kernels. If one does, one sees dmesg output plastered with BUG's. Especially by modprobe when loading the nvidia module. And there's of course these "nvidia: uh oh, sleeping while holding a lock!!" (paraphrased) messages, too. If you don't make backups regularly, don't use the nvidia drivers together with -rt kernels. This situation might be different for different kernel versions, but it is a _real_ problem. I always build two kernels. One with -rt and one w/o. The latter is for gaming (naturally i have to xorg.conf's too).. Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Wed Dec 14 05:19:00 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Wed Dec 14 05:19:38 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1134555540.8520.2.camel@eviltwin> On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 22:06 -0500, Paul Davis wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 21:28 -0500, Rob wrote: > > On Tue December 13 2005 19:11, Loki Davison wrote: > > > opengl use? if you can create, i.e design and build, a card > > > with comparable (3D) performance to my nvidia pci-e 6600le > > > sli, write open source drivers, for around 30 euro, i.e the > > > price i payed for my nvidia, i'd be very happy to buy one from > > > you, as would the rest of us. Otherwise i'll stick with my > > > nvidia. > > > > Lee wasn't suggesting you drop your use of nvidia.... he was > > suggesting that if you want proprietary video drivers, and > > you're dissatisfied with your machine's realtime performance, > > you're either going to have to lobby nvidia (or ati) to make > > their stuff work with realtime kernels, since they have access > > to their code and the kernel guys don't, or you're going to have > > to suck it up. > > i don't know anything about the ATI drivers, but the nvidia ones work > fine on an RT kernel. they provide a stub/wrapper that is recompiled as > part of driver installation. hence, the actual driver interface is > always built against your actual kernel, but it just proxies into the > real code. obviously, they have to have a driver for a kernel close to > the one that you applied the RT patch to, but this so far has not been a > problem. > I'm running the latest NVIDIA driver on an Athlon 64 with the FC4 planet-core-edge kernel with no problems at all. -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From loki.davison at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 06:07:52 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Wed Dec 14 06:08:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134555540.8520.2.camel@eviltwin> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134529599.13653.156.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134555540.8520.2.camel@eviltwin> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Jan Depner wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 22:06 -0500, Paul Davis wrote: > > On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 21:28 -0500, Rob wrote: > > > On Tue December 13 2005 19:11, Loki Davison wrote: > > > > opengl use? if you can create, i.e design and build, a card > > > > with comparable (3D) performance to my nvidia pci-e 6600le > > > > sli, write open source drivers, for around 30 euro, i.e the > > > > price i payed for my nvidia, i'd be very happy to buy one from > > > > you, as would the rest of us. Otherwise i'll stick with my > > > > nvidia. > > > > > > Lee wasn't suggesting you drop your use of nvidia.... he was > > > suggesting that if you want proprietary video drivers, and > > > you're dissatisfied with your machine's realtime performance, > > > you're either going to have to lobby nvidia (or ati) to make > > > their stuff work with realtime kernels, since they have access > > > to their code and the kernel guys don't, or you're going to have > > > to suck it up. > > > > i don't know anything about the ATI drivers, but the nvidia ones work > > fine on an RT kernel. they provide a stub/wrapper that is recompiled as > > part of driver installation. hence, the actual driver interface is > > always built against your actual kernel, but it just proxies into the > > real code. obviously, they have to have a driver for a kernel close to > > the one that you applied the RT patch to, but this so far has not been a > > problem. > > > > I'm running the latest NVIDIA driver on an Athlon 64 with the FC4 > planet-core-edge kernel with no problems at all. > stability isn't great here with mandriva multimedia kernel,or self compiled RT kernel, though actually the only problem i've had is playing movies, where after around 20 mins to half an hour of playing it locks up hard. I think it's something to do with power saving, but it doesn't do it if i use sdl instead of xv.... no idea why. So i've found a work around but not a solution. I use same kernel for music and games. Loki From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Wed Dec 14 07:00:59 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Wed Dec 14 07:01:11 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] Message-ID: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> I'm very pleased to announce the release of "Flutter", best described as a MIDI Tone Poem. It's the piece I have used to test out and learn the capabilities of Rosegarden, Ardour and various other applications. It uses fairly standard soundfonts and a couple of custom voices from my external D10. The whole piece runs to 28:00 minutes, I would really encourage people to listen to the whole thing in order, as that was how it was intended. That said it's all released under CC-by-sa-2.5 so do as you will with it. :) Direct links: http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter0_flap.ogg http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter1_fluke.ogg http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter2_fidget.ogg http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter3_fplusf--fplusf.ogg http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter4_flubber.ogg http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter5_flounder.ogg http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter6_fly.ogg Web: http://www.archive.org/audio/audio-details-db.php?collection=opensource_audio&collectionid=Flutter http://muzik.agnula.org/view.php?search=any&view=search&text=Flutter Thanks to everyone. Have fun! -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From kouhia at nic.funet.fi Wed Dec 14 07:22:15 2005 From: kouhia at nic.funet.fi (Juhana Sadeharju) Date: Wed Dec 14 07:22:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler Message-ID: >From: James Stone > >so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell it >with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, >which they would not be able to do under the GPL. Many GPL authors have accepted that fact. It is not a shame to not get money from your software! Why would synth manufacturers have to pay? Why they are not allowed to enjoy of free software the same way as we end-users? But, some other people may finish the pure-GPL fork of LS. Then the synth manufacturers need not pay to the fake-GPL LS authors either. Damn, what a wasted time in duplicate work would that be! Juhana -- http://music.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/linux-graphics-dev for developers of open source graphics software From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 09:28:31 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 14 09:28:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512140628x81311bcic0d9bd8cc69398b7@mail.gmail.com> On 12/10/05, James Stone wrote: > > >From my understanding, it is the commercial exploitation of the software, > rather than the sale of music written with the software that they are > trying to limit: so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell it > with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, > which they would not be able to do under the GPL. > > James Do you mean like this one? http://www.lionstracs.com/site/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=39&catid=37&Itemid=59 It seems that one company already has used it. I wonder why it should be OK for them to use it and not others? ;-) - Mark From tito at rumford.de Wed Dec 14 09:34:57 2005 From: tito at rumford.de (Wolfgang Woehl) Date: Wed Dec 14 09:35:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] In-Reply-To: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <200512141534.17083.tito@rumford.de> tim hall : > I'm very pleased to announce the release of "Flutter", best described > as a MIDI Tone Poem. Tim, thank you for this beautifully crafted, marvellous symphony. To my ears everything is right here and in place. I am overjoyed, like I was with the storytelling of "Zelda" some time ago, another fledgling transforming. When the crap will be forgotten "Flutter" will be around and shine. Release of the year in my humble opinion. All the best to you, Wolfgang From loki.davison at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 09:48:48 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Wed Dec 14 09:48:52 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > > I think it would be good for the community to have something similar > > or better than the Steinberg The Grand VSTi. What's your opinion? > > I agree that a good piano would be a cool thing, but equally (or even > more for my personal taste) I'd be interested in a *really* good Fender > Rhodes Piano (in the optimum case a bit Chick Corea like). > > But for the latter one I guess it would make sense to have a virtually > synthesized one instead of a sampled one. > > > Best regards > > > ce > > > if you are aiming for synthesised i can give you pointers to physical synthesis work on pianos. There has been tons of it. Commuted waveguide synthesis being the popular form. There is about 10000 times more research on pianos than everything else together. However given the overall attention to quality and playability by the research community i'd suggested persuing a gigasampler one, or something along those lines. linuxsampler is then the tool of choice. Loki From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Wed Dec 14 10:17:52 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Wed Dec 14 10:00:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Linux Sampler In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512140628x81311bcic0d9bd8cc69398b7@mail.gmail.com> References: <378927426.20051207225429@okonsar.com> <5bdc1c8b0512071404r4383e948se842b654810d9974@mail.gmail.com> <1133996474.957.20.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <5bdc1c8b0512071609h49712423oefdfdf9f5d6586f7@mail.gmail.com> <1134005684.10635.9.camel@localhost.localdomain> <5bdc1c8b0512140628x81311bcic0d9bd8cc69398b7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A037A0.4090304@woh.rr.com> Mark Knecht wrote: >On 12/10/05, James Stone wrote: > > > >>>From my understanding, it is the commercial exploitation of the software, >>rather than the sale of music written with the software that they are >>trying to limit: so if you were to build a linux based synth, and sell it >>with LS installed, they would like to get some money from you for it, >>which they would not be able to do under the GPL. >> >>James >> >> > >Do you mean like this one? > >http://www.lionstracs.com/site/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=39&catid=37&Itemid=59 > >It seems that one company already has used it. I wonder why it should >be OK for them to use it and not others? ;-) > >- Mark > > > I assume that you do know that Lionstracs is a venture started by none other than Dominic and Benno ? Best, dp From hardbop200 at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 10:01:25 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Wed Dec 14 10:01:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> Message-ID: On 12/13/05, Rob wrote: > On Tue December 13 2005 19:11, Loki Davison wrote: > > opengl use? if you can create, i.e design and build, a card > > with comparable (3D) performance to my nvidia pci-e 6600le > > sli, write open source drivers, for around 30 euro, i.e the > > price i payed for my nvidia, i'd be very happy to buy one from > > you, as would the rest of us. Otherwise i'll stick with my > > nvidia. > > Lee wasn't suggesting you drop your use of nvidia.... he was > suggesting that if you want proprietary video drivers, and > you're dissatisfied with your machine's realtime performance, > you're either going to have to lobby nvidia (or ati) to make > their stuff work with realtime kernels, since they have access > to their code and the kernel guys don't, or you're going to have > to suck it up. > > I remember having to turn down my graphics acceleration settings > to reduce xruns in my distant Windows past, so it's not like the > situation is unique to free software. > > Rob > This discussion is very helpful to me, I was unaware that proprietary drivers such as ATI's would cause such problems with a RT kernel. It was a video card that I had leftover from my Windows days, and since I don't have any $ to buy a new one, I'll just have to keep it for awhile. By the way, what is the proper name for a kernel that has been prepared for multimedia work? Realtime kernel? Low-latency kernel? -- Josh Lawrence http://www.hardbop200.com From pw_lists at slinkp.com Wed Dec 14 10:07:29 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Wed Dec 14 10:07:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Burning CDs under 2.6? Message-ID: <20051214150729.GC8654@slinkp.com> I haven't attempted to burn a cd in a long time, apparently not since I upgraded my kernel to 2.6 (currently 2.6.13), and hmmm, it no longer "just works." Argh. gcdmaster crashes every time I select "new audio CD". Got a message pending replies on the cdrdao-devel mailing list. Meanwhile, I thought I'd try cdrecord, which never gave me trouble before. cdrecord -scanbus complains loudly about the kernel: cdrecord: Warning: Running on Linux-2.6.13-gentoo-r5-nosmp-nopreempt-wireless cdrecord: There are unsettled issues with Linux-2.5 and newer. cdrecord: If you have unexpected problems, please try Linux-2.4 or Solaris. cdrecord: No such file or directory. Cannot open '/dev/pg*'. Cannot open SCSI driver. cdrecord: For possible targets try 'cdrecord -scanbus'. cdrecord: For possible transport specifiers try 'cdrecord dev=help'. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From dsbaikov at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 10:39:45 2005 From: dsbaikov at gmail.com (Dmitry Baikov) Date: Wed Dec 14 10:39:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Burning CDs under 2.6? In-Reply-To: <20051214150729.GC8654@slinkp.com> References: <20051214150729.GC8654@slinkp.com> Message-ID: <70a871c80512140739v4e9cc562m225506cb9782efac@mail.gmail.com> cdrecord dev=/dev/cdromWorks fine. As for this message:> cdrecord: Warning: Running on> Linux-2.6.13-gentoo-r5-nosmp-nopreempt-wireless> cdrecord: There are unsettled issues with Linux-2.5 and newer.> cdrecord: If you have unexpected problems, please try Linux-2.4 or> Solaris. Schilling respects only dev=x,y,z (scsi) naming convention and thinksthat linux one (/dev/xxx) is simply broken. From job17and9 at yahoo.com Wed Dec 14 11:07:18 2005 From: job17and9 at yahoo.com (Brian Dunn) Date: Wed Dec 14 11:07:24 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Mono only from pci capture, emu10k1 In-Reply-To: <200512141435.jBEEZu7n006667@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <20051214160718.51967.qmail@web81812.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Well I've made alot of progress on my Gentoo system, and i'm actually trying to make some music with it now. I'm trying to use the aux input on my SBLive Value (the line in jack is busted) to record two things at once from my old school mixer, using it's stereo bus. I pan the keyboard to the right, and the mic to the left, and then use jack to route alsa_pcm capture chanels one and two to seperate busses in ardour. but alas, the right bus is always silent. I've checked it in M$XP with the kX drivers, just to make sure my little custom wiring job was working. I set the AC97 capture to Aux, and left and right chanels where isolated, keys on one and mic on t'uther. So the hardware is working right. Is this a alsa mixer issue, because that thing baffels me! this is probably a question for the alsa list, but i thought maybe some of you gents have had this same isue. Gratefull, brian From creisor at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 11:26:19 2005 From: creisor at gmail.com (Chris Reisor) Date: Wed Dec 14 11:26:23 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> On 12/13/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > So far I have a nice (but not impressive) soundfont downloaded here: > > http://www.hum.aau.dk/~bovbjerg/piano4.html > > I'm on a 64k isdn connection so I can't download and try every free > sample on the net. > While experimenting to achieve a more natural sound I tried > dssi_convolve with some IRs downloaded from noisevault.com and got a > nicer result. > > Now, I've just been inspired by the Florian Shmidth dssi_convolve entry > on his blog and I decided to create an om patch with everything I need > to have a realistic piano, with: > > - the samples already loaded when I open the patch (I think I can use > fluidsynth-dssi, with a good soundfont); > - the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to > the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); > - it would be great to simulate also the resonance of other notes when > the damper pedal is pressed or other keys are already pressed; > - it would be great also to simulate a true hammer action; > > I think it would be good for the community to have something similar or > better than the Steinberg The Grand VSTi. What's your opinion? Can you > help me? > > Or I am doing something that's already been done? In this case, where > can I find it? > > Regards, > c. > - > www.cesaremarilungo.com > I have found great piano soundfonts here: http://www.ibiblio.org/thammer/HammerSound/ There's a really good Steinway. Load that into qsynth, and you're off. --chris reisor From cesare at poeticstudios.com Wed Dec 14 11:47:12 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Wed Dec 14 11:47:24 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A04C90.3060106@poeticstudios.com> Chris Reisor wrote: >On 12/13/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > >>So far I have a nice (but not impressive) soundfont downloaded here: >> >>http://www.hum.aau.dk/~bovbjerg/piano4.html >> >>I'm on a 64k isdn connection so I can't download and try every free >>sample on the net. >>While experimenting to achieve a more natural sound I tried >>dssi_convolve with some IRs downloaded from noisevault.com and got a >>nicer result. >> >>Now, I've just been inspired by the Florian Shmidth dssi_convolve entry >>on his blog and I decided to create an om patch with everything I need >>to have a realistic piano, with: >> >>- the samples already loaded when I open the patch (I think I can use >>fluidsynth-dssi, with a good soundfont); >>- the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to >>the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); >>- it would be great to simulate also the resonance of other notes when >>the damper pedal is pressed or other keys are already pressed; >>- it would be great also to simulate a true hammer action; >> >>I think it would be good for the community to have something similar or >>better than the Steinberg The Grand VSTi. What's your opinion? Can you >>help me? >> >>Or I am doing something that's already been done? In this case, where >>can I find it? >> >>Regards, >>c. >>- >>www.cesaremarilungo.com >> >> >> > >I have found great piano soundfonts here: >http://www.ibiblio.org/thammer/HammerSound/ > >There's a really good Steinway. Load that into qsynth, and you're off. > >--chris reisor > > > > > As I said, I'm on a 64k connection (DSL is not available where I live). I've already downloaded a sf file from there (Steinway_Model_C_sf2.zip, 30Mb) but, at least with qsynth, I get a very poor sounds and some adjacent notes seem to come from different directions, or from different distances. Maybe it's a software problem, but the soundfont from the link in my original message doesn't have this problem. Could you please point me at a direct url for the file? c. From creisor at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 12:22:22 2005 From: creisor at gmail.com (Chris Reisor) Date: Wed Dec 14 12:22:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <43A04C90.3060106@poeticstudios.com> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> <43A04C90.3060106@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <3e1f2d940512140922j34e61a49x9fe4a7635adabf21@mail.gmail.com> On 12/14/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Chris Reisor wrote: > > >On 12/13/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > > > > >>So far I have a nice (but not impressive) soundfont downloaded here: > >> > >>http://www.hum.aau.dk/~bovbjerg/piano4.html > >> > >>I'm on a 64k isdn connection so I can't download and try every free > >>sample on the net. > >>While experimenting to achieve a more natural sound I tried > >>dssi_convolve with some IRs downloaded from noisevault.com and got a > >>nicer result. > >> > >>Now, I've just been inspired by the Florian Shmidth dssi_convolve entry > >>on his blog and I decided to create an om patch with everything I need > >>to have a realistic piano, with: > >> > >>- the samples already loaded when I open the patch (I think I can use > >>fluidsynth-dssi, with a good soundfont); > >>- the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to > >>the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); > >>- it would be great to simulate also the resonance of other notes when > >>the damper pedal is pressed or other keys are already pressed; > >>- it would be great also to simulate a true hammer action; > >> > >>I think it would be good for the community to have something similar or > >>better than the Steinberg The Grand VSTi. What's your opinion? Can you > >>help me? > >> > >>Or I am doing something that's already been done? In this case, where > >>can I find it? > >> > >>Regards, > >>c. > >>- > >>www.cesaremarilungo.com > >> > >> > >> > > > >I have found great piano soundfonts here: > >http://www.ibiblio.org/thammer/HammerSound/ > > > >There's a really good Steinway. Load that into qsynth, and you're off. > > > >--chris reisor > > > > > > > > > > > As I said, I'm on a 64k connection (DSL is not available where I live). > > I've already downloaded a sf file from there (Steinway_Model_C_sf2.zip, > 30Mb) but, at least with qsynth, I get a very poor sounds and some > adjacent notes seem to come from different directions, or from different > distances. Maybe it's a software problem, but the soundfont from the > link in my original message doesn't have this problem. > > Could you please point me at a direct url for the file? > > c. > Wow 64k is a lot faster than my dialup. (Which is why I download my soundfonts and samples at work. Just don't tell the I.T. guys...oh wait, I am the I.T. guys...) Crap. The one I think I was referring to doesn't appear to be available for free anymore. But you can get it for $5 here: http://www.pianosounds.com/index.htm Here's a free one that people reviewed well. It's the "Stereo Grand Piano" http://www.hammersound.net/cgi-bin/soundlink_download2.pl/Download%20USA;SGPn.sfArk;190 From pcoccoli at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 12:22:57 2005 From: pcoccoli at gmail.com (Paul Coccoli) Date: Wed Dec 14 12:23:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <8d27a0610512140922n7eb6a33eq15af79ab32fb16d4@mail.gmail.com> On 12/13/05, Christoph Eckert wrote: > I agree that a good piano would be a cool thing, but equally (or even > more for my personal taste) I'd be interested in a *really* good Fender > Rhodes Piano (in the optimum case a bit Chick Corea like). Have you tried the ones on http://learjeff.com/sf/sf.html? I'm not really qualified to assess the quality, but it sounds nice to me... From drobilla at connect.carleton.ca Wed Dec 14 12:23:55 2005 From: drobilla at connect.carleton.ca (Dave Robillard) Date: Wed Dec 14 12:24:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134581035.7370.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-14-12 at 08:26 -0800, Chris Reisor wrote: > On 12/13/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > - the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to > > the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); This will be possible in the MIDI domain with the new version (currently in CVS) which has MIDI patching (unfortunately there's no plugin spec that can handle MIDI input and output yet). You'd still be able to do it just with some simple multiplication (or maybe a switch plugin), assuming you can get a boolean signal (0, 1) from the damper pedal. Let me know how it goes. -DR- From sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk Wed Dec 14 12:55:54 2005 From: sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk (guy) Date: Wed Dec 14 12:56:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Wine asking for feedback on Audio needs Message-ID: <43A05CAA.7090705@tiscali.co.uk> According to wine weekly news (lhttp://www.winehq.com/?issue=301) the wine project is asking for feedback on its handling of audio. If I can quote: /Alexandre mentioned there were some new changes for better audio driver management in winecfg. That work has been done by Robert Reif and this week he asked if anyone could give him some feedback regarding the lesser used (and more broken) audio drivers:/ /Is anyone using the arts, esound or jack sound drivers for non trivial use? By non trivial, I mean more than one application or more than a single device. If so, I am interested in getting information on the software you are using and how it is using the drivers. / /Would redesigning these drivers to show up as a single device per physical device which allowed being opened more than once be a problem?/ I am sure there are people on this list who know what they are talking about ( & I exclude myself from that!) who could really speak up for the requirements for serious audio work & wine. cheers Guy -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.13/199 - Release Date: 13/12/2005 ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 14 13:01:40 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:05:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> Message-ID: <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 09:01 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: > This discussion is very helpful to me, I was unaware that proprietary > drivers such as ATI's would cause such problems with a RT kernel. It > was a video card that I had leftover from my Windows days, and since I > don't have any $ to buy a new one, I'll just have to keep it for > awhile. > Well my point was that proprietary drivers are wrong, period, from both a technical and ethical standpoint - it was not specific to the RT kernel. It's not about whether they are buggy or not. When Linux users buy hardware that requires propriertary drivers you are impeding the progress of Linux and all free software. It would be understandable if there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the case. Really this is all a depressing reminder that as far as Linux has come over the years people are STILL buying hardware to run Windows on it. They would rather have a 5% better framerate in some game than support free software. Is the highest purpose of Linux really just to run proprietary games and VST plugins using Wine? If so then I'm wasting my time. Lee From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Wed Dec 14 13:08:32 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:08:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] In-Reply-To: <200512141534.17083.tito@rumford.de> References: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <200512141534.17083.tito@rumford.de> Message-ID: <200512141808.32669.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Wednesday 14 December 2005 14:34, Wolfgang Woehl was like: > Tim, thank you for this beautifully crafted, marvellous symphony. To my > ears everything is right here and in place. I am overjoyed, like I was > with the storytelling of "Zelda" some time ago, another fledgling > transforming. When the crap will be forgotten "Flutter" will be around > and shine. Release of the year in my humble opinion. Thanks Wolfgang. Humbled. :) I'm glad everything sounds in place. As I'm sure you can appreciate, I've kind of lost any kind of perspective on the piece. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From cesare at poeticstudios.com Wed Dec 14 13:09:11 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:09:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <1134581035.7370.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> <1134581035.7370.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <43A05FC7.8060705@poeticstudios.com> Dave Robillard wrote: >On Wed, 2005-14-12 at 08:26 -0800, Chris Reisor wrote: > > >>On 12/13/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: >> >> >>>- the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to >>>the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); >>> >>> > >This will be possible in the MIDI domain with the new version (currently >in CVS) which has MIDI patching (unfortunately there's no plugin spec >that can handle MIDI input and output yet). > >You'd still be able to do it just with some simple multiplication (or >maybe a switch plugin), assuming you can get a boolean signal (0, 1) >from the damper pedal. > >Let me know how it goes. > >-DR- > > > > > Ok. So I need to try the CVS version. But I'm also having problems with DSSI plugins. Om doesn't see them. I compiled it myself with --enable-dssi (and the configure script does find dssi.h) and set the correct DSSI_PATH, but I can't see them in the plugins list. I also need to filter incoming midi notes and to trigger other samples according to the situation. Maybe I can study om MIDI plugins API and code a plugin with everything I need. Thank you, c From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Wed Dec 14 13:29:10 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:29:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <200512141829.11318.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Wednesday 14 December 2005 18:01, Lee Revell was like: > Really this is all a depressing reminder that as far as Linux has come > over the years people are STILL buying hardware to run Windows on it. > They would rather have a 5% better framerate in some game than support > free software. ?Is the highest purpose of Linux really just to run > proprietary games and VST plugins using Wine? ?If so then I'm wasting my > time. Fortunately there are many of us running 100%/99% Free systems and we're extremely grateful for the work that you do. No, it isn't wasted. ;) I think people understandably get very excited about the possibilities provided by crossover projects and it can be nice to have something to counter "I bet your Linux box can't do That" with. Personally I might think about getting excited when manufacturers start bringing out native linux games. I'm sure the highest purpose of Linux is something to do with the fact that we don't have to tied down to such a limited perspective. -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From rtp405 at yahoo.com Wed Dec 14 13:34:42 2005 From: rtp405 at yahoo.com (R Parker) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:34:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051214183442.27195.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> --- Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 09:01 -0600, Josh Lawrence > wrote: > > This discussion is very helpful to me, I was > unaware that proprietary > > drivers such as ATI's would cause such problems > with a RT kernel. It > > was a video card that I had leftover from my > Windows days, and since I > > don't have any $ to buy a new one, I'll just have > to keep it for > > awhile. > > The reason you piss people off is because every helpful reply you make has a snide condescending remark in it somewhere. Very seldomly do you reply without registering your intolerance and your superiority over whomever it is that you are supposedly helping. Why should anyone even bother posting on this mailing list when they will be expecting you to insult them? ron > Well my point was that proprietary drivers are > wrong, period, from both > a technical and ethical standpoint - it was not > specific to the RT > kernel. It's not about whether they are buggy or > not. When Linux users > buy hardware that requires propriertary drivers you > are impeding the > progress of Linux and all free software. It would > be understandable if > there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers > but that's not the > case. > > Really this is all a depressing reminder that as far > as Linux has come > over the years people are STILL buying hardware to > run Windows on it. > They would rather have a 5% better framerate in some > game than support > free software. Is the highest purpose of Linux > really just to run > proprietary games and VST plugins using Wine? If so > then I'm wasting my > time. > > Lee > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From Martin.Wohlleben at gmx.de Wed Dec 14 13:39:43 2005 From: Martin.Wohlleben at gmx.de (Martin Wohlleben) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:39:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <200512141939.43848.Martin.Wohlleben@gmx.de> Am Mittwoch, 14. Dezember 2005 01:14 schrieb Christoph Eckert: > > I think it would be good for the community to have something similar > > or better than the Steinberg The Grand VSTi. What's your opinion? > > I agree that a good piano would be a cool thing, but equally (or even > more for my personal taste) I'd be interested in a *really* good Fender > Rhodes Piano (in the optimum case a bit Chick Corea like). > > But for the latter one I guess it would make sense to have a virtually > synthesized one instead of a sampled one. > > > Best regards > > > ce Hi Christoph, did you try MrRay73? It's a VST pulg-in for free but not open source. It work's for me with xfst and with dssi-vst. You can find it here: http://www.soundfonts.it/vst/MrRay73 Best regards, Martin From rob at curates-egg.org Wed Dec 14 13:54:49 2005 From: rob at curates-egg.org (Rob Fell) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:47:01 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> Lee Revell wrote: > ... It would be understandable if > there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the > case. Given that I'm considering building a new machine, can you point to references please? I wasn't aware any 3D GFX manufacturer had released any significant specs/code... > > Really this is all a depressing reminder that as far as Linux has come > over the years people are STILL buying hardware to run Windows on it. > They would rather have a 5% better framerate in some game than support > free software. Is the highest purpose of Linux really just to run > proprietary games and VST plugins using Wine? If so then I'm wasting my > time. You're not wasting your time, Lee. I don't own a copy of MS Windows (nor could I countenance a 'backup' from a friend). I run Linux, and that's all. cheers Rob From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 14 13:56:05 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:53:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051214183442.27195.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051214183442.27195.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1134586565.12086.40.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 10:34 -0800, R Parker wrote: > The reason you piss people off is because every > helpful reply you make has a snide condescending > remark in it somewhere. Very seldomly do you reply > without registering your intolerance and your > superiority over whomever it is that you are > supposedly helping. > > Why should anyone even bother posting on this mailing > list when they will be expecting you to insult them? You are probably right. Really, I'm a nice guy, I guess my only excuse is that I spend a lot of time on development mailing lists where this type of behavior is tolerated at best and encouraged at worst. Sorry if I offended anyone... Lee From lau at kudla.org Wed Dec 14 13:50:48 2005 From: lau at kudla.org (Rob) Date: Wed Dec 14 13:54:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> On Wed December 14 2005 13:01, Lee Revell wrote: > and all free software. It would be understandable if there > was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not > the case. [...] They would rather have a 5% better > framerate in some game than support free software. If 3D chipsets with proprietary drivers only gave the user 5% better performance, that would mean 3D chipsets with free software support are at about 95.2% of the proprietary chipsets' performance. I would gladly buy a 3D card (or notebook with 3D chipset) that has 95% of the speed of a current NVidia or ATI card while having open drivers instead of proprietary. (As it happens, I'm typing this on a notebook with an Intel chipset whose drivers are free, but it's also maybe 10% as fast as a "gaming video card." I am in the market for a new notebook and would like to choose correctly.) Could you provide some examples of 3D kit whose drivers aren't proprietary but which benchmark at 95% or better of NVidia or ATI? I'd even take one that only measures up to a $40 card and costs $99, because I hate proprietary drivers too. Unfortunately, as with 802.11g cards and softmodems, I've done the research and have never come up with an acceptable solution. I'm curious as to whether or not you have actually done your homework on this issue. I hope you have, because I'd like to have an answer when someone buys an nvidia card, has trouble with the driver conflicting with something else, and then goes, "Well, what else was I gonna buy?" Someone recently posted to this very list asking for beta testers of a music creation program that required a pretty decent 3D card, so it isn't just gaming we're talking about here. > Is the > highest purpose of Linux really just to run proprietary games > and VST plugins using Wine? If so then I'm wasting my time. I gotta tell you, I do most of my gaming on consoles like the Gamecube and Nintendo DS, and music production and coding are way more important to me than playing games. Nonetheless, I was overjoyed when I fired up a recent release of Wine last week and discovered it could finally run Hamsterball (on my lousy Intel chipset laptop to boot.) I think most people put gaming higher on their priority list than I do, but you can't assume someone will switch to Linux if what they do 10% of the time will still require them to boot into Windows. I started out with Linux 11 years ago for ethical reasons, but my enthusiasm is due to pragmatism, not religion. It was only about 2002 before I started trying to move other people to Linux en masse, not because Microsoft got more evil but because Linux got to be capable enough for non-technical users, and there are still hiccups today. Gaming is by far the largest of these hiccups (AOL used to be, but people are more willing to drop AOL nowadays since it's so ridiculously priced.) In those cases, I make them buy a copy of Windows and load it up with Openoffice, Firefox, Gaim, etc. and hope by the time they're ready for an upgrade, Linux will be ready for them. There are enough Linux users now that I think most of them are here for pragmatic reasons and not ethical ones anymore. Most if not all people who believe in free software for its own sake aren't using Windows anymore. Any strategy for encouraging Linux adoption that requires users to either (1) care about copyright ethics or (2) become more technical than they are is doomed to failure. Rob From juan at nixbox.com.ar Wed Dec 14 14:26:32 2005 From: juan at nixbox.com.ar (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Juan_Marcelo_Rodr=EDguez?=) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:03:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Guitars Message-ID: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello guys, Im a keyboardist, and Im working everyday composing and recording my songs using ardour as the center of my records. I have a Korg synth, and I haven't problems with the songs, I have enough patchs as I need to use: piano, strings, synths, etc's, because those sounds are great for me. The question is, that I need to record some riffs, or some *strong* chords with guitars and I cannot get a realistic and big sound for that. So, if you work with some kind of amp simulator, effects, vst, whatever, that let get those kind of guitars, tell me. I don't know what kind of music you listen to or you compose, but guitars like Stratovarius and Nightwish have, could be an exact example of what I need. If you think this topic is away from the idea of the list, contact me using my mail avoiding the list. Cheers, Juan. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDoHHowWB8GXdhYbcRApT1AJ9y11PUgQlY0sk6ux1z+e95m9LM/wCdEbCN 0n0j6duufvxK8X9f/9om0ME= =CT/M -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 14 14:11:01 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:08:42 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> Message-ID: <1134587461.12086.45.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 18:54 +0000, Rob Fell wrote: > Lee Revell wrote: > > ... It would be understandable if > > there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the > > case. > > Given that I'm considering building a new machine, can you point to > references please? I wasn't aware any 3D GFX manufacturer had released > any significant specs/code... Intel and VIA have 3D chipsets with open drivers. You're not going to get insanely high frame rates but that's the price of freedom ;-) There's also this project: http://www.opengraphics.org Lee From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 14 14:23:07 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:20:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> Message-ID: <1134588187.12086.49.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 13:50 -0500, Rob wrote: > I'm typing this on a notebook with an Intel chipset > whose drivers are free, but it's also maybe 10% as fast as a > "gaming video card." Ugh, maybe it's worse than I thought. All I know is Tuxracer is playable on my Via Unichrome chipset which has an open source 3D driver ;-) If the situation is that bad then the Open Graphics project might be our only hope. They claim they will be able to hit 90-95% of the performance of Nvidia and ATI gaming cards. Lee From rob at curates-egg.org Wed Dec 14 14:30:14 2005 From: rob at curates-egg.org (Rob Fell) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:22:33 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <1134587461.12086.45.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> <1134587461.12086.45.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43A072C6.9020609@curates-egg.org> Lee Revell wrote: > Intel and VIA have 3D chipsets with open drivers. You're not going to > get insanely high frame rates but that's the price of freedom ;-) Don't these chipsets use 'host' memory rather than dedicated video memory? If so, I'm not sure I want all that bandwidth stolen from the CPU :( > There's also this project: > > http://www.opengraphics.org I've read about this. Interesting idea, but I still have doubts that it'll produce ASIC/cards that will be affordable - though I'd love to be proved wrong. cheers Rob From rlrevell at joe-job.com Wed Dec 14 14:32:58 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:30:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1134588779.12086.58.camel@mindpipe> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 13:01 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 09:01 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: > > This discussion is very helpful to me, I was unaware that proprietary > > drivers such as ATI's would cause such problems with a RT kernel. It > > was a video card that I had leftover from my Windows days, and since I > > don't have any $ to buy a new one, I'll just have to keep it for > > awhile. > > > > Well my point was that proprietary drivers are wrong, period Sorry for the OT rant, this is not the right list for it. A more positive way to state it would be, "Please support the Open Graphics project, www.opengraphics.org". Lee From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Wed Dec 14 14:49:14 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (frank smith) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:49:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512141829.11318.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <200512141829.11318.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <43A0773A.3000806@walescomputers.co.uk> tim hall wrote: >On Wednesday 14 December 2005 18:01, Lee Revell was like: > > >>Really this is all a depressing reminder that as far as Linux has come >>over the years people are STILL buying hardware to run Windows on it. >>They would rather have a 5% better framerate in some game than support >>free software. Is the highest purpose of Linux really just to run >>proprietary games and VST plugins using Wine? If so then I'm wasting my >>time. >> >> > >Fortunately there are many of us running 100%/99% Free systems and we're >extremely grateful for the work that you do. No, it isn't wasted. ;) > >I think people understandably get very excited about the possibilities >provided by crossover projects and it can be nice to have something to >counter "I bet your Linux box can't do That" with. Personally I might think >about getting excited when manufacturers start bringing out native linux >games. I'm sure the highest purpose of Linux is something to do with the fact >that we don't have to tied down to such a limited perspective. > > Hi Well for me I'm 100% linux on my Audio as you dont miss what you havn't had!! As I'm using 64studio all the time I expect things like printers and OOffice to not work as it's not core to sound production. A pain yes, but well better than trying to open closed windoze!! Pople here in Wales are very impressed by what we are doing on Linux re DAW and aree itching to have a go. When we got the 3 tunes into the charts on some website ( No 1 - 3 and 7!) they were amazed to learn its all done on Linux Cheers Bob From rtp405 at yahoo.com Wed Dec 14 14:49:28 2005 From: rtp405 at yahoo.com (R Parker) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:49:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134586565.12086.40.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051214194928.25789.qmail@web32412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > You are probably right. Thanks for exposing me as a jackass with your understanding response. :) ron > Really, I'm a nice guy, guess my only excuse > is that I spend a lot of time on development mailing > lists where this > type of behavior is tolerated at best and encouraged > at worst. > > Sorry if I offended anyone... > > Lee > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From hardbop200 at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 14:51:11 2005 From: hardbop200 at gmail.com (Josh Lawrence) Date: Wed Dec 14 14:51:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134586565.12086.40.camel@mindpipe> References: <20051214183442.27195.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1134586565.12086.40.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Lee Revell wrote: > You are probably right. Really, I'm a nice guy, I guess my only excuse > is that I spend a lot of time on development mailing lists where this > type of behavior is tolerated at best and encouraged at worst. > > Sorry if I offended anyone... > > Lee Lee, since I'm the person the original comment was directed to, let me tell you that I quite enjoyed it. But I'm kinda masochistic :) Anyway, no offense taken. Back to the discussion at hand...I installed the realtime-lsm module on my Ubuntu box last night, and jackd runs with the realtime option enabled. I am, however, still getting xruns, and I'm not really sure why (as Lee or someone pointed out, it may be because I'm running Ubuntu's ATI drivers). So I'll continue to report my progress with using Ubuntu as a multimedia machine as I get time. -- Josh Lawrence http://www.hardbop200.com From ce at christeck.de Wed Dec 14 15:10:38 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Wed Dec 14 15:09:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Guitar amp emulator for Linux? In-Reply-To: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> References: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> Message-ID: <200512142110.38245.ce@christeck.de> Hi, > So, if you work with some kind of amp simulator, effects, vst, > whatever, that let get those kind of guitars, tell me. I don't know > what kind of music you listen to or you compose, but guitars like > Stratovarius and Nightwish have, ?could be an exact example of what I > need. There's Creox, but there doesn't seem too much development on it. I once wanted to use my Linux box as an guitar amp emulator, but then I bought a Behringer V-Amp 2 and am just happy. It's reasonably priced and easy to handle. > If you think this topic is away from the idea of the list, > contact me using my mail avoiding the list. I changed the subject to make it on-topic ;-))) . Best regards ce From hanaghan at starband.net Wed Dec 14 15:29:10 2005 From: hanaghan at starband.net (Russell Hanaghan) Date: Wed Dec 14 15:18:24 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051214194928.25789.qmail@web32412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20051214194928.25789.qmail@web32412.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43A08096.6060206@starband.net> R Parker wrote: >>You are probably right. >> >> > >Thanks for exposing me as a jackass with your >understanding response. :) > >ron > > ROTF....this, if nothing else is a true testament to the "adult" nature of the Linux community!! > > >> Really, I'm a nice guy, guess my only excuse >>is that I spend a lot of time on development mailing >>lists where this >>type of behavior is tolerated at best and encouraged >>at worst. >> >>Sorry if I offended anyone... >> >>Lee >> >> >> > > FWIW, I don't know Lee personally, but he is first with the responses always regarding our cornerstone topics....RT kernel operation and related. Personally, although I have had NIL time to play with my linux audio stuff lately, I for one am glad he's here!!! :) Even if a TAD thorny at times! LOL Cheers, R~ From ce at christeck.de Wed Dec 14 15:20:37 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Wed Dec 14 15:19:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <8d27a0610512140922n7eb6a33eq15af79ab32fb16d4@mail.gmail.com> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> <8d27a0610512140922n7eb6a33eq15af79ab32fb16d4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512142120.37783.ce@christeck.de> Hi, > Have you tried the ones on http://learjeff.com/sf/sf.html? ?I'm not > really qualified to assess the quality, but it sounds nice to me... no, I never saw them before. Thanks a lot for the hint. I'll try them over the weekend. Best regards ce From ce at christeck.de Wed Dec 14 15:23:04 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Wed Dec 14 15:22:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <200512141939.43848.Martin.Wohlleben@gmx.de> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> <200512141939.43848.Martin.Wohlleben@gmx.de> Message-ID: <200512142123.04886.ce@christeck.de> Hi, > did you try MrRay73? > It's a VST pulg-in for free but not open source. It work's for me > with xfst and with dssi-vst. You can find it here: > > http://www.soundfonts.it/vst/MrRay73 thanks a bunch for the hint. But to be honest, I prefer to stay open source and I'd like to avoid using Wine (no, I'm not religious :) . Best regards ce From steffl at bigfoot.com Wed Dec 14 15:22:28 2005 From: steffl at bigfoot.com (Erik Steffl) Date: Wed Dec 14 15:22:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <90078130512041738g347e23b3t3c7c98c3001afdd6@mail.gmail.com> <200512122117.05873.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <43A07F04.1000504@bigfoot.com> Lee Revell wrote: > On Tue, 2005-12-13 at 10:08 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: > >>>Do the DeMuDi multimedia kernels not work with Ubuntu then? >>>-- >> >>I haven't tried, but I can tell you that I just *finally* got my >>Radeon 9200 working with a standard Ubuntu kernel, so it is unlikely >>that I'm going to mess with that anytime soon. I think the best >>option for me is to start bugging the Ubuntu developers to start >>making "official" RT kernels available. > > > If by "got my Radeon 9200 working" you mean "you got the proprietary ATI > driver to work" then nope, this will never "work" with the RT kernel. > If you're willing to drop your insistence on using prioprietary drivers > and/or buying hardware that requires them, then you're in good shape! hmmm... are there really any options if you want openGL to work? Don't both (new) ati and nvidia cards need proprietary drivers for 3D? > That's one of the many reasons why proprietary drivers are evil and > rude, they tie you to a limited number of kernel version and thus > prevent any progress from happening. yes and video cards seem to be pretty much the only common category of hw that needs proprietary drivers (afaik most of the other commonly used categories of hw have at least some products with open source drivers) considering that often the info is not even available it's not even the case when somebody could just go and write driver, it's basically not possible. Ati drivers seem to be stuck (3D for cards from last few years), not sure what nvidia status is but last time I chcecked it was pretty much the same. erik From sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk Wed Dec 14 15:44:41 2005 From: sayhi2guy at tiscali.co.uk (guy) Date: Wed Dec 14 15:44:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Guitars In-Reply-To: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> References: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> Message-ID: <43A08439.8050008@tiscali.co.uk> The most important element is speaker emulation. Without it distorted guitars have that 'wasp in jam jar' sound. Fortunately there is a great LADSPA plug-in for this in Tim Goetze's excellent caps plug-in suite. Put this (it calls itself cabinet emulation) in a LADSPA effects chain after the pre-amp/distortion effect of choice & before your reverb/delay of choice & choose which speaker sound to use according to taste & which axe is plugged in. I have been thrilled with the results. I am away from my Linux Music box at the mo, if you are interested I will put up exactly what chain I use when I can get to check it out. Hope this helps Guy ( hopefully putting the axe into Linaxe ;0) ) Juan Marcelo Rodr?guez wrote: >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >Hash: SHA1 > >Hello guys, > Im a keyboardist, and Im working everyday composing and recording >my songs using ardour as the center of my records. > >I have a Korg synth, and I haven't problems with the songs, I have >enough patchs as I need to use: piano, strings, synths, etc's, >because those sounds are great for me. The question is, that I need to >record some riffs, or some *strong* chords with guitars and I cannot >get a realistic and big sound for that. > >So, if you work with some kind of amp simulator, effects, vst, >whatever, that let get those kind of guitars, tell me. I don't know >what kind of music you listen to or you compose, but guitars like >Stratovarius and Nightwish have, could be an exact example of what I >need. If you think this topic is away from the idea of the list, >contact me using my mail avoiding the list. > >Cheers, > Juan. >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >Version: GnuPG v1.2.7 (GNU/Linux) >Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org > >iD8DBQFDoHHowWB8GXdhYbcRApT1AJ9y11PUgQlY0sk6ux1z+e95m9LM/wCdEbCN >0n0j6duufvxK8X9f/9om0ME= >=CT/M >-----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > > > > -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.13.13/199 - Release Date: 13/12/2005 ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From dsbaikov at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 16:19:55 2005 From: dsbaikov at gmail.com (Dmitry Baikov) Date: Wed Dec 14 16:19:59 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A072C6.9020609@curates-egg.org> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> <1134587461.12086.45.camel@mindpipe> <43A072C6.9020609@curates-egg.org> Message-ID: <70a871c80512141319k77aac033lc8bdfd3d3d735263@mail.gmail.com> > Don't these chipsets use 'host' memory rather than dedicated video> memory? If so, I'm not sure I want all that bandwidth stolen from the> CPU :(I think PCI Express has enough bandwidth.Though, high-performance GPU with dedicated memory & open drivers is adream solution. --Dmitry From tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk Wed Dec 14 16:40:50 2005 From: tech at glastonburymusic.org.uk (tim hall) Date: Wed Dec 14 16:40:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <43A0773A.3000806@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <200512141829.11318.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <43A0773A.3000806@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <200512142140.50742.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> On Wednesday 14 December 2005 19:49, frank smith was like: > Well for me I'm 100% linux on my Audio as you dont miss what you havn't > had!! *Hi fives* Heh. > As I'm using 64studio all the time I expect things like printers and > OOffice to > not work as it's not core to sound production. > A pain yes, ?but well better than trying to open closed windoze!! > > Pople here in Wales are very impressed by what we are doing on Linux re > DAW and aree itching to have a go. > > When we got the 3 tunes into the charts on some website ( No 1 - 3 and > 7!) they were amazed to learn its all done on Linux Yee Haaaar!!! You're doing a grand job there Bob. :) -- cheers, tim hall http://glastonburymusic.org.uk/tim From chr.ohm at gmx.net Wed Dec 14 16:47:36 2005 From: chr.ohm at gmx.net (Christian Ohm) Date: Wed Dec 14 16:47:42 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> Message-ID: <20051214214736.GA19152@moongate.thevoid.net> On Wednesday, 14 December 2005 at 18:54, Rob Fell wrote: > Lee Revell wrote: > >... It would be understandable if > >there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the > >case. > > Given that I'm considering building a new machine, can you point to > references please? I wasn't aware any 3D GFX manufacturer had released > any significant specs/code... As far as I know the fastest 3D card with open drivers is the Radeon 8500/9100 (developed from specs ATI released at the time) - and I've heard even those are noticeably faster with the closed source drivers. -- If you want to get rich from writing, write the sort of thing that's read by persons who move their lips when the're reading to themselves. -- Don Marquis From lau at kudla.org Wed Dec 14 16:47:32 2005 From: lau at kudla.org (Rob) Date: Wed Dec 14 16:52:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134588187.12086.49.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> <1134588187.12086.49.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <200512141647.32736.lau@kudla.org> On Wed December 14 2005 14:23, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 13:50 -0500, Rob wrote: > > I'm typing this on a notebook with an Intel chipset > > whose drivers are free, but it's also maybe 10% as fast as a > > "gaming video card." > Ugh, maybe it's worse than I thought. All I know is Tuxracer > is playable on my Via Unichrome chipset which has an open > source 3D driver ;-) Yeah, Tux Racer works great on my laptop too. That's because Tux Racer was fairly simplistic as a 3D game when it was released over 5 years ago. ;) I'm glad to hear about the OpenGraphics project; that sounds like exactly what I'm after. I hope they eventually are able to get something going that can be mass produced in China or Taiwan and sold for prices in the same ballpark as Nvidia cards are sold today. In the meantime, I guess I'll have to make do with the fairly lame Intel and Via chipsets. Rob From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 17:01:41 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 14 17:01:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <200512142123.04886.ce@christeck.de> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <200512140114.23668.ce@christeck.de> <200512141939.43848.Martin.Wohlleben@gmx.de> <200512142123.04886.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512141401ob5485b2j494ed6d2471b4b97@mail.gmail.com> On 12/14/05, Christoph Eckert wrote: > Hi, > > > > did you try MrRay73? > > It's a VST pulg-in for free but not open source. It work's for me > > with xfst and with dssi-vst. You can find it here: > > > > http://www.soundfonts.it/vst/MrRay73 > > thanks a bunch for the hint. > > But to be honest, I prefer to stay open source and I'd like to avoid > using Wine (no, I'm not religious :) . > > > Best regards > > > ce > Yeah, I agree. In the old days I would have warmly recommended LinuxSampler with the Bardstown Bosendorfer gig file, but alas those days are over. - Mark From markknecht at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 17:05:40 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Wed Dec 14 17:05:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134586565.12086.40.camel@mindpipe> References: <20051214183442.27195.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1134586565.12086.40.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512141405g85be425i3637c4df5c639aab@mail.gmail.com> On 12/14/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 10:34 -0800, R Parker wrote: > > The reason you piss people off is because every > > helpful reply you make has a snide condescending > > remark in it somewhere. Very seldomly do you reply > > without registering your intolerance and your > > superiority over whomever it is that you are > > supposedly helping. > > > > Why should anyone even bother posting on this mailing > > list when they will be expecting you to insult them? > > You are probably right. Really, I'm a nice guy, I guess my only excuse > is that I spend a lot of time on development mailing lists where this > type of behavior is tolerated at best and encouraged at worst. > > Sorry if I offended anyone... > > Lee Lee, You've offended me at least a once or twice... ;-) That said you've helped me at least a million times more. I, for one, am happoy that you're here. - Mark From kjetil at ccrma.stanford.edu Wed Dec 14 17:15:33 2005 From: kjetil at ccrma.stanford.edu (Kjetil S. Matheussen) Date: Wed Dec 14 17:15:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512142157.jBELvG7l022458@roar.music.columbia.edu> References: <200512142157.jBELvG7l022458@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: Josh Lawrence: > > Back to the discussion at hand...I installed the realtime-lsm module > on my Ubuntu box last night, and jackd runs with the realtime option > enabled. I am, however, still getting xruns, and I'm not really sure > why (as Lee or someone pointed out, it may be because I'm running > Ubuntu's ATI drivers). So I'll continue to report my progress with > using Ubuntu as a multimedia machine as I get time. > Try the VESA driver instead. I get a significant less number of xruns when I run the vesa driver instead of the nv driver. (No, Lee, the nvidia driver doesn't work for my built-in gfx-board and my very old xfree X. ;-) .) -- From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Wed Dec 14 17:16:42 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Wed Dec 14 17:16:50 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> Message-ID: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> My experience is at best anecdotal, but my VooDoo 3D AGP card has been supported for a few years; too bad they are out of business now. Tux Racer and Chromium scream across my screen on just have a K7 500Mhz with 768 MB RAM. I don't know if anybody remembers getting nvidia cards to work under RedHat 7.1 or 7.2, but the instructions included "patching" (more like creating a memory hole) in the kernel for the card to work. Comparing old apples to old apples, I prefer my VooDoo 3D. Rather than going out to get the latest and greatest hardware, I tend to look first at what is currently supported under Linux. It may not be the newest, but at least it will work, and usually work well. Code maturity is important when considering hardware drivers. Currently, I am trying to decide between an RME Hammerfall and an M-Audio Delta 1010 audio card. Just as the 3D provides video performance, the RME Hammerfall does the same for audio, off loading the audio processing away from the main cpu. The alsa project also says both cards are supported. That's my $.02US anyway. -=cybersean3000=- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From g.meurisse at laposte.net Wed Dec 14 17:33:23 2005 From: g.meurisse at laposte.net (Guillaume Meurisse) Date: Wed Dec 14 17:33:49 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43A09DB3.3030400@laposte.net> Sean Edwards wrote: >Currently, I am trying to decide between an RME >Hammerfall and an M-Audio Delta 1010 audio card. Just >as the 3D provides video performance, the RME >Hammerfall does the same for audio, off loading the >audio processing away from the main cpu. The alsa >project also says both cards are supported. > A layla3G may be a better choice. it's cheaper tha RME and better than M-audio. guitoo From jesse at essej.net Wed Dec 14 17:36:31 2005 From: jesse at essej.net (Jesse Chappell) Date: Wed Dec 14 17:36:48 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Burning CDs under 2.6? In-Reply-To: <20051214150729.GC8654@slinkp.com> References: <20051214150729.GC8654@slinkp.com> Message-ID: On 12/14/05, Paul Winkler wrote: > I haven't attempted to burn a cd in a long time, apparently > not since I upgraded my kernel to 2.6 (currently 2.6.13), > and hmmm, it no longer "just works." Argh. There is no more ide-scsi emulation in 2.6, make sure you don't have that compiled in and make sure any kernel cmdline lines in grub/lilo are not there. Watch the bootup, or use dmesg to determine which device is your cd burner, a common one is /dev/hdc. Then try cdrecord dev=ATAPI:/dev/hdc .... jlc From pinojazz at gmail.com Wed Dec 14 18:05:25 2005 From: pinojazz at gmail.com (Carlos Pino) Date: Wed Dec 14 18:05:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Ardour-0.99 compiled with vst support --" Normalize" function doesn't work Message-ID: <43A0A535.30806@gmail.com> Hi there. I compiled ardour-0.99 with vst (fst) support with this scons command: scons BUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS=1 USE_SSE_EVERYWHERE=0 VST=1 VSTPATH=/home/supertux/vst/fst-1.7 PREFIX=/usr KSI=no DEBUG=yes To do this I copied,before, the fst-1.7/fst.h and fst-1.7/vst/ to ardour-099/libs/ardour build directory and the SC* files from fst-1.7/ardour amd fst-1.7/gtk_ardour to ardour-0.99 and ardour-0.99/gtk_ardour build directorys Everything during the the compilation proccess went fine, no errors,scons install did his task succesfuly. After this ardour run ok,all the vst fx been recognized fine ,but the "normalize" function doesn't work. If the compilation is made without vst support ,"normalize" works fine. Any idea? Thanks in advance Saludos Cheers. -- Carlos. From pw_lists at slinkp.com Wed Dec 14 18:13:52 2005 From: pw_lists at slinkp.com (Paul Winkler) Date: Wed Dec 14 18:14:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Burning CDs under 2.6? In-Reply-To: <70a871c80512140739v4e9cc562m225506cb9782efac@mail.gmail.com> References: <20051214150729.GC8654@slinkp.com> <70a871c80512140739v4e9cc562m225506cb9782efac@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051214231352.GA10170@slinkp.com> On Wed, Dec 14, 2005 at 06:39:45PM +0300, Dmitry Baikov wrote: > cdrecord dev=/dev/cdrom > Works fine. So it does! Thanks. > As for this message: > > cdrecord: Warning: Running on > > Linux-2.6.13-gentoo-r5-nosmp-nopreempt-wireless > > cdrecord: There are unsettled issues with Linux-2.5 and newer. > > cdrecord: If you have unexpected problems, please try Linux-2.4 or > > Solaris. > > Schilling respects only dev=x,y,z (scsi) naming convention and thinks > that linux one (/dev/xxx) is simply broken. Weird. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com From ross at jose.lug.udel.edu Wed Dec 14 20:20:17 2005 From: ross at jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) Date: Wed Dec 14 20:20:21 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> Message-ID: <20051215012017.GA770@jose.lug.udel.edu> On Wed, Dec 14, 2005 at 06:54:49PM +0000, Rob Fell wrote: > Given that I'm considering building a new machine, can you point to > references please? I wasn't aware any 3D GFX manufacturer had released > any significant specs/code... Matrox G400 - the most well-supported, most stable X11 drivers that are available. Yea, it won't give you insane framerates with OpenGL. But if you are looking for a 3D capable card, with awesome drivers, there is no substitute. -- Ross Vandegrift ross@lug.udel.edu "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." --St. Augustine, De Genesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37 From nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Wed Dec 14 20:23:53 2005 From: nando at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Fernando Lopez-Lezcano) Date: Wed Dec 14 20:23:58 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <20051214214736.GA19152@moongate.thevoid.net> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> <20051214214736.GA19152@moongate.thevoid.net> Message-ID: <1134609833.12850.68.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 22:47 +0100, Christian Ohm wrote: > On Wednesday, 14 December 2005 at 18:54, Rob Fell wrote: > > Lee Revell wrote: > > >... It would be understandable if > > >there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the > > >case. > > > > Given that I'm considering building a new machine, can you point to > > references please? I wasn't aware any 3D GFX manufacturer had released > > any significant specs/code... > > As far as I know the fastest 3D card with open drivers is the Radeon > 8500/9100 (developed from specs ATI released at the time) - and I've > heard even those are noticeably faster with the closed source drivers. Actually AFAIK the Radeon 9250 is the latest that has 3d accel with open source drivers. -- Fernando From cmetzler at speakeasy.net Wed Dec 14 23:03:34 2005 From: cmetzler at speakeasy.net (cmetzler@speakeasy.net) Date: Wed Dec 14 23:03:43 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) Message-ID: > > Matrox G400 - the most well-supported, most stable X11 drivers that > are available. > > Yea, it won't give you insane framerates with OpenGL. But if you are > looking for a 3D capable card, with awesome drivers, there is no > substitute. It not only won't give you insane framerates, it won't give you livable framerates on a lot of stuff. FlightGear, for instance, is unusable on either a Matrox G400 or a G550 (unless you like 2-4 frames per second on an Athlon XP 2000+ box). Then, on top of that, in OpenGL scenes that involve lots of detailed texturing on lots of polys, both G400 and G550 users have routinely reported full system hard lockups with DMA idle timeouts (see the BTS for XF86, X.org, freedesktop.org, the DRI project, and the forums at Matrox for more). But don't bother mentioning any of the above to Matrox -- they'll simply tell you that however free their drivers may be, OpenGL is *not supported in Linux*, and any OpenGL problems you have, you're on your own. That right there is a showstopper. I bought a Matrox card *because* of the open drivers; when their response to my hard lockup problems was "we don't support OpenGL on Linux", I ended up feeling like I'd been taken. -c From fullgo at dellorfano.net Wed Dec 14 23:18:51 2005 From: fullgo at dellorfano.net (Joseph Dell'Orfano) Date: Wed Dec 14 23:18:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Guitar amp emulator for Linux? In-Reply-To: <200512142110.38245.ce@christeck.de> References: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> <200512142110.38245.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <1134620331.11941.4.camel@Mike> I am using a commercial plugin called Amplitube (version 1.0) This works perfectly under jack-fst. -Joe On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 21:10 +0100, Christoph Eckert wrote: > Hi, > > > > So, if you work with some kind of amp simulator, effects, vst, > > whatever, that let get those kind of guitars, tell me. I don't know > > what kind of music you listen to or you compose, but guitars like > > Stratovarius and Nightwish have, could be an exact example of what I > > need. > > There's Creox, but there doesn't seem too much development on it. > > I once wanted to use my Linux box as an guitar amp emulator, but then I > bought a Behringer V-Amp 2 and am just happy. It's reasonably priced > and easy to handle. > > > If you think this topic is away from the idea of the list, > > contact me using my mail avoiding the list. > > I changed the subject to make it on-topic ;-))) . > > > Best regards > > > ce > -- Joseph Dell'Orfano From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 00:08:52 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Thu Dec 15 00:08:58 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A09DB3.3030400@laposte.net> Message-ID: <20051215050852.3674.qmail@web52602.mail.yahoo.com> Thanks, I will look into that. --- Guillaume Meurisse wrote: > Sean Edwards wrote: > > >Currently, I am trying to decide between an RME > >Hammerfall and an M-Audio Delta 1010 audio card. > Just > >as the 3D provides video performance, the RME > >Hammerfall does the same for audio, off loading the > >audio processing away from the main cpu. The alsa > >project also says both cards are supported. > > > A layla3G may be a better choice. it's cheaper tha > RME and better than > M-audio. > > guitoo > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ross at jose.lug.udel.edu Thu Dec 15 00:28:34 2005 From: ross at jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) Date: Thu Dec 15 00:28:37 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20051215052834.GA6274@jose.lug.udel.edu> On Thu, Dec 15, 2005 at 04:03:34AM +0000, cmetzler@speakeasy.net wrote: > It not only won't give you insane framerates, it won't give you > livable framerates on a lot of stuff. Well, remember that the card doesn't have a hardware geometry engine for transform and lighting. Of course it's going to be slow on a lot of cutting edge stuff. If that's the issue, see Lee's comment about free software and priorities that started this dicussion. > But don't bother mentioning any of > the above to Matrox -- they'll simply tell you that however free their > drivers may be, OpenGL is *not supported in Linux*, and any OpenGL > problems you have, you're on your own. That right there is a > showstopper. I bought a Matrox card *because* of the open drivers; > when their response to my hard lockup problems was "we don't support > OpenGL on Linux", I ended up feeling like I'd been taken. Heh, I think you misunderstand how free drivers work. You're caught up in the Windows model. Here's how it works (more or less) on Windows: 1) Hardware vendor writes a driver some API MS provides 2) You communicate with hardware vendor for support of the driver, which may or may not work well. Free software drivers work like this: 1) Vendor provides a sample implementation or hardware documentation to someone or some organization 2) That individual (who usually has nothing to do with the manufacturer!) produces a driver 3) You communicate to the hardware vendor and they say "WTF, we didn't write that dude...", AND THEY ARE RIGHT In the Windows case, I understand why you'd expect to get help from the vendor. In the free software driver case, I don't really see why you would expect that. -- Ross Vandegrift ross@lug.udel.edu "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." --St. Augustine, De Genesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37 From loki.davison at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 00:54:47 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Thu Dec 15 00:55:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512141405g85be425i3637c4df5c639aab@mail.gmail.com> References: <20051214183442.27195.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <1134586565.12086.40.camel@mindpipe> <5bdc1c8b0512141405g85be425i3637c4df5c639aab@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On 12/15/05, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/14/05, Lee Revell wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 10:34 -0800, R Parker wrote: > > > The reason you piss people off is because every > > > helpful reply you make has a snide condescending > > > remark in it somewhere. Very seldomly do you reply > > > without registering your intolerance and your > > > superiority over whomever it is that you are > > > supposedly helping. > > > > > > Why should anyone even bother posting on this mailing > > > list when they will be expecting you to insult them? > > > > You are probably right. Really, I'm a nice guy, I guess my only excuse > > is that I spend a lot of time on development mailing lists where this > > type of behavior is tolerated at best and encouraged at worst. > > > > Sorry if I offended anyone... > > > > Lee > > Lee, > You've offended me at least a once or twice... ;-) > > That said you've helped me at least a million times more. I, for > one, am happoy that you're here. > > - Mark I have to admit, i was getting a touch annoyed there, as not all of us have limitless money to get what we want as far as opensource and fast goes. I'm still happy this list ends up friendly and happy. I was looking for a card with opensource drivers when i got my nvidia, but i really have to admit i'm very happy with my nvidia card with it's evil commercial drivers. It was 30 euro, and for that price you can't get a lot of pci-e stuff, with 256 mb of DDR3 mem that can play Red Orchestra (native linux) etc at max quality and good frame rates. to quote the opengraphics faq " *Will I be able to play Doom 3 with this hardware?* Nope, but at the time of this writing, there is no graphics card on the market on which you can play Doom 3 well while using open source drivers. Less demanding games are likely to work however. " my 6600le sli, plays doom 3 at 75 frames a sec 1024 X 768, at good quality settings. It's still a dull game though ;-) The opengraphics site says it's only pci, then agp. I've got pci-e. Given that the opengraphics card doesn't actually exist yet, but comparing the specs... 6600le opengraphics 1.2 Billion pixels/s :: 400 million pixels/s 4 Pixel Pipelines at 425 :: Dual pixel pipeline at 200 Mhz 1000 MHz memory :: 400 hz memory 3 Vertex Pipelines :: doesn't mention anything about them easy to overclock :: pretty much maxed out. so the open graphics card seem in the same league as an old $10 matrox that has open source drivers. Not anything like my 6600le, or even my onboard pci-e card, which has much higher specs than the opengraphics one. >From the faq " It will accelerate games to varying degrees, but that is not its primary purpose." So yeah, it all depends on what you want, good, fast, cheap and open, choose 2 ;-) Anyway... back to me trying to learn guitar. guitar is REALLY fun ;-) Trying to learn i'm on fire, bruce springsteen. Loki From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Thu Dec 15 04:22:50 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Thu Dec 15 04:24:15 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> Sean Edwards wrote: > My experience is at best anecdotal, but my VooDoo 3D > AGP card has been supported for a few years; too bad > they are out of business now. Tux Racer and Chromium > scream across my screen on just have a K7 500Mhz with > 768 MB RAM. > > I don't know if anybody remembers getting nvidia cards > to work under RedHat 7.1 or 7.2, but the instructions > included "patching" (more like creating a memory hole) > in the kernel for the card to work. Comparing old > apples to old apples, I prefer my VooDoo 3D. > > Rather than going out to get the latest and greatest > hardware, I tend to look first at what is currently > supported under Linux. It may not be the newest, but > at least it will work, and usually work well. Code > maturity is important when considering hardware > drivers. > > Currently, I am trying to decide between an RME > Hammerfall and an M-Audio Delta 1010 audio card. Just > as the 3D provides video performance, the RME > Hammerfall does the same for audio, off loading the > audio processing away from the main cpu. The alsa > project also says both cards are supported. > HI I would have to say the RME on this, its supported on Linux (no control panel as such yet) but jack shows all what you need. As you say it just runs very well for Multitrack. Cheers Bob > That's my $.02US anyway. > > -=cybersean3000=- > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > -- Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From tito at rumford.de Thu Dec 15 05:59:09 2005 From: tito at rumford.de (Wolfgang Woehl) Date: Thu Dec 15 05:59:56 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was =?iso-8859-1?q?Re=3A=09=5Blinux-audio-user=5D=20Re=3A=20The=20best?= =?iso-8859-1?q?=20distro=20for=20music?= creation) In-Reply-To: <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <200512151158.35416.tito@rumford.de> studio-64 : > HI I would have to say the RME on this, its > supported on Linux (no control panel as such yet) What do you mean? There are "hdspmixer" and "hdspconf". From bwanab+lau at juraview.com Thu Dec 15 06:21:32 2005 From: bwanab+lau at juraview.com (Bill Allen) Date: Thu Dec 15 06:21:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Guitars In-Reply-To: <43A08439.8050008@tiscali.co.uk> References: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> <43A08439.8050008@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <43A151BC.3080807@juraview.com> guy wrote: > The most important element is speaker emulation. Without it distorted > guitars have that 'wasp in jam jar' sound. Fortunately there is a > great LADSPA plug-in for this in Tim Goetze's excellent caps plug-in > suite. Put this (it calls itself cabinet emulation) in a LADSPA > effects chain after the pre-amp/distortion effect of choice & before > your reverb/delay of choice & choose which speaker sound to use > according to taste & which axe is plugged in. I have been thrilled > with the results. I am away from my Linux Music box at the mo, if you > are interested I will put up exactly what chain I use when I can get > to check it out. > > Hope this helps > > Guy ( hopefully putting the axe into Linaxe ;0) ) > > Juan Marcelo Rodr?guez wrote: > >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >> Hash: SHA1 >> >> Hello guys, >> Im a keyboardist, and Im working everyday composing and recording >> my songs using ardour as the center of my records. >> >> I have a Korg synth, and I haven't problems with the songs, I have >> enough patchs as I need to use: piano, strings, synths, etc's, >> because those sounds are great for me. The question is, that I need to >> record some riffs, or some *strong* chords with guitars and I cannot >> get a realistic and big sound for that. > While I wholeheartedly second the suggestion to use Tim Goetze's CAPS plugins for Amp/Cabinet simulation for guitar, if you are planning to use keyboard to do guitar chords, I'm not sure that you'll ever find the right patches that will sound right. In my experience, the only way to get good guitar is with a guitar. I'm also a sax player and I have had good luck find soundfonts for tenor and alto that are passable, but I've never been happy with any electric guitar soundfonts. Regards, Bill From shakti at bayarea.net Thu Dec 15 06:42:04 2005 From: shakti at bayarea.net (Tracey Hytry) Date: Thu Dec 15 06:42:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134588187.12086.49.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> <1134588187.12086.49.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051215034204.282882f7.shakti@bayarea.net> Darn, it's late at night and I still haven't caught up on all of the discussion about the nvidia(etc) drivers, but. We only use linux on our machines and do play WoW with them because windows is such a pain to keep around just to play an on line game. I don't like to dual boot a computer and shut down a good linux session just because we like to play World of Warcraft. So we use wine and the closed source nvidia drivers to get the opengl speed that we need to play the game while listening to music(even a softsynth) with jack at low latencies*. Recently we needed to install Fedora 4 on a athlon 64 dual core and now we're starting to see the problems as the linux preemption clashes with the nvidia drivers. Not a pretty sight. We managed to get some stability with the 2.6.11 kernels but it all goes to hell with the 2.6.14. After a lot of reconfiguring, trying different kernels, and a lot of wasted time; we found what will work at least. We started to dig around for what others were doing with this situation and came accross this site: http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=14 where there seems to be a healthy amount of finger pointing from the linux side and the nvidia side about things working or not. It really looks like no one is right or wrong on this, and at least both sides are trying to get things to work. I feel that just like the low latency audio issues where we needed to be more vocal to get decent audio into the linux kernel; we prolly need to make more noise to the kernel folks to be sure things are clean, and to the nvidia people that they need to accept that it's a new world where preemption is the norm. Tracey. *We use our machines for high end audio and development first, but it's funny how a well tuned linux box can outpreform a windows box in that game. From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Thu Dec 15 06:43:29 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Thu Dec 15 06:43:45 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <200512151158.35416.tito@rumford.de> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512151158.35416.tito@rumford.de> Message-ID: <43A156E1.9050309@walescomputers.co.uk> Wolfgang Woehl wrote: > studio-64 : > >>HI I would have to say the RME on this, its >>supported on Linux (no control panel as such yet) > > > What do you mean? There are "hdspmixer" and "hdspconf". > > > Unfortunatly the hammerfall isin't found by these apps, no idea why, as the reason I bought the RME was for Linux support. Here is the putput of hdspconf: ******************** Looking for HDSP cards : Card 0 : RME Digi9636 (Rev 1.5) at 0xfd000000, irq 169 Card 1 : EDIROL UM-1 at usb-0000:00:0f.0-1, full speed Card 2 : MPU-401 UART at 0x330, irq 5 No Hammerfall DSP card found. 64studio:~# ********************* card is there and is used by jack no problems (I dont think I can set the sample rate through jack though) Cheers Bob Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From jayv at synth.net Thu Dec 15 07:30:41 2005 From: jayv at synth.net (Jay Vaughan) Date: Thu Dec 15 07:30:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051215034204.282882f7.shakti@bayarea.net> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> <1134588187.12086.49.camel@mindpipe> <20051215034204.282882f7.shakti@bayarea.net> Message-ID: >*We use our machines for high end audio and development first, but >it's funny how a well tuned linux box can outpreform a windows box >in that game. hey, i think the hottest use of linux for video gaming right now is in devices like the gp2x .. you wanna see how well linux can do gaming, just get one of these hot little boxes .. http://gbax.com/ i think the old argument 'you cant play games on linux' is well and truly dead, and the argument 'you cant do audio/video on linux' is also, extremely crufty. so for me the answer to the 'best distro for linux to do _blah_' is, and always has been, the one you roll yourself and share with your friends. and to do that you need hardware. right now, machines like the gp2x, cheap, battery powered and powerful, represent some pretty nice linux hardware .. and, get this, headsup you jackd types, usb-audio gadget drivers on this box means you've suddenly got, for a hundred bucks, two 200mhz processors you can apply to synthesis/audio/sound .. oh, and the requisite streaming mass storage, and a bit of 'ram, of course .. ;) for me, the desktop is dead. good riddance! -- ; Jay Vaughan From g.meurisse at laposte.net Thu Dec 15 07:39:20 2005 From: g.meurisse at laposte.net (Guillaume Meurisse) Date: Thu Dec 15 07:39:42 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A156E1.9050309@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512151158.35416.tito@rumford.de> <43A156E1.9050309@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <43A163F8.1080207@laposte.net> > ******************** > Looking for HDSP cards : > Card 0 : RME Digi9636 (Rev 1.5) at 0xfd000000, irq 169 > Card 1 : EDIROL UM-1 at usb-0000:00:0f.0-1, full speed > Card 2 : MPU-401 UART at 0x330, irq 5 Your sound card is not a Hammerfall dsp card. Drivers for this card are far behind those written for hdsp rme. guitoo From cmetzler at speakeasy.net Thu Dec 15 08:14:04 2005 From: cmetzler at speakeasy.net (cmetzler@speakeasy.net) Date: Thu Dec 15 08:14:09 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) Message-ID: > Heh, I think you misunderstand how free drivers work. You're caught > up in the Windows model. No, I'm not. In fact, I've never used Windows at home, ever. Not once. I started using Linux in 1996; prior to that, I didn't even have a home computer, living entirely on SunOS and various SYSV machines at work. > Free software drivers work like this: > > 1) Vendor provides a sample implementation or hardware documentation > to someone or some organization > 2) That individual (who usually has nothing to do with the > manufacturer!) produces a driver > 3) You communicate to the hardware vendor and they say "WTF, we didn't > write that dude...", AND THEY ARE RIGHT Except this is wrong in the Matrox case, since the drivers were written by Matrox. This is why Matrox got so popular in the first place -- they *wrote free drivers for Linux*. But along the way, after several years of maintaining them, they decided to no longer do so. In the meantime, the DRI project's one expert on Matrox bailed, who worked with the folks at Matrox on maintaining the drivers, also bailed, and they didn't find someone to replace him. This left Matrox in general, and 3D in Matrox in particular, without any support on either the corporate end or the volunteer end. But people still go around saying that Matrox cards have well-supported free drivers, including effective 3D drivers. It isn't so. -c From core at jacklab.net Thu Dec 15 09:04:27 2005 From: core at jacklab.net (Michael Bohle) Date: Thu Dec 15 09:04:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] rosegarden4 from cvs - build problems Message-ID: <1134655467.9183.19.camel@jacklab.metanet> This is a message from our jacklab team member Appleonkel: > Hi all, > > I want to build a RPM for SuSE 10.0. > It is all fine but i build as user > and there the problems. > It's all OK until: > > scons DESTDIR=/var/tmp/rosegarden4-1.2_cvs-build install > it install not all to DESTDIR. > > It fails with "Permission denied: > '/opt/kde3/share/icons/locolor/16x16/apps/x-rosegarden.xpm'" > > Why it not install to > DESTDIR/opt/kde3/share/icons/locolor/16x16/apps/? > > thanks for your work and help > > Olli ----------------------------------------------------- www.opensuse.org/JackLab | www.jacklab.net | irc.freenode.net #jacklab From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Thu Dec 15 09:18:33 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Thu Dec 15 09:15:58 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <1134656314.7539.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> > > Currently, I am trying to decide between an RME > > Hammerfall and an M-Audio Delta 1010 audio card. Just > > as the 3D provides video performance, the RME > > Hammerfall does the same for audio, off loading the > > audio processing away from the main cpu. The alsa > > project also says both cards are supported. this is an unfortunate reading of BS marketing text. the hammerfall series (digiXXXX and HDSP) do nothing of the sort, they never did, they don't on any other OS, etc etc etc. all that RME is referring to here are 2 things: a) direct monitoring without CPU involvement - well yeah, except that even consumer analog cards do that b) the card is a DMA busmaster, and so the CPU doesn't need to be involved in transferring data to the card, it just stuffs it into host-side RAM - well yeah, except that almost every other PCI card on the planet *except* RME's earlier designs do this too. this is really just an apology for the incredibly stupid design of the digi96 series, which require active participation by the host CPU to move data to the card. --p From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Thu Dec 15 09:26:41 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Thu Dec 15 09:24:11 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A163F8.1080207@laposte.net> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> <200512151158.35416.tito@rumford.de> <43A156E1.9050309@walescomputers.co.uk> <43A163F8.1080207@laposte.net> Message-ID: <1134656801.7539.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Thu, 2005-12-15 at 13:39 +0100, Guillaume Meurisse wrote: > > ******************** > > Looking for HDSP cards : > > Card 0 : RME Digi9636 (Rev 1.5) at 0xfd000000, irq 169 > > Card 1 : EDIROL UM-1 at usb-0000:00:0f.0-1, full speed > > Card 2 : MPU-401 UART at 0x330, irq 5 > > Your sound card is not a Hammerfall dsp card. Drivers for this card are > far behind those written for hdsp rme. far behind is a bit of an mis-statement. the cards are older and haven't changed much, and so the drivers are older and haven't changed much. its unfortunate that thomas charbonnel's hsdpconf does not work for the digiXXXX series, because everything (or almost everything) that they control also exists on the digiXXXX series devices. if somebody had the time, this would probably be rather easy to fix. --p From pinojazz at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 09:49:34 2005 From: pinojazz at gmail.com (Carlos Pino) Date: Thu Dec 15 09:49:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Ardour-0.99 compiled with vst support --" Normalize" function doesn't work In-Reply-To: <43A0A535.30806@gmail.com> References: <43A0A535.30806@gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A1827E.3060308@gmail.com> Carlos Pino wrote: > Hi there. > > I compiled ardour-0.99 with vst (fst) support with this scons command: > > scons BUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS=1 USE_SSE_EVERYWHERE=0 VST=1 > VSTPATH=/home/supertux/vst/fst-1.7 PREFIX=/usr KSI=no DEBUG=yes > > To do this I copied,before, the > fst-1.7/fst.h and fst-1.7/vst/ to ardour-099/libs/ardour build > directory > and > > the SC* files from fst-1.7/ardour amd fst-1.7/gtk_ardour to > ardour-0.99 and ardour-0.99/gtk_ardour build directorys > > Everything during the the compilation proccess went fine, no > errors,scons install did his task succesfuly. > After this ardour run ok,all the vst fx been recognized fine ,but > the "normalize" function doesn't work. > If the compilation is made without vst support ,"normalize" works fine. > > Any idea? > Hi again. The same happens with "reverse" function Saludos --Carlos. From cesare at poeticstudios.com Thu Dec 15 09:58:25 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Thu Dec 15 09:59:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Using open source audio software on an iBook 2gen (2001). What's the best solution? Message-ID: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> I mean, if I install a PPC gnu/Linux (I was thinking about Slackintosh because I really love Slackware) I'll be able to use all the hardware I can already use on my x86 box (expecially my Edirol UA-25)? Or it's better to compile the software I need (jack, ardour, zynaddsubfx) on MacOS X and buy a shiny new pc laptop when I'll have the money (It will take a long time :-) )? Does someone has experience with this? Thanks in advance, c. www.cesaremarilungo.com From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 10:11:13 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Thu Dec 15 10:11:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Using open source audio software on an iBook 2gen (2001). What's the best solution? In-Reply-To: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <20051215151113.37804.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> Have you looked into Fink? I even had Evolution working on my Mac, when I had one: http://fink.sourceforge.net/ --- Cesare Marilungo wrote: > I mean, if I install a PPC gnu/Linux (I was thinking > about Slackintosh > because I really love Slackware) I'll be able to use > all the hardware I > can already use on my x86 box (expecially my Edirol > UA-25)? > > Or it's better to compile the software I need (jack, > ardour, > zynaddsubfx) on MacOS X and buy a shiny new pc > laptop when I'll have the > money (It will take a long time :-) )? > > Does someone has experience with this? > > Thanks in advance, > > c. > www.cesaremarilungo.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From lau at kudla.org Thu Dec 15 10:28:50 2005 From: lau at kudla.org (Rob) Date: Thu Dec 15 10:32:29 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Using open source audio software on an iBook 2gen (2001). What's the best solution? In-Reply-To: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <200512151028.50430.lau@kudla.org> On Thu December 15 2005 09:58, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Or it's better to compile the software I need (jack, ardour, > zynaddsubfx) on MacOS X and buy a shiny new pc laptop when > I'll have the money (It will take a long time :-) )? If it's gonna take a long time, might as well wait for the x86 iBooks to show up. That's what I'm doing (my Dell laptop is about a year younger than your iBook.) Rob From fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk Thu Dec 15 10:48:54 2005 From: fsmith at walescomputers.co.uk (studio-64) Date: Thu Dec 15 10:49:06 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <1134656314.7539.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> <1134656314.7539.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <43A19066.5070506@walescomputers.co.uk> Paul Davis wrote: >>>Currently, I am trying to decide between an RME >>>Hammerfall and an M-Audio Delta 1010 audio card. Just >>>as the 3D provides video performance, the RME >>>Hammerfall does the same for audio, off loading the >>>audio processing away from the main cpu. The alsa >>>project also says both cards are supported. > > > this is an unfortunate reading of BS marketing text. > > the hammerfall series (digiXXXX and HDSP) do nothing of the sort, they > never did, they don't on any other OS, etc etc etc. > > all that RME is referring to here are 2 things: > > a) direct monitoring without CPU involvement > - well yeah, except that even consumer analog > cards do that > > b) the card is a DMA busmaster, and so the CPU doesn't > need to be involved in transferring data to the > card, it just stuffs it into host-side RAM > - well yeah, except that almost every other > PCI card on the planet *except* RME's > earlier designs do this too. this is > really just an apology for the incredibly > stupid design of the digi96 series, which > require active participation by the host > CPU to move data to the card. > > --p > > > That explains why this was cheaper at the time (over a year ago) I thought I would get this as: 1 It was supported 2 I could add more cards as the system grew 3 The website seemed to infer Linux Support I didnt really worry about monitoring and latency as I was using the DDX and this controlled the monitors as in most analogue studios. Apart from Word clock the HDSP card didnt seem that diffrerent. It's a shame RME have allowed the marketing depatment to run the company! Cheers Bob Bearmusic hearmymusic.co.uk From dsbaikov at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 11:30:31 2005 From: dsbaikov at gmail.com (Dmitry Baikov) Date: Thu Dec 15 11:31:04 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <20051215012017.GA770@jose.lug.udel.edu> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> <20051215012017.GA770@jose.lug.udel.edu> Message-ID: <70a871c80512150830o8d6735cg499fc2261b9f6fa@mail.gmail.com> > Yea, it won't give you insane framerates with OpenGL. But if you are> looking for a 3D capable card, with awesome drivers, there is no> substitute. The really bad thing is, that no cards except for modern NVIDIA's andATI's support GLSL and programmable shading in general. AFAIK, ATIdrivers works much worse than NVIDIA ones. So if you want to processvideo/3d using modern technologies you have no choice - NVIDIA only. And yes, it has direct implications on media art. Take a look at newversion of Jitter (Max/MSP addon) or Quartz Composer on MacOS X. Theyall use GPU to process video. Moreover, I am very sceptical on possibility to create such a GPU in aopen source way.If only nvidia/ati opened their driver sources... --Dmitry From ciccolix at tiscalinet.it Thu Dec 15 12:26:41 2005 From: ciccolix at tiscalinet.it (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lazzaro_Nicol=F2_Ciccolella?=) Date: Thu Dec 15 11:31:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Using open source audio software on an iBook 2gen (2001). What's the best solution? In-Reply-To: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <43A1A751.2060503@tiscalinet.it> Cesare Marilungo ha scritto: > I mean, if I install a PPC gnu/Linux (I was thinking about Slackintosh > because I really love Slackware I also love slackware (on intel computers), but in my experience with a mac computer (now i have a "mac mini") the best solution was ubuntu and gentoo (actualy run gentoo-ppc). > Or it's better to compile the software I need (jack, ardour, > zynaddsubfx) on MacOS X but "MacOS X" isnt linux :) ciao -- Lazzaro From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Thu Dec 15 12:02:26 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Thu Dec 15 11:59:58 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A19066.5070506@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> <1134656314.7539.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <43A19066.5070506@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <1134666146.7539.36.camel@localhost.localdomain> > > all that RME is referring to here are 2 things: > > > > a) direct monitoring without CPU involvement > > - well yeah, except that even consumer analog > > cards do that > > > > b) the card is a DMA busmaster, and so the CPU doesn't > > need to be involved in transferring data to the > > card, it just stuffs it into host-side RAM > > - well yeah, except that almost every other > > PCI card on the planet *except* RME's > > earlier designs do this too. this is > > really just an apology for the incredibly > > stupid design of the digi96 series, which > > require active participation by the host > > CPU to move data to the card. > > > > --p > > > > > > > > That explains why this was cheaper at the time (over a year ago) > I thought I would get this as: you should try to clarify what you mean by "this" in the last 2 sentences. > 1 It was supported > 2 I could add more cards as the system grew > 3 The website seemed to infer Linux Support all 3 are true for the digi96 series, the digi96XX series and the HDSP series. the digi96 is not recommended, however. --p From cesare at poeticstudios.com Thu Dec 15 12:14:08 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Thu Dec 15 12:15:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Using open source audio software on an iBook 2gen (2001). What's the best solution? In-Reply-To: <43A1A751.2060503@tiscalinet.it> References: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> <43A1A751.2060503@tiscalinet.it> Message-ID: <43A1A460.5070900@poeticstudios.com> Lazzaro Nicol? Ciccolella wrote: > Cesare Marilungo ha scritto: > >> I mean, if I install a PPC gnu/Linux (I was thinking about >> Slackintosh because I really love Slackware > > > I also love slackware (on intel computers), but in my experience with > a mac computer (now i have a "mac mini") the best solution was ubuntu > and gentoo (actualy run gentoo-ppc). > >> Or it's better to compile the software I need (jack, ardour, >> zynaddsubfx) on MacOS X > > > but "MacOS X" isnt linux :) > > ciao > -- > Lazzaro > > > > In fact, what I'm hoping to hear from you people here is that someone is actually using a ppc distro on an iBook and that all the hardware I'll need to make music is supported. :-P c. p.s. Lazzaro, alzati e cammina! Perdonami, non ho resistito. Ma so che con il mio nome potrai vendicarti. :-) From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Thu Dec 15 12:32:12 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Thu Dec 15 12:32:15 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Using open source audio software on an iBook 2gen (2001). What's the best solution? In-Reply-To: <43A1A460.5070900@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <20051215173212.38257.qmail@web52612.mail.yahoo.com> I use Debian Testing on Mac G3 Blue and White with no problems. -=cybersean3000=- --- Cesare Marilungo wrote: > In fact, what I'm hoping to hear from you people > here is that someone is > actually using a ppc distro on an iBook and that > all the hardware I'll > need to make music is supported. :-P > > c. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From cesare at poeticstudios.com Thu Dec 15 13:09:56 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Thu Dec 15 13:11:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. Message-ID: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> Ok, shame on me for this, but I would really really like to share with you my latest musical efforts. Unfortunately, I was already working on these tracks when I finally got everything working on gnu/Linux audio. So I finished these tracks (made with mostly with free VST plugins, my guitar and some vocals) on my copies of Tracktion on MacOSX and WinXP (Mackie gave them away for free last christmas to promote their forthcoming newer version). BTW it's a shame that a software made by one guy alone, using mostly opensource LGPL libraries and with an XML file format hasn't been released opensource. But I believe that when Ardour will have MIDI integration, it would be even better than Tracktion (it is already far better IMHO if you consider just the audio functionalities). I will probably retouch these tracks with jamin for the final cd version, but I'm already concentrated on new stuff now (using only o.s.s.). I don't like to think in terms of genres, but people often describes my music as ambient. So don't bother to download it if you don't like ambient. Anyway, If you'll consider listening to my new EP (released under the cc-licence) you can grab it here: http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_Moon_EP.zip It's a 27Mb zip with 4 mp3 tracks (192Kbps). Title is: The Moon EP (code name: last of the closed source sw tracks). Or for individual tracks: http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/As_we_grow_older.mp3 http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/Hope.mp3 http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_moon.mp3 http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_difference.mp3 I'm still working on the cover. Thank you very much. c. From rlrevell at joe-job.com Thu Dec 15 13:29:31 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Thu Dec 15 13:27:00 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <43A19066.5070506@walescomputers.co.uk> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> <1134656314.7539.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <43A19066.5070506@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <1134671371.12086.138.camel@mindpipe> On Thu, 2005-12-15 at 15:48 +0000, studio-64 wrote: > It's a shame RME have allowed the marketing depatment to run the > company! Welcome to capitalism in the 21st century. Products inexorably get worse due to investor demand for ever-increasing profit margins and the consumer is left holding the bag. Lee From hans at fugal.net Thu Dec 15 13:30:10 2005 From: hans at fugal.net (Hans Fugal) Date: Thu Dec 15 13:30:17 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Using open source audio software on an iBook 2gen (2001). What's the best solution? In-Reply-To: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A18491.8090400@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <20051215183010.GB16318@falcon.fugal.net> On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 at 15:58 +0100, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > I mean, if I install a PPC gnu/Linux (I was thinking about Slackintosh > because I really love Slackware) I'll be able to use all the hardware I > can already use on my x86 box (expecially my Edirol UA-25)? I suppose that if the hardware can plug into the iBook there's a good chance it will work. I have an iBook G4 which I dual-boot (Debian) and it is able to talk to my midi controller (USB) just fine. In general, I think you'll find hardware support to be basically equivalent. > Or it's better to compile the software I need (jack, ardour, > zynaddsubfx) on MacOS X and buy a shiny new pc laptop when I'll have the > money (It will take a long time :-) )? If the hardware works in OS X, and in Linux on x86, then it would definitely surprise me if it didn't work in linux on your iBook. -- Hans Fugal ; http://hans.fugal.net There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself. -- Johann Sebastian Bach -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051215/24014267/attachment.bin From drobilla at connect.carleton.ca Thu Dec 15 13:51:35 2005 From: drobilla at connect.carleton.ca (Dave Robillard) Date: Thu Dec 15 13:52:32 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <1134609833.12850.68.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> <20051214214736.GA19152@moongate.thevoid.net> <1134609833.12850.68.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> Message-ID: <1134672695.2850.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Wed, 2005-14-12 at 17:23 -0800, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 22:47 +0100, Christian Ohm wrote: > > On Wednesday, 14 December 2005 at 18:54, Rob Fell wrote: > > > Lee Revell wrote: > > > >... It would be understandable if > > > >there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the > > > >case. > > > > > > Given that I'm considering building a new machine, can you point to > > > references please? I wasn't aware any 3D GFX manufacturer had released > > > any significant specs/code... > > > > As far as I know the fastest 3D card with open drivers is the Radeon > > 8500/9100 (developed from specs ATI released at the time) - and I've > > heard even those are noticeably faster with the closed source drivers. > > Actually AFAIK the Radeon 9250 is the latest that has 3d accel with open > source drivers. Not to mention that people still work on the Radeon driver, whereas the Matrox stuff has been all but dead for years. Also, Matrox's new (PCI-E) releases of the Millenium series has gone proprietary as well. What a world... -DR- From markknecht at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 14:05:36 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Thu Dec 15 14:05:41 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <1134671371.12086.138.camel@mindpipe> References: <20051214221643.63430.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> <43A135EA.3030900@walescomputers.co.uk> <1134656314.7539.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <43A19066.5070506@walescomputers.co.uk> <1134671371.12086.138.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512151105j565587dcgef48555659fb07b3@mail.gmail.com> On 12/15/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Thu, 2005-12-15 at 15:48 +0000, studio-64 wrote: > > It's a shame RME have allowed the marketing depatment to run the > > company! > > Welcome to capitalism in the 21st century. Products inexorably get > worse due to investor demand for ever-increasing profit margins and the > consumer is left holding the bag. > > Lee Is RME publicly traded? I thought not. This may be a case where they just let the marketing guys run amuck... - Mark From rlrevell at joe-job.com Thu Dec 15 14:15:27 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Thu Dec 15 14:12:50 2005 Subject: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation) In-Reply-To: <1134672695.2850.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <43A06A79.8030609@curates-egg.org> <20051214214736.GA19152@moongate.thevoid.net> <1134609833.12850.68.camel@cmn3.stanford.edu> <1134672695.2850.4.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1134674128.12086.153.camel@mindpipe> On Thu, 2005-12-15 at 13:51 -0500, Dave Robillard wrote: > On Wed, 2005-14-12 at 17:23 -0800, Fernando Lopez-Lezcano wrote: > > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 22:47 +0100, Christian Ohm wrote: > > > On Wednesday, 14 December 2005 at 18:54, Rob Fell wrote: > > > > Lee Revell wrote: > > > > >... It would be understandable if > > > > >there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the > > > > >case. > > > > > > > > Given that I'm considering building a new machine, can you point to > > > > references please? I wasn't aware any 3D GFX manufacturer had released > > > > any significant specs/code... > > > > > > As far as I know the fastest 3D card with open drivers is the Radeon > > > 8500/9100 (developed from specs ATI released at the time) - and I've > > > heard even those are noticeably faster with the closed source drivers. > > > > Actually AFAIK the Radeon 9250 is the latest that has 3d accel with open > > source drivers. > > Not to mention that people still work on the Radeon driver, whereas the > Matrox stuff has been all but dead for years. > > Also, Matrox's new (PCI-E) releases of the Millenium series has gone > proprietary as well. What a world... According to people on LKML apparently ATI is planning to clamp down on the docs since getting the Xbox 360 contract. In the past they have released docs on the 2D engine but kept the 3D engine driver closed. The next generation of chips will not have a separate 2D engine at all but implement 2D accel with the 3D engine which they allegedly plan to keep completely closed. Lee From juan at nixbox.com.ar Thu Dec 15 16:34:18 2005 From: juan at nixbox.com.ar (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Juan_Marcelo_Rodr=EDguez?=) Date: Thu Dec 15 16:10:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Guitars In-Reply-To: <43A08439.8050008@tiscali.co.uk> References: <43A071E8.3020203@nixbox.com.ar> <43A08439.8050008@tiscali.co.uk> Message-ID: <43A1E15A.7080208@nixbox.com.ar> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 guy wrote: | The most important element is speaker emulation. Without it | distorted guitars have that 'wasp in jam jar' sound. Fortunately Exactly | there is a great LADSPA plug-in for this in Tim Goetze's excellent | caps plug-in suite. Put this (it calls itself cabinet emulation) | in a LADSPA effects chain after the pre-amp/distortion effect of | choice & before your reverb/delay of choice & choose which speaker | sound to use according to taste & which axe is plugged in. I have | been thrilled with the results. I am away from my Linux Music box | at the mo, if you are interested I will put up exactly what chain I | use when I can get to check it out. Please put it when you can, and of course all that help. Thanks. | | Hope this helps | | Guy ( hopefully putting the axe into Linaxe ;0) ) | Juan -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDoeFawWB8GXdhYbcRAlUKAJ9G1XMpLroeVfCsZutJRMOOkpJ9wgCfX23q /85e5fkrkoqeajI5sBpuuhI= =NbZV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From camro15 at gmx.de Thu Dec 15 16:11:00 2005 From: camro15 at gmx.de (Marco =?iso-8859-1?q?Schaffh=F6fer?=) Date: Thu Dec 15 16:11:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] M-Audio Audiophile 192 In-Reply-To: <200512120107.10042.phanatic@volny.cz> References: <200512100429.05490@plasmon.prima.de> <200512120107.10042.phanatic@volny.cz> Message-ID: <200512152211.00195@plasmon.prima.de> Am Montag 12 Dezember 2005 01:07 schrieb Ctirad Fertr: > Dne sobota 10 prosince 2005 04:29 Marco Schaffh?fer napsal(a): > > Hello, > > > Moreover I would like to know the differences between both cards (except > > from the sampling rate). Are there any benefits using the Audiophile 192 > > compared to the 2496? > > audiophile 192 has balanced I/O and slightly better converters. However, > some people say it sounds worse than audiophile 2496 or even that it's > noisy. I read many reviews and comments and it seems, that there is really > something wrong with this card. That doesn't sound much like any benefit. I think I'll go for the Audiophile 2496 then. Thanks a lot Marco From p.pruszczak at pro.onet.pl Thu Dec 15 17:52:28 2005 From: p.pruszczak at pro.onet.pl (p.pruszczak@pro.onet.pl) Date: Thu Dec 15 17:53:32 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] =?ISO-8859-2?Q?Re: Re: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was Re: [linux-audi= o-user] Re: The best distro for music creation)?= In-Reply-To: <43A19066.5070506@walescomputers.co.uk> Message-ID: <20051215225239Z1195071-1905+1967@kps9.test.onet.pl> get M-Audio 1010LT ;) it works, works, works :) I do NOT see any CPU usage with the PCI :):):) U?ytkownik studio-64 napisa?: >Paul Davis wrote: >>>>Currently, I am trying to decide between an RME >>>>Hammerfall and an M-Audio Delta 1010 audio card. Just >>>>as the 3D provides video performance, the RME >>>>Hammerfall does the same for audio, off loading the >>>>audio processing away from the main cpu. The alsa >>>>project also says both cards are supported. >> >> >> this is an unfortunate reading of BS marketing text. >> >> the hammerfall series (digiXXXX and HDSP) do nothing of the sort, they >> never did, they don\'t on any other OS, etc etc etc. >> >> all that RME is referring to here are 2 things: >> >> a) direct monitoring without CPU involvement >> - well yeah, except that even consumer analog >> cards do that >> >> b) the card is a DMA busmaster, and so the CPU doesn\'t >> need to be involved in transferring data to the >> card, it just stuffs it into host-side RAM >> - well yeah, except that almost every other >> PCI card on the planet *except* RME\'s >> earlier designs do this too. this is >> really just an apology for the incredibly >> stupid design of the digi96 series, which >> require active participation by the host >> CPU to move data to the card. >> >> --p >> >> >> > >That explains why this was cheaper at the time (over a year ago) >I thought I would get this as: > >1 It was supported >2 I could add more cards as the system grew >3 The website seemed to infer Linux Support > >I didnt really worry about monitoring and latency as I was using the DDX >and this controlled the monitors as in most analogue studios. > >Apart from Word clock the HDSP card didnt seem that diffrerent. > >It\'s a shame RME have allowed the marketing depatment to run the company! > >Cheers >Bob > > > > > > Bearmusic > hearmymusic.co.uk > From kjetil at ccrma.stanford.edu Thu Dec 15 19:15:44 2005 From: kjetil at ccrma.stanford.edu (Kjetil S. Matheussen) Date: Thu Dec 15 19:16:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was In-Reply-To: <200512151144.jBFBi57l011668@roar.music.columbia.edu> References: <200512151144.jBFBi57l011668@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: After working as a linux-audio sysadmin for 4 years, heres my experience with gfx-cards (my memory might be a bit unaccurate though): Matrox 400+500: Had four of those. All the machines were somewhat unstable for unknown reasons, also in windows. I'll probably never trust matrox again. I think the sharpness of those cards are overhyped, at least with long cables, its not as good as the gforce cards I have tried. Ati: Tried two the newer types 8xxx/9xxx. One of them have a picture that sometimes is a bit psychedelic, the other one caused crashes and had to be replaced (with a gforce card). Built-in intel graphics driver: Two of those, very old type. No problem, exept that it couldn't handle 1600x1200 resolution with at least 16bit colors. Very sharp pictures. Nvidia rio (or something): Had two of those. No problem with the open source drivers, but the pictures were quite blury. Nforce built-in gfx-card: Tried something like 4-5 of those. All works, but they need the binary-driver, and the picture is not sharp. Bad stuff. Nvidia gforce 2,3 and 4: Had something like 8 of them. All worked flawlessly with extremely sharp pictures. No problem with latency, because they work just fine with the open-source drivers. My next gfx card will probably be a gforce 4, if its still possible to buy it. Nvidia gforce fx: Tried one of those. In the beginning, the open source driver were horrible slow, so I had to use the binary driver. But that was fixed later, and now it works just fine with the open source driver. Very sharp picture, just like the other gforce cards. -- From illth at gmx.de Thu Dec 15 20:34:32 2005 From: illth at gmx.de (Thomas Ilnseher) Date: Thu Dec 15 20:34:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was In-Reply-To: References: <200512151144.jBFBi57l011668@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: <43A219A8.6070507@gmx.de> Kjetil S. Matheussen schrieb: > > After working as a linux-audio sysadmin for 4 years, heres my > experience with gfx-cards (my memory might be a bit unaccurate though): > > Matrox 400+500: Had four of those. All the machines were somewhat > unstable > for unknown reasons, also in windows. I'll probably never trust matrox > again. I think the sharpness of those cards are overhyped, at least > with long cables, its not as good as the gforce cards I have tried. > > Ati: Tried two the newer types 8xxx/9xxx. One of them have a picture > that sometimes is a bit psychedelic, the other one caused crashes and > had to be replaced (with a gforce card). > > Built-in intel graphics driver: Two of those, very old type. No > problem, exept that it couldn't handle 1600x1200 resolution with at > least 16bit > colors. Very sharp pictures. > > Nvidia rio (or something): Had two of those. No problem with the open > source drivers, but the pictures were quite blury. > > Nforce built-in gfx-card: Tried something like 4-5 of those. All works, > but they need the binary-driver, and the picture is not sharp. Bad stuff. > > Nvidia gforce 2,3 and 4: Had something like 8 of them. All worked > flawlessly with extremely sharp pictures. No problem with latency, > because they work just fine with the open-source drivers. My next gfx > card will probably be a gforce 4, if its still possible to buy it. > > Nvidia gforce fx: Tried one of those. In the beginning, the open > source driver were horrible slow, so I had to use the binary driver. > But that was fixed later, and now it works just fine with the open > source driver. Very sharp picture, just like the other gforce cards. > AFAIK, the problem w/ the open source driver is: a) does not support dualhead b) does not support xv / xvmc c) NO (not even slow) OpenGL support but, of course, things might have changed a bit. it's still some time gone since i last checked state of the nv driver. To comment on picture sharpness: the picture does not only depend on the chip, but also on some external filter components, and on the pcb. while the pcb's of those GFX cards often are the reference design, the filter components may be different for different brands. here in germany, a computer magazine ran some tests about the signal quality of those cards, and they have basically proven that nv chips have better ramdacs than theit ATi counterparts. But they also found some "black sheeps" among the nv cards that obviously used bad filters, so their image quality sucked, they were even worse than the good ATi cards. Anyway, i's suggest a DFP w/ DVI in, so the image will be sharp, no matter what brand your card is. I also noted that this seemed to be a discussion about matrox, nv, or ati. there is another gfx chip mfg: XGI. they released their 2D drivers as open-source. never tried them, thou, i'll stick with nv (and their closed source drivers) From yaqtil at gmail.com Thu Dec 15 21:09:39 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Thu Dec 15 21:09:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: OT: Accelerated 3D GFX cards with Free drivers (was In-Reply-To: <43A219A8.6070507@gmx.de> References: <200512151144.jBFBi57l011668@roar.music.columbia.edu> <43A219A8.6070507@gmx.de> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512151809v3889987ci6c466277bbb4a4bf@mail.gmail.com> > Anyway, i's suggest a DFP w/ DVI in, so the image will be sharp, no > matter what brand your card is. not always - had Matrox G400 powering dual-DVI setup and there was a _Ghost_ of the second screen on the first. that and the gamma was screwed up (darker areas appeared totally black) with DVI compared to VGA...and i thought that stuff was only supposed to happen on analog... nvidia definitely has the best linux driver suport, with ATi a distant second. unless youre a license/taint victim and want to suffer with some inferior or obsolete card ... From eviltwin69 at cableone.net Thu Dec 15 22:44:23 2005 From: eviltwin69 at cableone.net (Jan Depner) Date: Thu Dec 15 22:44:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134500369.19097.5.camel@mindpipe> <200512132128.52410.lau@kudla.org> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 13:01 -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > On Wed, 2005-12-14 at 09:01 -0600, Josh Lawrence wrote: > > This discussion is very helpful to me, I was unaware that proprietary > > drivers such as ATI's would cause such problems with a RT kernel. It > > was a video card that I had leftover from my Windows days, and since I > > don't have any $ to buy a new one, I'll just have to keep it for > > awhile. > > > > Well my point was that proprietary drivers are wrong, period, from both > a technical and ethical standpoint - it was not specific to the RT > kernel. It's not about whether they are buggy or not. When Linux users > buy hardware that requires propriertary drivers you are impeding the > progress of Linux and all free software. It would be understandable if > there was no 3D hardware available with open drivers but that's not the > case. > Lee, if you'll tell me what video card has an open, accelerated 3D driver that will handle 3D fly-throughs and editing of sonar and lidar data surfaces containing billions of points (that's billion with a b) I'll gladly get my office to switch. Until then it doesn't really matter to me whether it's ethical or not because I have a job to do. Look on the bright side though, I at least have most of my office using Linux for processing our data ;-) If it were just a personal issue I might use something with an open driver but so far I haven't seen one that's really capable of competing with the NVIDIA driver. > Really this is all a depressing reminder that as far as Linux has come > over the years people are STILL buying hardware to run Windows on it. > They would rather have a 5% better framerate in some game than support > free software. Is the highest purpose of Linux really just to run > proprietary games and VST plugins using Wine? If so then I'm wasting my > time. > You're definitely not wasting your time! I appreciate your input on most issues that show up on these lists. I will skip quite a few posts if the subject doesn't interest me but I usually read yours (and a number of others) 'cause you usually have the straight poop ;-) -- Jan 'Evil Twin' Depner The Fuzzy Dice http://myweb.cableone.net/eviltwin69/fuzzy.html "As we enjoy great advantages from the invention of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours, and this we should do freely and generously." Benjamin Franklin, on declining patents offered by the governor of Pennsylvania for his "Pennsylvania Fireplace", c. 1744 From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Fri Dec 16 00:36:55 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Fri Dec 16 00:37:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> Message-ID: <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> Has anybody got Behringers BCA2000 working with linux/alsa? http://www.behringer.com/BCA2000/index.cfm?lang=ENG -=cybersean3000=- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From b0ef at esben-stien.name Fri Dec 16 02:57:13 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Fri Dec 16 01:03:30 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <20051215034204.282882f7.shakti@bayarea.net> (Tracey Hytry's message of "Thu, 15 Dec 2005 03:42:04 -0800") References: <200512031702.jB3H2C7n021151@roar.music.columbia.edu> <1134583301.12086.21.camel@mindpipe> <200512141350.48883.lau@kudla.org> <1134588187.12086.49.camel@mindpipe> <20051215034204.282882f7.shakti@bayarea.net> Message-ID: <87vexp5vae.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> Tracey Hytry writes: > we prolly need to make more noise to the kernel folks to be sure > things are clean, and to the nvidia people that they need to accept > that it's a new world where preemption is the norm. Consider that a lost battle. It's more a cry to all you folks who buy hardware that requires proprietary software to stop doing it, but of course, most don't see what's really happening. When you buy, you vote and you're sending the wrong signal that this is accepted. We don't want to keep people busy reverse engineering hardware. The highest performance GPU available today with free software is r280, as far as I know, but some success is close with the r300 project. Tomorrows desktops are GPU accellerated and we definitely need a solution. I know we will find a solution somehow, or I'll be running the r280 until the end of time, even such a die hard free software gamer that I am. We need a free hardware revolution and I'm quite confident it will happen, cause these current companies are so blind they don't even see the demand. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From clemens at ladisch.de Fri Dec 16 03:16:32 2005 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Fri Dec 16 03:17:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Sean Edwards wrote: > Has anybody got Behringers BCA2000 working with > linux/alsa? No. It uses an unknown proprietary protocol. Regards, Clemens From jazzride at laposte.net Fri Dec 16 05:12:43 2005 From: jazzride at laposte.net (jazzride) Date: Fri Dec 16 05:17:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: Clemens Ladisch a ?crit : >Sean Edwards wrote: > > >>Has anybody got Behringers BCA2000 working with >>linux/alsa? >> >> > >No. It uses an unknown proprietary protocol. > > >Regards, >Clemens > > > ok what about BCF 2000 ? regards From kjetil at ccrma.stanford.edu Fri Dec 16 05:35:51 2005 From: kjetil at ccrma.stanford.edu (Kjetil S. Matheussen) Date: Fri Dec 16 05:35:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: The best distro for music creation In-Reply-To: <200512161022.jBGAMJ7l012969@roar.music.columbia.edu> References: <200512161022.jBGAMJ7l012969@roar.music.columbia.edu> Message-ID: Esben Stien: > The highest performance GPU available today with free software is > r280, as far as I know, but some success is close with the r300 > project. I think the the GPU performance is quite irrelevant for most linux audio users, although I have a feeling that the few of you who do care also yell very load about it. Whats important is sharpness and stable low-latency drivers, I think. How does r280 and r300 compete regarding those issues? -- From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Fri Dec 16 05:42:40 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Fri Dec 16 05:40:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <1134729760.8820.4.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Fri, 2005-12-16 at 11:12 +0100, jazzride wrote: > Clemens Ladisch a ?crit : > >Sean Edwards wrote: > >>Has anybody got Behringers BCA2000 working with > >>linux/alsa? > > > >No. It uses an unknown proprietary protocol. > > ok > what about BCF 2000 ? The Behringer webpage says that it has "Generic USB MIDI support with Windows XP? and MAC OS X?", which I assume means class compliant USB MIDI. In that case it should work fine with the snd-usb-audio module (or at least partially, since the webpage also mentions "Additional drivers and editor/librarian software available for free download on our website"). I hope it works, I've been thinking of getting that or the BCR2000 when I have some money to spare. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.d.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051216/a733dca1/attachment.bin From ardour at semiosix.com Fri Dec 16 02:30:22 2005 From: ardour at semiosix.com (John Anderson) Date: Fri Dec 16 05:53:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: <1134729760.8820.4.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> <1134729760.8820.4.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <1134718222.18715.2.camel@groovious> On Fri, 2005-12-16 at 11:42 +0100, Lars Luthman wrote: > On Fri, 2005-12-16 at 11:12 +0100, jazzride wrote: > > Clemens Ladisch a ?crit : > > >Sean Edwards wrote: > > >>Has anybody got Behringers BCA2000 working with > > >>linux/alsa? > > > > > >No. It uses an unknown proprietary protocol. > > > > ok > > what about BCF 2000 ? I just bought one. It works really well. It's kinda spooky to see the sliders moving by themselves. There's a bug in the 2.6.11 kernel that causes a USB keyboard to stop responding if the BCF changes its USB address, but that's been fixed in 2.6.14. > The Behringer webpage says that it has "Generic USB MIDI support with > Windows XP? and MAC OS X?", which I assume means class compliant USB > MIDI. In that case it should work fine with the snd-usb-audio module (or > at least partially, since the webpage also mentions "Additional drivers > and editor/librarian software available for free download on our > website"). I hope it works, I've been thinking of getting that or the > BCR2000 when I have some money to spare. >From what I've read, the BCR works pretty much the same as the BCF. bye John From ciccolix at tiscalinet.it Fri Dec 16 06:54:07 2005 From: ciccolix at tiscalinet.it (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Lazzaro_Nicol=F2_Ciccolella?=) Date: Fri Dec 16 05:59:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <43A2AADF.9010307@tiscalinet.it> jazzride ha scritto: > ok > what about BCF 2000 ? > regards > > it seem a midi controller (no audio in/out) From klaus.kosten at gmx.de Fri Dec 16 06:25:08 2005 From: klaus.kosten at gmx.de (Klaus Kosten) Date: Fri Dec 16 06:24:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <43A2A414.8040208@gmx.de> jazzride schrieb: > Clemens Ladisch a ?crit : > >> Sean Edwards wrote: >> >> >>> Has anybody got Behringers BCA2000 working with >>> linux/alsa? >>> >> >> >> No. It uses an unknown proprietary protocol. >> >> >> Regards, >> Clemens >> >> >> > ok > what about BCF 2000 ? > regards > > I don?t know about the BCF 2000, but I have a BCR 2000, and it works fine under Linux. The librarian/editor from Behringer?s website for both the BCR and the BCF is written in Java and works at least for the BCR, so i assume it will work for the BCF as well. There?s one drawback, though: Behringer will not release any programming information, not even about the sysex format, for these devices. Reverse engineering is required and seems possible. regards -- Klaus Kosten From b0ef at esben-stien.name Fri Dec 16 08:40:20 2005 From: b0ef at esben-stien.name (Esben Stien) Date: Fri Dec 16 06:47:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: (jazzride@laposte.net's message of "Fri, 16 Dec 2005 11:12:43 +0100") References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <8764pp5fej.fsf@quasar.esben-stien.name> jazzride writes: > what about BCF 2000 ? This is a MIDI controller and it works great; I got one. The motorized faders also works great. -- Esben Stien is b0ef@e s a http://www. s t n m irc://irc. b - i . e/%23contact [sip|iax]: e e jid:b0ef@ n n From jh at brainiac.com Fri Dec 16 06:54:22 2005 From: jh at brainiac.com (Joe Hartley) Date: Fri Dec 16 06:54:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Behringer BCA2000 In-Reply-To: References: <1134704663.3283.8.camel@eviltwin> <20051216053655.29136.qmail@web52609.mail.yahoo.com> <20051216081632.GA15343@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <20051216065422.579fcdaf.jh@brainiac.com> On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 11:12:43 +0100 jazzride wrote: > Clemens Ladisch a ?crit : > > >Sean Edwards wrote: > > > >>Has anybody got Behringers BCA2000 working with > >>linux/alsa? > > > >No. It uses an unknown proprietary protocol. > > > > > >Regards, > >Clemens > > > ok > what about BCF 2000 ? The BCF2000 works great with Ardour. See http://ardour.org/manual/using_a_bcf2000 for info on setting it up with Jack and Ardour. -- ====================================================================== Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh@brainiac.com Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa From tomcharles-edwards at fsmail.net Fri Dec 16 09:42:04 2005 From: tomcharles-edwards at fsmail.net (Tom Charles-Edwards) Date: Fri Dec 16 09:42:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM Message-ID: <25583739.1134744124728.JavaMail.www@wwinf3201> Hi there, sorry if this is a little basic for you guys but I can't mount CDROMs. If I do: mount /dev/scd0 I get: /dev/scd0 is not a valid block device My /etc/fstab is: /dev/scd0 /media/cdrom0 iso9660 ro,user,noauto 0 0 The output of ls -l /dev/cdrom0 is: brw-rw---- 1 root cdrom 11, 0 2004-05-21 02:22 /dev/scd0 The output of lsmod is: Module Size Used by Not tainted snd-seq-oss 30752 0 (autoclean) (unused) snd-seq-midi 3968 0 (autoclean) (unused) snd-seq-midi-event 3648 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi] snd-seq 41968 5 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi snd-seq-midi-event] mousedev 3832 1 keybdev 1892 0 (unused) hid 18628 0 (unused) input 3296 0 [mousedev keybdev hid] af_packet 13896 1 (autoclean) uhci 23772 0 (unused) ehci-hcd 16172 0 (unused) usbcore 56684 1 [hid uhci ehci-hcd] snd-intel8x0 21452 1 snd-ac97-codec 56604 0 [snd-intel8x0] gameport 1436 0 [snd-intel8x0] snd-mpu401-uart 4096 0 [snd-intel8x0] snd-hdsp 40520 1 snd-pcm-oss 39944 0 snd-mixer-oss 13880 2 [snd-pcm-oss] snd-pcm 65664 0 [snd-intel8x0 snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss] snd-timer 16868 0 [snd-seq snd-pcm] snd-hwdep 5280 0 [snd-hdsp] snd-page-alloc 6552 0 [snd-intel8x0 snd-hdsp snd-pcm] snd-rawmidi 14656 0 [snd-seq-midi snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp] snd-seq-device 4324 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi snd-seq snd-rawmidi] snd 36132 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-intel8x0 snd-ac97-codec snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-pcm snd-timer snd-hwdep snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device] soundcore 3876 7 [snd] 8139too 13896 1 mii 2096 0 [8139too] crc32 2864 0 [8139too] ohci1394 23024 0 (unused) ieee1394 183556 0 [ohci1394] sr_mod 12216 0 (autoclean) (unused) isofs 23480 0 (autoclean) ide-scsi 8656 0 scsi_mod 89312 2 [sr_mod ide-scsi] ide-cd 28128 0 (autoclean) cdrom 25344 0 (autoclean) [sr_mod ide-cd] ext3 71144 8 (autoclean) jbd 40312 8 (autoclean) [ext3] ide-detect 288 0 (autoclean) (unused) piix 7496 2 (autoclean) ide-disk 12704 9 (autoclean) ide-core 98268 9 (autoclean) [ide-scsi ide-cd ide-detect piix ide-disk] unix 16236 33 (autoclean) I'm using DeMuDi 1.2 with a 2.4 kernel. Any help much appreciated. Cheers, Tom From cave.dnb at tiscali.fr Fri Dec 16 10:39:57 2005 From: cave.dnb at tiscali.fr (Nigel Henry) Date: Fri Dec 16 10:51:55 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM In-Reply-To: <25583739.1134744124728.JavaMail.www@wwinf3201> References: <25583739.1134744124728.JavaMail.www@wwinf3201> Message-ID: <200512161639.57109.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> On Friday 16 December 2005 15:42, Tom Charles-Edwards wrote: > Hi there, > > sorry if this is a little basic for you guys but I can't mount CDROMs. If I > do: > > mount /dev/scd0 > > I get: > > /dev/scd0 is not a valid block device > > My /etc/fstab is: > > /dev/scd0 /media/cdrom0 iso9660 ro,user,noauto 0 0 > > The output of ls -l /dev/cdrom0 is: > > brw-rw---- 1 root cdrom 11, 0 2004-05-21 02:22 /dev/scd0 > > The output of lsmod is: > > Module Size Used by Not tainted > snd-seq-oss 30752 0 (autoclean) (unused) > snd-seq-midi 3968 0 (autoclean) (unused) > snd-seq-midi-event 3648 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi] > snd-seq 41968 5 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi > snd-seq-midi-event] mousedev 3832 1 > keybdev 1892 0 (unused) > hid 18628 0 (unused) > input 3296 0 [mousedev keybdev hid] > af_packet 13896 1 (autoclean) > uhci 23772 0 (unused) > ehci-hcd 16172 0 (unused) > usbcore 56684 1 [hid uhci ehci-hcd] > snd-intel8x0 21452 1 > snd-ac97-codec 56604 0 [snd-intel8x0] > gameport 1436 0 [snd-intel8x0] > snd-mpu401-uart 4096 0 [snd-intel8x0] > snd-hdsp 40520 1 > snd-pcm-oss 39944 0 > snd-mixer-oss 13880 2 [snd-pcm-oss] > snd-pcm 65664 0 [snd-intel8x0 snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss] > snd-timer 16868 0 [snd-seq snd-pcm] > snd-hwdep 5280 0 [snd-hdsp] > snd-page-alloc 6552 0 [snd-intel8x0 snd-hdsp snd-pcm] > snd-rawmidi 14656 0 [snd-seq-midi snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp] > snd-seq-device 4324 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi snd-seq > snd-rawmidi] snd 36132 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi > snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-intel8x0 snd-ac97-codec snd-mpu401-uart > snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-pcm snd-timer snd-hwdep snd-rawmidi > snd-seq-device] soundcore 3876 7 [snd] > 8139too 13896 1 > mii 2096 0 [8139too] > crc32 2864 0 [8139too] > ohci1394 23024 0 (unused) > ieee1394 183556 0 [ohci1394] > sr_mod 12216 0 (autoclean) (unused) > isofs 23480 0 (autoclean) > ide-scsi 8656 0 > scsi_mod 89312 2 [sr_mod ide-scsi] > ide-cd 28128 0 (autoclean) > cdrom 25344 0 (autoclean) [sr_mod ide-cd] > ext3 71144 8 (autoclean) > jbd 40312 8 (autoclean) [ext3] > ide-detect 288 0 (autoclean) (unused) > piix 7496 2 (autoclean) > ide-disk 12704 9 (autoclean) > ide-core 98268 9 (autoclean) [ide-scsi ide-cd ide-detect > piix ide-disk] unix 16236 33 (autoclean) > > I'm using DeMuDi 1.2 with a 2.4 kernel. > > Any help much appreciated. > > Cheers, > > Tom Hi Tom. IIRC you need to be a member of the cdrom group on Debian based installs. have a look in /etc/group to see if there is a cdrom group there. The Debian command as root would be. #usermod -G cdrom your_user_name. All the best. Nigel. From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Fri Dec 16 11:03:42 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Fri Dec 16 11:03:48 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM In-Reply-To: <25583739.1134744124728.JavaMail.www@wwinf3201> Message-ID: <20051216160342.83660.qmail@web52610.mail.yahoo.com> Have you read this? http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/Linux/docs/HOWTO/other-formats/html_single/CDROM-HOWTO.html -=cybersean3000=- --- Tom Charles-Edwards wrote: > Hi there, > > sorry if this is a little basic for you guys but I > can't mount CDROMs. If I do: > > mount /dev/scd0 > > I get: > > /dev/scd0 is not a valid block device > > My /etc/fstab is: > > /dev/scd0 /media/cdrom0 iso9660 > ro,user,noauto 0 0 > > The output of ls -l /dev/cdrom0 is: > > brw-rw---- 1 root cdrom 11, 0 2004-05-21 02:22 > /dev/scd0 > > The output of lsmod is: > > Module Size Used by Not tainted > snd-seq-oss 30752 0 (autoclean) > (unused) > snd-seq-midi 3968 0 (autoclean) > (unused) > snd-seq-midi-event 3648 0 (autoclean) > [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi] > snd-seq 41968 5 (autoclean) > [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi snd-seq-midi-event] > mousedev 3832 1 > keybdev 1892 0 (unused) > hid 18628 0 (unused) > input 3296 0 [mousedev keybdev > hid] > af_packet 13896 1 (autoclean) > uhci 23772 0 (unused) > ehci-hcd 16172 0 (unused) > usbcore 56684 1 [hid uhci ehci-hcd] > snd-intel8x0 21452 1 > snd-ac97-codec 56604 0 [snd-intel8x0] > gameport 1436 0 [snd-intel8x0] > snd-mpu401-uart 4096 0 [snd-intel8x0] > snd-hdsp 40520 1 > snd-pcm-oss 39944 0 > snd-mixer-oss 13880 2 [snd-pcm-oss] > snd-pcm 65664 0 [snd-intel8x0 > snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss] > snd-timer 16868 0 [snd-seq snd-pcm] > snd-hwdep 5280 0 [snd-hdsp] > snd-page-alloc 6552 0 [snd-intel8x0 > snd-hdsp snd-pcm] > snd-rawmidi 14656 0 [snd-seq-midi > snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp] > snd-seq-device 4324 0 [snd-seq-oss > snd-seq-midi snd-seq snd-rawmidi] > snd 36132 0 [snd-seq-oss > snd-seq-midi snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-intel8x0 > snd-ac97-codec snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss > snd-mixer-oss snd-pcm snd-timer snd-hwdep > snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device] > soundcore 3876 7 [snd] > 8139too 13896 1 > mii 2096 0 [8139too] > crc32 2864 0 [8139too] > ohci1394 23024 0 (unused) > ieee1394 183556 0 [ohci1394] > sr_mod 12216 0 (autoclean) > (unused) > isofs 23480 0 (autoclean) > ide-scsi 8656 0 > scsi_mod 89312 2 [sr_mod ide-scsi] > ide-cd 28128 0 (autoclean) > cdrom 25344 0 (autoclean) [sr_mod > ide-cd] > ext3 71144 8 (autoclean) > jbd 40312 8 (autoclean) [ext3] > ide-detect 288 0 (autoclean) > (unused) > piix 7496 2 (autoclean) > ide-disk 12704 9 (autoclean) > ide-core 98268 9 (autoclean) > [ide-scsi ide-cd ide-detect piix ide-disk] > unix 16236 33 (autoclean) > > I'm using DeMuDi 1.2 with a 2.4 kernel. > > Any help much appreciated. > > Cheers, > > Tom > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Fri Dec 16 11:33:35 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Fri Dec 16 11:33:52 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM In-Reply-To: <200512161639.57109.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> Message-ID: <20051216163335.94683.qmail@web52610.mail.yahoo.com> Also, you may want to be a little more explicit with your mount command. For example: mount -t iso9660 /dev/scd0 /media/cdrom0 Usually, CD ROM mounts are dynamic and don't require an entry in fstab. The only time I think you would need an entry in fstab is if you need a cd mounted at boot time. -=cybersean3000=- --- Nigel Henry wrote: > On Friday 16 December 2005 15:42, Tom > Charles-Edwards wrote: > > Hi there, > > > > sorry if this is a little basic for you guys but I > can't mount CDROMs. If I > > > > Tom > > Hi Tom. IIRC you need to be a member of the cdrom > group on Debian based > installs. have a look in /etc/group to see if there > is a cdrom group there. > The Debian command as root would be. #usermod -G > cdrom your_user_name. All > the best. Nigel. > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From torbenh at gmx.de Fri Dec 16 12:20:50 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Fri Dec 16 12:00:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Ardour-0.99 compiled with vst support --" Normalize" function doesn't work In-Reply-To: <43A1827E.3060308@gmail.com> References: <43A0A535.30806@gmail.com> <43A1827E.3060308@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051216172050.GC4891@mobilat> On Thu, Dec 15, 2005 at 03:49:34PM +0100, Carlos Pino wrote: > Carlos Pino wrote: > > >Hi there. > > > > I compiled ardour-0.99 with vst (fst) support with this scons command: > > > > scons BUILD_SSE_OPTIMIZATIONS=1 USE_SSE_EVERYWHERE=0 VST=1 > >VSTPATH=/home/supertux/vst/fst-1.7 PREFIX=/usr KSI=no DEBUG=yes > > > > To do this I copied,before, the > > fst-1.7/fst.h and fst-1.7/vst/ to ardour-099/libs/ardour build > >directory > > and > > > > the SC* files from fst-1.7/ardour amd fst-1.7/gtk_ardour to > >ardour-0.99 and ardour-0.99/gtk_ardour build directorys > > > >Everything during the the compilation proccess went fine, no > >errors,scons install did his task succesfuly. > > After this ardour run ok,all the vst fx been recognized fine ,but > >the "normalize" function doesn't work. > >If the compilation is made without vst support ,"normalize" works fine. > > > > Any idea? > > > Hi again. > > The same happens with "reverse" function ok... i will have a look soon... this is all "proof of concept" stuff -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From kleffner at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 12:21:25 2005 From: kleffner at gmail.com (Matt Kleffner) Date: Fri Dec 16 12:21:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] RME Hammerfall DSP Multiface firmware loading problem Message-ID: <876bb1680512160921ude14459j7d72396ac30154fd@mail.gmail.com> Hello, Previously I could load the firmware onto my RME Multiface, but I haven't used it for a few months. I recently reinstalled debian sarge on my machine, but I can no longer get the firmware to load. I found previous emails on this problem but I found no clear solution. I am using a 2.6.14.3 kernel with the alsa drivers compiled as modules, and the drivers are newer than the buggy (for RME) 1.0.8 versions. I've also put snd_hdsp in my initrd image as mentioned in http://lalists.stanford.edu/lad/2005/11/0149.html The version info and error messages are listed below. Any thoughts on what is wrong? Does the firmware and hdsploader version (1.0.9rc3) have to match the alsa driver version (1.0.10rc1)? Did I miss a solution on this or another list? Any help is appreciated. - Matt Kernel messages at boot time: Hammerfall-DSP: wait for FIFO status <= 0 failed after 30 iterations Hammerfall-DSP: couldn't get firmware from userspace. try using hdsploader Hammerfall-DSP: card initialization pending : waiting for firmware Results from hdsploader: hdsploader - firmware loader for RME Hammerfall DSP cards Looking for HDSP + Multiface or Digiface cards : Card 0 : VIA 82C686A/B rev50 with ICE1232 at 0xa800, irq 9 Card 1 : RME Hammerfall DSP at 0xdd000000, irq 9 Upload firmware for card hw:1 Hwdep ioctl error on card hw:1 : Input/output error. lspci | grep Hammerfall: 0000:00:0a.0 Multimedia audio controller: Xilinx Corporation RME HammerfallDSP(rev 32) cat /proc/asound/version: Advanced Linux Sound Architecture Driver Version 1.0.10rc1 (Mon Sep 12 08:13:092005 UTC). hdsploader source: alsa-firmware-loaders deb package, AGNULA, package version 1.0.9rc3-0 firmware (from alsa-firmware-1.0.9rc3.tar.bz2): multiface_firmware.bin multiface_firmware_rev11.bin From cesare at poeticstudios.com Fri Dec 16 12:50:08 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Fri Dec 16 12:50:16 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <1134581035.7370.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> <1134581035.7370.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <43A2FE50.2070106@poeticstudios.com> Dave Robillard wrote: >On Wed, 2005-14-12 at 08:26 -0800, Chris Reisor wrote: > > >>On 12/13/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: >> >> >>>- the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to >>>the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); >>> >>> > >This will be possible in the MIDI domain with the new version (currently >in CVS) which has MIDI patching (unfortunately there's no plugin spec >that can handle MIDI input and output yet). > >You'd still be able to do it just with some simple multiplication (or >maybe a switch plugin), assuming you can get a boolean signal (0, 1) >from the damper pedal. > >Let me know how it goes. > >-DR- > > > > I'm having some issues with the CVS version of om-synth (on Slackware 10.2 with all the latest gtk* libs compiled from source): - I had to compile --with-alsa-midi, because the configure script was asking for a midiport.h header inside jack includes, but it doesn't seem to exists (but the 0.2.0 version works with jack). Maybe, something has changed in jack support? - om starts. om_gtk crashes with a segmentation fault error as soon as I try to open a patch to edit. Can you help me? Thanks in advance, c. From x at branwelt.de Fri Dec 16 12:49:36 2005 From: x at branwelt.de (Emanuel Rumpf) Date: Fri Dec 16 12:51:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM In-Reply-To: <20051216163335.94683.qmail@web52610.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051216163335.94683.qmail@web52610.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43A2FE30.9070802@branwelt.de> Sean Edwards wrote: >Usually, CD ROM mounts are dynamic and don't require >an entry in fstab. The only time I think you would >need an entry in fstab is if you need a cd mounted at >boot time. > > but...the fstab entry for cdroms allows the device to be mounted in userspace... emanuel From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Fri Dec 16 12:50:06 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Fri Dec 16 12:55:18 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] RME Hammerfall DSP Multiface firmware loading problem In-Reply-To: <876bb1680512160921ude14459j7d72396ac30154fd@mail.gmail.com> References: <876bb1680512160921ude14459j7d72396ac30154fd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134755406.7539.94.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2005-12-16 at 11:21 -0600, Matt Kleffner wrote: > Hello, > > Previously I could load the firmware onto my RME Multiface, but I > haven't used it for a few months. I recently reinstalled debian sarge > on my machine, but I can no longer get the firmware to load. I found > previous emails on this problem but I found no clear solution. I am > using a 2.6.14.3 kernel with the alsa drivers compiled as modules, and > the drivers are newer than the buggy (for RME) 1.0.8 versions. I've > also put snd_hdsp in my initrd image as mentioned in > http://lalists.stanford.edu/lad/2005/11/0149.html > > The version info and error messages are listed below. Any thoughts on > what is wrong? Does the firmware and hdsploader version (1.0.9rc3) > have to match the alsa driver version (1.0.10rc1)? Did I miss a > solution on this or another list? Any help is appreciated. try power-cycling *everything*. the computer, (including unplugging the power cord (and battery if its a laptop), and the multiface box. i've run into this condition once or twice, and the only solution i have found is a complete power cycle of everything. --p From cave.dnb at tiscali.fr Fri Dec 16 13:03:45 2005 From: cave.dnb at tiscali.fr (Nigel Henry) Date: Fri Dec 16 13:11:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <200512161903.45838.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> On Thursday 15 December 2005 19:09, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Ok, > shame on me for this, but I would really really like to share with you > my latest musical efforts. Unfortunately, I was already working on these > tracks when I finally got everything working on gnu/Linux audio. So I > finished these tracks (made with mostly with free VST plugins, my guitar > and some vocals) on my copies of Tracktion on MacOSX and WinXP (Mackie > gave them away for free last christmas to promote their forthcoming > newer version). BTW it's a shame that a software made by one guy alone, > using mostly opensource LGPL libraries and with an XML file format > hasn't been released opensource. But I believe that when Ardour will > have MIDI integration, it would be even better than Tracktion (it is > already far better IMHO if you consider just the audio functionalities). > I will probably retouch these tracks with jamin for the final cd > version, but I'm already concentrated on new stuff now (using only o.s.s.). > > I don't like to think in terms of genres, but people often describes my > music as ambient. So don't bother to download it if you don't like ambient. > > Anyway, If you'll consider listening to my new EP (released under the > cc-licence) you can grab it here: > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_Moon_EP.zip > > It's a 27Mb zip with 4 mp3 tracks (192Kbps). Title is: The Moon EP (code > name: last of the closed source sw tracks). > > Or for individual tracks: > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/As_we_grow_older.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/Hope.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_moon.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_difference.mp3 > > I'm still working on the cover. > > Thank you very much. Hi Cesare. Really nice tunes man. I particularly liked As we grow older, and Hope, but the other two are pretty good also. I presume that your going to make your tunes available in .ogg format as well in the future. I had to play them using Mplayer on FC2, and it was using 100% cpu, but didn't seem to affect the sound quality. Really nice work. Thanks. Nigel. > > c. From steiner at block4.com Fri Dec 16 13:11:58 2005 From: steiner at block4.com (Malte Steiner) Date: Fri Dec 16 13:12:07 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] UA-100 In-Reply-To: <1134378469.439d3de53d9e6@webmail.uni-halle.de> References: <4399DCCE.6080606@block4.com> <1134378469.439d3de53d9e6@webmail.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <43A3036E.3000503@block4.com> Hello, thanks for your time. > The driver hardcodes four channels of 16-bit data at 44.1 kHz. > it doesnt have a dedicated switch. > What is the output of "lsusb -v" for this device? > > Bus 001 Device 004: ID 0582:0000 Roland Corp. Device Descriptor: bLength 18 bDescriptorType 1 bcdUSB 1.00 bDeviceClass 255 Vendor Specific Class bDeviceSubClass 0 bDeviceProtocol 255 bMaxPacketSize0 8 idVendor 0x0582 Roland Corp. idProduct 0x0000 bcdDevice 1.09 iManufacturer 0 iProduct 0 iSerial 0 bNumConfigurations 1 Configuration Descriptor: bLength 9 bDescriptorType 2 wTotalLength 119 bNumInterfaces 3 bConfigurationValue 1 iConfiguration 0 bmAttributes 0x40 Self Powered MaxPower 0mA Interface Descriptor: bLength 9 bDescriptorType 4 bInterfaceNumber 0 bAlternateSetting 0 bNumEndpoints 1 bInterfaceClass 255 Vendor Specific Class bInterfaceSubClass 255 Vendor Specific Subclass bInterfaceProtocol 0 iInterface 0 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x01 EP 1 OUT bmAttributes 1 Transfer Type Isochronous Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x0000 1x 0 bytes bInterval 1 Interface Descriptor: bLength 9 bDescriptorType 4 bInterfaceNumber 0 bAlternateSetting 1 bNumEndpoints 1 bInterfaceClass 255 Vendor Specific Class bInterfaceSubClass 255 Vendor Specific Subclass bInterfaceProtocol 0 iInterface 0 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x01 EP 1 OUT bmAttributes 1 Transfer Type Isochronous Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x0168 1x 360 bytes bInterval 1 Interface Descriptor: bLength 9 bDescriptorType 4 bInterfaceNumber 1 bAlternateSetting 0 bNumEndpoints 1 bInterfaceClass 255 Vendor Specific Class bInterfaceSubClass 255 Vendor Specific Subclass bInterfaceProtocol 0 iInterface 0 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN bmAttributes 1 Transfer Type Isochronous Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x0000 1x 0 bytes bInterval 1 Interface Descriptor: bLength 9 bDescriptorType 4 bInterfaceNumber 1 bAlternateSetting 1 bNumEndpoints 1 bInterfaceClass 255 Vendor Specific Class bInterfaceSubClass 255 Vendor Specific Subclass bInterfaceProtocol 0 iInterface 0 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x81 EP 1 IN bmAttributes 1 Transfer Type Isochronous Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x00b8 1x 184 bytes bInterval 1 Interface Descriptor: bLength 9 bDescriptorType 4 bInterfaceNumber 2 bAlternateSetting 0 bNumEndpoints 2 bInterfaceClass 255 Vendor Specific Class bInterfaceSubClass 255 Vendor Specific Subclass bInterfaceProtocol 0 iInterface 0 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x02 EP 2 OUT bmAttributes 2 Transfer Type Bulk Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x0020 1x 32 bytes bInterval 1 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x82 EP 2 IN bmAttributes 2 Transfer Type Bulk Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x0020 1x 32 bytes bInterval 1 Interface Descriptor: bLength 9 bDescriptorType 4 bInterfaceNumber 2 bAlternateSetting 1 bNumEndpoints 2 bInterfaceClass 255 Vendor Specific Class bInterfaceSubClass 255 Vendor Specific Subclass bInterfaceProtocol 0 iInterface 0 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x02 EP 2 OUT bmAttributes 2 Transfer Type Bulk Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x0020 1x 32 bytes bInterval 1 Endpoint Descriptor: bLength 7 bDescriptorType 5 bEndpointAddress 0x82 EP 2 IN bmAttributes 3 Transfer Type Interrupt Synch Type None Usage Type Data wMaxPacketSize 0x0020 1x 32 bytes bInterval 2 Thanks for any help, Malte -- Malte Steiner media art + development -www.block4.com- From kleffner at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 15:50:16 2005 From: kleffner at gmail.com (Matt Kleffner) Date: Fri Dec 16 15:50:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] RME Hammerfall DSP Multiface firmware loading problem In-Reply-To: <1134755406.7539.94.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <876bb1680512160921ude14459j7d72396ac30154fd@mail.gmail.com> <1134755406.7539.94.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <876bb1680512161250o25cf2addnfec67c9052f1d431@mail.gmail.com> I powered down and unplugged everything. After reconnecting everythingand turning the (desktop) computer on, the "Host Error" light on themultiface went out and the kernel log contained: Hammerfall-DSP: wait for FIFO status <= 0 failed after 30 iterationsHammerfall-DSP: loading firmwareHammerfall-DSP: finished firmware loading Now, when I run hdspconf and select any option (e.g. change samplingrate), I get an error for each option selected. For example, if Ichange the sampling rate to 44.1 kHz the radio button selection"jumps" back to 48 kHz. The stdout of hdspconf looks like: HDSPConf 1.4 - Copyright (C) 2003 Thomas Charbonnel This program comes WITH ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTYHDSPConf is free software, see the file copying for details Looking for HDSP cards :Card 0 : VIA 82C686A/B rev50 with ICE1232 at 0xa800, irq 9Card 1 : RME Hammerfall DSP + Multiface at 0xdd000000, irq 9Multiface found !1 Hammerfall DSP card found.Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1 The last message is repeated every time I attempt to change a setting,and it doesn't show up at all until I try to change a setting. If Iclose hdspconf and run amixer -c 1 cset numid=11 2(syntax from http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7024) the correct (44.1 kHz) setting shows up when I reopen hdspconf.Changing the rate back to 48 kHz in hdspconf results in the sameerror, except the selection now remains fixed at 44.1 kHz. Any thoughts on why this is happening? Is the version of HDSPConf too old? - Matt On 12/16/05, Paul Davis wrote:> try power-cycling *everything*. the computer, (including unplugging the> power cord (and battery if its a laptop), and the multiface box.>> i've run into this condition once or twice, and the only solution i have> found is a complete power cycle of everything.>>> --p From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Fri Dec 16 16:56:42 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Fri Dec 16 16:54:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] RME Hammerfall DSP Multiface firmware loading problem In-Reply-To: <876bb1680512161250o25cf2addnfec67c9052f1d431@mail.gmail.com> References: <876bb1680512160921ude14459j7d72396ac30154fd@mail.gmail.com> <1134755406.7539.94.camel@localhost.localdomain> <876bb1680512161250o25cf2addnfec67c9052f1d431@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134770202.7539.108.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Fri, 2005-12-16 at 14:50 -0600, Matt Kleffner wrote: > I powered down and unplugged everything. After reconnecting everythingand turning the (desktop) computer on, the "Host Error" light on themultiface went out and the kernel log contained: > Hammerfall-DSP: wait for FIFO status <= 0 failed after 30 iterationsHammerfall-DSP: loading firmwareHammerfall-DSP: finished firmware loading > Now, when I run hdspconf and select any option (e.g. change samplingrate), I get an error for each option selected. For example, if Ichange the sampling rate to 44.1 kHz the radio button selection"jumps" back to 48 kHz. > The stdout of hdspconf looks like: > HDSPConf 1.4 - Copyright (C) 2003 Thomas Charbonnel This program comes WITH ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTYHDSPConf is free software, see the file copying for details > Looking for HDSP cards :Card 0 : VIA 82C686A/B rev50 with ICE1232 at 0xa800, irq 9Card 1 : RME Hammerfall DSP + Multiface at 0xdd000000, irq 9Multiface found !1 Hammerfall DSP card found.Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1 > The last message is repeated every time I attempt to change a setting,and it doesn't show up at all until I try to change a setting. If Iclose hdspconf and run > amixer -c 1 cset numid=11 2(syntax from http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7024) > the correct (44.1 kHz) setting shows up when I reopen hdspconf.Changing the rate back to 48 kHz in hdspconf results in the sameerror, except the selection now remains fixed at 44.1 kHz. > Any thoughts on why this is happening? Is the version of HDSPConf too old? > - Matt > On 12/16/05, Paul Davis wrote:> try power-cycling *everything*. the computer, (including unplugging the> power cord (and battery if its a laptop), and the multiface box.>> i've run into this condition once or twice, and the only solution i have> found is a complete power cycle of everything.>>> --p i have a nasty feeling that ALSA 1.0.10 may have broken something here. this is the second report of this in a few weeks. i know its ugly and horrible and time consuming, but it would really help if you could back up to 1.0.9 and test that. --p From creisor at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 17:24:57 2005 From: creisor at gmail.com (Chris Reisor) Date: Fri Dec 16 17:25:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> On 12/15/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Ok, > shame on me for this, but I would really really like to share with you > my latest musical efforts. Unfortunately, I was already working on these > tracks when I finally got everything working on gnu/Linux audio. So I > finished these tracks (made with mostly with free VST plugins, my guitar > and some vocals) on my copies of Tracktion on MacOSX and WinXP (Mackie > gave them away for free last christmas to promote their forthcoming > newer version). BTW it's a shame that a software made by one guy alone, > using mostly opensource LGPL libraries and with an XML file format > hasn't been released opensource. But I believe that when Ardour will > have MIDI integration, it would be even better than Tracktion (it is > already far better IMHO if you consider just the audio functionalities). > I will probably retouch these tracks with jamin for the final cd > version, but I'm already concentrated on new stuff now (using only o.s.s.). > > I don't like to think in terms of genres, but people often describes my > music as ambient. So don't bother to download it if you don't like ambient. > > Anyway, If you'll consider listening to my new EP (released under the > cc-licence) you can grab it here: > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_Moon_EP.zip > > It's a 27Mb zip with 4 mp3 tracks (192Kbps). Title is: The Moon EP (code > name: last of the closed source sw tracks). > > Or for individual tracks: > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/As_we_grow_older.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/Hope.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_moon.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_difference.mp3 > > I'm still working on the cover. > Glad you're on our side now. 'The Difference' is fantastic. My favorite. Reminds me of The Album Leaf. I agree that genres and labels rarely do music justice. I'm glad I listened. --chris reisor From fritz at fritzmetal.de Fri Dec 16 17:54:50 2005 From: fritz at fritzmetal.de (FRitz) Date: Fri Dec 16 17:54:55 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> Chris Reisor wrote: > On 12/15/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: >> Ok, >> shame on me for this, but I would really really like to share with you >> my latest musical efforts. Unfortunately, I was already working on these >> tracks when I finally got everything working on gnu/Linux audio. So I >> finished these tracks (made with mostly with free VST plugins, my guitar >> and some vocals) on my copies of Tracktion on MacOSX and WinXP (Mackie >> gave them away for free last christmas to promote their forthcoming >> newer version). BTW it's a shame that a software made by one guy alone, >> using mostly opensource LGPL libraries and with an XML file format >> hasn't been released opensource. But I believe that when Ardour will >> have MIDI integration, it would be even better than Tracktion (it is >> already far better IMHO if you consider just the audio functionalities). >> I will probably retouch these tracks with jamin for the final cd >> version, but I'm already concentrated on new stuff now (using only o.s.s.). >> >> I don't like to think in terms of genres, but people often describes my >> music as ambient. So don't bother to download it if you don't like ambient. >> >> Anyway, If you'll consider listening to my new EP (released under the >> cc-licence) you can grab it here: >> >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_Moon_EP.zip >> >> It's a 27Mb zip with 4 mp3 tracks (192Kbps). Title is: The Moon EP (code >> name: last of the closed source sw tracks). >> >> Or for individual tracks: >> >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/As_we_grow_older.mp3 >> >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/Hope.mp3 >> >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_moon.mp3 >> >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_difference.mp3 >> >> I'm still working on the cover. >> Downloading! > Glad you're on our side now. > --chris reisor Care to explain that to an "outsider"? :-) Best wishes, FRitz From fritz at fritzmetal.de Fri Dec 16 18:19:34 2005 From: fritz at fritzmetal.de (FRitz) Date: Fri Dec 16 18:19:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <43A34B86.4040402@fritzmetal.de> Hi Cesare, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Ok, > shame on me for this, No, why? > Thank you very much. > > c. I listened to your music. Man, this is really deep stuff. Like it. There's something in all 4 four pieces that I like. Thanx a lot for sharing. All the best, FRitz From creisor at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 19:02:23 2005 From: creisor at gmail.com (Chris Reisor) Date: Fri Dec 16 19:02:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> Message-ID: <3e1f2d940512161602i53015049p3e1b9b5486f57ded@mail.gmail.com> On 12/16/05, FRitz wrote: > > > Chris Reisor wrote: > > On 12/15/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > >> Ok, > >> shame on me for this, but I would really really like to share with you > >> my latest musical efforts. Unfortunately, I was already working on these > >> tracks when I finally got everything working on gnu/Linux audio. So I > >> finished these tracks (made with mostly with free VST plugins, my guitar > >> and some vocals) on my copies of Tracktion on MacOSX and WinXP (Mackie > >> gave them away for free last christmas to promote their forthcoming > >> newer version). BTW it's a shame that a software made by one guy alone, > >> using mostly opensource LGPL libraries and with an XML file format > >> hasn't been released opensource. But I believe that when Ardour will > >> have MIDI integration, it would be even better than Tracktion (it is > >> already far better IMHO if you consider just the audio functionalities). > >> I will probably retouch these tracks with jamin for the final cd > >> version, but I'm already concentrated on new stuff now (using only o.s.s.). > >> > >> I don't like to think in terms of genres, but people often describes my > >> music as ambient. So don't bother to download it if you don't like ambient. > >> > >> Anyway, If you'll consider listening to my new EP (released under the > >> cc-licence) you can grab it here: > >> > >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_Moon_EP.zip > >> > >> It's a 27Mb zip with 4 mp3 tracks (192Kbps). Title is: The Moon EP (code > >> name: last of the closed source sw tracks). > >> > >> Or for individual tracks: > >> > >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/As_we_grow_older.mp3 > >> > >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/Hope.mp3 > >> > >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_moon.mp3 > >> > >> http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_difference.mp3 > >> > >> I'm still working on the cover. > >> > > Downloading! > > > > Glad you're on our side now. > > --chris reisor > > > Care to explain that to an "outsider"? :-) > > > Best wishes, FRitz > The Good Side. The Open Source side. From fritz at fritzmetal.de Fri Dec 16 19:16:13 2005 From: fritz at fritzmetal.de (FRitz) Date: Fri Dec 16 19:16:15 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <3e1f2d940512161602i53015049p3e1b9b5486f57ded@mail.gmail.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> <3e1f2d940512161602i53015049p3e1b9b5486f57ded@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A358CD.6000908@fritzmetal.de> >>> Glad you're on our side now. >>> --chris reisor >> >> Care to explain that to an "outsider"? :-) >> >> >> Best wishes, FRitz >> > > The Good Side. The Open Source side. Why good? In which way good? And why it's a "side"? Side of what? From markknecht at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 19:26:36 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Fri Dec 16 19:26:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512161626h1cf7941er2fec1f4e309f0e15@mail.gmail.com> On 12/15/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Ok, > shame on me for this, but I would really really like to share with you > my latest musical efforts. Unfortunately, I was already working on these > tracks when I finally got everything working on gnu/Linux audio. So I > finished these tracks (made with mostly with free VST plugins, my guitar > and some vocals) on my copies of Tracktion on MacOSX and WinXP (Mackie > gave them away for free last christmas to promote their forthcoming > newer version). BTW it's a shame that a software made by one guy alone, > using mostly opensource LGPL libraries and with an XML file format > hasn't been released opensource. But I believe that when Ardour will > have MIDI integration, it would be even better than Tracktion (it is > already far better IMHO if you consider just the audio functionalities). > I will probably retouch these tracks with jamin for the final cd > version, but I'm already concentrated on new stuff now (using only o.s.s.). > > I don't like to think in terms of genres, but people often describes my > music as ambient. So don't bother to download it if you don't like ambient. > > Anyway, If you'll consider listening to my new EP (released under the > cc-licence) you can grab it here: > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_Moon_EP.zip > > It's a 27Mb zip with 4 mp3 tracks (192Kbps). Title is: The Moon EP (code > name: last of the closed source sw tracks). > > Or for individual tracks: > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/As_we_grow_older.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/Hope.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_moon.mp3 > > http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_difference.mp3 > > I'm still working on the cover. > > Thank you very much. > > c. Cesare, Thanks for posting this. I enjoyed all 4 pieces, my favorite being 'As We Grow Older'. I think this one could have appeared as part of a Genesis album, circa 'The Lamb Lies Down...'. Very good piece. Please don't be apologetic about tools. No sense wasting time on those thoughts. The music brightened my dreary, cold Friday afternoon here in California. With best regards, Mark From markknecht at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 19:28:05 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Fri Dec 16 19:28:07 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <200512161903.45838.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <200512161903.45838.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512161628i68b747edi9a1ba4a99f156b06@mail.gmail.com> On 12/16/05, Nigel Henry wrote: > I presume that your going to > make your tunes available in .ogg format as well in the future. I had to play > them using Mplayer on FC2, and it was using 100% cpu, but didn't seem to > affect the sound quality. Really nice work. Thanks. Nigel. No such problems with my favorite day to day player Aqualung. Check it out if you haven't already. http://aqualung.sourceforge.net/ Cheers, Mark From tomcharles-edwards at fsmail.net Fri Dec 16 20:05:31 2005 From: tomcharles-edwards at fsmail.net (Tom Charles-Edwards) Date: Fri Dec 16 20:05:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM Message-ID: <12309890.1134781531511.JavaMail.www@wwinf3202> > Message Received: Dec 16 2005, 04:03 PM > From: "Sean Edwards" > To: tomcharles-edwards@fsmail.net, "A list for linux audio users" > Cc: > Subject: Re: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM > > Have you read this? > > http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/Linux/docs/HOWTO/other-formats/html_single/CDROM-HOWTO.html > > -=cybersean3000=- > > --- Tom Charles-Edwards > wrote: > > > Hi there, > > > > sorry if this is a little basic for you guys but I > > can't mount CDROMs. If I do: > > > > mount /dev/scd0 > > > > I get: > > > > /dev/scd0 is not a valid block device > > > > My /etc/fstab is: > > > > /dev/scd0 /media/cdrom0 iso9660 > > ro,user,noauto 0 0 > > > > The output of ls -l /dev/cdrom0 is: > > > > brw-rw---- 1 root cdrom 11, 0 2004-05-21 02:22 > > /dev/scd0 > > > > The output of lsmod is: > > > > Module Size Used by Not tainted > > snd-seq-oss 30752 0 (autoclean) > > (unused) > > snd-seq-midi 3968 0 (autoclean) > > (unused) > > snd-seq-midi-event 3648 0 (autoclean) > > [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi] > > snd-seq 41968 5 (autoclean) > > [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi snd-seq-midi-event] > > mousedev 3832 1 > > keybdev 1892 0 (unused) > > hid 18628 0 (unused) > > input 3296 0 [mousedev keybdev > > hid] > > af_packet 13896 1 (autoclean) > > uhci 23772 0 (unused) > > ehci-hcd 16172 0 (unused) > > usbcore 56684 1 [hid uhci ehci-hcd] > > snd-intel8x0 21452 1 > > snd-ac97-codec 56604 0 [snd-intel8x0] > > gameport 1436 0 [snd-intel8x0] > > snd-mpu401-uart 4096 0 [snd-intel8x0] > > snd-hdsp 40520 1 > > snd-pcm-oss 39944 0 > > snd-mixer-oss 13880 2 [snd-pcm-oss] > > snd-pcm 65664 0 [snd-intel8x0 > > snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss] > > snd-timer 16868 0 [snd-seq snd-pcm] > > snd-hwdep 5280 0 [snd-hdsp] > > snd-page-alloc 6552 0 [snd-intel8x0 > > snd-hdsp snd-pcm] > > snd-rawmidi 14656 0 [snd-seq-midi > > snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp] > > snd-seq-device 4324 0 [snd-seq-oss > > snd-seq-midi snd-seq snd-rawmidi] > > snd 36132 0 [snd-seq-oss > > snd-seq-midi snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-intel8x0 > > snd-ac97-codec snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss > > snd-mixer-oss snd-pcm snd-timer snd-hwdep > > snd-rawmidi snd-seq-device] > > soundcore 3876 7 [snd] > > 8139too 13896 1 > > mii 2096 0 [8139too] > > crc32 2864 0 [8139too] > > ohci1394 23024 0 (unused) > > ieee1394 183556 0 [ohci1394] > > sr_mod 12216 0 (autoclean) > > (unused) > > isofs 23480 0 (autoclean) > > ide-scsi 8656 0 > > scsi_mod 89312 2 [sr_mod ide-scsi] > > ide-cd 28128 0 (autoclean) > > cdrom 25344 0 (autoclean) [sr_mod > > ide-cd] > > ext3 71144 8 (autoclean) > > jbd 40312 8 (autoclean) [ext3] > > ide-detect 288 0 (autoclean) > > (unused) > > piix 7496 2 (autoclean) > > ide-disk 12704 9 (autoclean) > > ide-core 98268 9 (autoclean) > > [ide-scsi ide-cd ide-detect piix ide-disk] > > unix 16236 33 (autoclean) > > > > I'm using DeMuDi 1.2 with a 2.4 kernel. > > > > Any help much appreciated. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Tom > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > Hi Sean, no, I hadn't - thanks for that. It seems a bit clearer than the other things I've been going through. Cheers, Tom From tomcharles-edwards at fsmail.net Fri Dec 16 20:18:21 2005 From: tomcharles-edwards at fsmail.net (Tom Charles-Edwards) Date: Fri Dec 16 20:18:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM Message-ID: <13504582.1134782301947.JavaMail.www@wwinf3202> > Message Received: Dec 16 2005, 03:51 PM > From: "Nigel Henry" > To: linux-audio-user@music.columbia.edu, tomcharles-edwards@fsmail.net > Cc: > Subject: Re: [linux-audio-user] Problems mounting CDROM > > On Friday 16 December 2005 15:42, Tom Charles-Edwards wrote: > > Hi there, > > > > sorry if this is a little basic for you guys but I can't mount CDROMs. If I > > do: > > > > mount /dev/scd0 > > > > I get: > > > > /dev/scd0 is not a valid block device > > > > My /etc/fstab is: > > > > /dev/scd0 /media/cdrom0 iso9660 ro,user,noauto 0 0 > > > > The output of ls -l /dev/cdrom0 is: > > > > brw-rw---- 1 root cdrom 11, 0 2004-05-21 02:22 /dev/scd0 > > > > The output of lsmod is: > > > > Module Size Used by Not tainted > > snd-seq-oss 30752 0 (autoclean) (unused) > > snd-seq-midi 3968 0 (autoclean) (unused) > > snd-seq-midi-event 3648 0 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi] > > snd-seq 41968 5 (autoclean) [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi > > snd-seq-midi-event] mousedev 3832 1 > > keybdev 1892 0 (unused) > > hid 18628 0 (unused) > > input 3296 0 [mousedev keybdev hid] > > af_packet 13896 1 (autoclean) > > uhci 23772 0 (unused) > > ehci-hcd 16172 0 (unused) > > usbcore 56684 1 [hid uhci ehci-hcd] > > snd-intel8x0 21452 1 > > snd-ac97-codec 56604 0 [snd-intel8x0] > > gameport 1436 0 [snd-intel8x0] > > snd-mpu401-uart 4096 0 [snd-intel8x0] > > snd-hdsp 40520 1 > > snd-pcm-oss 39944 0 > > snd-mixer-oss 13880 2 [snd-pcm-oss] > > snd-pcm 65664 0 [snd-intel8x0 snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss] > > snd-timer 16868 0 [snd-seq snd-pcm] > > snd-hwdep 5280 0 [snd-hdsp] > > snd-page-alloc 6552 0 [snd-intel8x0 snd-hdsp snd-pcm] > > snd-rawmidi 14656 0 [snd-seq-midi snd-mpu401-uart snd-hdsp] > > snd-seq-device 4324 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi snd-seq > > snd-rawmidi] snd 36132 0 [snd-seq-oss snd-seq-midi > > snd-seq-midi-event snd-seq snd-intel8x0 snd-ac97-codec snd-mpu401-uart > > snd-hdsp snd-pcm-oss snd-mixer-oss snd-pcm snd-timer snd-hwdep snd-rawmidi > > snd-seq-device] soundcore 3876 7 [snd] > > 8139too 13896 1 > > mii 2096 0 [8139too] > > crc32 2864 0 [8139too] > > ohci1394 23024 0 (unused) > > ieee1394 183556 0 [ohci1394] > > sr_mod 12216 0 (autoclean) (unused) > > isofs 23480 0 (autoclean) > > ide-scsi 8656 0 > > scsi_mod 89312 2 [sr_mod ide-scsi] > > ide-cd 28128 0 (autoclean) > > cdrom 25344 0 (autoclean) [sr_mod ide-cd] > > ext3 71144 8 (autoclean) > > jbd 40312 8 (autoclean) [ext3] > > ide-detect 288 0 (autoclean) (unused) > > piix 7496 2 (autoclean) > > ide-disk 12704 9 (autoclean) > > ide-core 98268 9 (autoclean) [ide-scsi ide-cd ide-detect > > piix ide-disk] unix 16236 33 (autoclean) > > > > I'm using DeMuDi 1.2 with a 2.4 kernel. > > > > Any help much appreciated. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Tom > > Hi Tom. IIRC you need to be a member of the cdrom group on Debian based > installs. have a look in /etc/group to see if there is a cdrom group there. > The Debian command as root would be. #usermod -G cdrom your_user_name. All > the best. Nigel. > > Hi there Nigel, thanks for replying. /etc/group has: cdrom:x:24:tom so I guess I'm a member of that group already. Cheers, Tom From brad at sonaural.com Fri Dec 16 20:29:43 2005 From: brad at sonaural.com (Brad Fuller) Date: Fri Dec 16 20:30:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] extract and mix Message-ID: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> I couldn't find a way to do this in ecasound, maybe there's a way to do it. Here's what I want to do: Find the exact length of a audio file in ms. I think ecalength can do this, I know it's not sample accurate, but I just need down to the around 1ms. Maybe there's another option other than ecalength. Then, I want to extract a section of another file: at a specific location in ms at a length of the file above. Then, mix that extracted segment with another file and save the result to a new file. How can this be done? I don't know of a utility that can extract a specific length at a specific location in ms. brad From torbenh at gmx.de Fri Dec 16 20:36:16 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Fri Dec 16 20:36:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] [ANN] netjack-0.6 is out Message-ID: <20051217013616.GA29168@mobilat> hi... you can get netjack-0.6 at http://netjack.sf.net i dont believe ppc <-> x86 is working currently, but for connecting some machines with the same hardware it should do. have fun with it. -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From cesare at poeticstudios.com Fri Dec 16 21:20:50 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Fri Dec 16 21:20:55 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512161626h1cf7941er2fec1f4e309f0e15@mail.gmail.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <5bdc1c8b0512161626h1cf7941er2fec1f4e309f0e15@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A37602.2030508@poeticstudios.com> Mark Knecht wrote: >On 12/15/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > > >>Ok, >>shame on me for this, but I would really really like to share with you >>my latest musical efforts. Unfortunately, I was already working on these >>tracks when I finally got everything working on gnu/Linux audio. So I >>finished these tracks (made with mostly with free VST plugins, my guitar >>and some vocals) on my copies of Tracktion on MacOSX and WinXP (Mackie >>gave them away for free last christmas to promote their forthcoming >>newer version). BTW it's a shame that a software made by one guy alone, >>using mostly opensource LGPL libraries and with an XML file format >>hasn't been released opensource. But I believe that when Ardour will >>have MIDI integration, it would be even better than Tracktion (it is >>already far better IMHO if you consider just the audio functionalities). >>I will probably retouch these tracks with jamin for the final cd >>version, but I'm already concentrated on new stuff now (using only o.s.s.). >> >>I don't like to think in terms of genres, but people often describes my >>music as ambient. So don't bother to download it if you don't like ambient. >> >>Anyway, If you'll consider listening to my new EP (released under the >>cc-licence) you can grab it here: >> >>http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_Moon_EP.zip >> >>It's a 27Mb zip with 4 mp3 tracks (192Kbps). Title is: The Moon EP (code >>name: last of the closed source sw tracks). >> >>Or for individual tracks: >> >>http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/As_we_grow_older.mp3 >> >>http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/Hope.mp3 >> >>http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_moon.mp3 >> >>http://www.cesaremarilungo.com/download/music/The_difference.mp3 >> >>I'm still working on the cover. >> >>Thank you very much. >> >>c. >> >> > >Cesare, > Thanks for posting this. I enjoyed all 4 pieces, my favorite being >'As We Grow Older'. I think this one could have appeared as part of a >Genesis album, circa 'The Lamb Lies Down...'. Very good piece. > > Please don't be apologetic about tools. No sense wasting time on >those thoughts. > > The music brightened my dreary, cold Friday afternoon here in California. > >With best regards, >Mark > > > > Thank you all. Really. This is what keeps me making music. About the tools: I'm really inspired by the whole open source community. This is how a lot of things in the world should be. Freedom, shared knowledge, passion and lack of greed. c. From brad at sonaural.com Fri Dec 16 21:39:55 2005 From: brad at sonaural.com (Brad Fuller) Date: Fri Dec 16 21:40:12 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] extract and mix In-Reply-To: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> References: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> Message-ID: <43A37A7B.7010001@sonaural.com> Brad Fuller wrote: > I couldn't find a way to do this in ecasound, maybe there's a way to > do it. Here's what I want to do: > > Find the exact length of a audio file in ms. I think ecalength can do > this, I know it's not sample accurate, but I just need down to the > around 1ms. Maybe there's another option other than ecalength. > > Then, I want to extract a section of another file: at a specific > location in ms at a length of the file above. > > Then, mix that extracted segment with another file and save the result > to a new file. How can this be done? I don't know of a utility that > can extract a specific length at a specific location in ms. > > brad > > I forgot all about sox - looks like I could use sox to essentially extract a section by using the feature "trim start length" -- *Brad Fuller* +1 (408) 799-6124 *Sonaural Audio Studio* See Us At GDC 2006 Hear us online: www.Sonaural.com See me on O'Reilly From loki.davison at gmail.com Fri Dec 16 22:12:10 2005 From: loki.davison at gmail.com (Loki Davison) Date: Fri Dec 16 22:12:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Which is the best way to simulate a real piano under gnu/Linux? Here's my proposal. In-Reply-To: <43A2FE50.2070106@poeticstudios.com> References: <439F5FB9.9010604@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512140826g50de1197r5f433058a633a3cf@mail.gmail.com> <1134581035.7370.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> <43A2FE50.2070106@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: On 12/17/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > Dave Robillard wrote: > > >On Wed, 2005-14-12 at 08:26 -0800, Chris Reisor wrote: > > > > > >>On 12/13/05, Cesare Marilungo wrote: > >> > >> > >>>- the patch will send the notes to two different responses according to > >>>the state of the damper pedal (I'm not sure this could be done with om); > >>> > >>> > > > >This will be possible in the MIDI domain with the new version (currently > >in CVS) which has MIDI patching (unfortunately there's no plugin spec > >that can handle MIDI input and output yet). > > > >You'd still be able to do it just with some simple multiplication (or > >maybe a switch plugin), assuming you can get a boolean signal (0, 1) > >from the damper pedal. > > > >Let me know how it goes. > > > >-DR- > > > > > > > > > I'm having some issues with the CVS version of om-synth (on Slackware > 10.2 with all the latest gtk* libs compiled from source): > > - I had to compile --with-alsa-midi, because the configure script was > asking for a midiport.h header inside jack includes, but it doesn't seem > to exists (but the 0.2.0 version works with jack). Maybe, something has > changed in jack support? > > - om starts. om_gtk crashes with a segmentation fault error as soon as I > try to open a patch to edit. > > Can you help me? > > Thanks in advance, > > c. > same problem here. Is this a jack midi vs alsa midi issue? Loki From marcospcmusica at yahoo.com.ar Fri Dec 16 16:55:50 2005 From: marcospcmusica at yahoo.com.ar (Marcos Guglielmetti) Date: Sat Dec 17 02:05:02 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Musix GNU+Linux 0.30-final, released / download mirrors Message-ID: <200512162255.50875.marcospcmusica@yahoo.com.ar> http://www.musix.distrux.net/ http://www.musix.distrux.net/download.html http://musix.k-maleon.com/download.html ---------------------------------------------------------- News: *French & Portuguese 100% supported -Ardour 0.99-3 -KDE 3.4.2 ? ? ? ? *Kmail 1.8.2 ? ? ? -KDM funciona desde el Live CD *Ghostess ? ? ? ? *WhySynth DSSI *Sineshaper DSSI *Lilypond 2.6.3 *# Solfege 2.0 ? *# Denemo 0.7 -# Noteedit 2.8.0 *Beast 0.6 ? ? ? ? ? *Seq24 ?0.7 ? ? ? ? *# linuxsampler 0.3 *# Rezound 0.12 ? ? *Kit Yamaha Vintage --> Hydrogen Drum Machine *Firestarter ?1.0 ? *Alsa Modular Synth 1.8.7 *## Bristol ?0.9.1 ? *Horgand 1.07 ? ? ? *Caps plugins 0.2.3 *# DGuitar *# Linux Multimedia Studio 0.1.1 -Soporte para dispositivos USB audio y MIDI *Escritorio Administraci?n *Synaptic ? State: - upgraded from musix 0.26 * new # important bugs detected ## critical bugs -- Marcos Guglielmetti(www.pc-musica.com.ar) Coordinador del desarrollo de Musix GNU+Linux (www.musix.org.ar) ___________________________________________________________ 1GB gratis, Antivirus y Antispam Correo Yahoo!, el mejor correo web del mundo http://correo.yahoo.com.ar From james at dis-dot-dat.net Sat Dec 17 10:14:48 2005 From: james at dis-dot-dat.net (james@dis-dot-dat.net) Date: Sat Dec 17 10:13:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A37602.2030508@poeticstudios.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <5bdc1c8b0512161626h1cf7941er2fec1f4e309f0e15@mail.gmail.com> <43A37602.2030508@poeticstudios.com> Message-ID: <20051217151448.GE16164@phlunky.Belkin> On Sat, 17 Dec, 2005 at 03:20AM +0100, Cesare Marilungo spake thus: > Thank you all. Really. This is what keeps me making music. > > About the tools: I'm really inspired by the whole open source community. > This is how a lot of things in the world should be. Freedom, shared > knowledge, passion and lack of greed. I've been tremendously busy lately, and a lot of stuff has passed me by. Lucky for me, this post drew my attention to the original. This is really nice stuff, and I hope to hear more. And keep us posted on how you get on with the new tools. Thanks for the music, James > c. > -- "I'd crawl over an acre of 'Visual This++' and 'Integrated Development That' to get to gcc, Emacs, and gdb. Thank you." (By Vance Petree, Virginia Power) From cave.dnb at tiscali.fr Sat Dec 17 15:03:50 2005 From: cave.dnb at tiscali.fr (Nigel Henry) Date: Sat Dec 17 15:03:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512161628i68b747edi9a1ba4a99f156b06@mail.gmail.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <200512161903.45838.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> <5bdc1c8b0512161628i68b747edi9a1ba4a99f156b06@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512172103.50596.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> On Saturday 17 December 2005 01:28, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/16/05, Nigel Henry wrote: > > I presume that your going to > > make your tunes available in .ogg format as well in the future. I had to > > play them using Mplayer on FC2, and it was using 100% cpu, but didn't > > seem to affect the sound quality. Really nice work. Thanks. Nigel. > > No such problems with my favorite day to day player Aqualung. Check it > out if you haven't already. > > http://aqualung.sourceforge.net/ > > Cheers, > Mark Hi Mark. This is the second time that you've prompted me to try Aqualung. I think you must have some vested interest in it (only joking). Thanks for the link this time. I think I put it off last time, not wishing to Google and get page after page of skindiving equipment or links to Jethro Tull. Anyway I DL'd the tar.gz, then read the compile info. Darn! It needs gtk+2.0 , and FC2 only has gtk+-1.2.10-29.1.1. Same problem here as with Sineshaper and Om. Back to FC2 I looked around in synaptic and saw the xmms mp3 plugin was there, tried it and it worked. A bit strange, because the first time I tried to install this it would not work. Perhaps libmad was missing at the time. So I can play mp3's without frying the cpu with Mplayer, but it would obviously be better if more up to date files like gtk+ 2.0 were available for Fedora. Perhaps I'll try Aqualung on Debian, as there are Deb packages available for it. Not sure which way to go getting it installed on Gentoo (your favorite). BTW. Hows it going with the VSTi's with Savihost and Wine? I've just DL'd MrRay73, a Rhodes piano that I saw a link to on the list, and that works ok with Savihost, but still terrible latency problems from the Evolution MK-225C usb midi keyboard. A bit like playing a pipe organ. Press the key, and then sit back and wait for the sound. All the best. Nigel. From markknecht at gmail.com Sat Dec 17 15:16:37 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sat Dec 17 15:16:39 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <200512172103.50596.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <200512161903.45838.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> <5bdc1c8b0512161628i68b747edi9a1ba4a99f156b06@mail.gmail.com> <200512172103.50596.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512171216n5b5d830cgb9600847a61a23ed@mail.gmail.com> On 12/17/05, Nigel Henry wrote: > On Saturday 17 December 2005 01:28, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On 12/16/05, Nigel Henry wrote: > > > I presume that your going to > > > make your tunes available in .ogg format as well in the future. I had to > > > play them using Mplayer on FC2, and it was using 100% cpu, but didn't > > > seem to affect the sound quality. Really nice work. Thanks. Nigel. > > > > No such problems with my favorite day to day player Aqualung. Check it > > out if you haven't already. > > > > http://aqualung.sourceforge.net/ > > > > Cheers, > > Mark > > Hi Mark. This is the second time that you've prompted me to try Aqualung. I > think you must have some vested interest in it (only joking). Thanks for the > link this time. I think I put it off last time, not wishing to Google and get > page after page of skindiving equipment or links to Jethro Tull. Anyway I > DL'd the tar.gz, then read the compile info. Darn! It needs gtk+2.0 , and FC2 > only has gtk+-1.2.10-29.1.1. Same problem here as with Sineshaper and Om. > Back to FC2 I looked around in synaptic and saw the xmms mp3 plugin was > there, tried it and it worked. A bit strange, because the first time I tried > to install this it would not work. Perhaps libmad was missing at the time. So > I can play mp3's without frying the cpu with Mplayer, but it would obviously > be better if more up to date files like gtk+ 2.0 were available for Fedora. > Perhaps I'll try Aqualung on Debian, as there are Deb packages available for > it. Not sure which way to go getting it installed on Gentoo (your favorite). I run it on all my home Gentoo machines. (3 as of today.) I also run it on a Planet box running FC2, but that may be an older version. I could check that. I haven't had many problems with Gentoo. The only thing there has been using an occasional ~x86 library to make the Aqualung developers happy. > > BTW. Hows it going with the VSTi's with Savihost and Wine? I've just DL'd > MrRay73, a Rhodes piano that I saw a link to on the list, and that works ok > with Savihost, but still terrible latency problems from the Evolution MK-225C > usb midi keyboard. A bit like playing a pipe organ. Press the key, and then > sit back and wait for the sound. As of late I'm pretty much out of the music area. We're in the middle of a bunch of house remodeling things - new windows, floors, redoing a laundry room and turning it into a computer game room. I haven't touched savihost in quite awhile unfortunately. It did have some latency issues, that's for sure. The main problem there (I think) is that the Wine Jack driver is pretty much kaput. It seems that no one wants to maintain it and it doesn't work with the new versions of Jack. Bummer! I tried to drum up some interest in supporting it on the Jack developers list but couldn't get a response. Disappointing as we're all Jack users and having great Jack support in Wine would be wonderful in so many ways. I'm sure it will happen some day...just not sure which one. ;-) I have not tried the new xfst stuff as it wouldn't build on my AMD64 machine and it seemed that no xfst developer had an AMD64 machine to debug the issues. Is that any different now? > > All the best. Nigel. > And to you! Cheers, Mark From rlrevell at joe-job.com Sat Dec 17 15:20:20 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Sat Dec 17 15:17:17 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-12 at 11:47 -0500, Paul Davis wrote: > ( LAU folk: this is an initial outline of an email I want to dispatch to > the desktop-architects list in the very near future. Your comments > are eagerly sought. Note that this section specifically seeks to > avoid any discussion of implementations or specific approachs. I > would like to fully flesh out the list of tasks ASAP ) > > Making Sound Just Work > ------------------------ > > One of the "second tier" of requirements mentioned several times at > the OSDL Portland Linux Desktop Architects workshop was "making audio > on Linux just work". Many people find it easy to leave this > requirement lying around in various lists of goals and requirements, > but before we can make any progress on defining a plan to implement > the goal, we first need to define it rather more precisely. > If we can agree on the goals below the next step is to determine which of these don't already Just Work and of the remaining items, which will need to be solved at the application level (IOW specified in that desktop environment's requirements for a correct audio app) and which can be solved at lower level. For example, in order to control application volumes independently, in the event that the hardware does not support it do we require each app to implement a software volume control? Or can it be solved at the ALSA level without requiring an intermediate buffer or extra copy? Also we need to select a baseline system to determine how many of these items Just Work already. Personally I would recommend a recent Ubuntu distro with the latest Gnome release. Another question, where do we draw the line between things that should Just Work and which should be possible but require configuration by the user. For example "use multiple soundcards as a single logical device" is tricky - do you think it's realistic to expect an idiot proof interface for this? I'd also like to see the OSS API go away as it makes meeting the goals below much easier. > DEFINING THE GOAL > ================= > > The list below is a set of tasks that a user could reasonably expect > to perform on a computer running Linux that has access to zero, one > or more audio interfaces. > > The desired task should either work, or produce a sensible and > comprehensible error message explaining why it failed. For example, > attempting to control input gain on a device that has no hardware > mixer should explain that the device has no controls for input gain. > > PLAYBACK > > - play a compressed audio file > * user driven (e.g. play(1)) > * app driven (e.g. {kde,gnome_play}_audiofile()) > - play a PCM encoded audio file (specifics as above) > - hear system sounds > - VOIP > - game audio > - music composition > - music editing > - video post production > > RECORDING > > - record from hardware inputs > * use default audio interface > * use other audio interface > * specify which h/w input to use > * control input gain > - record from other application(s) > - record from live (network-delivered) compressed audio > streams > > > MIXING > > - control h/w mixer device (if any) > > * allow use of a generic app for this > * NOTE to non-audio-focused readers: the h/w mixer > is part of the audio interface that is used > to control signal levels, input selection > for recording, and other h/w specific features. > Some pro-audio interfaces do not have a h/w mixer, > most consumer ones do. It has almost nothing > to do with "hardware mixing" which describes > the ability of the h/w to mix together multiple > software-delivered audio data streams. > > - multiple applications using soundcard simultaneously > - control application volumes independently > - provide necessary apps for controlling specialized > hardware (e.g. RME HDSP, ice1712, ice1724, liveFX) > > ROUTING > > - route audio to specific h/w among several installed devices > - route audio between applications > - route audio across network > > MULTIUSER > > - which of the above should work in a multi-user scenario? > > MISC > > - use multiple soundcards as a single logical device > > > > From markknecht at gmail.com Sat Dec 17 15:36:11 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sat Dec 17 15:36:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> On 12/17/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Mon, 2005-12-12 at 11:47 -0500, Paul Davis wrote: > > ( LAU folk: this is an initial outline of an email I want to dispatch to > > the desktop-architects list in the very near future. Your comments > > are eagerly sought. Note that this section specifically seeks to > > avoid any discussion of implementations or specific approachs. I > > would like to fully flesh out the list of tasks ASAP ) > > > > Making Sound Just Work > > ------------------------ > > > > One of the "second tier" of requirements mentioned several times at > > the OSDL Portland Linux Desktop Architects workshop was "making audio > > on Linux just work". Many people find it easy to leave this > > requirement lying around in various lists of goals and requirements, > > but before we can make any progress on defining a plan to implement > > the goal, we first need to define it rather more precisely. > > > > If we can agree on the goals below the next step is to determine which > of these don't already Just Work and of the remaining items, which will > need to be solved at the application level (IOW specified in that > desktop environment's requirements for a correct audio app) and which > can be solved at lower level. For example, in order to control > application volumes independently, in the event that the hardware does > not support it do we require each app to implement a software volume > control? Or can it be solved at the ALSA level without requiring an > intermediate buffer or extra copy? > > Also we need to select a baseline system to determine how many of these > items Just Work already. Personally I would recommend a recent Ubuntu > distro with the latest Gnome release. > > Another question, where do we draw the line between things that should > Just Work and which should be possible but require configuration by the > user. For example "use multiple soundcards as a single logical device" > is tricky - do you think it's realistic to expect an idiot proof > interface for this? > > I'd also like to see the OSS API go away as it makes meeting the goals > below much easier. > > > DEFINING THE GOAL > > ================= > > > > The list below is a set of tasks that a user could reasonably expect > > to perform on a computer running Linux that has access to zero, one > > or more audio interfaces. > > > > The desired task should either work, or produce a sensible and > > comprehensible error message explaining why it failed. For example, > > attempting to control input gain on a device that has no hardware > > mixer should explain that the device has no controls for input gain. > > > > PLAYBACK > > > > - play a compressed audio file > > * user driven (e.g. play(1)) > > * app driven (e.g. {kde,gnome_play}_audiofile()) > > - play a PCM encoded audio file (specifics as above) > > - hear system sounds > > - VOIP > > - game audio > > - music composition > > - music editing > > - video post production > > I don't know if it's implied somewhere in the comments above but I think that, as a user coming from the Windows and recently Mac world that making sure pretty much everything out there that gets linked on a web page should be able to play from in the browser you are using. There are some strange aspects about mplayer and web browsers, at least on my systems, which can end up with multiple mp3's playing at the same time. Stuff like starting an mp3/ogg/xxx file playing, and then hitting the back button, should stop the audio, or if it doesn't, hitting another audio link should stop the previous one from playing. Anyway, that's my 2 cents. It's great that you guys are talking about making this better. Also, the OSS api could possibly go away but there are still huge numbers of apps that depend on it. Lots of old Linux games, etc., shouldn't suddently fail. As long as alsa-oss handles that it should be cool. Thanks, Mark From rlrevell at joe-job.com Sat Dec 17 15:51:37 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Sat Dec 17 15:48:27 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> On Sat, 2005-12-17 at 12:36 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > I don't know if it's implied somewhere in the comments above but I > think that, as a user coming from the Windows and recently Mac world > that making sure pretty much everything out there that gets linked on > a web page should be able to play from in the browser you are using. > There are some strange aspects about mplayer and web browsers, at > least on my systems, which can end up with multiple mp3's playing at > the same time. Stuff like starting an mp3/ogg/xxx file playing, and > then hitting the back button, should stop the audio, or if it doesn't, > hitting another audio link should stop the previous one from playing. > Because the Linux browsers are garbage. For some reason the people who develop them worry about bullshit like extensions and toolbars and making sure the apps are translated into Xhosa than fixing basic usability bugs like this. Simple things don't even work, like, if I click a media link that opens an external player, then it finishes playing, then I click another link, rather than opening in the same player it launches a new one. Eventually I have 50 media players open. Lee From rlrevell at joe-job.com Sat Dec 17 15:54:35 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Sat Dec 17 15:51:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1134852876.11227.41.camel@mindpipe> On Sat, 2005-12-17 at 12:36 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > mplayer and web browsers, at > least on my systems, which can end up with multiple mp3's playing at > the same time mplayer is hopeless in this regard because it does not integrate with the desktop environment (Gnome or KDE) so it has no way to talk to other apps other than spawning a new process. With Gnome totem is supposed to handle this better but it's still horribly buggy and godawful slow and when it does play half the time it's incapable of even keeping the audio and video in sync. Lee From markknecht at gmail.com Sat Dec 17 17:29:39 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sat Dec 17 17:29:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512171429p6bda31adk47d6a3a7c3a7507@mail.gmail.com> On 12/17/05, Lee Revell wrote: > On Sat, 2005-12-17 at 12:36 -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > I don't know if it's implied somewhere in the comments above but I > > think that, as a user coming from the Windows and recently Mac world > > that making sure pretty much everything out there that gets linked on > > a web page should be able to play from in the browser you are using. > > There are some strange aspects about mplayer and web browsers, at > > least on my systems, which can end up with multiple mp3's playing at > > the same time. Stuff like starting an mp3/ogg/xxx file playing, and > > then hitting the back button, should stop the audio, or if it doesn't, > > hitting another audio link should stop the previous one from playing. > > > > Because the Linux browsers are garbage. For some reason the people who > develop them worry about bullshit like extensions and toolbars and > making sure the apps are translated into Xhosa than fixing basic > usability bugs like this. > > Simple things don't even work, like, if I click a media link that opens > an external player, then it finishes playing, then I click another link, > rather than opening in the same player it launches a new one. > Eventually I have 50 media players open. > > Lee Yeah, that's what I see also, if the system even understands the link in the first place. The Firefox guys do not make it obvious for new users how you link a specific media type to a specific player. Maybe mplayerplug-in does that, and it does a better job than 1-2 years ago, but it seems that there's a long way to go yet to have a new user sit down and have this stuff 'just work'. - Mark. From juan at nixbox.com.ar Sat Dec 17 17:05:26 2005 From: juan at nixbox.com.ar (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Juan_Marcelo_Rodr=EDguez?=) Date: Sat Dec 17 19:52:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] LinuxSampler, dirty and unusable ( can't mlockall() memory!: Cannot allocate memory ) Message-ID: <43A48BA6.3060304@nixbox.com.ar> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello, Im working with a korg controller via midi, through a SBLive 5.1 with some samples. I used to test qsynth, and works fine, even with big sound fonts files, now I got some interesting .gig files and I compiled linuxsampler with qsampler, and I got a dirty sound with all the .gig files, truly awful and unplayeable. I compiled the 'stable' and the 'unstable' software versions ( liblscp, libgig, linuxsampler, qsampler ) and from both I cannot work well with them. The output from the program, is the subject of the mail, the complete one ( sorry for the several lines ) is : ($:~)- linuxsampler LinuxSampler 0.3.3 Copyright (C) 2003, 2004 by Benno Senoner and Christian Schoenebeck Copyright (C) 2005 Christian Schoenebeck Detected features: MMX SSE Creating Sampler...OK Registered MIDI input drivers: ALSA Registered audio output drivers: ALSA,JACK Starting LSCP network server (0.0.0.0:8888)...Thread: WARNING, can't mlockall() memory!: Cannot allocate memory OK LinuxSampler initialization completed. :-) The warning is the same for both, stable and unstable. Hope you can help. Juan -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFDpIumwWB8GXdhYbcRAh9qAJ95z4En6yOMYvdpb6tlcBAWgtr/9ACfT0A8 pPvtzM1kHmLExT7a9OqDYrA= =Gjns -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From torbenh at gmx.de Sun Dec 18 04:56:46 2005 From: torbenh at gmx.de (torbenh@gmx.de) Date: Sun Dec 18 04:57:49 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512171216n5b5d830cgb9600847a61a23ed@mail.gmail.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <200512161903.45838.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> <5bdc1c8b0512161628i68b747edi9a1ba4a99f156b06@mail.gmail.com> <200512172103.50596.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> <5bdc1c8b0512171216n5b5d830cgb9600847a61a23ed@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051218095646.GA4494@mobilat> On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 12:16:37PM -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/17/05, Nigel Henry wrote: > > On Saturday 17 December 2005 01:28, Mark Knecht wrote: > > > On 12/16/05, Nigel Henry wrote: > > > > I presume that your going to > > > > make your tunes available in .ogg format as well in the future. I had to > > > > play them using Mplayer on FC2, and it was using 100% cpu, but didn't > > > > seem to affect the sound quality. Really nice work. Thanks. Nigel. > > > > > > No such problems with my favorite day to day player Aqualung. Check it > > > out if you haven't already. > > > > > > http://aqualung.sourceforge.net/ > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Mark > > > > Hi Mark. This is the second time that you've prompted me to try Aqualung. I > > think you must have some vested interest in it (only joking). Thanks for the > > link this time. I think I put it off last time, not wishing to Google and get > > page after page of skindiving equipment or links to Jethro Tull. Anyway I > > DL'd the tar.gz, then read the compile info. Darn! It needs gtk+2.0 , and FC2 > > only has gtk+-1.2.10-29.1.1. Same problem here as with Sineshaper and Om. > > Back to FC2 I looked around in synaptic and saw the xmms mp3 plugin was > > there, tried it and it worked. A bit strange, because the first time I tried > > to install this it would not work. Perhaps libmad was missing at the time. So > > I can play mp3's without frying the cpu with Mplayer, but it would obviously > > be better if more up to date files like gtk+ 2.0 were available for Fedora. > > Perhaps I'll try Aqualung on Debian, as there are Deb packages available for > > it. Not sure which way to go getting it installed on Gentoo (your favorite). > > I run it on all my home Gentoo machines. (3 as of today.) I also run > it on a Planet box running FC2, but that may be an older version. I > could check that. I haven't had many problems with Gentoo. The only > thing there has been using an occasional ~x86 library to make the > Aqualung developers happy. > > > > > BTW. Hows it going with the VSTi's with Savihost and Wine? I've just DL'd > > MrRay73, a Rhodes piano that I saw a link to on the list, and that works ok > > with Savihost, but still terrible latency problems from the Evolution MK-225C > > usb midi keyboard. A bit like playing a pipe organ. Press the key, and then > > sit back and wait for the sound. mr ray works perfectly with fst-1.7. you wont distiguish it from a normal linux synth. > > As of late I'm pretty much out of the music area. We're in the middle > of a bunch of house remodeling things - new windows, floors, redoing a > laundry room and turning it into a computer game room. I haven't > touched savihost in quite awhile unfortunately. > > It did have some latency issues, that's for sure. The main problem > there (I think) is that the Wine Jack driver is pretty much kaput. It > seems that no one wants to maintain it and it doesn't work with the > new versions of Jack. Bummer! I tried to drum up some interest in > supporting it on the Jack developers list but couldn't get a response. > Disappointing as we're all Jack users and having great Jack support in > Wine would be wonderful in so many ways. I'm sure it will happen some > day...just not sure which one. ;-) the correct solution would be to write an asio<->jack gateway. but dont expect that to come from me. > I have not tried the new xfst stuff as it wouldn't build on my AMD64 > machine and it seemed that no xfst developer had an AMD64 machine to > debug the issues. Is that any different now? sorry... i still seem to be the only "active" fst dev. and i only have 32bit here. which will not change as i am happy with my 2 athlonxp 2000+ machines. and with netjack (-> jack clustering) i have pretty much headroom still. > > > > All the best. Nigel. > > > > And to you! > > Cheers, > Mark > -- torben Hohn http://galan.sourceforge.net -- The graphical Audio language From kvehmanen at eca.cx Sun Dec 18 05:00:01 2005 From: kvehmanen at eca.cx (Kai Vehmanen) Date: Sun Dec 18 04:58:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] puzzling ecasound error In-Reply-To: <8d27a0610512012043s4c1296f8o7523a706727e8568@mail.gmail.com> References: <8d27a0610511282009k71b859b3i5e7a5117f465cf88@mail.gmail.com> <8d27a0610511290741n83c5650j245057695a9b2d4b@mail.gmail.com> <8d27a0610512012043s4c1296f8o7523a706727e8568@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 1 Dec 2005, Paul Coccoli wrote: >> On Tue, 29 Nov 2005, Paul Coccoli wrote: >>> I get that plate reverb error no matter what options I use. Is that >>> something in my system configuration? > I see three plate reverbs: > 152. Versatile plate reverb > -el:Plate,'bandwidth','tail','damping','blend' > 222. Plate reverb > -el:plate,'Reverb time','Damping','Dry/wet mix' Hmm, ok, that's the problem, "Plate" vs "plate" as the plugin name. This is valid use of LADSPA, so I'll have to add some workaround to new versions of ecasound. You can still use the plugins via their numerical id (-eli:num-id,params,... to ecasound). -- links, my public keys, etc at http://eca.cx/kv From mockingbird at ihug.co.nz Sun Dec 18 04:53:06 2005 From: mockingbird at ihug.co.nz (Chris Bannister) Date: Sun Dec 18 05:22:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] amd64 - distro questions... In-Reply-To: <20051125112729.A99579@replic.net> References: <438181A0.9090004@pro.onet.pl> <5bdc1c8b0511251009u4e0e9f2ne2066fc4f3bdfdb@mail.gmail.com> <20051125112729.A99579@replic.net> Message-ID: <20051218095306.GG9588@kan> On Fri, Nov 25, 2005 at 11:27:29AM -0800, carmen wrote: > > I'm a Gentoo AMD64 user and am running a pure 64-bit setup. The > > audio part of it works pretty well for me, but there are a number of > > limitations in the overall/non-audio system. Much web based multimedia > > doesn't work at all. > > disagree. the only thing that doesnt work is silly flash animation sites, and annoying flash banners, and a few sites that are lame enough to use flash for the navigation. no big loss. the latest mplayerplug-in even has support for google video, and quicktime, and windows media, providing the codec is implemented via ffmpeg or such - it usually is. its nice to reclaim that diskspace and kernel compile time that was just so i could see silly flash ads i didnt even want to see Many people recommend keeping e-mail messages 72 chars wide. -- Chris. ====== Reproduction if desired may be handled locally. -- rfc3 From yaqtil at gmail.com Sun Dec 18 06:24:31 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Sun Dec 18 06:24:35 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] amd64 - distro questions... In-Reply-To: <20051218095306.GG9588@kan> References: <438181A0.9090004@pro.onet.pl> <5bdc1c8b0511251009u4e0e9f2ne2066fc4f3bdfdb@mail.gmail.com> <20051125112729.A99579@replic.net> <20051218095306.GG9588@kan> Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512180324x25019704g84552b52325315ae@mail.gmail.com> > > disagree. the only thing that doesnt work is silly flash animation sites, and annoying flash banners, and a few sites that are lame enough to use flash for the navigation. no big loss. the latest mplayerplug-in even has support for google video, and quicktime, and windows media, providing the codec is implemented via ffmpeg or such - it usually is. its nice to reclaim that diskspace and kernel compile time that was just so i could see silly flash ads i didnt even want to see > > Many people recommend keeping e-mail messages 72 chars wide. your client cant wrap to screen width? what are you using, netscape? BTW, i switched to gmail, it seems to wrap automagically, but i stil prefer leaving it up to the reader.. re the mplayer bit, if you are using 64bit firefox, you can just symlink mplayer to a 32 bit binary and it will play 32bit proprietary codecs in the 64bit browser via window tricks.. From lilli.chiffon at free.fr Sun Dec 18 07:07:08 2005 From: lilli.chiffon at free.fr (lilli chiffon) Date: Sun Dec 18 07:07:11 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. Message-ID: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> Hi the list. I would like to know your advice about external soundcard (with ieee 1394 port) recognize by linux. My native soundcard is not full eqquiped in input/output port that why i'm searching for a soundcard with rca/xlr/jack connections. I'm running under debian sarge with a 2.6.14 kernel. Thanks by advance. P'tit Louis. From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 07:34:26 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 07:33:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> Message-ID: <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> > I would like to know your advice about external soundcard (with ieee > 1394 port) recognize by linux. ieee 1394 is not yet optimal supported on Linux, but see freebob.sf.net for some details, including working devices. > My native soundcard is not full eqquiped in input/output port that > why i'm searching for a soundcard with rca/xlr/jack connections. > > I'm running under debian sarge with a 2.6.14 kernel. If you're not bound to the firewire port and you're interested in a painless solution, I can recommend USB 1.1 devices (AFAIK there are no USB 2.0 devices known to work under Linux). There are cards from Tascam which work fine as well as I personally can recommend the Edirol UA-25. Happy X-mas ;-))) . Best regards ce From a at gaydenko.com Sun Dec 18 07:51:51 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Sun Dec 18 07:47:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <200512181551.51486@goldspace.net> Christoph, As you are familiar with USB alsa support, can you recommend an USB device with the only demands to have SPDIF (coaxial or optic) 96/24 in/out? Andrew ======= On Sunday 18 December 2005 15:34, Christoph Eckert wrote: ======= ... If you're not bound to the firewire port and you're interested in a painless solution, I can recommend USB 1.1 devices (AFAIK there are no USB 2.0 devices known to work under Linux). There are cards from Tascam which work fine as well as I personally can recommend the Edirol UA-25. Happy X-mas ;-))) . Best regards ce From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 08:03:13 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 08:02:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181551.51486@goldspace.net> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> <200512181551.51486@goldspace.net> Message-ID: <200512181403.13975.ce@christeck.de> > As you are familiar with USB alsa support, can you recommend an USB > device with the only demands to have SPDIF (coaxial or optic) 96/24 > in/out? I never used SPDIF, but at least the UA-25 can be run @ 24/96 (but then not in full duplex mode) and it features digital I/O (not sure if it is SPDIF). Ask Google for details. Here's a link to the device (no, I'm not paid by Thomann ;-) : http://www.thomann.de/thoiw2_edirol_ua25_usb_audio_prodinfo.html Best regards ce From markknecht at gmail.com Sun Dec 18 08:11:01 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sun Dec 18 08:11:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <20051218095646.GA4494@mobilat> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <200512161903.45838.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> <5bdc1c8b0512161628i68b747edi9a1ba4a99f156b06@mail.gmail.com> <200512172103.50596.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> <5bdc1c8b0512171216n5b5d830cgb9600847a61a23ed@mail.gmail.com> <20051218095646.GA4494@mobilat> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512180511l1177cd93gc3e46716c39aa375@mail.gmail.com> On 12/18/05, torbenh@gmx.de wrote: > On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 12:16:37PM -0800, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On 12/17/05, Nigel Henry wrote: > > > BTW. Hows it going with the VSTi's with Savihost and Wine? > > > > > > I have not tried the new xfst stuff as it wouldn't build on my AMD64 > > machine and it seemed that no xfst developer had an AMD64 machine to > > debug the issues. Is that any different now? > > sorry... i still seem to be the only "active" fst dev. and i only have > 32bit here. which will not change as i am happy with my 2 athlonxp 2000+ > machines. and with netjack (-> jack clustering) i have pretty much > headroom still. > That's OK. I'm not likely to do much musically for the next few months. I do have one interesting out though. To get full browsing capabilities (Java & flash + mplayer, etc.) I run Firefox in a completely chroot'ed 32-bit enviroment on my AMD64 machine. I haven't considered doing serious audio this until now, but possibly I can run two jack servers, one in the 64-bit area using the HDSP 9652, to run Ardour, etc, and a second in the 32-bit area using either the onboard NVidia chip or I could put a second card in if this worked and was useful. I'd tie the two environments together with external spdif or audio cables. Would it work? Might be fun to try. - Mark From a at gaydenko.com Sun Dec 18 08:16:14 2005 From: a at gaydenko.com (Andrew Gaydenko) Date: Sun Dec 18 08:12:08 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181403.13975.ce@christeck.de> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181551.51486@goldspace.net> <200512181403.13975.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <200512181616.14500@goldspace.net> Thanks, I have looked at the device. It is superfluous fo my purposes. I have tried to find something like USB-SPDIF bridge only (taking in mind an external DAC using). ======= On Sunday 18 December 2005 16:03, Christoph Eckert wrote: ======= > As you are familiar with USB alsa support, can you recommend an USB > device with the only demands to have SPDIF (coaxial or optic) 96/24 > in/out? I never used SPDIF, but at least the UA-25 can be run @ 24/96 (but then not in full duplex mode) and it features digital I/O (not sure if it is SPDIF). Ask Google for details. Here's a link to the device (no, I'm not paid by Thomann ;-) : http://www.thomann.de/thoiw2_edirol_ua25_usb_audio_prodinfo.html Best regards ce From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 08:31:20 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 08:30:17 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181616.14500@goldspace.net> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181403.13975.ce@christeck.de> <200512181616.14500@goldspace.net> Message-ID: <200512181431.21023.ce@christeck.de> > Thanks, I have looked at the device. It is superfluous fo my > purposes. I have tried to find something like USB-SPDIF bridge only > (taking in mind an external DAC using). OK, but I guess it will be hard to find a simpler card with 24/96. I once used an el cheapo Terratec Aureon USB which offers optical I/O but at 16/48 only. Best regards ce From ardour at semiosix.com Sun Dec 18 09:21:01 2005 From: ardour at semiosix.com (John Anderson) Date: Sun Dec 18 09:21:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> On Sun, 2005-12-18 at 13:34 +0100, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > I would like to know your advice about external soundcard (with ieee > > 1394 port) recognize by linux. > > ieee 1394 is not yet optimal supported on Linux, but see freebob.sf.net > for some details, including working devices. > > > My native soundcard is not full eqquiped in input/output port that > > why i'm searching for a soundcard with rca/xlr/jack connections. > > > > I'm running under debian sarge with a 2.6.14 kernel. > > If you're not bound to the firewire port and you're interested in a > painless solution, I can recommend USB 1.1 devices (AFAIK there are no > USB 2.0 devices known to work under Linux). So are there no longer latency issues with USB audio? bye John From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Sun Dec 18 10:01:13 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Sun Dec 18 09:43:16 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] In-Reply-To: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <43A579B9.3020006@woh.rr.com> tim hall wrote: >I'm very pleased to announce the release of "Flutter", best described as a >MIDI Tone Poem. It's the piece I have used to test out and learn the >capabilities of Rosegarden, Ardour and various other applications. It uses >fairly standard soundfonts and a couple of custom voices from my external >D10. The whole piece runs to 28:00 minutes, I would really encourage people >to listen to the whole thing in order, as that was how it was intended. That >said it's all released under CC-by-sa-2.5 so do as you will with it. :) > >Direct links: >http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter0_flap.ogg >http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter1_fluke.ogg >http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter2_fidget.ogg >http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter3_fplusf--fplusf.ogg >http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter4_flubber.ogg >http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter5_flounder.ogg >http://www.archive.org/download/Flutter/flutter6_fly.ogg > >Web: >http://www.archive.org/audio/audio-details-db.php?collection=opensource_audio&collectionid=Flutter >http://muzik.agnula.org/view.php?search=any&view=search&text=Flutter > >Thanks to everyone. Have fun! > > From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Sun Dec 18 10:15:06 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Sun Dec 18 09:57:26 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] In-Reply-To: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> References: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> Message-ID: <43A57CFA.8090301@woh.rr.com> Hi Tim: Very ambitious stuff ! I'm currently listening to #3, so my comments are a bit provisional at this point. Your composition skill is evident, the piece hangs together well so far. You've obviously made extensive use of your available materials, but that's also one of my primary criticisms: like in my own stuff, the soundfonts just don't sound very good. As I listen to the work I keep thinking how great it would sound with better sounds. What you've used isn't godawful, it's just that the composition strikes me as deserving a better realization. I'm wondering how it might sound if the orchestral sounds were replaced by some high-end GIG files played through Linuxsampler. Maybe a collaboration could happen with one of the LS users on this list ? The realism that can be achieved with modern sampling technology is awesome. Some time ago a fellow Csound user posted a piece that used samples that were so realistic I was sure he had the piece performed and recorded, but I was told that all sounds were samples. Of course, you could also just sell everything you own, take a out a personal loan at high interest, and hire a real orchestra to read through your piece once. ;-) So far, I give it 10 out of 10 points for your composition, 5 out of 10 for the sounds. On to the next section... And thank you for letting us hear more of your music ! :) Best regards, dp From cesare at poeticstudios.com Sun Dec 18 09:57:03 2005 From: cesare at poeticstudios.com (Cesare Marilungo) Date: Sun Dec 18 09:58:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> Message-ID: <43A578BF.6010304@poeticstudios.com> John Anderson wrote: >On Sun, 2005-12-18 at 13:34 +0100, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > >>>I would like to know your advice about external soundcard (with ieee >>>1394 port) recognize by linux. >>> >>> >>ieee 1394 is not yet optimal supported on Linux, but see freebob.sf.net >>for some details, including working devices. >> >> >> >>>My native soundcard is not full eqquiped in input/output port that >>>why i'm searching for a soundcard with rca/xlr/jack connections. >>> >>>I'm running under debian sarge with a 2.6.14 kernel. >>> >>> >>If you're not bound to the firewire port and you're interested in a >>painless solution, I can recommend USB 1.1 devices (AFAIK there are no >>USB 2.0 devices known to work under Linux). >> >> > >So are there no longer latency issues with USB audio? > >bye >John > > > > > > I tried more than an USB 1.1 soundcard on different operating systems, and I think you can't go beyond 5.6ms, setting -p64 -n4 in jackd (this is what I use with my UA-25). But even that is less latency that I used to get with my old PCI soundcard (EgoSys Waveterminal 24/96) on WinXP. This was an expensive professional soundcard when I bought it six years ago. It's just my experience, but with gnu/Linux, jack and the alsa-usb-audio driver you get far lower latencies than when using other operating systems. Ciao, c. www.cesaremarilungo.com From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 10:45:59 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 10:44:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> Message-ID: <200512181645.59091.ce@christeck.de> > So are there no longer latency issues with USB audio? I do not get very low latency, I'm at 16usecs. That's OK for my needs. But I also read that you can achieve much better latencies, down to 5usecs, by using the patches of Ingo Molnar (such a kernel doesn't boot on my notebook :( ) and tweaking the system a bit. There are also tricks playing with the interrupts. So, if you need low latency you can get good results by tweaking the system. Best regards ce From folderol at ukfsn.org Sun Dec 18 11:13:18 2005 From: folderol at ukfsn.org (Folderol) Date: Sun Dec 18 11:12:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181645.59091.ce@christeck.de> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> <200512181645.59091.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <20051218161318.57ecd624@localhost> On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 16:45:59 +0100 Christoph Eckert wrote: > > > So are there no longer latency issues with USB audio? > > I do not get very low latency, I'm at 16usecs. That's OK for my needs. Are you sure you meant microseconds? Not milliseconds? That sounds 'kin fast to me! -- F From siliconbilly at hotmail.com Sun Dec 18 11:19:49 2005 From: siliconbilly at hotmail.com (=?iso-8859-1?B?UGVkcm8gSGVybmFuc+Fleg==?=) Date: Sun Dec 18 11:19:52 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] mac mini & imic problem whit jack Message-ID: hello everybody, i cant start jack whit alsa driver, this is the error message: jackd 0.99.0 Copyright 2001-2003 Paul Davis and others. jackd comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY This is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it under certain conditions; see the file COPYING for details loading driver .. apparent rate = 44100 creating alsa driver ... hw:1|-|512|4|44100|0|2|nomon|swmeter|-|32bit control device hw:1 configuring for 44100Hz, period = 512 frames, buffer = 4 periods Couldn't open hw:1 for 32bit samples trying 24bit instead Couldn't open hw:1 for 24bit samples trying 16bit instead Sorry. The audio interface "hw:1" doesn't support any of the hardware sample formats that JACK's alsa-driver can use. ALSA: cannot configure playback channel cannot load driver module alsa 16:58:40.791 JACK was stopped successfully. 16:58:42.773 Could not connect to JACK server as client............... my system is a mac mini with a external imic, ubuntu hoary ppc..........the only way i found to start jack is selecting oss driver.....the same imic works on a i386 machine with same distro. i try to listen music with xmms and alsa plugin and all works ok...imic its working and alsa too.. somebody has the imic or another external soundcard working in a ppc machine whith jack? need i buy another external sound card.... usb, firewire?? regards Pedro _________________________________________________________________ M?viles, DVD, c?maras digitales, coleccionismo... Con unas ofertas que ni te imaginas. http://www.msn.es/Subastas/ From m_nels at gmx.net Sun Dec 18 11:25:37 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Sun Dec 18 11:24:19 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] In-Reply-To: <43A57CFA.8090301@woh.rr.com> References: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <43A57CFA.8090301@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <43A58D81.1070008@gmx.net> Dave Phillips wrote: > Of course, you could also just sell everything you own, take a out a > personal loan at high interest, and hire a real orchestra to read > through your piece once. ;-) Alternatively, find a decent local amateur orchestra, and make friends with them... Talk to the conductor, give him the score, let them rehearse it. Hire/borrow a reasonable sounding room, and take along your PC with some microphones. You could even record at one of their rehersals if that's convenient. Try youth, amateur, college and University orchestras. I'm sure that most of these kinds of groups would be keen to get involved. Most musicians like playing music... It might not be the same as a professional orchestra, but some of them do sound good. Regards, Michael From finnendahl at folkwang-hochschule.de Sun Dec 18 11:27:55 2005 From: finnendahl at folkwang-hochschule.de (Orm Finnendahl) Date: Sun Dec 18 11:28:54 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] [ANNOUNCE] pdsend_3113 LADSPA plugin Message-ID: <20051218162755.GB15362@mh-freiburg.de> Hi, I just uploaded a pdsend LADSPA plugin on this page: http://icem-www.folkwang-hochschule.de/~finnendahl/pd.html It is called pdsend_3113 and it can be used for the remote control of fader automation in pd by ardour. That way, pd can be used for the development and prototyping of plugins or a LADSPA host like ardour can be used as a high resolution sequencer of control signals for pd patches. An example is included. -- Orm From ivangerven at skynet.be Sun Dec 18 11:47:44 2005 From: ivangerven at skynet.be (Ivo Vangerven) Date: Sun Dec 18 11:48:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> Message-ID: <005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> Hi Louis, We recently experimented with some interfaces in the framework of a paper I had to write for an Audio Engineer course. As far as FireWire is concerned, there is the FreeBoB project others referred to. But thought you can find some reports of working setups on their site, I think this is still pretty much a developers' thing (they are at the pre-alpha version). We personally tried the Tascam-US122 over USB 1. It has two balanced mic/line inputs with pre-amp and 48V phantom power on 1/4 TRS jack or XLR, the jack inputs impedance can be switched for guitar/bass input, and there is a TRS insert point on each channel. It has no RCA-inputs (but that's quickly fixed via the line-in), but it does have RCA output. There's MIDI in/out, but no digital audio connections. It was a bit of a hassle to get it up and running (we are running the lastest version of DeMuDi), but we got it working for audio in/out (when using jack, increasing the Periods/buffer parameter from 2 to 10 made the audio free of distortion. With the -default?- setting of 2, it sounded horrible). Till now, we couldn't get it working for MIDI in/out. Rgds, Ivo Vangerven ----- Original Message ----- From: "lilli chiffon" To: "Liste audio" Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 1:07 PM Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. > Hi the list. > > I would like to know your advice about external soundcard (with ieee > 1394 port) recognize by linux. > > My native soundcard is not full eqquiped in input/output port that why > i'm searching for a soundcard with rca/xlr/jack connections. > > I'm running under debian sarge with a 2.6.14 kernel. > > Thanks by advance. > > P'tit Louis. > > From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 11:52:09 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 11:51:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <20051218161318.57ecd624@localhost> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181645.59091.ce@christeck.de> <20051218161318.57ecd624@localhost> Message-ID: <200512181752.10061.> > > I do not get very low latency, I'm at 16usecs. That's OK for my > > needs. > > Are you sure you meant microseconds? Not milliseconds? > > That sounds 'kin fast to me! argh. You're right. I always used msecs instead of usecs, but due to my bad english I thought I learned that msecs are written as usecs in english. My fault :) . ce From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 12:02:26 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 12:01:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> Message-ID: <200512181802.26713.ce@christeck.de> > It was a bit of a hassle to get it up and running (we are running the > lastest version of DeMuDi), but we got it working for audio in/out > (when using jack, increasing the Periods/buffer parameter from 2 to > 10 made the audio free of distortion. With the -default?- setting of > 2, it sounded horrible). Till now, we couldn't get it working for > MIDI in/out. There's a dedicated ALSA module for this device: snd-usb-usx2y. Did you use it or did you drive it via snd_usb_audio? Best regards ce From lilli.chiffon at free.fr Sun Dec 18 12:19:10 2005 From: lilli.chiffon at free.fr (lilli chiffon) Date: Sun Dec 18 12:19:15 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> Message-ID: <1134926351.10566.3.camel@yo-machine> Thanks for your answers. OK I forget firewire device. Edirol UA 25 looks good for my needs. Tascam is cheaper, good ratio quality/price. Merry christmas. P'tit Louis. From fritz at fritzmetal.de Sun Dec 18 12:31:53 2005 From: fritz at fritzmetal.de (FRitz) Date: Sun Dec 18 12:31:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A358CD.6000908@fritzmetal.de> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> <3e1f2d940512161602i53015049p3e1b9b5486f57ded@mail.gmail.com> <43A358CD.6000908@fritzmetal.de> Message-ID: <43A59D09.7010500@fritzmetal.de> Hi Chris, would you please answer my questions? I really would like to know as I simply don't understand what you're talking about. I thought this list is about Linux and audio so I don't understand what you said about sides and these things. Thanx a lot, FRitz FRitz wrote: >>>> Glad you're on our side now. >>>> --chris reisor >>> >>> Care to explain that to an "outsider"? :-) >>> >>> >>> Best wishes, FRitz >>> >> >> The Good Side. The Open Source side. > > Why good? In which way good? And why it's a "side"? Side of what? > > > From ivangerven at skynet.be Sun Dec 18 12:43:39 2005 From: ivangerven at skynet.be (Ivo Vangerven) Date: Sun Dec 18 12:43:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine><005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> <200512181802.26713.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <006a01c603fa$94e6f870$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> Christoph We did use snd-usb-usx2y. But there's also a firmware upload to do for this device, so you first have to find that one, and then we were missing several packages (to 4 levels "deep" in the dependencies) to be able to do this upload. That's what I meant by 'bit of a hassle"... Hey, till a very short time ago I wandered about on Mac and WinXP with ProTools, Logic and Cubase ! ;-) Rgds, ivo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christoph Eckert" To: "A list for linux audio users" Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2005 6:02 PM Subject: Re: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. > > > It was a bit of a hassle to get it up and running (we are running the > > lastest version of DeMuDi), but we got it working for audio in/out > > (when using jack, increasing the Periods/buffer parameter from 2 to > > 10 made the audio free of distortion. With the -default?- setting of > > 2, it sounded horrible). Till now, we couldn't get it working for > > MIDI in/out. > > There's a dedicated ALSA module for this device: snd-usb-usx2y. Did you > use it or did you drive it via snd_usb_audio? > > > Best regards > > > ce > > From reynal at ensea.fr Sun Dec 18 13:08:46 2005 From: reynal at ensea.fr (Sylvain Reynal) Date: Sun Dec 18 13:09:19 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <1134926351.10566.3.camel@yo-machine> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> <1134926351.10566.3.camel@yo-machine> Message-ID: <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> On Sunday 18 December 2005 18:19, lilli chiffon wrote: > Thanks for your answers. > > OK I forget firewire device. Thought you'd be glad to know that I've got an Edirol FA-66 that works flawlessly with freebob prealpha 3.0 and jack. Both audio I/O and MIDI ports work ok, very stable when used with ardour, rosegarden, RTsynth and stuff, so that "prealpha" sounds a bit of a misnomer to me; this might as well be a decision from the developers to avoid too much grumbling ;-). Latency perf: I measured a latency of 11ms (with no xrun except a handful of on start-up) after: 1) increasing the PCI bus latency of the ieee1394 OHCI controller to 243 (see "Tuning the hardware" ?at http://www.soundfabrik.net/wb/#linux), and 2) recompiling a vanilla 2.6.11 kernel with the PREEMPT flag turned on. No more, no less... (my current setup is a Clevo-5400 laptop with a 2.4Ghz P4). I also tried a 2.6.14 kernel with Ingo's low-latency patches and the PREEMPT_RT flag turned on. This did not drastically improve the situation (slightly lower latency, but the system would freeze now and often), as IMHO the ultimate bottleneck seems to lie in the kernel's ieee1394 subsystem. That said, if a ~10ms latency suits your needs (it does for me), then you may safely buy this card and use it with freebob. Note, however, that there is no alsa support as yet in freebob, but you can use jack <-> alsa bridges (e.g., oss2jack or jacklaunch) to make alsa/oss-only applications work with jack. Hope this helps. Syd -- --- Sylvain Reynal * Laboratoire de Physique Theorique et Modelisation (CNRS UMR 8089) Universite de Cergy-Pontoise 2, av A Chauvin, F-95302 Cergy-Pontoise +33(0)1-34-25-75-16 * ENSEA 6, av du Ponceau F-95014 Cergy-Pontoise +33(0)1-30-73-62-45 From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 13:18:04 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 13:17:01 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <006a01c603fa$94e6f870$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181802.26713.ce@christeck.de> <006a01c603fa$94e6f870$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> Message-ID: <200512181918.04809.ce@christeck.de> Hi, > We did use snd-usb-usx2y. > > But there's also a firmware upload to do for this device, so you > first have to find that one, and then we were missing several > packages (to 4 levels "deep" in the dependencies) to be able to do > this upload. That's what I meant by 'bit of a hassle"... on this years Linuxtag I managed the audio booth. I can well remember a participiant who was praising the Tascam all the time, that's why I wondered. He even used the MIDI port, so do not take my silly question as offense :) . The guy I'm talking about even is a member of this list, so Arnold, can you read us ;-))) ? Best regards ce From ce at christeck.de Sun Dec 18 13:35:39 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Sun Dec 18 13:34:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <1134926351.10566.3.camel@yo-machine> <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> Message-ID: <200512181935.39579.ce@christeck.de> > Latency perf: I measured a latency of 11ms (with no xrun except a > handful of on start-up) after: > 1) increasing the PCI bus latency of the ieee1394 OHCI controller to > 243 (see "Tuning the hardware" ?at > http://www.soundfabrik.net/wb/#linux), and 2) recompiling a vanilla > 2.6.11 kernel with the PREEMPT flag turned on. No more, no less... That's really a *great* improvement compared to the talk of Daniel Wagner at LAC 2005 where he told that the latency still is at 50msecs. Great to see that firewire audio support improves! Best regards ce From markknecht at gmail.com Sun Dec 18 14:32:43 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sun Dec 18 14:32:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A59D09.7010500@fritzmetal.de> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> <3e1f2d940512161602i53015049p3e1b9b5486f57ded@mail.gmail.com> <43A358CD.6000908@fritzmetal.de> <43A59D09.7010500@fritzmetal.de> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512181132mdd05d6aw2d836f1639a1ca6f@mail.gmail.com> On 12/18/05, FRitz wrote: > > Hi Chris, > > would you please answer my questions? I really would like to know as I > simply don't understand what you're talking about. I thought this list > is about Linux and audio so I don't understand what you said about sides > and these things. > > > Thanx a lot, FRitz > I think it was just an off hand comment. If I understood it correctly, Chris was saying that Cesare was on the other side (Windows) but is glad he joined Chris's side (Linux) now. Frankly, I don't care about sides. I just like the music. If I did a recording in Pro Tools and wanted to post it here I'd add a bit of some Linux soft synth and postit. What's the big deal, right? - Mark From fritz at fritzmetal.de Sun Dec 18 15:57:36 2005 From: fritz at fritzmetal.de (FRitz) Date: Sun Dec 18 15:57:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512181132mdd05d6aw2d836f1639a1ca6f@mail.gmail.com> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> <3e1f2d940512161602i53015049p3e1b9b5486f57ded@mail.gmail.com> <43A358CD.6000908@fritzmetal.de> <43A59D09.7010500@fritzmetal.de> <5bdc1c8b0512181132mdd05d6aw2d836f1639a1ca6f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A5CD40.7060800@fritzmetal.de> Yes Mark, that's the way I see it. :-) All the best, FRitz Mark Knecht wrote: > On 12/18/05, FRitz wrote: >> Hi Chris, >> >> would you please answer my questions? I really would like to know as I >> simply don't understand what you're talking about. I thought this list >> is about Linux and audio so I don't understand what you said about sides >> and these things. >> >> >> Thanx a lot, FRitz >> > > I think it was just an off hand comment. If I understood it correctly, > Chris was saying that Cesare was on the other side (Windows) but is > glad he joined Chris's side (Linux) now. > > Frankly, I don't care about sides. I just like the music. If I did a > recording in Pro Tools and wanted to post it here I'd add a bit of > some Linux soft synth and postit. What's the big deal, right? > > - Mark > > > From rtp405 at yahoo.com Sun Dec 18 18:04:55 2005 From: rtp405 at yahoo.com (R Parker) Date: Sun Dec 18 18:04:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512181132mdd05d6aw2d836f1639a1ca6f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20051218230455.55405.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > > Frankly, I don't care about sides. I just like the > music. If I did a > recording in Pro Tools and wanted to post it here > I'd add a bit of > some Linux soft synth and postit. What's the big > deal, right? I'd suggest sticking with the Subject style of "OT:..." which is being used in this post. That enables people to delete the post without investing their time into figuring out that the post doesn't have much of anything to do with Linux Audio. Otherwise you can post music that's produced with Linux audio applications which is on topic for a list titled Linux Audio Users. No? ron > - Mark > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ross at jose.lug.udel.edu Sun Dec 18 18:28:25 2005 From: ross at jose.lug.udel.edu (Ross Vandegrift) Date: Sun Dec 18 18:28:27 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051218232824.GA1088@jose.lug.udel.edu> On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 03:51:37PM -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > Simple things don't even work, like, if I click a media link that opens > an external player, then it finishes playing, then I click another link, > rather than opening in the same player it launches a new one. > Eventually I have 50 media players open. It's not the job of the browser to keep accounting on external apps. If it were, it'd be doomed to failure anyhow - that task can never be accomplished. Rather, it is up to the individual applications to do the right thing if there is a session already open. xmms has worked the way you seem to expect since its inception. -- Ross Vandegrift ross@lug.udel.edu "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." --St. Augustine, De Genesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37 From markknecht at gmail.com Sun Dec 18 19:12:56 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Sun Dec 18 19:12:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <20051218230455.55405.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <5bdc1c8b0512181132mdd05d6aw2d836f1639a1ca6f@mail.gmail.com> <20051218230455.55405.qmail@web32403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512181612n59358fc4oc4b1df408a37aaf9@mail.gmail.com> On 12/18/05, R Parker wrote: > > > > > Frankly, I don't care about sides. I just like the > > music. If I did a > > recording in Pro Tools and wanted to post it here > > I'd add a bit of > > some Linux soft synth and postit. What's the big > > deal, right? > > I'd suggest sticking with the Subject style of > "OT:..." which is being used in this post. That > enables people to delete the post without investing > their time into figuring out that the post doesn't > have much of anything to do with Linux Audio. > > Otherwise you can post music that's produced with > Linux audio applications which is on topic for a list > titled Linux Audio Users. No? > > ron Ron, You're certainly allowed you opinion, but I don't think the only definition of a 'Lunux Audio User' is someone using Linux for recording, ala Ardour or whatever. I mean, I use Ardour. I no longer use Pro Tools. I was only making the point that if I'm using Linux anywhere in my tool set to make music, be it Jamin or ZynAddSubFX or Muse or Rosegarden, then it's my opinion, and only my opinion, that it's just as on topic as some other tool set. Note that we have discussions here and elsewhere about Ardour on OS X. Technically that's off topic also, right? Anyway, I'll be happy to say OT when I think it's appropriate. I expect it won't be very often. With best regards, Mark From clemens at ladisch.de Mon Dec 19 03:52:06 2005 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Mon Dec 19 03:52:41 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] UA-100 In-Reply-To: <43A3036E.3000503@block4.com> References: <4399DCCE.6080606@block4.com> <1134378469.439d3de53d9e6@webmail.uni-halle.de> <43A3036E.3000503@block4.com> Message-ID: <20051219085206.GD8293@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Malte Steiner wrote: > > What is the output of "lsusb -v" for this device? > > Bus 001 Device 004: ID 0582:0000 Roland Corp. > ... Looks OK. Does playing/recording .wav files with aplay/arecord work? Regards, Clemens From clemens at ladisch.de Mon Dec 19 03:55:39 2005 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Mon Dec 19 03:56:15 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <20051219085539.GE8293@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Christoph Eckert wrote: > (AFAIK there are no USB 2.0 devices known to work under Linux). The SB Audigy 2 NX is supported. The digital output does not work, but the analog in/outputs and everything else (including such important things like the remote control and the LEDs) are supported. Regards, Clemens From clemens at ladisch.de Mon Dec 19 03:58:13 2005 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Mon Dec 19 03:58:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] mac mini & imic problem whit jack In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20051219085813.GF8293@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Pedro Hernans?ez wrote: > Sorry. The audio interface "hw:1" doesn't support any of the hardware > sample formats that JACK's alsa-driver can use. > > my system is a mac mini with a external imic Jack supports only samples in the native format of the machine which is big endian on PPC, but USB devices use little endian samples. Use "plughw:1" instead of "hw:1". HTH Clemens From dsbaikov at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 04:50:31 2005 From: dsbaikov at gmail.com (Dmitry Baikov) Date: Mon Dec 19 04:50:33 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <005601c603f2$c55c7e60$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> <1134926351.10566.3.camel@yo-machine> <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> Message-ID: <70a871c80512190150u27ee2135nc0695dba2faba3b3@mail.gmail.com> On 12/18/05, Sylvain Reynal wrote:> Latency perf: I measured a latency of 11ms (with no xrun except a handful of> on start-up) after:> 1) increasing the PCI bus latency of the ieee1394 OHCI controller to 243 (see> "Tuning the hardware" at http://www.soundfabrik.net/wb/#linux), and Please-please-please, tell your settings for freebob!I still can't figure out how to achieve less than 60msec latency withmy FA-101 (which is very similar). Than you. --Dmitry. From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 00:07:18 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Mon Dec 19 05:38:02 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] qsynth not visible in noteedit (but visible in kmid, rosegarden) Message-ID: <200512190707.18840.ii001001@yahoo.ca> any idea why? any idea how i can fix this? and can somebody please tell me the difference between kmid and kmidi? debian packs them together. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 01:06:43 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Mon Dec 19 07:23:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] qsynth not visible in noteedit (but visible in kmid, rosegarden) In-Reply-To: <200512190707.18840.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512190707.18840.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <200512190806.43081.ii001001@yahoo.ca> any idea why? any idea how i can fix this? and can somebody please tell me the difference between kmid and kmidi? debian packs them together. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From reynal at ensea.fr Mon Dec 19 07:28:08 2005 From: reynal at ensea.fr (Sylvain Reynal) Date: Mon Dec 19 07:28:33 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <70a871c80512190150u27ee2135nc0695dba2faba3b3@mail.gmail.com> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> <70a871c80512190150u27ee2135nc0695dba2faba3b3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> On Monday 19 December 2005 10:50, Dmitry Baikov wrote: > Please-please-please, tell your > settings for freebob!I still can't figure out how to achieve less than > 60msec latency withmy FA-101 (which is very similar). Than you. 1) If you've not already done so, recompile your kernel with the PREEMPT flag turned on (i personally use 2.6.11 and 2.6.14 vanilla kernels). Otherwise you may experience too many xruns, e.g., when switching windows or running tons of apps etc. I'm still testing a 2.6.14 kernel further patched with Ingo Molnar's low-latency patches. I'll keep you posted. 2) change the PCI bus latency of your IEEE controller (let me insist: this may be a +real+ bottleneck; an evidence that you've got such a bottleneck there is the occurence of tons of "IEC61883C: possible raw1394 error" messages when jackd is running...). First, fetch the ID of your IEEE controller: root@stooges:/audio > lspci -vv | grep IEEE 0000:02:04.0 FireWire (IEEE 1394): Texas Instruments TSB43AB21 IEEE-1394a-2000 Mine is 0000:02:04.0. Replace 02:04.0 with YOUR number in the following: root@stooges:/audio > setpci -v -s 0000:02:04.0 latency_timer=f0 (0xf0=240 sounds ok for me, but the rule is simply that it should be set to the maximum allowed value, so that the IEEE controller can hold the bus for a sufficiently long period for the data bursts to complete on time). 3) run freebob, then jackd with the following parameters. I personally prefer to run them with startproc, and stop them with "killall" (i actually put all the following in a rcjack start|stop script in /etc/init.d; ask for it if you're interested). startproc -t 3 -l /audio/freebob.log /usr/bin/freebob && echo "freebob running" JACKD_XML="-o osc.udp://localhost:31000" JACKD_OPTS="-p 64 -b 40 -i 8 -t 16 -s 4" startproc -t 3 -n -20 -l /audio/jackd.log /usr/bin/jackd -R -d iec61883 $JACKD_XML $JACKD_OPTS && echo "jackd running" ("-n -20" sets the lower possible nice value for jackd). This leads to ~11ms as reported by jdelay. And if you're interested, I can send you my edirolFA66.xml; this avoids running the freebob daemon (in this case, JACKD_XML="-f /audio/bin/edirolFA66.xml"). Minor changes shoud be needed for the FA100. You can build one by hand by retrieving all the necessary info from the output of "libfreebobctl/examples/test-freebobctl-osc osc.udp://localhost:31000" Note also that i run everything as root. Surely, this is not good practice, but ok for testing purpose... Otherwise, patch your kernel with the rt-lsm patch, or -even safer- use rlimits. As an ultimate side-note, i also shutdown all services that are not mandatory when doing audio recording, e.g., rcnetwork, rcpowersaved, rcpccardd, (and with SuSE: suseplugger, susewatcher,.... ) Syd From marcospcmusica at yahoo.com.ar Sun Dec 18 02:14:27 2005 From: marcospcmusica at yahoo.com.ar (Marcos Guglielmetti) Date: Mon Dec 19 08:10:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] In-Reply-To: <43A57CFA.8090301@woh.rr.com> References: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <43A57CFA.8090301@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <200512180814.28449.marcospcmusica@yahoo.com.ar> On Sunday 18 December 2005 16:15, Dave Phillips wrote: > ? The realism that can be achieved with modern sampling technology is > awesome. Some time ago a fellow Csound user posted a piece that used > samples that were so realistic I was sure he had the piece performed > and recorded, but I was told that all sounds were samples. Could you give me a link to the audio files from your friend? I would like to listen to Csound samples, MIDI instruments made with Csound, etc. Thanks -- Marcos Guglielmetti (www.pc-musica.com.ar) Coordinador del desarrollo de Musix GNU+Linux (www.musix.org.ar) ___________________________________________________________ 1GB gratis, Antivirus y Antispam Correo Yahoo!, el mejor correo web del mundo http://correo.yahoo.com.ar From cave.dnb at tiscali.fr Mon Dec 19 08:11:27 2005 From: cave.dnb at tiscali.fr (Nigel Henry) Date: Mon Dec 19 08:11:59 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] qsynth not visible in noteedit (but visible in kmid, rosegarden) In-Reply-To: <200512190707.18840.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512190707.18840.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <200512191411.27049.cave.dnb@tiscali.fr> On Monday 19 December 2005 06:07, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > any idea why? any idea how i can fix this? > > and can somebody please tell me the difference between kmid and kmidi? > debian packs them together. Hi. Kmid needs to have a soundfont loaded onto your soundcard if your card is capable of that, so as to produce sounds. In my case I have an Audigy2 soundblaster card, and can load soundfonts onto it, using the "sfxload " command. You need the package "awesfx" installed to use sfxload. Kmidi uses timidity synth to produce sounds and does not need soundfonts loaded onto your soundcard. Sadly it no longer works for me with KDE versions later than that on Fedora Core 1. Maybe issues with the 2.6 kernel post FC1 are also responsible for Kmidi no longer working, but I've never received an answer about that. I seem to recollect that it worked on my initial install of Debian Woody 3.0r2, but when I upgraded to Sarge it was removed. A great shame, as I always found Kmidi worked more reliably than Kmid. All the best. Nigel. > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Mon Dec 19 09:22:08 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Mon Dec 19 09:04:13 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Proof of the Pudding [New Music] In-Reply-To: <200512180814.28449.marcospcmusica@yahoo.com.ar> References: <200512141201.00181.tech@glastonburymusic.org.uk> <43A57CFA.8090301@woh.rr.com> <200512180814.28449.marcospcmusica@yahoo.com.ar> Message-ID: <43A6C210.7020704@woh.rr.com> Marcos Guglielmetti wrote: >On Sunday 18 December 2005 16:15, Dave Phillips wrote: > > >> The realism that can be achieved with modern sampling technology is >>awesome. Some time ago a fellow Csound user posted a piece that used >>samples that were so realistic I was sure he had the piece performed >>and recorded, but I was told that all sounds were samples. >> >> > >Could you give me a link to the audio files from your friend? > >I would like to listen to Csound samples, MIDI instruments made with >Csound, etc. Thanks > > > Alas, that piece is long gone. However, if you want to check out music made with Csound just take a look at the listings at www.csounds.com. You might also want to check out the demos on the linuxsampler site. Best, dp From arnold.krille at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 09:10:48 2005 From: arnold.krille at gmail.com (Arnold Krille) Date: Mon Dec 19 09:10:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512181918.04809.ce@christeck.de> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181802.26713.ce@christeck.de> <006a01c603fa$94e6f870$0201a8c0@kmteu.kmtg.net> <200512181918.04809.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <2def88b80512190610q7b9abb0do@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, 2005/12/18, Christoph Eckert : > on this years Linuxtag I managed the audio booth. I can well remember a > participiant who was praising the Tascam all the time, that's why I > wondered. > He even used the MIDI port, so do not take my silly question as > offense :) . > The guy I'm talking about even is a member of this list, so Arnold, can > you read us ;-))) ? Yeah, I can read you! I don't have internet during the weekend... I am still using my tascam and I am back in a state where I am praising it! I had some troubles with it in combination with my new turion64 laptop, but some testing showed that its not a problem with the tascam or its driver, but with the hd being to slow. Because if I record into ram or on usb-stick, all is well. So I think I will save some money next year and get a usb-disk for audio... But currently all my money is spent, I got the monitors I was dreaming about on linuxtag! Have a nice week, Arnold -- visit http://dillenburg.dyndns.org/~arnold/ --- Wenn man mit Raubkopien Bands wie Brosis oder Britney Spears wirklich verhindern k?nnte, w?rde ich mir noch heute einen Stapel Brenner und einen Sack Rohlinge kaufen. From jjbenham at chicagoguitar.com Mon Dec 19 09:16:09 2005 From: jjbenham at chicagoguitar.com (Jeremiah Benham) Date: Mon Dec 19 09:27:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <20051219141609.GA25154@chicagoguitar.com> On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 03:51:37PM -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > Because the Linux browsers are garbage. For some reason the people who > develop them worry about bullshit like extensions and toolbars and > making sure the apps are translated into Xhosa than fixing basic > usability bugs like this. Every browser works in linux. What on earth are you talking about. Use mozplugger to handle your applications that are launched with each media type. if don't like what it does? { Edit /etc/mozpluggerr. } else { :) } Ha Ha Jeremiah From siliconbilly at hotmail.com Mon Dec 19 09:47:41 2005 From: siliconbilly at hotmail.com (=?iso-8859-1?B?UGVkcm8gSGVybmFuc+Fleg==?=) Date: Mon Dec 19 09:47:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] mac mini & imic problem whit jack In-Reply-To: <20051219085813.GF8293@turing.informatik.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: Thanks Clemens Use "plughw:1" instead of "hw:1" works perfect...finally i can capture with ardour.. Best Regards Pedro >From: Clemens Ladisch >Reply-To: A list for linux audio users > >To: A list for linux audio users >Subject: Re: [linux-audio-user] mac mini & imic problem whit jack >Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 09:58:13 +0100 > >Pedro Hernans?ez wrote: > > Sorry. The audio interface "hw:1" doesn't support any of the hardware > > sample formats that JACK's alsa-driver can use. > > > > my system is a mac mini with a external imic > >Jack supports only samples in the native format of the machine which is >big endian on PPC, but USB devices use little endian samples. > >Use "plughw:1" instead of "hw:1". > > >HTH >Clemens _________________________________________________________________ M?viles, DVD, c?maras digitales, coleccionismo... Con unas ofertas que ni te imaginas. http://www.msn.es/Subastas/ From markknecht at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 09:52:54 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Mon Dec 19 09:52:58 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Making Audio on Linux Just Work: (1) defining the goals In-Reply-To: <20051219141609.GA25154@chicagoguitar.com> References: <1134406063.13653.16.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1134850820.11227.30.camel@mindpipe> <5bdc1c8b0512171236t504ae28ch4d8a496ab576f1fc@mail.gmail.com> <1134852698.11227.37.camel@mindpipe> <20051219141609.GA25154@chicagoguitar.com> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512190652k73a0aaddk74a3bec825d96f00@mail.gmail.com> On 12/19/05, Jeremiah Benham wrote: > On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 03:51:37PM -0500, Lee Revell wrote: > > Because the Linux browsers are garbage. For some reason the people who > > develop them worry about bullshit like extensions and toolbars and > > making sure the apps are translated into Xhosa than fixing basic > > usability bugs like this. > > Every browser works in linux. What on earth are you talking about. Use mozplugger to handle your applications that are launched with each media type. > if don't like what it does? { > Edit /etc/mozpluggerr. > } > else { > :) > } > > Ha Ha > > Jeremiah Yes, ha ha, but I believe you miss the point. From rlrevell at joe-job.com Mon Dec 19 10:32:11 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Mon Dec 19 10:28:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> <70a871c80512190150u27ee2135nc0695dba2faba3b3@mail.gmail.com> <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> Message-ID: <1135006332.16112.34.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-19 at 13:28 +0100, Sylvain Reynal wrote: > startproc -t 3 -l /audio/freebob.log /usr/bin/freebob && echo > "freebob > running" > JACKD_XML="-o osc.udp://localhost:31000" > JACKD_OPTS="-p 64 -b 40 -i 8 -t 16 -s 4" > startproc -t 3 -n -20 -l /audio/jackd.log /usr/bin/jackd -R -d > iec61883 > $JACKD_XML $JACKD_OPTS && echo "jackd running" > > ("-n -20" sets the lower possible nice value for jackd). > This leads to ~11ms as reported by jdelay. Running JACK at a lowered nice value will not give you any lower latency and is considered a bad idea, as JACK already uses the pthread APIs to acquire real-time scheduling for the time sensitive threads. Running it at a low nice value could cause non real-time parts of JACK to interfere with the audio engine. If this does improve your latency it means there's a serious bug somewhere. Lee From kleffner at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 13:00:36 2005 From: kleffner at gmail.com (Matt Kleffner) Date: Mon Dec 19 13:00:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] RME Hammerfall DSP Multiface firmware loading problem In-Reply-To: <1134770202.7539.108.camel@localhost.localdomain> References: <876bb1680512160921ude14459j7d72396ac30154fd@mail.gmail.com> <1134755406.7539.94.camel@localhost.localdomain> <876bb1680512161250o25cf2addnfec67c9052f1d431@mail.gmail.com> <1134770202.7539.108.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: <876bb1680512191000i55d01b16xa0cc45a4d6550ab6@mail.gmail.com> Sorry about the formatting of my last message - I'm not sure how I got gmail to do that! Hopefully this one will be formatted correctly... Summary: hdspconf works with 1.0.9b in 2.6.13.5; FIFO error remains The easiest way for me to revert to 1.0.9 was to compile a slightly older vanilla 2.6 kernel. (1.0.10 is in the vanilla 2.6.14.3 kernel.) For those who are interested: I could not find any online kernel source browsers that were functional, so I started downloading other versions of the kernel. I got lucky and the next lower version, 2.6.13.5, has the following in linux-2.6.13.5/include/sound/version.h : /* include/version.h. Generated by configure. */ #define CONFIG_SND_VERSION "1.0.9b" #define CONFIG_SND_DATE " (Thu Jul 28 12:20:13 2005 UTC)" Therefore, I compiled this kernel. I powered down, removed all cables, plugged all of them back in and powered on. Here is the kernel log: Hammerfall-DSP: wait for FIFO status <= 0 failed after 30 iterations Hammerfall-DSP: loading firmware Hammerfall-DSP: finished firmware loading hdspconf now works (with 1.0.9b and 2.6.13.5) and I can change any of its settings. However, the kernel log messages have not changed from 2.6.14.3. Is the FIFO error important? Using the amixer workaround to set the sampling rate and compiling 2.6.14.3 with the PREEMPT flags set, I was able to successfully record audio with ardour - even though the FIFO error was present at boot time. If I find I need 1.0.9b with 2.6.14.3, how challenging is it to downgrade alsa in the kernel source? - Matt On 12/16/05, Paul Davis wrote: >> On Fri, 2005-12-16 at 14:50 -0600, Matt Kleffner wrote: >> I powered down and unplugged everything. After reconnecting everything >> and turning the (desktop) computer on, the "Host Error" light on the >> multiface went out and the kernel log contained: >> >> Hammerfall-DSP: wait for FIFO status <= 0 failed after 30 iterations >> Hammerfall-DSP: loading firmware >> Hammerfall-DSP: finished firmware loading >> >> Now, when I run hdspconf and select any option (e.g. change sampling >> rate), I get an error for each option selected. For example, if I >> change the sampling rate to 44.1 kHz the radio button selection >> "jumps" back to 48 kHz. >> >> The stdout of hdspconf looks like: >> >> HDSPConf 1.4 - Copyright (C) 2003 Thomas Charbonnel >> This program comes WITH ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY >> HDSPConf is free software, see the file copying for details >> >> Looking for HDSP cards : >> Card 0 : VIA 82C686A/B rev50 with ICE1232 at 0xa800, irq 9 >> Card 1 : RME Hammerfall DSP + Multiface at 0xdd000000, irq 9 >> Multiface found ! >> 1 Hammerfall DSP card found. >> Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1 >> Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1 >> Error accessing ctl interface on card hw:1 >> >> The last message is repeated every time I attempt to change a setting, >> and it doesn't show up at all until I try to change a setting. If I >> close hdspconf and run >> >> amixer -c 1 cset numid=11 2 >> (syntax from http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7024) >> >> the correct (44.1 kHz) setting shows up when I reopen hdspconf. >> Changing the rate back to 48 kHz in hdspconf results in the same >> error, except the selection now remains fixed at 44.1 kHz. >> >> Any thoughts on why this is happening? Is the version of HDSPConf too old? >> >> - Matt >> On 12/16/05, Paul Davis wrote: >> try power-cycling *everything*. the computer, (including unplugging the >> power cord (and battery if its a laptop), and the multiface box. >> >> i've run into this condition once or twice, and the only solution i have >> found is a complete power cycle of everything. >> >> >> --p > > i have a nasty feeling that ALSA 1.0.10 may have broken something here. > this is the second report of this in a few weeks. i know its ugly and > horrible and time consuming, but it would really help if you could back > up to 1.0.9 and test that. > > --p > > > From rlrevell at joe-job.com Mon Dec 19 13:24:58 2005 From: rlrevell at joe-job.com (Lee Revell) Date: Mon Dec 19 13:21:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] RME Hammerfall DSP Multiface firmware loading problem In-Reply-To: <876bb1680512191000i55d01b16xa0cc45a4d6550ab6@mail.gmail.com> References: <876bb1680512160921ude14459j7d72396ac30154fd@mail.gmail.com> <1134755406.7539.94.camel@localhost.localdomain> <876bb1680512161250o25cf2addnfec67c9052f1d431@mail.gmail.com> <1134770202.7539.108.camel@localhost.localdomain> <876bb1680512191000i55d01b16xa0cc45a4d6550ab6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <1135016699.20747.36.camel@mindpipe> On Mon, 2005-12-19 at 12:00 -0600, Matt Kleffner wrote: > If I find I need 1.0.9b with 2.6.14.3, how challenging is it to > downgrade alsa in the kernel source? It's pointless, you need to identify what change introduced the bug so it can be fixed for 2.6.14.4. Lee From brad at sonaural.com Mon Dec 19 13:20:56 2005 From: brad at sonaural.com (Brad Fuller) Date: Mon Dec 19 13:21:34 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] extract and mix In-Reply-To: <43A37A7B.7010001@sonaural.com> References: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> <43A37A7B.7010001@sonaural.com> Message-ID: <43A6FA08.5020908@sonaural.com> Brad Fuller wrote: > Brad Fuller wrote: > >> I couldn't find a way to do this in ecasound, maybe there's a way to >> do it. Here's what I want to do: >> >> Find the exact length of a audio file in ms. I think ecalength can do >> this, I know it's not sample accurate, but I just need down to the >> around 1ms. Maybe there's another option other than ecalength. >> >> Then, I want to extract a section of another file: at a specific >> location in ms at a length of the file above. >> >> Then, mix that extracted segment with another file and save the >> result to a new file. How can this be done? I don't know of a >> utility that can extract a specific length at a specific location in ms. >> >> brad >> >> > I forgot all about sox - looks like I could use sox to essentially > extract a section by using the feature "trim start length" does anyone have any ideas on how I can accomplish this process? Has anyone used the "trim" feature in sox? Also, I like to be able to extract the file section (step 2 above) to the nearest zero crossing (to prevent potential clicks). Any pointers, even off the top of your head, would be most appreciated. thanks, brad From ce at christeck.de Mon Dec 19 13:24:30 2005 From: ce at christeck.de (Christoph Eckert) Date: Mon Dec 19 13:23:22 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <2def88b80512190610q7b9abb0do@mail.gmail.com> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181918.04809.ce@christeck.de> <2def88b80512190610q7b9abb0do@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512191924.30539.ce@christeck.de> Hi, > Yeah, I can read you! I don't have internet during the weekend... how do your survive weekends?!? Just kidding ;-) . > I am still using my tascam and I am back in a state where I am > praising it! You even have used its MIDI interface during Linuxtag and it worked very well, didn't you? Best regards ce From markknecht at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 13:36:34 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Mon Dec 19 13:36:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] extract and mix In-Reply-To: <43A6FA08.5020908@sonaural.com> References: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> <43A37A7B.7010001@sonaural.com> <43A6FA08.5020908@sonaural.com> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512191036y33f08939h119a21ae5d8a9c3@mail.gmail.com> On 12/19/05, Brad Fuller wrote: > Brad Fuller wrote: > > > Brad Fuller wrote: > > > >> I couldn't find a way to do this in ecasound, maybe there's a way to > >> do it. Here's what I want to do: > >> > >> Find the exact length of a audio file in ms. I think ecalength can do > >> this, I know it's not sample accurate, but I just need down to the > >> around 1ms. Maybe there's another option other than ecalength. sndfile-info? mark@lightning ~ $ sndfile-info Web-music/2AM-40Bars.wav Version : libsndfile-1.0.11 ======================================== File : Web-music/2AM-40Bars.wav Length : 35744300 RIFF : 35744292 WAVE fmt : 16 Format : 0x1 => WAVE_FORMAT_PCM Channels : 2 Sample Rate : 44100 Block Align : 6 Bit Width : 24 Bytes/sec : 264600 data : 35744256 End ---------------------------------------- Sample Rate : 44100 Frames : 5957376 Channels : 2 Format : 0x00010003 Sections : 1 Seekable : TRUE Duration : 00:02:15.087 Signal Max : 7.50863e+06 (-0.96 dB) mark@lightning ~ $ I cannot help with the rest. Sorry. - Mark > >> > >> Then, I want to extract a section of another file: at a specific > >> location in ms at a length of the file above. > >> > >> Then, mix that extracted segment with another file and save the > >> result to a new file. How can this be done? I don't know of a > >> utility that can extract a specific length at a specific location in ms. > >> > >> brad > >> > >> > > I forgot all about sox - looks like I could use sox to essentially > > extract a section by using the feature "trim start length" > > does anyone have any ideas on how I can accomplish this process? Has > anyone used the "trim" feature in sox? > Also, I like to be able to extract the file section (step 2 above) to > the nearest zero crossing (to prevent potential clicks). Any pointers, > even off the top of your head, would be most appreciated. > > thanks, > brad > From creisor at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 14:28:33 2005 From: creisor at gmail.com (Chris Reisor) Date: Mon Dec 19 14:28:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] OT: Music *not* made with gnu/Linux. In-Reply-To: <43A59D09.7010500@fritzmetal.de> References: <43A1B174.5060408@poeticstudios.com> <3e1f2d940512161424v240cd617nce13767d5eddc044@mail.gmail.com> <43A345BA.1030403@fritzmetal.de> <3e1f2d940512161602i53015049p3e1b9b5486f57ded@mail.gmail.com> <43A358CD.6000908@fritzmetal.de> <43A59D09.7010500@fritzmetal.de> Message-ID: <3e1f2d940512191128q45f54c08t6ce3f77e6bc4d8fc@mail.gmail.com> Sorry, this is why I normally remain a lurker. I meant nothing by this. In the future, I will refrain from making off-hand comments. Didn't mean to ruffle any feathers. I will go back to lurking unless I can help someone with something, which isn't very likely. Shutting up...now. --chris On 12/18/05, FRitz wrote: > > Hi Chris, > > would you please answer my questions? I really would like to know as I > simply don't understand what you're talking about. I thought this list > is about Linux and audio so I don't understand what you said about sides > and these things. > > > Thanx a lot, FRitz > > > > FRitz wrote: > >>>> Glad you're on our side now. > >>>> --chris reisor > >>> > >>> Care to explain that to an "outsider"? :-) > >>> > >>> > >>> Best wishes, FRitz > >>> > >> > >> The Good Side. The Open Source side. > > > > Why good? In which way good? And why it's a "side"? Side of what? > > > > > > > From brad at sonaural.com Mon Dec 19 14:55:54 2005 From: brad at sonaural.com (Brad Fuller) Date: Mon Dec 19 14:56:20 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] extract and mix In-Reply-To: <5bdc1c8b0512191036y33f08939h119a21ae5d8a9c3@mail.gmail.com> References: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> <43A37A7B.7010001@sonaural.com> <43A6FA08.5020908@sonaural.com> <5bdc1c8b0512191036y33f08939h119a21ae5d8a9c3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A7104A.4060506@sonaural.com> Mark Knecht wrote: >On 12/19/05, Brad Fuller wrote: > > >>Brad Fuller wrote: >> >> >> >>>Brad Fuller wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>>I couldn't find a way to do this in ecasound, maybe there's a way to >>>>do it. Here's what I want to do: >>>> >>>>Find the exact length of a audio file in ms. I think ecalength can do >>>>this, I know it's not sample accurate, but I just need down to the >>>>around 1ms. Maybe there's another option other than ecalength. >>>> >>>> > >sndfile-info? > >mark@lightning ~ $ sndfile-info Web-music/2AM-40Bars.wav > >Version : libsndfile-1.0.11 > >======================================== >File : Web-music/2AM-40Bars.wav >Length : 35744300 >RIFF : 35744292 >WAVE >fmt : 16 > Format : 0x1 => WAVE_FORMAT_PCM > Channels : 2 > Sample Rate : 44100 > Block Align : 6 > Bit Width : 24 > Bytes/sec : 264600 >data : 35744256 >End > >---------------------------------------- >Sample Rate : 44100 >Frames : 5957376 >Channels : 2 >Format : 0x00010003 >Sections : 1 >Seekable : TRUE >Duration : 00:02:15.087 >Signal Max : 7.50863e+06 (-0.96 dB) > >mark@lightning ~ $ > >I cannot help with the rest. Sorry. > > Thanks mark. I was hoping that there was a utility that I could use in a script as I have to do this many many times. I guess I could grep for "Duration: " and grab the numbers. brad >- Mark > > >>>>Then, I want to extract a section of another file: at a specific >>>>location in ms at a length of the file above. >>>> >>>>Then, mix that extracted segment with another file and save the >>>>result to a new file. How can this be done? I don't know of a >>>>utility that can extract a specific length at a specific location in ms. >>>> >>>>brad >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>I forgot all about sox - looks like I could use sox to essentially >>>extract a section by using the feature "trim start length" >>> >>> >>does anyone have any ideas on how I can accomplish this process? Has >>anyone used the "trim" feature in sox? >>Also, I like to be able to extract the file section (step 2 above) to >>the nearest zero crossing (to prevent potential clicks). Any pointers, >>even off the top of your head, would be most appreciated. >> >>thanks, >> >> >> From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 08:27:36 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Mon Dec 19 15:27:51 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! Message-ID: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> ? REFERENCE: http://rnvs.informatik.tu-chemnitz.de/~jan/noteedit/noteedit.html (i just found this!) the developers of noteedit say on their site they want to end noteedit development because nobody cares about noteedit. this makes me angry. on their official page, they are blaming us for this situation. (maybe they are right, maybe they are wrong.) NOTEEDIT (which is GPL), THE BEST USER-FRIENDLY SCORE EDITOR FOR GNU/LINUX (cause that's what it is!), doesn't deserve to be ignored. what is wrong with us? i wonder why most of us ignore it... is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome supporters? is it because we all afford to buy finale and don't need a GPL score editor? i really don't understand why we keep on ignoring it. it's a... mystery to me why almost nobody even mentions it... (maybe they didn't choose a very memorable name? are you confusing it with an application class name?) honestly, i would be very sad if the noteedit project was abandoned! i am not related to the noteedit project in any way, as i am a newbye to anything gnu/linux. however, noteedit is one of the reasons for me to feel comfortable in gnu/linux. maybe we could do something about it? i don't know... advertizing the project... promoting it... whatever... or just take a look at it (if you haven't already) and think for yourself. it may not be *perfect*, but it's THE BEST we have... you may want to read this, for further information: http://rnvs.informatik.tu-chemnitz.de/~jan/noteedit/noteedit.html ? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Mon Dec 19 15:45:51 2005 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Mon Dec 19 15:43:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181334.26951.ce@christeck.de> <1134915662.18716.3.camel@groovious> Message-ID: <1135025151.5522.3.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Sun, 2005-12-18 at 16:21 +0200, John Anderson wrote: > On Sun, 2005-12-18 at 13:34 +0100, Christoph Eckert wrote: > > > I would like to know your advice about external soundcard (with ieee > > > 1394 port) recognize by linux. > > > > ieee 1394 is not yet optimal supported on Linux, but see freebob.sf.net > > for some details, including working devices. > > > > > My native soundcard is not full eqquiped in input/output port that > > > why i'm searching for a soundcard with rca/xlr/jack connections. > > > > > > I'm running under debian sarge with a 2.6.14 kernel. > > > > If you're not bound to the firewire port and you're interested in a > > painless solution, I can recommend USB 1.1 devices (AFAIK there are no > > USB 2.0 devices known to work under Linux). just for the record, Sound On Sound's latest issue has an interesting roundtable on firewire, usb, usb 2.0, mLAN etc. featuring various "luminaries" from RME, Yamaha, MOTU, ESI etc etc. lots of *very* different opinions voiced, particularly about USB2.0. --p From brad at sonaural.com Mon Dec 19 15:51:05 2005 From: brad at sonaural.com (Brad Fuller) Date: Mon Dec 19 15:51:40 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] extract and mix In-Reply-To: <200512191530.55840.greg@gregwilder.com> References: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> <5bdc1c8b0512191036y33f08939h119a21ae5d8a9c3@mail.gmail.com> <43A7104A.4060506@sonaural.com> <200512191530.55840.greg@gregwilder.com> Message-ID: <43A71D39.9050701@sonaural.com> Greg Wilder wrote: >On Monday 19 December 2005 14:55, Brad Fuller wrote: > > >>Thanks mark. I was hoping that there was a utility that I could use in >>a script as I have to do this many many times. I guess I could grep for >>"Duration: " and grab the numbers. >> >> > >Hi Brad, > >I've attached a little utility called sndinfo that creates output similar to >sndfile-info. It's a little more specific in terms of length: > > > >>sndinfo /snd/greg/fl.c4 >> >> >/snd/greg/fl.c4: > srate: 44100 > chans: 1 > length: 3.472970 > type: AIFF > format: 16-bit big endian > written: Wed 14-Dec-05 12:48 EST > comment: F > >HTH, >Greg > > thanks greg. It's a bit more informative than sndfile-info, I like that it also gives sample length (your example doesn't show it, but it did when I ran it.) Where'd you get it? Is there an argument that can extract specific data? like just the type or just the length? Does it extract information from the header, or calculate the information? From greg at gregwilder.com Mon Dec 19 16:00:36 2005 From: greg at gregwilder.com (Greg Wilder) Date: Mon Dec 19 16:01:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] extract and mix In-Reply-To: <43A71AB3.30109@sonaural.com> References: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> <200512191530.55840.greg@gregwilder.com> <43A71AB3.30109@sonaural.com> Message-ID: <200512191600.36634.greg@gregwilder.com> On Monday 19 December 2005 15:40, Brad Fuller wrote: > thanks greg. It's a bit more informative than sndfile-info, I like that > it also gives sample length (your example doesn't show it, but it did > when I ran it.) > Where'd you get it? Good question. Somebody on the list will know for sure. I think is an old version of sndflie-info that used to come with csound? Maybe? Sndinfo is a little utility I've carried around on my linux boxes since 1997 or so. I think I picked it up at Eastman. It may have even begun life running on one of those amazing ol' NeXT machines... (R.I.P.) > Is there an argument that can extract specific > data? like just the type or just the length? Nope. I've attached an ugly little perl script that will do it. Not pretty, but it gets the job done. > Does it extract information from the header, or calculate the information? Don't know. G www.gregwilder.com -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: duration.pl Type: application/x-perl Size: 559 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051219/9a4e43a4/duration.bin From yaqtil at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 16:20:29 2005 From: yaqtil at gmail.com (c) Date: Mon Dec 19 16:20:42 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] noteedit, the score editor! Message-ID: <21e8fdff0512191320i7ab7ed91ld99eb4ef023b700a@mail.gmail.com> > i really don't understand why we keep on ignoring it. it's a... mystery maybe nobody in the LAU community reads musical notes..or wants to write them > to me why almost nobody even mentions it... (maybe they didn't choose a > very memorable name? are you confusing it with an application class > name?) honestly, i would be very sad if the noteedit project was > abandoned! RoseGarden...LilyPond...i think NoteEdit just needs a new name. how about Orchid Lake? From hans at fugal.net Mon Dec 19 16:22:01 2005 From: hans at fugal.net (Hans Fugal) Date: Mon Dec 19 16:22:10 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <20051219212201.GA21348@falcon.fugal.net> On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 at 15:27 +0200, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > ? > REFERENCE: > http://rnvs.informatik.tu-chemnitz.de/~jan/noteedit/noteedit.html > > (i just found this!) the developers of noteedit say on their site they > want to end noteedit development because nobody cares about noteedit. > this makes me angry. What makes you angry? That they want to end development or that they claim nobody cares about noteedit? > on their official page, they are blaming us for this situation. (maybe > they are right, maybe they are wrong.) Every one of us, including the noteedit authors, has power only over his or her own actions. If they feel compelled to stop development, that is their choice. In the end, that's all it comes down to. > NOTEEDIT (which is GPL), THE BEST USER-FRIENDLY SCORE EDITOR FOR > GNU/LINUX (cause that's what it is!), doesn't deserve to be ignored. Nor does it _deserve_ anything else, whether good or evil. It's just a bunch of bits. Perhaps you'd like to imply that the authors of noteedit don't deserve to be ignored. This is a much more poignant point, and it's hard for us developers to accept sometimes, but using our software is just as voluntary as our creating it. > what is wrong with us? i wonder why most of us ignore it... When it comes to software and business, the question is never what is wrong with the user/customer, but what is wrong with the software/product/service. > is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome supporters? > is it because we all afford to buy finale and don't need a GPL score > editor? > > i really don't understand why we keep on ignoring it. it's a... mystery > to me why almost nobody even mentions it... (maybe they didn't choose a > very memorable name? are you confusing it with an application class > name?) honestly, i would be very sad if the noteedit project was > abandoned! Or maybe it's not really ignored at all. I'd like to see proof that it is being ignored, whatever that means. > i am not related to the noteedit project in any way, as i am a newbye to > anything gnu/linux. however, noteedit is one of the reasons for me to > feel comfortable in gnu/linux. > > maybe we could do something about it? i don't know... advertizing the > project... promoting it... whatever... or just take a look at it (if > you haven't already) and think for yourself. it may not be *perfect*, > but it's THE BEST we have... The great part about open source software is that if a project is abandoned, it can be picked up by somebody else or at least downloaded in its latest state. It looks like there's a berlios project to carry on the torch, so that may be happening here. If you want to help, there are many ways to do so even if you're not a coder (e.g. documentation or web design or promotion). If you think the best hope is to court the previous developers with lavish praise or whatever it would take to make them feel that spending time on noteedit is worth their time, then by all means go ahead. I come into this saga in the middle - all I'm going off of is your post and the website you linked to. I can only give a general observation: in the OSS world, software is written and software is used. Not all software written gets used, but everything that gets used can be maintained by virtue of the open source. So I just wanted to reassure you on two points: there is no conspiracy to ignore noteedit, and because noteedit is open source it will continue to be available and perhaps even continue to improve. Let's each do something proactive for our favorite project(s) and refrain from blaming others for our (in)actions. -- Hans Fugal ; http://hans.fugal.net There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself. -- Johann Sebastian Bach -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051219/088c4fe3/attachment.bin From larsl at users.sourceforge.net Mon Dec 19 16:33:08 2005 From: larsl at users.sourceforge.net (Lars Luthman) Date: Mon Dec 19 16:30:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <1135027988.27391.10.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> On Mon, 2005-12-19 at 15:27 +0200, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > (i just found this!) the developers of noteedit say on their site they > want to end noteedit development because nobody cares about noteedit. > this makes me angry. > > on their official page, they are blaming us for this situation. (maybe > they are right, maybe they are wrong.) > > NOTEEDIT (which is GPL), THE BEST USER-FRIENDLY SCORE EDITOR FOR > GNU/LINUX (cause that's what it is!), doesn't deserve to be ignored. > what is wrong with us? i wonder why most of us ignore it... > > is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome supporters? > is it because we all afford to buy finale and don't need a GPL score > editor? Do "most of us" actually use score editors? I prefer piano rolls myself, I can barely read notes. It sounds a bit silly to stop writing something because it doesn't get mentioned often enough on LAU. Judging from the forums and the mailing list archives on the BerliOS page there seem to be some people who are interested in it. -- Lars Luthman PGP key: http://www.student.nada.kth.se/~d00-llu/pgp_key.php Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part Url : http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/attachments/20051219/3e6a7f57/attachment.bin From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Mon Dec 19 16:39:16 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Mon Dec 19 16:40:11 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <1135027988.27391.10.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <1135027988.27391.10.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <43A72884.2070300@chapelperilous.net> Lars Luthman wrote: > On Mon, 2005-12-19 at 15:27 +0200, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > >>(i just found this!) the developers of noteedit say on their site they >>want to end noteedit development because nobody cares about noteedit. >>this makes me angry. >> >>on their official page, they are blaming us for this situation. (maybe >>they are right, maybe they are wrong.) >> >>NOTEEDIT (which is GPL), THE BEST USER-FRIENDLY SCORE EDITOR FOR >>GNU/LINUX (cause that's what it is!), doesn't deserve to be ignored. >>what is wrong with us? i wonder why most of us ignore it... >> >>is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome supporters? >>is it because we all afford to buy finale and don't need a GPL score >>editor? If I recall, this all came about because a (false) rumor was being spread about Finale being ported to Linux, and this was perceived as a threat to the future success of NoteEdit. I doubt it's a KDE issue, either, since Rosegarden (the *other* score editor) is also a KDE application. > Do "most of us" actually use score editors? I prefer piano rolls myself, > I can barely read notes. I use Rosegarden extensively for score editing. -- Brett From linuxmedia4 at netscape.net Mon Dec 19 17:14:51 2005 From: linuxmedia4 at netscape.net (LinuxMedia) Date: Mon Dec 19 17:15:38 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: extract and mix Message-ID: <43A730DB.2040203@netscape.net> Brad Fuller wrote: >>> I couldn't find a way to do this in ecasound, maybe there's a way to >>> do it. Here's what I want to do: >>> >>> Find the exact length of a audio file in ms. I think ecalength can do >>> this, I know it's not sample accurate, but I just need down to the >>> around 1ms. Maybe there's another option other than ecalength. >>> >>> Then, I want to extract a section of another file: at a specific >>> location in ms at a length of the file above. >>> >>> Then, mix that extracted segment with another file and save the >>> result to a new file. How can this be done? I don't know of a >>> utility that can extract a specific length at a specific location in ms. This should work... bash> ecalength LengthFile.wav LengthFile.wav: 9.083s (0m9s) bash> ecasound -i:ExtractFrom.wav -y:(StartPosition) -t:9.083 -o:Extracted.wav bash> ecasound -a:1 -i:Extracted.wav -a:2 -i:MixWith.wav -a:1,2 -o:BothFilesMixed.wav Of course, this gets tricky if any of the files in question have different channel counts, bit depths, sampling rates or are of different file types. It still can be done, but there will be other interm steps involved. But in a best case scenerio, the above should work. Let me know if this how it went.... Rocco From pinojazz at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 17:14:56 2005 From: pinojazz at gmail.com (Carlos Pino) Date: Mon Dec 19 17:16:21 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <43A730E0.100@gmail.com> I. I. Ooisen wrote: > >REFERENCE: >http://rnvs.informatik.tu-chemnitz.de/~jan/noteedit/noteedit.html > >(i just found this!) the developers of noteedit say on their site they >want to end noteedit development because nobody cares about noteedit. >this makes me angry. > >on their official page, they are blaming us for this situation. (maybe >they are right, maybe they are wrong.) > >NOTEEDIT (which is GPL), THE BEST USER-FRIENDLY SCORE EDITOR FOR >GNU/LINUX (cause that's what it is!), doesn't deserve to be ignored. >what is wrong with us? i wonder why most of us ignore it... > >is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome supporters? >is it because we all afford to buy finale and don't need a GPL score >editor? > >i really don't understand why we keep on ignoring it. it's a... mystery >to me why almost nobody even mentions it... (maybe they didn't choose a >very memorable name? are you confusing it with an application class >name?) honestly, i would be very sad if the noteedit project was >abandoned! > >i am not related to the noteedit project in any way, as i am a newbye to >anything gnu/linux. however, noteedit is one of the reasons for me to >feel comfortable in gnu/linux. > >maybe we could do something about it? i don't know... advertizing the >project... promoting it... whatever... or just take a look at it (if >you haven't already) and think for yourself. it may not be *perfect*, >but it's THE BEST we have... > >you may want to read this, for further information: >http://rnvs.informatik.tu-chemnitz.de/~jan/noteedit/noteedit.html > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > Hi. Sad news,I find noteedit a very good aplication. I'm not a good music reader nor writer,but when i need it Is faster for me to write by hand.i have never use Finale nor other music writing app. Last night I was playing with it and trying to find the way to have a "normal" view (for me) of the score.Im accustomed to the real book,and I like to write my scores in that way,simple melody line and chords over,each line divided in four bars,to have a clear preview of what I'm writing and reading,but have not succes.This is not the first time I find this issue,and probably the main cause,between others with no direct relationship with noteedit,that made me reject the use and more extensive test of the program. Wish Noteedit keep live ,growing and improve his features. Excuse my english. Saludos --Carlos. From lau at kudla.org Mon Dec 19 17:25:17 2005 From: lau at kudla.org (Rob) Date: Mon Dec 19 17:29:47 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <200512191725.17982.lau@kudla.org> On Mon December 19 2005 08:27, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome > supporters? I actually never tried it because I thought it was some command-line-based thing that output TeX files or some similar 1980's-era thing, and I'd have to use some random tla2ps program to get useful output from it. But maybe I had it confused with Lilypond. > is it because we all afford to buy finale and > don't need a GPL score editor? For my very limited scoring needs, Rosegarden is enough. But I just didn't know Noteedit was as capable as you say it is. Rob From brad at sonaural.com Mon Dec 19 18:28:35 2005 From: brad at sonaural.com (Brad Fuller) Date: Mon Dec 19 18:29:03 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: extract and mix In-Reply-To: <43A730DB.2040203@netscape.net> References: <43A730DB.2040203@netscape.net> Message-ID: <43A74223.3060305@sonaural.com> LinuxMedia wrote: > Brad Fuller wrote: > >>> I couldn't find a way to do this in ecasound, maybe there's a way to > >>> do it. Here's what I want to do: > >>> > >>> Find the exact length of a audio file in ms. I think ecalength can do > >>> this, I know it's not sample accurate, but I just need down to the > >>> around 1ms. Maybe there's another option other than ecalength. > >>> > >>> Then, I want to extract a section of another file: at a specific > >>> location in ms at a length of the file above. > >>> > >>> Then, mix that extracted segment with another file and save the > >>> result to a new file. How can this be done? I don't know of a > >>> utility that can extract a specific length at a specific location > in ms. > > This should work... > > bash> ecalength LengthFile.wav > LengthFile.wav: 9.083s (0m9s) > > bash> ecasound -i:ExtractFrom.wav -y:(StartPosition) -t:9.083 > -o:Extracted.wav > > bash> ecasound -a:1 -i:Extracted.wav -a:2 -i:MixWith.wav -a:1,2 > -o:BothFilesMixed.wav > > Of course, this gets tricky if any of the files in question have > different channel counts, bit depths, sampling rates or are of > different file types. It still can be done, but there will be other > interm steps involved. But in a best case scenerio, the above should > work. > > Let me know if this how it went.... > Rocco > Thanks Rocco, That's close to what Jeremy mentioned over on the ecasound list. I asked him, and I'll ask here: do you know who to find the closest zero crossing? in the extracted "from" file? That would seem to be a necessary step to prevent clicks. brad From reynal at ensea.fr Mon Dec 19 18:50:27 2005 From: reynal at ensea.fr (Sylvain Reynal) Date: Mon Dec 19 18:50:51 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <1135006332.16112.34.camel@mindpipe> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> <1135006332.16112.34.camel@mindpipe> Message-ID: <200512200050.29116.reynal@ensea.fr> Lee, Thank you for your clear explanation. This is a point i'd totally overlooked, and leaving the "-n -20" flag in the command line was just "so-mechanical" (i.e., a remnant of the time where i'd run jackd w/o the -R flag, and where i'd notice slightly better perf ...) I've just redone a couple of tests without the -n -20 option and with my 2.6.11-preempt kernel this doesn't seem to change anything indeed (wooow, thanks god, there are no serious bugs ;-))) Now, looking back on this, I must admit i also got a bit muddled up over "nice" vs "priority" issues when i recently started working with a 2.6.14-rt kernel. I could read in a previous post on this list that -to sum up- one should have jackd running at a priority "higher than all irq handlers besides the soundcard irq" (where soundcard=ieee1394 controller in my case): as i take it, running jackd with, e.g., -P -70, simply increases the RT scheduling priority of jack then (irrespective of the nice value of the non-RT part of jackd if i understand what you said). Am i right? (btw, jackd -P anynegativenumber triggers an error with my 2.6.14-rt kernel, i get a "cannot use real-time scheduling (FIFO at priority -70) etc."; probably the subject for another thread though) Regards, Syd > Running [jackd] > at a low nice value could cause non real-time parts of JACK to interfere > with the audio engine. From dsbaikov at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 19:34:48 2005 From: dsbaikov at gmail.com (Dmitry Baikov) Date: Mon Dec 19 19:34:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181908.46510.reynal@ensea.fr> <70a871c80512190150u27ee2135nc0695dba2faba3b3@mail.gmail.com> <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> Message-ID: <70a871c80512191634x476fc53ek6ca822d5d95e94a2@mail.gmail.com> > 1) If you've not already done so, recompile your kernel with the PREEMPT flagrunning 2.6.14-rt22 > 2) change the PCI bus latency of your IEEE controller (let me insist: this may> be a +real+ bottleneck; an evidence that you've got such a bottleneck there> is the occurence of tons of "IEC61883C: possible raw1394 error" messages when> jackd is running...).Thanks a lot for this hint. I had tons of such messages. Now, most are gone. > ("-n -20" sets the lower possible nice value for jackd).> This leads to ~11ms as reported by jdelay.Comfirmed. The bad thing is, sometimes delay increases with each xrun,but it's purely freebob issues. > And if you're interested, I can send you my edirolFA66.xml; this avoids> running the freebob daemon (in this case,I'd be very grateful, if you can. > Note also that i run everything as root. Surely, this is not good practice,I use rtlimits Thank you a lot.You helped me to overcome my frustration. Best regards, Dmitry. From reynal at ensea.fr Mon Dec 19 20:00:36 2005 From: reynal at ensea.fr (Sylvain Reynal) Date: Mon Dec 19 20:01:36 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <70a871c80512191634x476fc53ek6ca822d5d95e94a2@mail.gmail.com> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> <70a871c80512191634x476fc53ek6ca822d5d95e94a2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512200200.36743.reynal@ensea.fr> On Tuesday 20 December 2005 01:34, Dmitry Baikov wrote: > (in this case,I'd be very grateful, if you can. You'll find my freebob XML "configuration" file for the Edirol FA-66 here: http://www-reynal.ensea.fr/linux-audio/edirolFA66.xml.gz (no other stuff there so far ;-). Regards, Syd From dsbaikov at gmail.com Mon Dec 19 20:21:32 2005 From: dsbaikov at gmail.com (Dmitry Baikov) Date: Mon Dec 19 20:21:37 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512200200.36743.reynal@ensea.fr> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> <70a871c80512191634x476fc53ek6ca822d5d95e94a2@mail.gmail.com> <200512200200.36743.reynal@ensea.fr> Message-ID: <70a871c80512191721y475d0744n820099438441e8f6@mail.gmail.com> On 12/20/05, Sylvain Reynal wrote:> You'll find my freebob XML "configuration" file for the Edirol FA-66 here:> http://www-reynal.ensea.fr/linux-audio/edirolFA66.xml.gzGot it! Thank you. Dmitry. From set at pobox.com Mon Dec 19 20:57:30 2005 From: set at pobox.com (Paul) Date: Mon Dec 19 20:57:43 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: extract and mix In-Reply-To: <200512191600.36634.greg@gregwilder.com> References: <43A36A07.6030801@sonaural.com> <200512191530.55840.greg@gregwilder.com> <43A71AB3.30109@sonaural.com> <200512191600.36634.greg@gregwilder.com> Message-ID: <20051220015729.GC12626@squish.home.loc> Greg Wilder , on Mon Dec 19, 2005 [04:00:36 PM] said: > On Monday 19 December 2005 15:40, Brad Fuller wrote: > > thanks greg. It's a bit more informative than sndfile-info, I like that > > it also gives sample length (your example doesn't show it, but it did > > when I ran it.) > > Where'd you get it? > Good question. Somebody on the list will know for sure. I think is an old Hi; its part of the libsndfile kit. http://www.mega-nerd.com/libsndfile/ Paul set@pobx.com From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Mon Dec 19 21:52:34 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Mon Dec 19 21:34:27 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <43A771F2.9050203@woh.rr.com> I. I. Ooisen wrote: > >REFERENCE: >http://rnvs.informatik.tu-chemnitz.de/~jan/noteedit/noteedit.html > >(i just found this!) the developers of noteedit say on their site they >want to end noteedit development because nobody cares about noteedit. >this makes me angry. > >on their official page, they are blaming us for this situation. (maybe >they are right, maybe they are wrong.) > > While I can appreciate your concern you should know that NoteEdit version 2.8.0 rc1 was released on June 4 of this year. If you click on the BerliOS link a little further down on the page you linked you'll find that NE development has indeed been continued. The page you linked to is no longer the official page and this is old news, sorry. The original author felt that NE hadn't received sufficient attention from the community, and his assertion that there was a Linux Finale on the way was unfounded. Nevertheless he decided to discontinue his involvement with its development. Thankfully it has been continued by other developers. I agree that it's a fine application. As to who else uses it, I don't know. I don't work with notation much these days, but I found that NE had a transparent interface and many useful features. I've been writing a series of articles for the Linux Journal on music notation software for Linux, NE will be profiled in the next installment, along with LilyPond. Best, dp From cybersean3000 at yahoo.com Mon Dec 19 23:31:02 2005 From: cybersean3000 at yahoo.com (Sean Edwards) Date: Mon Dec 19 23:31:09 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <43A771F2.9050203@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20051220043103.68180.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> This may be anti-open, but here it goes. I think if you want to copyright a piece of music in the U.S.A, it needs to be in standard music notation. This requirement may be a Library of Congress requirement, but I am not sure. Anyway, if you want to publish and protect a MIDI piano-roll composed piece of music, you need some way of converting it to standard notation and printing it out. It doesn't get much easier than importing a MIDI file into noteedit! And for those of us who are not proficient with a MIDI keyboard, transcribing a piece of music from paper to noteedit and then exporting it to MIDI is a great starting point for learning music and songs. The best thing about noteedit is that you don't need Rosegarden+Lilypond to run it. -=cybersean3000=- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From roberts.noah at gmail.com Tue Dec 20 00:55:24 2005 From: roberts.noah at gmail.com (Noah Roberts) Date: Tue Dec 20 00:55:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <567aa5f60512192155r730132dakaf5be174bfe067b4@mail.gmail.com> On 12/19/05, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome supporters? localhost mp3 # emerge -pv noteedit These are the packages that I would merge, in order: Calculating dependencies ...done! [ebuild N ] kde-base/kde-env-3-r4 0 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/arts-3.4.3 +alsa -arts -artswrappersuid -debug +esd -hardened +jack -kdeenablefinal +mp3 -nas +vorbis -xinerama 922 kB [ebuild N ] media-libs/tse3-0.2.7 +alsa -arts -oss 589 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdelibs-3.4.3 +alsa -arts +cups -debug -doc -jpeg2k -kdeenablefinal -kerberos -openexr +spell +ssl +tiff -xinerama -zeroconf 16,482 kB [ebuild N ] media-libs/taglib-1.4 -debug 715 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/libkcddb-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 5,366 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kioslaves-3.4.3 -arts -debug +encode +flac -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) +mp3 +vorbis -xinerama 0 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kfile-plugins-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -theora +vorbis -xinerama 0 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kappfinder-data-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kmid-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kmix-3.4.3 +alsa -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/mpeglib-3.4.1 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 5,417 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kscd-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-meta-3.4.3 -arts +xine 0 kB [ebuild N ] media-sound/noteedit-2.6.2 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal -xinerama 1,817 kB Total size of downloads: 31,312 kB I have to admit that is definately a point against it. Even with emerge I'm not that interested in adding all that crap to my system right now. From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Tue Dec 20 00:59:46 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Tue Dec 20 00:55:45 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <20051220043103.68180.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20051220043103.68180.qmail@web52615.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <43A79DD2.6010300@chapelperilous.net> Sean Edwards wrote: > This may be anti-open, but here it goes. I think if > you want to copyright a piece of music in the U.S.A, > it needs to be in standard music notation. This > requirement may be a Library of Congress requirement, > but I am not sure. Not sure what you mean, but copyrighting music does not require it to be in standard notation, AFAIK. If you mean 'publishing' music, I don't think standard notation is required either -- a book of guitar tablature is considered published music, which is why online tablature sites are still getting harassed by the music publishing industry. And IIRC, only melodies and lyrics can be copyrighted -- harmonies and song titles can't. (Hmmmm... what about counterpoint? Does that cont as harmony or melody in the view of copyright laws?) -- Brett From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 22:50:14 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 01:10:33 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, =?iso-8859-1?q?=09the_score?= editor! In-Reply-To: <43A730E0.100@gmail.com> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <43A730E0.100@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512200550.14165.ii001001@yahoo.ca> > I'm not a good music reader nor writer,but when i need it Is > faster for me to write by hand. why, do you write it in adobe? :D)) > Last night I was playing with it and trying to > find the way to have a "normal" view (for me) of the score.Im > accustomed to the real book,and I like to write my scores in that > way,simple melody line and chords over,each line divided in four > bars,to have a clear preview of what I'm writing and reading,but > have not succes.This is not the first time I find this issue,and > probably the main cause,between others with no direct relationship > with noteedit,that made me reject the use and more extensive test of > the program. finale has a reputation for having (at least in its first versions) the most idiotic, un-intuitive, and frustrating interface in the history of software. believe me. don't compare noteedit with finale. they are conceived differently. noteedit is more like "nwc" ("noteworthy composer") for windows, which is a much friendlier design. just try noteworthy composer (for windows, not gpl), and you'll see what i mean. then try NOTEEDIT. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 22:57:45 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 03:10:31 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191725.17982.lau@kudla.org> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <200512191725.17982.lau@kudla.org> Message-ID: <200512200557.45366.ii001001@yahoo.ca> > I actually never tried it because I thought it was some > command-line-based thing that output TeX files or some similar > 1980's-era thing, and I'd have to use some random tla2ps program > to get useful output from it. i forgot to mention one more thing: this is what i mean by NOTEEDIT being ignored: many people are not informed what it really is or does. and very few people don't recommend NOTEEDIT to the newbyes. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 23:58:02 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 04:42:38 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <1135027988.27391.10.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <1135027988.27391.10.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> Message-ID: <200512200658.02204.ii001001@yahoo.ca> > Do "most of us" actually use score editors? I prefer piano rolls > myself, I can barely read notes. i am pretty much sure composers read notes. then maybe linux-audio-user is not the right list for composers. > It sounds a bit silly to stop writing something because it doesn't > get mentioned often enough on LAU. yes, it does sound silly. i am sure they actually want to attract attention on them. let's make fun of them. (i am only half ironic, as i also half agree with you.) > Judging from the forums and the > mailing list archives on the BerliOS page there seem to be some > people who are interested in it. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Tue Dec 20 00:38:34 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 04:42:53 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] noteedit, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <21e8fdff0512191320i7ab7ed91ld99eb4ef023b700a@mail.gmail.com> References: <21e8fdff0512191320i7ab7ed91ld99eb4ef023b700a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512200738.35012.ii001001@yahoo.ca> > maybe nobody in the LAU community reads musical notes..or wants to > write them then do you imply we should create another LAU group, for music-literate persons? :) > RoseGarden...LilyPond...i think NoteEdit just needs a new name. how > about Orchid Lake? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From pinojazz at gmail.com Tue Dec 20 04:55:26 2005 From: pinojazz at gmail.com (Carlos Pino) Date: Tue Dec 20 04:55:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512200550.14165.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <43A730E0.100@gmail.com> <200512200550.14165.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <43A7D50E.4040304@gmail.com> I. I. Ooisen wrote: >> I'm not a good music reader nor writer,but when i need it Is >>faster for me to write by hand. >> >> > >why, do you write it in adobe? :D)) > > > > Sorry my english is too much poor to understand this,I mean paper and pencil :\ >>Last night I was playing with it and trying to >>find the way to have a "normal" view (for me) of the score.Im >>accustomed to the real book,and I like to write my scores in that >>way,simple melody line and chords over,each line divided in four >>bars,to have a clear preview of what I'm writing and reading,but >>have not succes.This is not the first time I find this issue,and >>probably the main cause,between others with no direct relationship >>with noteedit,that made me reject the use and more extensive test of >>the program. >> >> > >finale has a reputation for having (at least in its first versions) the >most idiotic, un-intuitive, and frustrating interface in the history of >software. believe me. > > I believe you,I don't know Finale. >don't compare noteedit with finale. > I didn't,I only name it in my post because here, http://rnvs.informatik.tu-chemnitz.de/~jan/noteedit/noteedit.html that is in the open post of this thread , is named as part of the reason of the discontinuation of the project. > they are conceived differently. >noteedit is more like "nwc" ("noteworthy composer") for windows, which >is a much friendlier design. > > Don't know nwc,neither.Does it have the feature to see the sheet as a "normal" paper,and not one line only? >just try noteworthy composer (for windows, not gpl), and you'll see what >i mean. then try NOTEEDIT. > > Ok, goin to be difficult presently as I don't use windows anymore,but if I got the chance,I will. Saludos --Carlos. From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 22:43:46 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 04:58:56 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <43A72884.2070300@chapelperilous.net> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <1135027988.27391.10.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <43A72884.2070300@chapelperilous.net> Message-ID: <200512200543.46179.ii001001@yahoo.ca> On Monday 19 December 2005 23:39, Brett McCoy wrote: > I doubt it's a KDE issue, either, since Rosegarden (the *other* score > editor) is also a KDE application. rosegarden is not a score editor and will *hopefully* never be. remember each tool has some specific purposes. score editing is not what rosegarden is supposed to do. i hate combos. and perhaps all gnu/linuxists should. :) rosegarden should deal best with the way music sounds, not with the way music looks. > I use Rosegarden extensively for score editing. have you tried noteedit? > -- Brett __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 22:37:08 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 05:01:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <20051219212201.GA21348@falcon.fugal.net> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <20051219212201.GA21348@falcon.fugal.net> Message-ID: <200512200537.08902.ii001001@yahoo.ca> On Monday 19 December 2005 23:22, Hans Fugal wrote: > Nor does it _deserve_ anything else, whether good or evil. It's just > a bunch of bits. Perhaps you'd like to imply that the authors of > noteedit don't deserve to be ignored. This is a much more poignant > point, and it's hard for us developers to accept sometimes, but using > our software is just as voluntary as our creating it. i don't care about the authors of noteedit, and i don't even (want to ever) know who they are. all i care is that NOTEEDIT is ignored. and what makes me angry is that the reason is... ignorance of what noteedit actually does. > When it comes to software and business, the question is never what is > wrong with the user/customer, but what is wrong with the > software/product/service. very much agreed. > Or maybe it's not really ignored at all. I'd like to see proof that > it is being ignored, whatever that means. it *is* ignored. but, hey, if i think better, i realise that any music notation software is ignored (proportionally) just as much. not even finale is as popular as it "should" be. > If you think the > best hope is to court the previous developers with lavish praise or > whatever it would take to make them feel that spending time on > noteedit is worth their time, then by all means go ahead. as i said, i have no idea who they were and i don't care about "creators", but only about their "creation". i hate any type of personality cult, and this certainly includes britney spears, john paul ii, linus torvalds, and (please don't kill me!) even g. bush jr... ;) > So I just wanted to reassure you on two points: there is no > conspiracy to ignore noteedit, and because noteedit is open source it > will continue to be available and perhaps even continue to improve. well, i surely hope you're right, because i *love* NOTEEDIT :) -- and thanks. > Let's each do something proactive for our favorite project(s) and > refrain from blaming others for our (in)actions. why, i was *surely* not blaming! i was just expressing amazement combined with frustration. as i am not a coder, i thought talking about noteedit was the right (proactive) thing i could do. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 22:54:48 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 05:30:44 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191725.17982.lau@kudla.org> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <200512191725.17982.lau@kudla.org> Message-ID: <200512200554.48189.ii001001@yahoo.ca> > I actually never tried it because I thought it was some > command-line-based thing that output TeX files or some similar > 1980's-era thing, and I'd have to use some random tla2ps program > to get useful output from it. But maybe I had it confused with > Lilypond. right, noteedit has nothing to do with command-line apps. > For my very limited scoring needs, Rosegarden is enough. But I > just didn't know Noteedit was as capable as you say it is. if you know noteworthy composer (for windows), then you almost know how noteedit looks. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Mon Dec 19 23:07:55 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 05:36:46 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, =?iso-8859-1?q?=09the_score?= editor! In-Reply-To: <43A771F2.9050203@woh.rr.com> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <43A771F2.9050203@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <200512200607.55851.ii001001@yahoo.ca> > I don't work with notation much these days, but I found that NE had a > transparent interface and many useful features. I've been writing a > series of articles for the Linux Journal on music notation software > for Linux, NE will be profiled in the next installment, along with > LilyPond. maybe you shouldn't mention them together, as it seems this creates confusion. (somebody expressed it earlier in the thread.) i suppose people need to know that noteedit is user friendly and gui. or maybe you could emphasize this. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From m_nels at gmx.net Tue Dec 20 05:42:07 2005 From: m_nels at gmx.net (Michael T D Nelson) Date: Tue Dec 20 05:40:28 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <43A7D50E.4040304@gmail.com> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <43A730E0.100@gmail.com> <200512200550.14165.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <43A7D50E.4040304@gmail.com> Message-ID: <43A7DFFF.4000709@gmx.net> Carlos Pino wrote: > I. I. Ooisen wrote: >>> I'm not a good music reader nor writer,but when i need it Is >>> faster for me to write by hand. >> >> why, do you write it in adobe? :D)) >> > Sorry my english is too much poor to understand this,I mean paper and > pencil :\ Don't worry. As a native English speaker, what you originally wrote was well expressed, and easily understood. My understanding is that Carlos Pino probably understood you perfectly too - I *think* he was making a light-hearted pun - possibly based on the name of an Adobe program? I could be wrong though. Regards, Michael From arnold.krille at gmail.com Tue Dec 20 05:56:58 2005 From: arnold.krille at gmail.com (Arnold Krille) Date: Tue Dec 20 05:57:02 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Re: Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512191924.30539.ce@christeck.de> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512181918.04809.ce@christeck.de> <2def88b80512190610q7b9abb0do@mail.gmail.com> <200512191924.30539.ce@christeck.de> Message-ID: <2def88b80512200256h6a818bc6o@mail.gmail.com> 2005/12/19, Christoph Eckert : > > Yeah, I can read you! I don't have internet during the weekend... > how do your survive weekends?!? > Just kidding ;-) . Got a girlfriend now. No kidding... > > I am still using my tascam and I am back in a state where I am > > praising it! > You even have used its MIDI interface during Linuxtag and it worked very > well, didn't you? Yep, midi even works before the firmware is loaded (if I remember right). The next weekend I am planning to use my laptop and the tascam as my only synth, no external soundmoduls this time... So for the first time I am heavily dependent on it. Arnold -- visit http://dillenburg.dyndns.org/~arnold/ --- Wenn man mit Raubkopien Bands wie Brosis oder Britney Spears wirklich verhindern k?nnte, w?rde ich mir noch heute einen Stapel Brenner und einen Sack Rohlinge kaufen. From salvuz_78 at virgilio.it Tue Dec 20 06:03:59 2005 From: salvuz_78 at virgilio.it (Salvatore Di Pietro) Date: Tue Dec 20 06:04:06 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <200512200050.29116.reynal@ensea.fr> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512191328.09833.reynal@ensea.fr> <1135006332.16112.34.camel@mindpipe> <200512200050.29116.reynal@ensea.fr> Message-ID: <43A7E51F.8030608@virgilio.it> Sylvain Reynal wrote: [cut] > (btw, jackd -P anynegativenumber triggers an error with my 2.6.14-rt kernel, i > get a "cannot use real-time scheduling (FIFO at priority -70) etc."; probably > the subject for another thread though) That's so because priority in SCHED_FIFO (not nice) goes from 1 to 99, being 1 the lowest priority and 99 the higher. :) HTH bye -- salvuz POST FATA RESVRGO Linux registered user #291700 | machine #174619 get counted on ---> http://counter.li.org/ <--- From emillo at libero.it Tue Dec 20 06:14:20 2005 From: emillo at libero.it (Emiliano Grilli) Date: Tue Dec 20 06:15:24 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512200554.48189.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <200512191725.17982.lau@kudla.org> <200512200554.48189.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <20051220111419.GA26847@emillo.net> marted?, 20 dicembre 2005 alle 05:54:48, I. I. Ooisen ha scritto: > > > I actually never tried it because I thought it was some > > command-line-based thing that output TeX files or some similar > > 1980's-era thing, and I'd have to use some random tla2ps program > > to get useful output from it. But maybe I had it confused with > > Lilypond. > > right, noteedit has nothing to do with command-line apps. Yes, it's a GUI app, but if you want something to print on an actual printer you must export the score to something like abc or lilypond, which are command line apps. BTW, I think having a command line interface it's a *plus* for a program, not a minus. And yes, noteedit's dependency on KDE is not-so-good for us gnome (or other wm) users... The same can be told for rosegarden. It would be better if they rather rely only on QT (like hydrogen or muse). I'm not so happy having to install 25 megs of kdelibs & friends only to run these 2 apps... Noteedit is a very good program in my opinion. It does an excellent job in exporting abc files. I'm not so music-literate so I appreciate its "highlight while playing" feature (absent in rosegarden). Having it sync with jack_transport would be a "killer" addition, too :) It was a big shame when its original author discontinued it, and I'm glad that someone picked it up and continue the work. I think we all have to be grateful with free software authors, as they give a great gift to us non programmers. Just my 2 cents... Cheers -- Emiliano Grilli Linux user #209089 http://www.emillo.net From mista.tapas at gmx.net Tue Dec 20 06:47:09 2005 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Schmidt) Date: Tue Dec 20 06:47:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <20051220124709.77fcaf2e@mango.fruits.de> On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 15:27:36 +0200 "I. I. Ooisen" wrote: > NOTEEDIT (which is GPL), THE BEST USER-FRIENDLY SCORE EDITOR FOR > GNU/LINUX (cause that's what it is!), doesn't deserve to be ignored. > what is wrong with us? i wonder why most of us ignore it... Hi, it doesn't get ignored deliberately. If the author complained about too little feedback, he should have written a more buggy software ;) Noteedit is cool. Plus it's alive and kicking (not maintained by the original author anymore, but that's ok, too. Long live open source software) Have fun, Flo -- Palimm Palimm! http://tapas.affenbande.org From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Tue Dec 20 07:32:27 2005 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Tue Dec 20 07:14:14 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512200607.55851.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <43A771F2.9050203@woh.rr.com> <200512200607.55851.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <43A7F9DB.9010004@woh.rr.com> I. I. Ooisen wrote: >>I don't work with notation much these days, but I found that NE had a >>transparent interface and many useful features. I've been writing a >>series of articles for the Linux Journal on music notation software >>for Linux, NE will be profiled in the next installment, along with >>LilyPond. >> >> > >maybe you shouldn't mention them together, as it seems this creates >confusion. (somebody expressed it earlier in the thread.) > > NE creates output formatted for MusiXTeX/PMX, LilyPond, abc, MIDI, and MusicXML, an impressive number of targets. I'm planning to include it with the LilyPond profile precisely because it is such a superb front-end for LilyPond. I agree with Hans re: usage. Apps succeed in the world because of their merit and because people actually use them. I also agree that getting the word out is important to the public awareness of the app. So maybe you should consider writing an article about NoteEdit ? I'm not joking, there are a number of venues that would be interested in such an article. >i suppose people need to know that noteedit is user friendly and gui. or >maybe you could emphasize this. > > I will. There will be screenshots. :) Best, dp From reynal at ensea.fr Tue Dec 20 07:43:09 2005 From: reynal at ensea.fr (sylvain reynal) Date: Tue Dec 20 07:41:00 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Looking for soundcard. In-Reply-To: <43A7E51F.8030608@virgilio.it> References: <1134907628.2217.0.camel@yo-machine> <200512200050.29116.reynal@ensea.fr> <43A7E51F.8030608@virgilio.it> Message-ID: <200512201343.09945.reynal@ensea.fr> On Tuesday 20 December 2005 12:03, Salvatore Di Pietro wrote: > That's so because priority in SCHED_FIFO (not nice) goes from 1 to 99, > being 1 the lowest priority and 99 the higher. :) grrrr.... i'm floored. That was THAT obvious and i just couldn't see it ;-) Thanks. Syd From core at jacklab.net Tue Dec 20 08:01:18 2005 From: core at jacklab.net (Michael Bohle) Date: Tue Dec 20 08:01:25 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] Musix GNU+Linux 0.30-final, released / download mirrors In-Reply-To: <200512162255.50875.marcospcmusica@yahoo.com.ar> References: <200512162255.50875.marcospcmusica@yahoo.com.ar> Message-ID: <1135083678.5765.14.camel@jacklab.metanet> Hi Marcos Very nice distribution, lots of very practical userfriendly scripts. But the localiation is mostly spanish or portugese - no problem for me ;) Thank you for your nice work... i will integrate some of your ideas in the openSUSE audio distribution, you have made some ideas of mine come true - like telepatic connection ;) And otherwise, (ec the ghostness script) i have realized that in a other way, but same... funny. Michael www.jacklab.net | www.opensuse.org/JackLab | irc.freenode.net #jacklab Am Freitag, den 16.12.2005, 22:55 +0100 schrieb Marcos Guglielmetti: > http://www.musix.distrux.net/ > > > http://www.musix.distrux.net/download.html > http://musix.k-maleon.com/download.html > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > News: > > *French & Portuguese 100% supported > -Ardour 0.99-3 > -KDE 3.4.2 > *Kmail 1.8.2 > -KDM funciona desde el Live CD > *Ghostess > *WhySynth DSSI > *Sineshaper DSSI > *Lilypond 2.6.3 > *# Solfege 2.0 > *# Denemo 0.7 > -# Noteedit 2.8.0 > *Beast 0.6 > *Seq24 0.7 > *# linuxsampler 0.3 > *# Rezound 0.12 > *Kit Yamaha Vintage --> Hydrogen Drum Machine > *Firestarter 1.0 > *Alsa Modular Synth 1.8.7 > *## Bristol 0.9.1 > *Horgand 1.07 > *Caps plugins 0.2.3 > *# DGuitar > *# Linux Multimedia Studio 0.1.1 > -Soporte para dispositivos USB audio y MIDI > *Escritorio Administraci?n > *Synaptic > > State: > - upgraded from musix 0.26 > * new > # important bugs detected > ## critical bugs > > From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Tue Dec 20 01:56:49 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 08:28:04 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <567aa5f60512192155r730132dakaf5be174bfe067b4@mail.gmail.com> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <567aa5f60512192155r730132dakaf5be174bfe067b4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512200856.49439.ii001001@yahoo.ca> On Tuesday 20 December 2005 07:55, Noah Roberts wrote: > On 12/19/05, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > > is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome > > supporters? > > localhost mp3 # emerge -pv noteedit > > These are the packages that I would merge, in order: > > Calculating dependencies ...done! > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kde-env-3-r4 0 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/arts-3.4.3 +alsa -arts -artswrappersuid > -debug +esd -hardened +jack -kdeenablefinal +mp3 -nas +vorbis > -xinerama 922 kB > [ebuild N ] media-libs/tse3-0.2.7 +alsa -arts -oss 589 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdelibs-3.4.3 +alsa -arts +cups -debug -doc > -jpeg2k -kdeenablefinal -kerberos -openexr +spell +ssl +tiff > -xinerama -zeroconf 16,482 kB > [ebuild N ] media-libs/taglib-1.4 -debug 715 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/libkcddb-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 5,366 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kioslaves-3.4.3 -arts -debug > +encode +flac -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) +mp3 +vorbis -xinerama 0 > kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kfile-plugins-3.4.3 -arts > -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -theora +vorbis -xinerama 0 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kappfinder-data-3.4.3 -arts > -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kmid-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kmix-3.4.3 +alsa -arts -debug > -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/mpeglib-3.4.1 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 5,417 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kscd-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-meta-3.4.3 -arts +xine 0 kB > [ebuild N ] media-sound/noteedit-2.6.2 -arts -debug > -kdeenablefinal -xinerama 1,817 kB > > Total size of downloads: 31,312 kB > > > I have to admit that is definately a point against it. Even with > emerge I'm not that interested in adding all that crap to my system > right now. so it's just as i was supposing, it's mostly because it's a kde application... but hey, if you install rosegarden, you don't have to install all that crap to your system. not because of noteedit, that is ;) (which makes your "point against [noteedit]" pretty much irrelevant) or you don't use rosegarden either? (which pretty much makes *you* irrelevant to the LAU list) (just teasing, really!) :D sorry for the way i *had* to put it, i actually just liked the word play... heh... NOW SERIOUSLY: the way i see it packed under portage is a point against GENTOO, not against NOTEEDIT. really! i didn't have to apt-get kappfinder in order to use noteedit or anything like kdemultimedia (also kmid, or kmix, or arts, or mpeglib, or kscd?!? -- GENTOO REALLY SCARES ME HERE... I HAD BETTER OPINIONS ON IT!) (and yes, i *know* what i am talking about; of kde, debian uses *only* kdelibs, which is a nice way debian deals with kde apps.) maybe you should switch to debian? ;) don't get me wrong on this, i myself very much appreciate the gentoo project... i am even planning to try it... but i am not sure i'll try it anymore... the way you imply gentoo deals with kde apps kills all my enthusiasm about gentoo... i know kde is bloatware, but the way you imply gentoo deals with it makes it... scareware. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From markknecht at gmail.com Tue Dec 20 08:46:05 2005 From: markknecht at gmail.com (Mark Knecht) Date: Tue Dec 20 08:46:11 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512200856.49439.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <567aa5f60512192155r730132dakaf5be174bfe067b4@mail.gmail.com> <200512200856.49439.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <5bdc1c8b0512200546k4f5c1623k6e2bf31ab7c325d7@mail.gmail.com> On 12/19/05, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > On Tuesday 20 December 2005 07:55, Noah Roberts wrote: > > On 12/19/05, I. I. Ooisen wrote: > > > is it because noteedit is a kde app and most of us are gnome > > > supporters? > > > > localhost mp3 # emerge -pv noteedit > > > > These are the packages that I would merge, in order: > > > > Calculating dependencies ...done! > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kde-env-3-r4 0 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/arts-3.4.3 +alsa -arts -artswrappersuid > > -debug +esd -hardened +jack -kdeenablefinal +mp3 -nas +vorbis > > -xinerama 922 kB > > [ebuild N ] media-libs/tse3-0.2.7 +alsa -arts -oss 589 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdelibs-3.4.3 +alsa -arts +cups -debug -doc > > -jpeg2k -kdeenablefinal -kerberos -openexr +spell +ssl +tiff > > -xinerama -zeroconf 16,482 kB > > [ebuild N ] media-libs/taglib-1.4 -debug 715 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/libkcddb-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 5,366 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kioslaves-3.4.3 -arts -debug > > +encode +flac -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) +mp3 +vorbis -xinerama 0 > > kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kfile-plugins-3.4.3 -arts > > -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -theora +vorbis -xinerama 0 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-kappfinder-data-3.4.3 -arts > > -debug -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kmid-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kmix-3.4.3 +alsa -arts -debug > > -kdeenablefinal (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/mpeglib-3.4.1 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 5,417 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kscd-3.4.3 -arts -debug -kdeenablefinal > > (-kdexdeltas) -xinerama 0 kB > > [ebuild N ] kde-base/kdemultimedia-meta-3.4.3 -arts +xine 0 kB > > [ebuild N ] media-sound/noteedit-2.6.2 -arts -debug > > -kdeenablefinal -xinerama 1,817 kB > > > > Total size of downloads: 31,312 kB > > > > > > I have to admit that is definately a point against it. Even with > > emerge I'm not that interested in adding all that crap to my system > > right now. > > > so it's just as i was supposing, it's mostly because it's a kde > application... > > but hey, if you install rosegarden, you don't have to install all that > crap to your system. not because of noteedit, that is ;) > (which makes your "point against [noteedit]" pretty much irrelevant) > > or you don't use rosegarden either? > (which pretty much makes *you* irrelevant to the LAU list) (just > teasing, really!) :D > > sorry for the way i *had* to put it, i actually just liked the word > play... heh... > > > NOW SERIOUSLY: > > the way i see it packed under portage is a point against GENTOO, not > against NOTEEDIT. really! > > i didn't have to apt-get kappfinder in order to use noteedit or anything > like kdemultimedia (also kmid, or kmix, or arts, or mpeglib, or kscd?!? > -- GENTOO REALLY SCARES ME HERE... I HAD BETTER OPINIONS ON IT!) > > (and yes, i *know* what i am talking about; of kde, debian uses *only* > kdelibs, which is a nice way debian deals with kde apps.) > > maybe you should switch to debian? ;) > don't get me wrong on this, i myself very much appreciate the gentoo > project... i am even planning to try it... > > but i am not sure i'll try it anymore... the way you imply gentoo deals > with kde apps kills all my enthusiasm about gentoo... i know kde is > bloatware, but the way you imply gentoo deals with it makes it... > scareware. I did not seem to have the problems that Noah did on my wife's Gentoo box. I only had to emerge 4 KDE packages to get noteedit built. That said I chose to build 2.8.0 as the noteedit page said it was the curent stable version. So much for that being true: kbuildsycoca: WARNING: '/usr/share/applications/mplayer.desktop' specifies undefined mimetype/servicetype 'video/x-fli' kbuildsycoca: WARNING: '/usr/share/applications/mplayer.desktop' specifies undefined mimetype/servicetype 'video/vnd.vivo' LilyPond check: not available. KCrash: Application 'noteedit' crashing... Unable to start Dr. Konqi mark@dragonfly ~ $ Maybe I should try an earlier version one of these days. Cheers, Mark From ii001001 at yahoo.ca Tue Dec 20 05:02:57 2005 From: ii001001 at yahoo.ca (I. I. Ooisen) Date: Tue Dec 20 08:47:05 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <43A7D50E.4040304@gmail.com> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <200512200550.14165.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <43A7D50E.4040304@gmail.com> Message-ID: <200512201202.57678.ii001001@yahoo.ca> > > Don't know nwc,neither.Does it have the feature to see the > sheet as a "normal" paper,and not one line only? yes, it nwc does (not easy to find that feature, though) :) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From idragosani at chapelperilous.net Tue Dec 20 08:53:08 2005 From: idragosani at chapelperilous.net (Brett McCoy) Date: Tue Dec 20 08:53:50 2005 Subject: [linux-audio-user] FOLKS, PAY ATTENTION TO NOTEEDIT, the score editor! In-Reply-To: <200512200543.46179.ii001001@yahoo.ca> References: <200512191527.36623.ii001001@yahoo.ca> <1135027988.27391.10.camel@c213-100-50-8.swipnet.se> <43A72884.2070300@chapelperilous.net> <200512200543.46179.ii001001@yahoo.ca> Message-ID: <43A80CC4.902@chapelperilous.net> I. I. Ooisen wrote: >>I doubt it's a KDE issue, either, since Rosegarden (the *other* score >>editor) is also a KDE application. > > > rosegarden is not a score editor and will *hopefully* never be. remember > each tool has some specific purposes. score editing is not what > rosegarden is supposed to do. You should tell the Rosegarden developers that because they make the claim on the website that it is a score editor. :-) Granted, Rosegarden is missing some stuff that NoteEdit probably has (multiple voices per staff, easy insertion/deletion of measures), but Rosegarden has always worked "out of the box" for me, which is why I use it, whereas NoteEdit was problematic (see below). > i hate combos. and perhaps all gnu/linuxists should. :) > > rosegarden should deal best with the way music sounds, not with the way > music looks. > > >>I use Rosegarden extensively for score editing. > > > have you tried noteedit? Yes, I have tried it. It kept crashing on me, and I had trouble getting it to find my MIDI devices (the TSE3 library, I think, was the issue, it was segfaulting on startup), and refused to import any of my MIDI files. It doesn't support Jack either, which is crucial for the setup I am using for composing and recording. -- Brett From cme